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Tercio
Jan 30, 2003



Holy poo poo, I love the Teutonic Order now. The flavor is perfect.

I love to burn through leaders for bonuses. I'm in a perfect spot to grow tall.

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Quantumfate
Feb 17, 2009

Angered & displeased, he went to the Blessed One and, on arrival, insulted & cursed him with rude, harsh words.

When this was said, the Blessed One said to him:


"Motherfucker I will -end- you"

So uh, I'm having some issues- I'm having this issue too, I can't access any commands with my army. You can't really see it, and that's the issue, it's just behind the province banners. How do I change that?


Also localization problems

OneTwentySix
Nov 5, 2007

fun
FUN
FUN




Average Bear posted:

like what the gently caress lol



I don't understand what's going on here, were you Ottomans and suddenly became Byzantium?


As far as the increased coring and diploannexing costs, I haven't played enough yet to really have a feel for it, but on the surface, I really don't like it. I feel like monarch points were just too important before this patch, and now they're more so. By decreasing the claim reduction and increasing the cost to core (and increasing the cost as the AI develops provinces), the value of monarch points goes up further since you have less to work with. Stability, ideas, tech, sinks like inflation or war cost, development, culture conversion, coring, generals/admirals, etc., they all draw from the same pool - basically, monarch points determines how much you can do in the game. There need to be limits or else there's no challenge, but I feel like they're getting to close to "I can't go to war because I won't be able to core anything, so now I'm just going to sit here for five years."

I also don't know how I feel about the new building/development system. Before, buildings cost points to build, so you didn't really build them. Now, development costs monarch points, and affects the effectiveness of your buildings, so will people do much with either system? I can see you building buildings in your best provinces, but I can't imagine people really developing their crappy provinces much, so it won't be worth building buildings there. Anyone who's played more have any impressions on this? Has development proven useful as a strategic choice? I sort of feel like by changing the coring/annex costs, they're trying to make development more appealing than conquest, or to at least to be competitive. The problem though, is that it's more fun to win a war and take provinces from an opponent than it is to push a button and have your provinces' stats go up a little bit. I messed around a little with debug mode, and it seems to me like to really have an impact, you need tech levels amounts of development to see much of an effect on your nation.

The dependence on monarch points is especially hard on non-Western nations, though. Technologies are so much more expensive that they have fewer to play around with, and then westernization is extremely expensive on top of that, so these changes hurt them even more. It's less vital when they're fighting each other, but now this just kind of compounds their disadvantages with Europe - plus, there's now another area for them to fall behind in with development. I feel like they need something to lessen the damage.

With all the things that monarch points can be used for, I feel like there needs to be another way to get more points or to make them go further. I also think that money should be more important beyond simply having a positive cash flow and a reserve for when you don't. Money should be usable to invest in improving your nation, too; if I made 3,000 more ducats than my rivals over a century, that money should have had an effect on my country beyond the effects of fielding a larger army. They went a step better with decoupling buildings from monarch points, but the effectiveness of the buildings still depends on development and that is dependent on MPs, so they just moved when the MP cost is paid.

I'd like to see something where you could purchase 10 year policies, things like -10% dev cost, +10% admin efficiency, +1 monarch points/month, removing a penalty for having a policy, etc. using a one time payment of ducats. Have the cost increase with number of provinces owned, an increase over time value, and maybe discounts for non-western tech groups. This would also help make going tall more appealing, since you'd make more money from development while keeping your territory (and costs) the same. In this way, if you plan on going tall, as you get taller you get additional benefits from doing so (you've had the benefits from more policies over that period of time).

Maybe I'm just talking out of my rear end and the game is just fine and I'll get used to it; I'll have to play around with it some more and change up my strategies, but I just don't think it's a good idea to make war less rewarding when there's nothing to do in the game when you're not at war or planning your next war, and the changes to coring/annexing costs have done this. It might be more historical, but all I really care about is whether or not I'm having fun. I also like the idea that WC is possible, even if I don't do a WC (I enjoyed my one run when I did it, though). I can't imagine that you'd get very far on a WC as the game is now.

