Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
Kylra
Dec 1, 2006

Not a cute boy, just a boring girl.
It got a bit better towards the end, but a lot of the stuff between episode 1 to the stroganoff song, then from there to the last 3ish episodes was not up to par with the first two seasons.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

.Clash
Apr 10, 2009
GX had problems. But I don't know why any of them would prevent you from enjoying the rest of it.

Sakurazuka
Jan 24, 2004

NANI?

GX was fun and if you're only reason for watching something was to trash talk it you should probably be doing something else with your time.

The Colonel
Jun 8, 2013


I commute by bike!

Sakurazuka posted:

GX was fun and if you're only reason for watching something was to trash talk it you should probably be doing something else with your time.

Torquemadras
Jun 3, 2013

Symphogear GX, episode 9, update!

- God loving dammit, Hibiki
- Okay, it's getting QUITE ridiculous how often the Autoscorers go "yeeeeeaaaaaah could totally kill you, but not gonna". I'm kinda annoyed at this point. Like, just let them get away somehow...
- So, uuuuuuh... are the Autoscorers pretty much going Suicide by Symphogear, here? But they wanna have kickass showdowns with someone while doing that? I mean, I'm not complaining about great dumb big ol' fights, but that feels like it's cheapening things a bit... Especially when the villains gently caress off anytime else. Are you even trying
- Carol, you continue being the lamest end boss, I hope you transform into something rad at some point
- GOD loving DAMMIT, HIBIKI

Yeah, let's see where this is going. You better make a totally sick comeback, Hibiki. I'm tired of you jobbing despite having the raddest action scenes :mad: (Okay, destroying Carol was nice, I'll give you that.) Hopefully there'll be more -

OH poo poo TRUE AMERICAN DR. VER IS BACK :911:

UP AND ADAM
Jan 24, 2007
Hibiki got screwed out of so many action scenes with her hospital storylines in G and GX. I hope the writers have some better ideas for 4 and 5.

Torquemadras
Jun 3, 2013

Aaaaaaaand done.

This post is dedicated to the worst hero. :911: Rest in peace, Vercingetorix. You've been (WILL CONTINUE TO BE?!) the best character of this entire franchise. Every single line, GOLD. "I'd love to become a hero that the kids love, but..." Ahahahahaha

Conclusion? I like S3 a WHOLE LOT MORE than S2. Obviously, the second season introduced Dr. Ver, but it's a total mess plot-wise and I never really liked two thirds of the power trio it introduced. (S3 didn't change that. Sorry.) The Autoscorers are simply great antagonists - super stylish and plain fun to watch. To be honest, I got quite annoyed at their whole schtick of never truly fighting the protagonists - literally everything goes according to plan for them. Kinda sours me on their otherwise awesome battles. I kinda wish they'd revived alongside Carol too, just so that there can be a fight where they're actually trying to win. I don't care if they get swatted, the heroes earned it! Carol also kinda sucks, but she got better towards the end when she was full-on delusional instead of just eye-rollingly emo. Aside from those annoying issues with the Autoscorers, Carol's general suckitude and Hibiki spending too much time in timeout hospital, it's great stuff and I like the finale a lot.

Wishlist for the next seasons: 1) Villains who are actually trying to win fights, 2) more Genjurou outside of the command center, 3) more Hibiki punching villains with friendship in the face, 4) and, while I acknowledge that perfection can, by definition, never be replicated, more characters as awesome as Dr. Ver.
I'll be there to watch this big dumb show :toot:

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Carol's reaction to Ver makes up for everything else about her. "He just showed up and won't stop talking. :what:"

Phobophilia
Apr 26, 2008

by Hand Knit
If there was one thing that GX needed, they were slower, SoL-ey episodes and scenes that allowed the characters to bounce off each other and audience to breathe. S1 had a really good set right after Tsubasa got hospitalised, as did G, but GX felt too jam packed.

