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DaisyDanger posted:I've provided responses that should have been satisfactory, but you're scum and want to look innocent, so you continue prodding. You're still not under any real pressure since Met and I are the only ones who think you're full of poo poo at this point, but keep on trying to clear your name. I don't care how I look. I care about you putting your thoughts down. quote:Isn't that what you'd want for town to think? I think it's a worse play to make for town, actually. forestalling obfuscation in the sake of clarity is almost never a bad town play. quote:You didn't expect yourself or pmom to get lynched because "a chorus of people" were already calling you town and you just said pmom wasn't under any heat. You had nothing to lose as scum by bluffing as a town tracker, but you might gain trust from town. As town, you gain nothing by coming out as a tracker since neither you nor pmom were under pressure, but you lose the safety in anonymity of your town role. I already had town's trust. I don't gain anything. It's an illogical move for scum to make, and a good one for town. Acting as if trying to prevent mislynches is without value simply ignores the real meat of the game. Power roles and results don't win games. Good reads do.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:38
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Tremendous Taste posted:I already had town's trust. I don't gain anything. It's an illogical move for scum to make, and a good one for town. Acting as if trying to prevent mislynches is without value simply ignores the real meat of the game. If you gain nothing, why did you do it?
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Jul 2, 2015 18:39
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DaisyDanger posted:If you gain nothing, why did you do it? that's a bad attempt at a gotcha, considering (as scum) ought to have been reasonably assumed as so Tremendous Taste posted:
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Jul 2, 2015 18:42
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I've addressed what town gainsTremendous Taste posted:Acting as if trying to prevent mislynches is without value simply ignores the real meat of the game. Tremendous Taste posted:I was instead clarifying why I trust him to avoid a potential misdirection from a player I'm reasonably certain is scum.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:43
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I'm trying to not block post, but I'd like to get this out now town watcher should absolutely watch me tonight.There's a high likelihood that I am either roleblocked or killed.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:49
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Tremendous Taste posted:that's a bad attempt at a gotcha, considering (as scum) ought to have been reasonably assumed as so I didn't even think of it as a gotcha, because I honestly and genuinely believe you didn't gain fuckall AS TOWN from revealing your role. At the time you said you were town tracker, neither you or pmom were in any real danger. You still aren't! One vote against pmom and suddenly "I am the town tracker and pmom didn't visit anyone last night, so he's town!!" Total bullshit.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:52
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I call you out on that and your response is basically that roles don't mean poo poo and that's not how you win the game, but there you are, trying to use your role to save pmom when he doesn't even need saved.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:53
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Tremendous Taste posted:I'm trying to not block post, but I'd like to get this out now But roles don't mean poo poo so why would scum come after you? 
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Jul 2, 2015 18:54
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Taste, were you making poo poo up with that tracker claim yesterday? I'm sorry if you already addressed it but there were...a lot of posts.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:55
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Taste is not dying tonight, cmon.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:56
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DaisyDanger posted:I didn't even think of it as a gotcha, because I honestly and genuinely believe you didn't gain fuckall AS TOWN from revealing your role. At the time you said you were town tracker, neither you or pmom were in any real danger. You still aren't! One vote against pmom and suddenly "I am the town tracker and pmom didn't visit anyone last night, so he's town!!" You know the metaphor about trying to close the barn door after the horse has escaped? The lesson is to close it before. DaisyDanger posted:But roles don't mean poo poo so why would scum come after you? because they killed off kb first, which means they're going for good town players rather than the more sportsmanlike process of eliminating lurkers DaisyDanger posted:I call you out on that and your response is basically that roles don't mean poo poo and that's not how you win the game, but there you are, trying to use your role to save pmom when he doesn't even need saved. Don't try to put words in my mouth. Roles don't win games, but it's not like we have to ignore them. It's just that my life as a tracker is not worth a potential mislynch.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:57
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Propaganda Machine posted:Taste, were you making poo poo up with that tracker claim yesterday? I'm sorry if you already addressed it but there were...a lot of posts. No.
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Jul 2, 2015 18:57
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Pinterest Mom posted:Taste is not dying tonight, cmon. I think they have to. I'm going to get copped tonight, and you tomorrow, or vice versa, and we're both going to show town
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Jul 2, 2015 18:59
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Tremendous Taste posted:It's just that my life as a tracker is not worth a potential mislynch. I don't think I agree with this. You said you go by probabilities and not possibilities, so given that pmom didn't visit anyone, he's probably vanilla, right? He could be vanilla scum or vanilla town. If you are town like you say, you know with 100% certainty that you are town. Why wouldn't you save yourself over someone that is probably town, but not certainly? Hopefully all my terminology is correct.
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Jul 2, 2015 19:01
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I'm going to make one comment about yesterday and then move on. I'm going to say this as someone who might be completely new to Mafia, but who's been on the Internet since 28.8k modems. TT has almost 3 times as many posts in this thread than anyone else and as a new person it's tiring and irritating to scroll through a dozen or more posts from a single person just to get like 3 full sentences. I understand that it's his personal posting style, but if that's the way he wants to post then he can't sit there and act surprised/shocked/outraged when people call him out on it. Quite honestly, that style of posting just makes my eyes glaze over and skim past any type of argument Taste is trying to make. I feel like his arguments and reasons would be better served if he'd take a few minutes and put his thoughts into a single post rather than overwhelming the thread with posts. Now that all that is out of the way let's move on. Despite TTs claims yesterday, I am still highly suspicious of PMom and I haven't heard a compelling argument to change my assumption yet, so for the moment that's where my vote stays. Taste is still getting suspicious splash back from being close to PMom. I really want to figure out what's going on there, but I'm willing to wait for another day if necessary. Now as for other people, I just don't have the experience to get a read on people who haven't really posted much. However, I'll will say that it's interesting that EXAKT said his self imposed flavor was Hollywood Hulk Hogan because that character was Hogan's heel turn.