Node
May 20, 2001

KICKED IN THE COOTER


Taco Defender

Another Person posted:

So the first big dumb exploit with CS has been found.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...urg-wad.860854/

i love it

e; for anyone who can't tell what happened, the player as an OPM joined a coalition against Burgundy and declared the war, let themselves get sieged, and then in the peace deal gave ALL of Austria's land away

I'm shocked.

Trujillo
Jul 10, 2007


Arzakon posted:

Any reason you took the inland province instead of the CoT on the coast? I noticed the AE is pretty beefy up there but took it anyways and got coalitioned. Going to need to start improving relations if I want to try and grab all three.

For some reason I thought the center of trade was in Madurai. Didn't realize till after. Would've taken it if I knew. I haven't gotten coalitioned yet or even seen one though. I regret not taking more from Vijay. Bahmanias took the lion's share of them and then turned around and ate another country and no one blinked an eye.

axeil
Feb 14, 2006

MR KELLY AND HIS WILD RIDE ARE DEAD.

LONG LIVE CARSON WENTZ AND HIS WAWA BATHROOM EMPIRE




Toilet Rascal

So count me amongst those who are getting really bad slowdown with the new patch Speeds 3, 4 and 5 are all pretty much the same at this point. Before things worked absolutely fine. Someone on the forums was saying apparently some nations are constantly switching fort maintenance on and off and that might be doing it.

edit: I will say I love the new fort mechanic. I'm trying out a game as Poland since I've never played anyone in Eastern Europe and they have fun achievements and I'm really enjoying my first war against the Teutonic Order. A lot of clever maneuvering from both me and the AI which means the war isn't just smacking each other once and then running around. It feels like combat in the 1400s, if clicking stuff on a map could really feel like combat.

axeil fucked around with this message at Jun 10, 2015 around 00:09

Average Bear
Apr 4, 2010


OneTwentySix posted:

I don't understand what's going on here, were you Ottomans and suddenly became Byzantium?

I was Byzantium, Byz Separatists in Mamluk owned cyrprus revolted, they presumably became the BYZ tag as well and thus I became them. So I had Cyprus's idea group choices, their monarch points and randomly genned monarch.

Badger of Basra
Jul 25, 2007



So should I wait on them to patch this before I try to play? I just caught up on DLC because of the deal.

Another Person
Oct 20, 2010





axeil posted:

So count me amongst those who are getting really bad slowdown with the new patch Speeds 3, 4 and 5 are all pretty much the same at this point. Before things worked absolutely fine. Someone on the forums was saying apparently some nations are constantly switching fort maintenance on and off and that might be doing it.

Hm. I am going to guess fort maintenance is something that is decided in a manner similar to whether a nation can colonise or not, where they need a certain monthly income to do it. I can see smaller nations on the borderline flicking it on and off with every few events they get which might change their income.

e; I'd just play it. So far nothing gamebreaking has been exposed except some slowdown in a few cases. The only big exploit is one that is player controlled, and not one which can directly benefit you.

dead comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


Average Bear posted:

I was Byzantium, Byz Separatists in Mamluk owned cyrprus revolted, they presumably became the BYZ tag as well and thus I became them. So I had Cyprus's idea group choices, their monarch points and randomly genned monarch.

Was about to start a Byzantium game, thanks for the warning.

So, Common Sense. Feels like a completely new game, so I have no idea where would be a good place to learn the ropes (again and again )

Elendil004
Mar 22, 2003

The prognosis
is not good.



Oh wow you can full annex a non-belligerent junior partner in a war, awesome. Went to war with Tunis (and Grenada) as Castille and was able to full annex Granada in a few years, truce-be-damned.

OneTwentySix
Nov 5, 2007

fun
FUN
FUN




Average Bear posted:

I was Byzantium, Byz Separatists in Mamluk owned cyrprus revolted, they presumably became the BYZ tag as well and thus I became them. So I had Cyprus's idea group choices, their monarch points and randomly genned monarch.

Ah, got you. I was wondering why anyone would pick Maritime as their first idea group!

SSJ_naruto_2003
Oct 12, 2012



Wiz, there's a bug with movement locking. If you're locked heading to a province, you can just click to move to that province again and it will instantly unlock you, letting you move to wherever you want.