Also, the funniest scene of Shirabe/Kirika being idiots was the one with Shirabe cooking, where she carefully sipped some soup, stated that it was "perfect", and the camera zoomed out and she was making instant noodles.

UP AND ADAM
Jan 24, 2007
I just want the action and plot to lead to a satisfying climax with some amount of stakes for the audience and some earned resolution to the issues and themes raised earlier on. It feels like it's way easier to do that with the absence of expectations during a first season, with a simpler story and smaller cast, especially since they have to continue to juggle song representation throughout the season for CD sales, though, so I'll take whatever they put out.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled
It's way harder to have a satisfying amount of focus on any given character since the cast has ballooned to double its original size.

graybook
Oct 10, 2011

pinya~
Jesus christ I'm disappointed that I missed all this gold discussion.

I saw a guy at Anime Boston with a Symphogear Live 2016 shirt on and briefly fanboyed at him, so I hope to be in his shoes for a future Live. (I can dream.)

Still waiting on a translation to exist for the last Zesshoushinai episode, but they'd been entertaining as ever.

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
So I ended up speeding through Symphogear GX in three days, and I think I can say that it's my favorite of the 3 seasons because of its narrative and villains.

Symphogear has the best OP of the 3 seasons , and served as a very good entry into the series. That said, the start of the series was pretty dark, and I don't mean in just a bloody or edgy way, but there's this feeling of hopelessness that sets in. You got Kanade dying right off the bat, Tsubasa's resentment of Hibki, Tsubasa's Swan Song (I prefer this term to Climax Song), the inexperienced HIbki having to do all the fighting on her own as Tsubasa recovers, etc. etc.

My enjoyment of G was marred by the utter stupidity of the villains, especially Maria, and the fact that they let Dr. Ver just run around without restraint. There's also the fact that Ver is a pathetic piece of poo poo who does nothing but gloat or freak out and cower in terror. It was still a good series, and had the best insert songs (Chris's song in the school competition, the duet between Shirabe and Kirika as they fight, Kirika and Shirabe's Symphogear songs in general, Miku's chilling Symphogear song) in my opnion. It was also my favorite series fight-wise, because it wasn't as if the enemy Symphogears actually outclassed the main cast. With the exception of Miku's relic, which was pretty much meant to be anti-relic, the fights were pretty even and the new Symphogears had really cool fighting styles. The Shirabe vs Kirka fight was just really great with their combined songs, which worked amazingly together since they were based on the same relic. And of course there was Hibiki utterly destroying the Nephilim after she went berserk.

Villain-wise, Carol and the Autoscorers were way better than Fine or the FIS. Like, the backstory for Fine, and how she's just doing all this outta love, made me roll my eyes. It just really felt stupid at how Hibiki forgives this mass murderer, who throws a loving meteor onto the earth right after being forgiven, and then gets forgiven again. I mean, sure, it worked out in the sequel, but it's still pretty stupid in my opinion. And I've repeatedly complained about Maria and Ver while watching G. In contrast, the Autoscorers are just really amped to fight and are stylish and fun as hell. It's cool how they take poses all the time, even when they fight. Leiur in particular was the best cause she's taking different poses even as she'd dodging, and she can turn her coins into tonfas. That's really really neat. Micha's fun and wild, Garie has a sharp tongue and a rotten personality that's a delight to watch, Leiur is stylish as hell, and Phara's got this really unique power and this sorta taunting, arrogant elegance. The Autoscorers don't have some tragic past, nor are they hindered by morality. They're just here to do what Carol tells them to do, which is fight and die, and all of them do that with glee. It's endearing, really, after FIS.

