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Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012



No Huns.

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Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Funky Valentine posted:

The insanity must be conserved until the Gothic Senate is formed.

:getin:

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Edit-Yeah, I want this to win:

YF-23 posted:



No King nor Emperor was fit to rule the Italian realm. The Central Roman state, having secured Italy from the Emperor of the west but under persistent siege from all sides and unable to pursue dreams of establishing itself as Empire in the Mediterranean entered a crisis of leadership as the purpose of the realm was uncertain. Without any practical source of legitimacy for the pretenders and under pressure from the heretic Goths and pagan Avars to the north, the Italian Romans found a common cause in defence of the faith, with the Bishop of Rome playing an increasingly active role in the state, culminating in a Great Compromise: the acceptance by the Roman Senate and the Italian nobility of the Pope as the highest authority in the realm.

The Western Roman Separatists start CK2 as the Holy Roman Empire, a theocracy under the Pope, who is Emperor over a number of duke- and king-level feudal vassals.

Lord Cyrahzax fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Jun 11, 2015

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Merdifex posted:

Well, the pope could accrue any number of titles given how flabby and corrupt the office is bound to become, but my issue was with calling it the Holy Roman Empire, which I get was a joke, but doesn't really bring to point how different this sort of administration is.

It's Holy, it's Roman, and it's an Empire. What's not to get?

Also, I switched my vote to it.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Merdifex posted:

Can we start flagchat for Holy Roman Empire

I think cannibalizing this from Byzlp would be a good start:

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Freudian posted:



Caralian is a cool word.

Agreed.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

RowansWarden posted:



In the early days of Islam, missionaries brought the faith to the Eastern Roman Empire. Faced with an existential threat from the Sassanids to the east and the ever-growing power of the Bishop of Rome to the west, the Emperor embraced Islam. By the eighth century, the Byzantines were largely Muslim, and they managed to reclaim some of western Anatolia while the Arabs expanded into most of the Sassanid lands west of Persia. Persia itself remained Zoroastrian, while Christian Axum still ruled Egypt.

Muslim Byzantium

:allears:

Edit:

quote:

Hellenic Islam

Unlike OTL where many Byzantine emperors scoffed at Muhammad's budding new religion, declaring it nothing more than some misguided Christian heresy held by backward desert savages, one emperor saw something more; he saw inspiration.

Upon receiving several letters from Muhammad, he put into writing his own improvements to Muhammad's own theology. Why would Theos (the term he used instead of Allah) speak to some desert barbarian in his own guttural tongue rather than to an emperor who spoke one of the most beautiful and prestigious language on earth?

In reality, the language of revelation was Greek, since the archangels Gabriel and Michael appeared to this emperor and pointed out that Greek was not only the best language, but also that Muhammad misinterpreted them greatly.

His writings and revelations were recorded by him and his followers in a collection of books called the Theonomy (god's laws.) It was revealed to him that you could marry more than one woman, among other things.

This new faith was called Paradinism, after the Greek word for submission.

Specifically voting for this modification.

Lord Cyrahzax fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Jun 14, 2015

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Merdifex posted:

I'd support this in conjunction with my three caliphate things if the emperor claimed to be another Islamic prophet after Muhammad and founded another sect of Islam where people believe that Greek is the language of revelation.

Yeah, it's hard to imagine that even a weakened Byzantium would accept playing second fiddle to the Arabs.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Merdifex posted:

In that case, I'd modify RowansWarden's proposal a bit to include specifics:



Hellenic Islam

Unlike OTL where many Byzantine emperors scoffed at Muhammad's budding new religion, declaring it nothing more than some misguided Christian heresy held by backward desert savages, one emperor saw something more; he saw inspiration.

Upon receiving several letters from Muhammad, he put into writing his own improvements to Muhammad's own theology. Why would Theos (the term he used instead of Allah) speak to some desert barbarian in his own guttural tongue rather than to an emperor who spoke one of the most beautiful and prestigious language on earth?

In reality, the language of revelation was Greek, since the archangels Gabriel and Michael appeared to this emperor and pointed out that Greek was not only the best language, but also that Muhammad misinterpreted them greatly.

His writings and revelations were recorded by him and his followers in a collection of books called the Theonomy (god's laws.) It was revealed to him that you could marry more than one woman, among other things.

This new faith was called Paradinism, after the Greek word for submission.

i love it, voting this

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012



Let's see how Roman we can get. :allears:

Lord Cyrahzax fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Jun 15, 2015

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

GSD posted:

I just want Ireland to be free of the (whoever) yoke.