Average Bear
Apr 4, 2010


OneTwentySix posted:

Ah, got you. I was wondering why anyone would pick Maritime as their first idea group!

A byz game is safe to play as long as you remove your cores that Byz separatists give you.

Mans
Sep 14, 2011

We have the dimension of an empire.


every big DLC turns the game into a comical disaster of bugs and glitches and i thank you all for buying it as soon as it was released and suffer through all those problems so they can be patched before i bother buying it.

i love you goons

firestruck
Dec 28, 2010

nullify me


Mans posted:

every big DLC turns the game into a comical disaster of bugs and glitches and i thank you all for buying it as soon as it was released and suffer through all those problems so they can be patched before i bother buying it.

i love you goons

I've played like 80 years out of a campaign already and haven't experienced any comically disastrous bugs, and have done similar things with every expansion except for conquest of paradise.

Maybe I'm just lucky or something though.

Node
May 20, 2001

KICKED IN THE COOTER


Taco Defender

firestruck posted:

I've played like 80 years out of a campaign already and haven't experienced any comically disastrous bugs, and have done similar things with every expansion except for conquest of paradise.

Maybe I'm just lucky or something though.

You just don't notice them. Like when the AI did not know how to explore on the El Dorado release.

Stevefin
Sep 30, 2013



GreyPowerVan posted:

Wiz, there's a bug with movement locking. If you're locked heading to a province, you can just click to move to that province again and it will instantly unlock you, letting you move to wherever you want.

I noticed this as well by accident. However the AI seems to not be able to do it.

It has been a very funny game, England 'won' the 100 years war and gained France under a PU, They shortly revolted and became independent.

Serbia somehow snuck under the Ottomans nose and conquered Constantinople along with Byzantiums directly controlled Greek lands, The Ottoman AI seems very confused about this change of events.

Pol-Lith PU fired, However Lith already was loosing crap loads of land to the Golden horde and Crimea. Lith shortly again broke out when the Teutonic Order heavily kicked Polands teeth in for the second time

Average Bear
Apr 4, 2010


Average Bear posted:

A byz game is safe to play as long as you remove your cores that Byz separatists give you.

I just had this happen on the Genoese islands east of Turkey in a new Byz game and nothing bad happened. Just got the islands fine. So this info might not be completely accurate

AdjectiveNoun
Oct 11, 2012

Everything. Is. Fine.


Is it just me (or mac users in general), or is the mouse super hosed up now? Like just trying to move it to select anything causes random zoom and scrolling, and it's super irritating.

Lprsti99
Apr 7, 2011

Everything's coming up explodey!



Pillbug

axeil posted:

edit: And then Wiz came in to the "For the Love of God, Lower the Coring Cost" thread and left a great reply that just got them angrier:

Wait, I'm gonna need a link to that, I love game forums rage.

Baron Porkface
Jan 22, 2007


Why aren't my forts retaking enemy neighboring territory?

dead comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


Mans posted:

every big DLC turns the game into a comical disaster of bugs and glitches and i thank you all for buying it as soon as it was released and suffer through all those problems so they can be patched before i bother buying it.

i love you goons

Man considering how far Paradox has come in terms of testing, development and patching, I buy the major DLCs out of principle

I mean, I played the original Victoria. I have seen things in the dark.

RentACop
Feb 24, 2007



Node posted:

You just don't notice them. Like when the AI did not know how to explore on the El Dorado release.

These posts are forever stuck in my mind

Agnostalgia posted:

Okay, tried this new world thing as Cherokee this time. Things seem to be going pretty well, except. . .





I can't find any goddamned white people.

Arrhythmia posted:

*finger on monkey's paw curls down*

Lucky Samurai
Oct 4, 2011

Being jaded about something is so cool. You're just as useless as everybody else, but you get to be irritating and bitter about it.


Baronjutter posted:

I just bought 2 previous expansion packs at full price last night so I was "up to date" for today

If you bought them on Steam you could try abusing the new Steam refund policy like a rented mule.

I mean it's not really abuse I just wanted to use that analogy.

Drakhoran
Oct 21, 2012


So the game tells me I have +-x% chance of getting a heir for this or that reason, but does anyone know what the base chance of getting an heir is? I decided to try out the new parliament mechanics by playing England and now have lots of thorny roses making this a somewhat urgent question.