Carol herself is also a much better and tragic villain than Fine or Ver. She's got all this power, but she has to give up a part of herself every time she uses it. There's a clear, personal drawback. Her childlike form makes it clear that despite her age, she's still mentally a kid broken up over what happened to her father. I think it's also clear that Carol is very aware that her father did not actually want her to destroy the world, but she deliberately misinterpreted his message because she couldn't reconcile his last wish with her desire for vengeance. The scene in the final episode where she willingly destroys her memories of her father just so she can keep on trying to destroy it is a really powerful and tragic moment because her love of her father is pretty much what drives her on, yet at that point she's so far gone and unwilling to turn back that she burns them away for holding her back. Her final moments are a lot more fitting and poetic than Fine's or Ver's ends in their respective seasons, though those two villains do get to have their own moments in the sequels. She pays the ultimate price for using her powers by losing everything she knows about herself, but does one final act of good in the end by allowing Elfnein to live on.

That said, I think GX had plenty of major flaws in action and fighting that affected the plot. The girls are utterly outclassed by the Autoscorers, and even when they get their upgrades they still hafta use their super forms to win. This makes a fair amount of episodes follow a really predictable formula of "Symphogear fights Autoscorer -> Loses / fails to achieve super form -> Autoscorer retreats -> Rematch -> Personal revelation -> Super form -> Victory -> All part of the plan." I mean, sure, other stuff happens too, but it takes up the most of the episode. It also contrasts with G, where, like I said, the Symphogears were more or less on equal footing. Still, we did get some cool stuff out of it, like Tsubasa overcoming Phara's sword breaking conceptual abilities by becoming a wing instead. That was incredibly neat.

Still, I feel like there's a lot less stupidity involved in GX as compared to G. Like, sure, the cast keep falling for the plan of the villains, but to be fair, it's evident from the viewer's point of view cause we get that scene with something activating after Garie's death and we see all these Autoscorers so amped to die, but you can't really expect the cast to pick up on stuff that happens out of their knowledge and the Autoscorers are crazy robots so who even knows why they're so happy. Plus, the new way of summoning Noise means that you can't just knock away the Staff of Solomon or beat up the person wielding it - seriously, they loving HAD Ver at one point and he still got away with the Staff of Solomon, what the gently caress.

One thing that I feel like G and GX haven't been able to replicate is the raw emotion and impact of the end-of-the-season power up that the original Symphogear had. Sure, the scales are bigger - there's 7 billion Swan Songs now - but I feel like that actually lessens the impact for me in a way. In Symphogear, everything was literally going to poo poo. Chris sacrificed herself to stop the giant cannon's shot, Tsubasa went down destroying the cannon, and Hibiki was completely destroyed and too demoralized to go on. Things are literally at their darkest. There is no one available to fight. So what gives the three Symphogears the power to fight on are their friends, the people they've saved, their fellow classmates. It's a lot more personal, a reaffirmation that even though the Symphogears are the ones fighting out there, they're not fighting alone. Fine's reaction plays a part, too, as the realization that she was responsible in a way for the power that her foes now wield baffles and bewilders her. This happens in GX too, when the girls use the phonic power of Carol's attack to power up, and it's a nice theme of the villains inadvertently creating their most powerful opponents. The OP playing as the girls power up is also incredibly fitting, though I might be biased because like I've said, the first OP is my favorite.

Also there's the fact that the upgrade happens right at the end of an episode, making it so much more prominent than when it happens in the middle of the final episode.

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Symphogear is real good yeah.

The Colonel
Jun 8, 2013


I commute by bike!
dr. ver was fun both as a villain and as mankind's last action hero

BlitzBlast
Jul 30, 2011

some people just wanna watch the world burn
Maria is one of the best parts about G because you quickly realize she has no idea what the hell she's doing. Her entire character arc is her just spiraling deeper and deeper into a sunk cost fallacy, and it all gloriously blows up in her face at the end. Meanwhile if you hated Ver because he was pathetic then you missed the point so hard I don't even know what to say.

I loved G because it didn't do the usual sequel thing of introducing new villains from nowhere who are inexplicably stronger than the heroes. All of FIS are completely out of their depth and consistently manage to technically win the battles of the day but decisively lose the war, which is something so fresh that to me it made up a lot for how loving awful some of their plot beats were.