How can the rightful rule of (a) Rome be considered a yoke?

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012



Let's give those Turks and Iranians a chance, hmm?

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Merdifex posted:

I wonder why. So what happens of them?

they die sailing to britain

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

theblastizard posted:

Gothia should have Austria's flag in black and slightly darker black.

Ugh. Let's try to avoid tricolors in this lp.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

:golfclap:

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Egypt is looking surprisingly non-green. Were they converted but not Arabized?

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Are there any Greco-Roman pagans left?

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

yes, please share

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Off to a wonderful start.

Will you be posting a link to this mod? I really want to try out this scenario.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Rejected Fate posted:

I would like to petition our liege for a better coat of arms :colbert:

Unless of course that isn't possible

Our coat of arms tells me one thing, friend: this "Gothia" is a sham, ruled by a degenerate and aesthetically illiterate half-breed! No, our rightful king reigns in so-called Belgica, under the glorious golden lion! Death to the traitorous Lugdunum cabal! Death to the Triarius pretenders! Long live the Amalings (and their lovely flag)!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

How perfect! This pretender and his Orthodox wench can only produce corpses and girls. Surely our lords will see the light? The Triarius are accursed by God, rejected by the Almighty, along with every poor soul trapped under their rule! These are but the first of the punishments to come! The Amalings must be restored for a truly united and holy Gothia!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Does Triarius decadence, depravity and degeneracy know no bounds?! Thiudareiks dares to call himself the king of Armorica, knowing that it belongs only to the true lord of the Goths? He holds tournaments and throws parties with his heretic wife and other Septimanian filth, parading his repulsive half-breed sons as if they were worth anything! It's sickening to see, but redemption is coming for Gothia, oh yes. The Triarius are no doubt too deep in the cups to understand that the realm they stole will shatter upon the usurper's death. The Amalings will restore themselves, even if they have to wait! Gothia will be reborn, stronger and greater than it was before!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Yeah, was not having the High Priesthood already existing an oversight?

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Ofaloaf posted:

Having the High Priesthood from the beginning would've just meant Zoroastrian holy wars beginning even earlier.

Work on the CK2 mod began while the Attila bit was still ongoing, and because Horse Lords had been announced, it seemed likely there would be a wave of big patches coming through at some point during the mod work phase. Because of that, I tried to mod as few parts as possible with the logic being that the more files modded, the more likely something would be no longer valid or might go horribly wrong once the patches roll through, and the more headaches and frustration I would have to endure to get everything working.

Thus, I haven't touched the CB files at all and I don't want to touch the CB files, which would've been the other way to prevent Zoroastrian crusades in the 8th century. Leaving the high priesthood disabled at game start was a quick and easy way to at least briefly delay Zoroastrian holy war expansion. A lot of test runs had it fire later than this, too.

That's what I figured. I was kind of hoping for some kind of flavor explanation, though, maybe Sassanian-style Iconoclasts.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Ah, now we see the legacy of the accursed usurper! Two kingdoms, hated, weak, and yearning for the return of their rightful lord! The Amalings may have been blunted, but they cannot be stopped! The Triarius are not long for this world!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Curse the Triarius! They who ally themselves with heretics and foreigners to keep the Goths divided! They who proudly slaughter the just servants of the rightful king! They, who by their very existence, doom the Goths to weakness, separation and irrelevancy! Their annihilation cannot come quickly enough!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

It is all so clear to me now. The Triarius and the Amalings mean nothing! Gothia has been rent asunder for it's trust in what has proven to be a false faith! I say now, before you all, that Arius was a heretic! I say that his misguided and damned children slaughter each other for the want of any true spiritual satisfaction, any true faith!

But what is the answer? The Imperial Creed has seen the Orthodox realms around us prosper. The Zoroastrians have won glory in the East. Favor seems to shine on all but the Arians! Whatever the truth is, then, I say Arianism is a lie! I condemn it and its bastard children! I demand that the rulers of Gothia find a real religion!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Gothia embraces heresy, and Belgica is all but destroyed! We are reduced to an Imperial lapdog, a slave of the accursed House of Lepidoso! I would drat you King Gabriel, if you had not already done it yourself! May your reign be short, may your sons die in the crib, and may your deeds be erased from history!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Luhood posted:

No Arianism? Boo! If this continues I'm gonna go join Cyrahzax in the radical group. We're gonna be the Statler and Waldorf of Gothia!