Bold Robot
Jan 6, 2009

Be brave.


AdjectiveNoun posted:

Is it just me (or mac users in general), or is the mouse super hosed up now? Like just trying to move it to select anything causes random zoom and scrolling, and it's super irritating.

It's all of us:

Trabisnikof posted:

There are OS X trackpad issues since the most recent patch, you can workaround them by using a mouse, but don't expect to play without one until they get fixed.

Spiderfist Island posted:

Yeah, I'm also having these trackpad issues as well, and to top it off the built-in keyboard shortcuts don't even work anymore. Plugging in a mouse makes zooming take forever now, and the game seems to be burning up my computer considerably more than it did previously.

Mac support has always been pretty iffy but this really blows.

axeil
Feb 14, 2006

MR KELLY AND HIS WILD RIDE ARE DEAD.

LONG LIVE CARSON WENTZ AND HIS WAWA BATHROOM EMPIRE




Toilet Rascal

Dear god. Austria allied France I have never seen this before and while I'd like to blame it on DLC bugs demons it doesn't seem to be the case.




Additionally, is it possible to get the PU with Lithuania if you don't do it in the first 3 years? I didn't realize I needed +1 stability so I feel like I screwed up...

Lprsti99 posted:

Wait, I'm gonna need a link to that, I love game forums rage.

https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...3#post-19439002

axeil fucked around with this message at Jun 10, 2015 around 02:26

Pellisworth
Jun 20, 2005

Hi, I am listening to the new Weepies album and sipping on some ice tea... with a slice of lemon, of course! Tomorrow I plan on growing a pair of ovaries.


So, uh, my game won't launch at all. I played as the Teutonic Order to try out the new Theocracy and fort/zone of control mechanics, got about 30 years in and quit for dinner. Now I cannot launch the game at all, despite having restarted my computer, Steam, and verifying the game cache twice.

Prop Wash
Jun 12, 2010


axeil posted:

Dear god. Austria allied France




Additionally, is it possible to get the PU with Lithuania if you don't do it in the first 3 years? I didn't realize I needed +1 stability so I feel like I screwed up...


https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...3#post-19439002

You can do it up until Lithuania loses their jagiellon King. I think it has to be the original King, but I forget, having just done it like two hours ago. Poland in this patch is fun. Hungary somehow allied Austria, France, Castile and Genoa but they haven't declared on me yet, so here's hoping Austria wakes up and remembers they actually hate France. I revoked Moldavia's March status so I can get some coastline and expand into the Crimean lands.

Now I'm just racing to tech 10 to be the commonwealth before Hungary, ottotams, Muscovy or the HRE stomp me.

edit: oh, and something's definitely going on with OPMs and fort maintenance. I was just watching the toggle for the Livonian Order's one fort click on and off repeatedly.

Prop Wash fucked around with this message at Jun 10, 2015 around 02:37

Futuresight
Oct 11, 2012

IT'S ALL TURNED TO SHIT!


OneTwentySix posted:

Maybe I'm just talking out of my rear end and the game is just fine and I'll get used to it; I'll have to play around with it some more and change up my strategies, but I just don't think it's a good idea to make war less rewarding when there's nothing to do in the game when you're not at war or planning your next war, and the changes to coring/annexing costs have done this. It might be more historical, but all I really care about is whether or not I'm having fun. I also like the idea that WC is possible, even if I don't do a WC (I enjoyed my one run when I did it, though). I can't imagine that you'd get very far on a WC as the game is now.

I'm running 1.11 "beta" right now because of this even though I bought the expansion. I play every game like I'm trying to conquer the world even though I inevitably won't and I've often run into times when I just couldn't afford to core things as non-western nations, so this change potentially sucks hard for my play style. I have some games to finish up anyway so I'll just wait and see what people think after a while playing on the new patch.

Pellisworth
Jun 20, 2005

Hi, I am listening to the new Weepies album and sipping on some ice tea... with a slice of lemon, of course! Tomorrow I plan on growing a pair of ovaries.