Meanwhile GX doubles down so hard on the standard formula it practically gave me whiplash. Let's not even talk about how loving awful the final battle was.

quote:

Her final moments are a lot more fitting and poetic than Fine's or Ver's ends in their respective seasons, though those two villains do get to have their own moments in the sequels.

Also you're going to have to explain this because "Fine finally decides to change herself" and "Ver is told he will rot in prison instead of dying gloriously" were beat for beat perfection. Meanwhile Carol just... changes her mind all of a sudden.

EDIT: Though I thought GX was so awful I went from thinking G was okay to loving it, so I am admittedly pretty biased.

BlitzBlast fucked around with this message at 06:12 on Apr 30, 2016

UP AND ADAM
Jan 24, 2007
Neither have been as good as season 1. G and GX are similar in their appeal, to me.

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

GX having 4 loving episodes of fighting carol at the end was its big issue imo

if you took like 3 fight scenes out of gx and replaced them with little character beats it'd be a lot better.

also give the hibiki's dad arc a less weird conclusion. him doing something to redeem himself and her wanting to reach out to him is fine, but the scene at the end was... weird? like if you made it them having another meal at the diner, making kind of awkward conversation, hibiki's dado ffers to pay, smiling at each other, that'd be a lot more satisfying of an ending to that plot thread than hibiki's mom getting two lines and her grandma shaking her head. show that it's weird and might not be perfect, but that they're working it out.

edit: also i don't think Hibiki forgiving Fine was meant to be the Right thing to do, it was just meant to be the Hibiki thing to do. Hibiki is a weird protag with a really weird view of morality and that's why she's good. Don't be a hero, just be loud.

Endorph fucked around with this message at 06:40 on Apr 30, 2016

nielsm
Jun 1, 2009



Season 1 is still the only one that has Gen properly punch things.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

Endorph posted:

GX having 4 loving episodes of fighting carol at the end was its big issue imo

if you took like 3 fight scenes out of gx and replaced them with little character beats it'd be a lot better.

also give the hibiki's dad arc a less weird conclusion. him doing something to redeem himself and her wanting to reach out to him is fine, but the scene at the end was... weird? like if you made it them having another meal at the diner, making kind of awkward conversation, hibiki's dado ffers to pay, smiling at each other, that'd be a lot more satisfying of an ending to that plot thread than hibiki's mom getting two lines and her grandma shaking her head. show that it's weird and might not be perfect, but that they're working it out.

edit: also i don't think Hibiki forgiving Fine was meant to be the Right thing to do, it was just meant to be the Hibiki thing to do. Hibiki is a weird protag with a really weird view of morality and that's why she's good. Don't be a hero, just be loud.

Yeah, they really compressed GX's back half a lot in exchange for...more time for everyone to DBZ at Carol, I guess. Them spending like the first half of the series building up the conflict with Garie and then suddenly machine gun killing Autoscorers one episode after another was super weird.

I also think GX suffered a bit from trying to shoehorn in plot drama for every single one of the main cast for the sake of fairness, I guess, when it really wasn't necessary. Chris's plot beat was super weird and redundant because she ended up overcoming the same issue in GX that she had already overcome before in both G and the first season, for example. I feel like it would have worked better if they had chosen a few characters to get major plot focus and let the other characters assist that plot focus instead of everyone having to have Their Designated Plot Episode. This would have allowed more time for Hibiki and Tsubasa's daddy issues thing to be resolved better, or to give Maria's plot a little bit more time to breathe besides "Man I suck. Wait, I don't suck at all! HA!".

BlitzBlast
Jul 30, 2011

some people just wanna watch the world burn

Kanos posted:

Chris's plot beat was super weird and redundant because she ended up overcoming the same issue in GX that she had already overcome before in both G and the first season, for example.

Nah, in S1 Chris decides to trust other people again. And in G her entire deal is that while she's mostly transitioned to her new environment (as showcased by her ridiculously cute song), her sordid past is getting in the way of that. She's also really bothered about the Staff of Solomon, since she's partly responsible for all the death it causes. Both of those are resolved fairly well, which is one of the stronger parts of G in my opinion.