I'm never going Orthodox now. :allears:

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

catlord posted:

I swear to God you were just saying we should convert from Arianism. I'm starting to suspect that you might just be wildly contrarian!

I was saying that, it's true! However, even if I thought we might need to adjust Arianism, it certainly didn't mean I wanted Gothia to embrace Orthodoxy, of all things. My opposition comes more from what we converted to rather than the conversion itself. Seeing the debased lengths the accursed Triarius have gone to for mere temporal stability have changed my opinion further: Arianism was wrong, but far less wrong than Orthodoxy. There must be, is, another, correct faith on the other end of this spectrum, one Gothia should be striving for. But, if Arianism is the closest we can come, it's adequate.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

So, the king of the drunks can't even be bothered to devote himself to his false faith? Coward! His drive to expand, though, would almost be admirable if it weren't so limited in scope. How will Gothia ever be restored if these middling campaigns for these worthless and minuscule strips of land are all the accursed Triarius are able to muster? It shall never be!

And look at our supposed allies in Hispania! All of Iberia is theirs! How long before Septimania is crushed, before Aquitaine is subjugated, before we are enslaved once more to the Romans?! Our drunkard king has already sold our souls to them, has he not? He already licks their Patriarch's boots, soon he will travel to Cartagena and submit to the Emperor! We must prevent this! We must restore the Arian creed, force this spiritual mercenary into one of those monasteries, and subjugate all the lesser realms that surround us, starting with the traitors in Armorica!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

The world has been consumed by heathens and heretics! God has abandoned us, His ungrateful and rebellious children! Do we not deserve it? Have we not seen the warnings, the signs?! There is no hope left, no salvation, only the rule of heathen tyrants on earth, and the rule of Satan below. That is all that awaits humanity!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

The Abbasids are losing ground fast. Half of Egypt was conquered by loving Nubia.

I'm hoping some Africanu refugees help the king establish a new Rome in Alexandria. :getin:

Lord Cyrahzax fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Oct 24, 2015

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Ofaloaf posted:

The biggest weakness of the HRE is that, being a theocracy and all, it can't arrange normal marriage alliances. As far as single realms go it's still fairly strong, and I don't think I've even seen one HRE civil war yet, but if it's not in a holy war, nobody's going to be even able to ally with it.

And then, of course, once you smash in a realm's army once, it's really hard for the AI to rebound in time to retake the initiative in a war.

Is the HRE a titular title? I'm really surprised that it hasn't really tried expanding all that much, especially against those Sicilian counts.

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

oh my god

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

GSD posted:

I am sure the roman realm will be a perfectly stable one from now on, forever.

Indeed! How could this not be the case? How could the masses of Hispania, once given a taste of (relatively) true Christian rule, not easily submit once more to lies of Roman Orthodoxy? The Triarius traitors must think they have chained a great beast, but already I can hear it: the yearning for freedom, the hunger for for faith, and, yes, the rage of the oppressed! Soon, the coward Lalan will be deposed! Soon, an Arian Emperor will cross the Pyrenees and restore the faith in all of Gaul! Soon, new Arian legions will crush the pagans of Britain, the accursed papists in Rome, and even the degenerate sister-fuckers of Africa!

( Anomoean) Arianism's triumph is inevitable!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Fox Ironic posted:

Not gonna happen unless one of those succesor Kingdoms can get control of three Holy Sites. Speaking of which, what are the Celtic Holy Sites?

I'm curious about this too. If they're mostly in Britain, reform should still be possible, especially because I'm assuming that those kingdoms are ruled by the same dynasty?

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

The last Anomoean kingdom, lost! Carthage, fallen from the hands of the pagans into the hands of heretics! Britain itself is soiled by the presence of the Orthodox! But that is not the worst of it. No, that is the all but assured rebirth of the Roman Empire with an accursed Triarius as its master, finally with the power to extinguish the true faith forever, and to inflict their heresies across Europe!

It cannot last, it cannot hold! Arianism cannot die such a death!

Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

RabidWeasel posted:

I love how the WRE in this timeline is basically doing what the ERE did in ours. I'm sure the inevitable collapse will be fun :)

I don't know, the ERE never inherited giant foreign kingdoms like this. Maybe if Manuel Komnenos's Hungarian personal union actually happened?

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Lord Cyrahzax
Oct 11, 2012

Unwise_Cashew posted:

From what I remember, the Mediterranean was a Sicilian lake. Or, I guess, Sicily was Rome 2.0.

No, it was a de Hauteville lake by the end, and Sicily was just the most highly developed de Hauteville kingdom.

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