So I've tried the following:

restart computer
restart Steam
verify cache
start game from Steam library

x3 with no progress, nothing happens after trying to launch the game. Then I reverted to the last patch, re-downloaded this patch, tried the above. No luck.

Guess, uh, I'll wait a few days?

Edit: and I just redownloaded the entire game by hitting "delete local content," it still will not launch despite playing without any problems an hour ago.

I'm really disappointed that I'm literally unable to play the game. I can tolerate launch-day gameplay bugs, but what the gently caress?

Pellisworth fucked around with this message at Jun 10, 2015 around 02:59

Empress Theonora
Feb 19, 2001

She was a sword glinting in the depths of night, a lance of light piercing the darkness. There would be no mistakes this time.





10/10 GOTY

BgRdMchne
Oct 31, 2011

Put 'em up and tell
me that you love me.


Rincewind posted:



10/10 GOTY

Yes!

VDay
Jul 2, 2003

I'm Pacman Jones!


What's a good money sink early on in the game? Playing as Muscovy and am in that "Swallowed everyone around me, taking a nap while stuff cores" phase and have a bunch of gold saved up (1k+ with like an 11/month income). Most of my provinces are pretty bad so spending the gold on buildings seems like kind of a waste, and throwing up a bunch of forts just to have them seems like it's asking to be bankrupt from them later.

Is there some magic number for when a marketplace is "worth it"? I know obviously it'll always eventually be worth it, but is there an easy cutoff you guys use? Like if building it will add at least 0.10 income per month than go for it?

Broguts
Oct 16, 2014


Ever win a battle so decisive you actually feel bad? Like these Poles, Moldavians, and Lithuanians form a big 37 regiment stack to take out my glorious 20 regiment stack of brave crusaders of the Teutonic Order. The Slavs and Baltics made a few key errors: they crossed a river, I was on a hill,I had cannons while they did not, and my general was crazy good, like 4 shock, 3 fire, and 3 maneuver (no siege but whatever). What followed was a victory so loving incredible I wish I had screen capped it, I only lost about 5 thousand infantry and like a thousand cav, they lost a good 20 thou, RIP Poland.

dead comedy forums
Oct 21, 2011


VDay posted:

What's a good money sink early on in the game?

I suppose that is going to be a part of the early new DLC meta: figuring out what to do with money.

It kinda messes with the point of relieving monarch point costs of buildings because development, but you won't bother building stuff in poo poo provinces... I would say to save up the cash for mercs and forts to help your Siberian expansion and build an eventual big rear end fleet.

Futuresight
Oct 11, 2012

IT'S ALL TURNED TO SHIT!


My previous rule is to just save all the money. I'll eventually blow it on some stupidly costly campaign or sink it into advisors when there's no good cheap ones available or lose half my fleet or something like that. I figure having the money I need to take advantage of an opening or deal with a setback will create more value than a long-term cash investment since money on buildings can usually only earn you either more money you apparently didn't need or manpower you can replace with more merc use. With development in now I don't know if that's changed.

Volkerball
Oct 15, 2009
Probation
Can't post for 3 days!


Finally a sale! The DLC collection includes everything up until July 2014. For reference, it's between the release of Res Publica and the Art of War. I plan on snagging Art of War and El Dorado separately, but is their any other DLC after that timeframe that's important? In CK2, it mostly just unit packs and music and poo poo I don't care about.

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Prop Wash
Jun 12, 2010


Broguts posted:

Ever win a battle so decisive you actually feel bad? Like these Poles, Moldavians, and Lithuanians form a big 37 regiment stack to take out my glorious 20 regiment stack of brave crusaders of the Teutonic Order. The Slavs and Baltics made a few key errors: they crossed a river, I was on a hill,I had cannons while they did not, and my general was crazy good, like 4 shock, 3 fire, and 3 maneuver (no siege but whatever). What followed was a victory so loving incredible I wish I had screen capped it, I only lost about 5 thousand infantry and like a thousand cav, they lost a good 20 thou, RIP Poland.

No, the real key error they made was allowing the Teuts to survive to Cannon Times.

Also, learn from my dumb mistake: that shiny new Force Religion button works like a charm, but it does not guarantee by any means that your newly Catholic vassal will be able to convert their entirely Orthodox land.

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