Meanwhile in GX her entire issue is that she wants Kirika and Shirabe to think she's cool. Which, I mean, isn't weird or anything but is kinda silly next to daddy issues, DADDY ISSUES, (sudden) self-esteem issues, and overwhelming feelings of uselessness.

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

Chris is trying to be the team mom, and I think that is okay. Lord knows Hibiki and Tsubasa are too stupid for that role.

nielsm
Jun 1, 2009



Kanos posted:

Yeah, they really compressed GX's back half a lot in exchange for...more time for everyone to DBZ at Carol, I guess. Them spending like the first half of the series building up the conflict with Garie and then suddenly machine gun killing Autoscorers one episode after another was super weird.

I believe the point was that team Carol was just waiting for our team to reach the right power level and then intentionally have the autoscorers be defeated by dubsteb attack. It really wasn't that they all of a sudden had become that much better, it was simply that Carol's plan was working.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

BlitzBlast posted:

Nah, in S1 Chris decides to trust other people again. And in G her entire deal is that while she's mostly transitioned to her new environment (as showcased by her ridiculously cute song), her sordid past is getting in the way of that. She's also really bothered about the Staff of Solomon, since she's partly responsible for all the death it causes. Both of those are resolved fairly well, which is one of the stronger parts of G in my opinion.

Meanwhile in GX her entire issue is that she wants Kirika and Shirabe to think she's cool. Which, I mean, isn't weird or anything but is kinda silly next to daddy issues, DADDY ISSUES, (sudden) self-esteem issues, and overwhelming feelings of uselessness.

Her issues in GX are tied directly into her issues in G in and Symphogear; she's someone who has been hurt by losing people she loved multiple times in her life and she never wants to risk that pain again, so she acts haughty and bitchy and pushes people away instead of trying to form bonds with them. Symphogear presents this the straightest(resolved by Hibiki being Hibiki), G mixes it up by having her feeling guilty over Solomon's Cane but refusing to allow anyone else to help her fix the issue because it's her responsibility and what if they get hurt helping her(resolved by her allowing Tsubasa to help her), and then GX retreads this for a third time by having her be afraid to be a mentor figure and friend to Kirika and Shirabe because it might hurt if she loses them or if they lose her(resolved by her going "Wait, I've done this before, this is dumb").

nielsm posted:

I believe the point was that team Carol was just waiting for our team to reach the right power level and then intentionally have the autoscorers be defeated by dubsteb attack. It really wasn't that they all of a sudden had become that much better, it was simply that Carol's plan was working.

The thing is that the team hadn't really reached the right power level as a group, they just kind of did it sequentially in rapid succession with like half an episode devoted to each of their individual growths. Marie actually got some setup and foreshadowing for her duel with Garie and her powerup. Everyone else just kind of ran through their season's worth of plot development in half an episode each so they could fit them clowning their respective opponent in the back half of the ep.

graybook
Oct 10, 2011

pinya~

chumbler posted:

Chris is trying to be the team mom, and I think that is okay. Lord knows Hibiki and Tsubasa are too stupid for that role.

Maria is already the Top Mom anyways.

And I agree with a lot of the discussion posted within the past few hours; hopefully in the seasons we're gonna get, they do MUCH better with the pacing and don't have to artificially manufacture drama that gets resolved far too quickly. We've had enough of the characters retreading issues that seemed to have been resolved.

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022

BlitzBlast posted:

Maria is one of the best parts about G because you quickly realize she has no idea what the hell she's doing. Her entire character arc is her just spiraling deeper and deeper into a sunk cost fallacy, and it all gloriously blows up in her face at the end. Meanwhile if you hated Ver because he was pathetic then you missed the point so hard I don't even know what to say.

People have told me that I missed the point to other stuff like Terraformars so I guess I'm not breaking any new ground by missing the point here.

As for Ver, I just can't see him as anything but pathetic, both as a character and a human being. I don't find his antics amusing for the most part, I'm just stuck wondering how stupid everyone has to be to let him run around like that.

BlitzBlast posted:

I loved G because it didn't do the usual sequel thing of introducing new villains from nowhere who are inexplicably stronger than the heroes. All of FIS are completely out of their depth and consistently manage to technically win the battles of the day but decisively lose the war, which is something so fresh that to me it made up a lot for how loving awful some of their plot beats were.

Meanwhile GX doubles down so hard on the standard formula it practically gave me whiplash. Let's not even talk about how loving awful the final battle was.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I liked the fact that FIS aren't suddenly new threats who overpower the main characters, and it was pretty novel when the threat of people with guns was actually a threat to them at two points until Ver went on his killing spree.

And the formula and fights and the strength of the Autoscorers are something I do consider weaknesses of GX, like I've mentioned. I didn't really have any problems with the final battle per say, other than the fact that I really really really liked Carol's song and didn't find the conclusion to the battle to be any better and worse than that of G's, and definitely not as good as the end of Symphogear.

BlitzBlast posted:

Also you're going to have to explain this because "Fine finally decides to change herself" and "Ver is told he will rot in prison instead of dying gloriously" were beat for beat perfection. Meanwhile Carol just... changes her mind all of a sudden.

EDIT: Though I thought GX was so awful I went from thinking G was okay to loving it, so I am admittedly pretty biased.

Fine finally decides to change herself after being forgiven for a second time for throwing a giant rock on earth is weird to me, especially because the second forgiveness comes right after the rock. Plus, it felt less like Fine turning over a new leaf but just giving up cause Hibiki would have kept trying to stop and be friends with her or whatever and she decided she might as well not go through all of that again. I mean, I'm glad she does redeem herself by saving Shirabe's life, but the entire thing left a bad taste in my mouth.

I'll admit that Dr. Ver's fate at the end of G is pretty poetic, but I guess I was so tired of him at that point. Plus, I figured he'd escape one way or another and make a return in the sequel, given that Fine made her temporary comeback in G as well.

Well, i don't really think Carol changes her mind all of the sudden? Her reaching out for Hibiki's hand isn't something she's doing because she's deciding to be good all of the sudden, it's cause the ghost of her dead dad or something. Plus, at this point, she has burned away most of her memories.

But we've already had multiple scenes of Carol being able to manifest as an illusion or image from Elfnein, so who's to say that the reverse didn't happen at the end? Elfnein herself is a lot different from the Autoscorers cause she maintains a connection to Carol's father - despite being a creation of Carol's, she still continues to refer to him as Papa and develops memories of him. So even when Carol has burned away most of her memories, the memories are still there within Elfnein, and I dunno, maybe they resonated, causing Carol to hallucinate? Or maybe after burning away most of her memories Carol was vulnerable to the memories within Elfnein, causing her father to appear as a ghost or a hallucination. I don't know why, but I just thought it made sense in a way.

And Carol reaping what she sowed and losing all her memories after everything is over, returning to a blank slate, and then choosing to do good by saving Elfnein at the cost of her life or whatever, makes more sense then her just being redeemed. In my opinion, the villain Carol, for all intents and purposes, died when she lost all her memories. If Carol had just decided to repent and save Elfnein, I don't think I would have liked it quite as much because I don't see the villain Carol turning good so suddenly.

I'll admit that am also equally biased cause I just really like Carol and her songs. Probably my favorite songs of GX. The OVAs really endeared me to her, too.

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022

Endorph posted:

also give the hibiki's dad arc a less weird conclusion. him doing something to redeem himself and her wanting to reach out to him is fine, but the scene at the end was... weird? like if you made it them having another meal at the diner, making kind of awkward conversation, hibiki's dado ffers to pay, smiling at each other, that'd be a lot more satisfying of an ending to that plot thread than hibiki's mom getting two lines and her grandma shaking her head. show that it's weird and might not be perfect, but that they're working it out.
While I'm not really happy with the way the thing ended, for similar reasons, and feel like it was sorta rush, I really did like the redemption and reconciliation story of Hibiki's dad a lot, especially when compared to the situation with Tsubasa's dad, which just ends in one episode when it turns out the man loved her all this time despite ignoring her and Tsubasa just didn't see it cause she was convinced he disliked him.

Endorph posted:

edit: also i don't think Hibiki forgiving Fine was meant to be the Right thing to do, it was just meant to be the Hibiki thing to do. Hibiki is a weird protag with a really weird view of morality and that's why she's good. Don't be a hero, just be loud.
I don't always like the Hibiki thing to do, especially when she's agonizing over whether or not to fight when people are in danger of dying.

Kanos
Sep 6, 2006

was there a time when speedwagon didn't get trolled

ZepiaEltnamOberon posted:

And Carol reaping what she sowed and losing all her memories after everything is over, returning to a blank slate, and then choosing to do good by saving Elfnein at the cost of her life or whatever, makes more sense then her just being redeemed. In my opinion, the villain Carol, for all intents and purposes, died when she lost all her memories. If Carol had just decided to repent and save Elfnein, I don't think I would have liked it quite as much because I don't see the villain Carol turning good so suddenly.

I'm pretty sure what happened in the end was Carol and Elfnein did a DBZ Fusion Dance. Elfnein's physical body was dying and Carol's mind was basically a shredded unrecoverable mess, so in order to save themselves they combined into a single whole, neither wholly Carol nor wholly Elfnein but parts of both.

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022

Kanos posted:

I'm pretty sure what happened in the end was Carol and Elfnein did a DBZ Fusion Dance. Elfnein's physical body was dying and Carol's mind was basically a shredded unrecoverable mess, so in order to save themselves they combined into a single whole, neither wholly Carol nor wholly Elfnein but parts of both.

My initial thought was the scene from the end of Tales of the Abyss, only with more kissing.

That said, I do think Elfnein is the dominating personality in the new body, given that she refers to herself as "boku", unlike Carol, and the way she acts at the end of the episode has a lot more in common with Elfnein.

Which is why I guess I tend to think of her as Elfnein, just in Carol's body, rather than a amalgamation of the two.

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

oh yeah carol's va is an insanely good singer, that's fair

and yeah, I don't think you are supposed to like the Hibiki thing to do? It's a weird thing to say but Wild Arms Writer Guy is pretty big on just letting characters be the characters. You can argue Hibiki's waffling when people are in danger and Communication shtick makes her an unlikable protagonist but I think it makes her pretty human.

As for Chris's character beat in GX, it was a little weird but the basic thing was her trying to be reliable for Shirabe and Kirika, who she sees a lot herself in. They're orphans, they've got some weird trust issues, they've been used by other people. The part that makes it weird is that A) Kirishira already have Maria, and B) for some reason Symphogear has seen fit to relegate like 20% of Chris's characterization to the gag specials.

As with a lot of things with GX, it could have been solved by just giving it more screen time. I really hope S4 is about Tsubasa's family or something, because that's definitely something that needs more air time than 'my grandfather assaulted my mom, im actually genjuuro's sister' 'what the gently caress' *attacked by swordbreaker and it is never brought up again*.

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

I also hope that since they were announced together S4 and S5 are basically just one 26 episode season instead of two 13-ep arcs.

graybook
Oct 10, 2011

pinya~
Inori Minase's singing shocked me with that force since I'm only used to hearing her as Chino from Gochiusa.

BlitzBlast
Jul 30, 2011

some people just wanna watch the world burn
A lot of the GX Zesshoushinais honestly felt like they should've been in the show in the first place, but were just cut out for some reason.

Watching them afterward made it seem like Miku was making up for lost time. :v:

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022

graybook posted:

Inori Minase's singing shocked me with that force since I'm only used to hearing her as Chino from Gochiusa.

Wait, what?

Holy poo poo I had no idea.

I just thought, hey, her name looks sorta like Iori Minase from iM@S and that was it but holy loving poo poo.

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022
She has such an wide range. Elfnein, Carol, and grown up Carol all sound very different in their anime an in their songs.

Leaving aside her insert song, tomorrow and Green Green sound utterly different.

It's amazing.

chumbler
Mar 28, 2010

My wish list for seasons 4 and 5 is pretty much this:

-More thirsty Miku
-More Chris being the eternal third wheel
-Chris is finally no longer the eternal third wheel

BlitzBlast
Jul 30, 2011

some people just wanna watch the world burn
Incidentally, according to the keywords Shenshou Jing is actually ridiculously weak as far as relics goes. That was why FIS decided to just integrate it into their helicopter instead of searching for a natural user, it straight up wouldn't have been helpful.

Thing is, Miku's massive lesbian boner for Hibiki was so strong that when it was conveyed to Shenshou Jing through Linker it buffed the ever living hell out of the thing. Besides stealth (which is really just a manifestation of a mirror's ability to reflect light), the only other thing it's supposed to be able to do is purify curses. This got turned into purifying relics entirely, because I guess Miku saw Hibiki's case of Gungnir cancer as a curse. Her ability to fly is also explained as the Shenshou Jing's light having grown so strong that the EM waves enable her to spit in the face of gravity.

Ver wasn't kidding when he said it was all the POWER OF LOVE.

Allarion
May 16, 2009

がんばルビ!
I'm still hoping for a Kanade resurrection just because Gungnir as a spear is rad and Maria really did not get to use it that often.

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009

#givemikuhergear

#letmikusayfuck

Allarion posted:

I'm still hoping for a Kanade resurrection just because Gungnir as a spear is rad and Maria really did not get to use it that often.
just get gae bolg up in this, problem solved

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

ZepiaEltnamOberon
Oct 25, 2010

I Failed At Anime 2022

Endorph posted:

and yeah, I don't think you are supposed to like the Hibiki thing to do? It's a weird thing to say but Wild Arms Writer Guy is pretty big on just letting characters be the characters. You can argue Hibiki's waffling when people are in danger and Communication shtick makes her an unlikable protagonist but I think it makes her pretty human.

I want to like things.

I guess her doubts and whatnot might make her human, but I feel like her sense of morality isn't really human. Um, sorta hard to put it in words, but Hibiki sorta reminds me of Gon of Hunter x Hunter. Not in terms of their moralities, but more in that their moralities are disconnected from the values and views of normal people in the same world.

Endorph posted:

As for Chris's character beat in GX, it was a little weird but the basic thing was her trying to be reliable for Shirabe and Kirika, who she sees a lot herself in. They're orphans, they've got some weird trust issues, they've been used by other people. The part that makes it weird is that A) Kirishira already have Maria, and B) for some reason Symphogear has seen fit to relegate like 20% of Chris's characterization to the gag specials.

Yeah, I think the Chris thing makes more sense with after watching the OVAs.

Since Tsubasa graduated on the day the series began and was now touring as an artist, Chris finds herself having to fill her shoes as the oldest member of the girls who remain students. Sure, Kirika and Shirabe have Maria, but Maria's also not there since she's working for the UN. She's overly conscious of her position,

I don't think it played out very well in the story itself - like the Shirabe and Kirika plot, it was based on misunderstandings and an inability to communicate their points across properly.

That said, I had no idea that Tsubasa had graduated until I saw the OVAs. I just figured Shirabe and Kirika were the same grade as Hibki and Miku cause the concept of time passing in Symphogear is not shown very often, I think.

Endorph posted:

As with a lot of things with GX, it could have been solved by just giving it more screen time. I really hope S4 is about Tsubasa's family or something, because that's definitely something that needs more air time than 'my grandfather assaulted my mom, im actually genjuuro's sister' 'what the gently caress' *attacked by swordbreaker and it is never brought up again*.

Yah.

  • Locked thread