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Jul 2, 2015 19:01
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DaisyDanger posted:I don't think I agree with this. You said you go by probabilities and not possibilities, so given that pmom didn't visit anyone, he's probably vanilla, right? He could be vanilla scum or vanilla town. If you are town like you say, you know with 100% certainty that you are town. Why wouldn't you save yourself over someone that is probably town, but not certainly? I get what you're saying, but the lynch is the most important weapon the town has. A higher likelihood of a good lynch is more valuable to town than the harm from a higher likelihood of a nightkilled tracker. So while tracker>vanilla/bp, cleared town + potentially forestalled mislynch > anonymous tracker + anonymous town
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Jul 2, 2015 19:05
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Tremendous Taste posted:I get what you're saying, but the lynch is the most important weapon the town has. A higher likelihood of a good lynch is more valuable to town than the harm from a higher likelihood of a nightkilled tracker. Yeah I get that lynching is all we have, but pmom only had one person saying he was sort of scummy. You shut the barn door before you even had any animals in there.
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Jul 2, 2015 19:19
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I'd rather try to nab the fox before he's in the henhouse 
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Jul 2, 2015 19:21
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 I still think you're scum!
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Jul 2, 2015 19:37
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While I think Taste's argument against Met was a misreading of Met's point. I do agree that a lynch on Taste or PMom is probably incorrect right now. I don't however have a good read on anyone else. The most suspicious thing I've seen other than the Taste-Met fight is the Imgay-ANarc stuff from D1.
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Jul 2, 2015 19:38
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DaisyDanger posted:
That's a horse of a different color! garthoneeye posted:While I think Taste's argument against Met was a misreading of Met's point. I do agree that a lynch on Taste or PMom is probably incorrect right now. I like the avatar. I might case Narc but I'd rather not see Met get off.
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Jul 2, 2015 19:40
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Tremendous Taste posted:
Anyway Daisy's argument is making a lot more sense to me than yours. I don't understand closing the barn door when someone has all of one vote on them and it's D2. The added irony is the people that don't believe you're a tracker anyway. On the topic of the vote I still kind of like mine where I have it for the reasons stated earlier. I'm super amused by the idea that EXAKT scum slipped by roleplaying as heel Hogan though.
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Jul 2, 2015 19:55
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Fast Luck posted:There's definitely not one of those. Think of it as preventative medicine. A pre-emptive strike.
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Jul 2, 2015 20:04
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Tremendous Taste posted:Think of it as preventative medicine. A pre-emptive strike. So if you'd tracked me on N1 and I'd gone no where, would you have had my back when exakt threw a vote on me? I don't believe you would have, not even for a second.
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Jul 2, 2015 20:08
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If we had been interacting significantly and some scummy person was trying to throw suspicion on us both by association, yes
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Jul 2, 2015 20:16
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For the record I'm still pretty sure Taste is not a town tracker. I'd be willing to lynch him based on his play yesterday, this suspicion of lying, Daisy's case, and his buddying with pmom. ##vote taste
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Jul 2, 2015 20:58
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Daisy didn't case me.
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Jul 2, 2015 20:59
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Tremendous Taste posted:Daisy didn't case me. Not as an action. I believe ANarc meant the case (argument) Daisy laid out when you asked why she voted for you.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:08
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TMMadman posted:Not as an action. I believe ANarc meant the case (argument) Daisy laid out when you asked why she voted for you. Oh he knew what I meant. He's just trying to minimize her argument as nothing substantial or worth looking at.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:14
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This is a case: AnonymousNarcotics has floated through this game without posting much of anything of consequence. I'm going to detail literally every single post she makes. Use this as a read-along. Her confirmation post. This is where we'll start, of course. Town claim in first post, a bit dull but mostly innocuous. The next five posts are a series of fluff. The first game related post is here. It's of course a snipe that doesn't really address the point whatsoever. Again, it's D1, so we can give her a bit of a slide on this. Two posts later, however, we start to see a trend forming: AnonymousNarcotics posted:I am here and reading the thread but I have nothing to contribute. It's not out of the ordinary for taste to make some outlandish claim or accusation to test reactions so it's a null read for me. This doesn't say anything. It's total fence-sitting and basically just showing up to say "this thing is happening." That's faking content. AnonymousNarcotics posted:##vote imgay This is a bad vote. She halfway admits in the vote itself that it's a policy vote. I'm sure she'll justify it somewh- AnonymousNarcotics posted:I wouldn't say it's a bad vote, but it's definitely not a GOOD vote. Do you have something better? Oh. Yeah, you shouldn't be making votes you don't think are good. quote:Tbh after playing a few games with imgay I wouldn't mind him out regardless of his alignment because he doesn't play with town's best interests in mind. *This is my personal opinion based on experience please don't come at me for a bad argument. I don't care.*  That's super anti-town, c'mon. Throw in a couple more posts digging around old games to justify the vote you yourself claimed was bad , yuck. Jumping on the back of my pleading with Daisy to post and vote here. Again, this is faking content. Two posts making sure people know she's around for deadline follow. I don't like gotchas, but this strikes me as weird: AnonymousNarcotics posted:20 min before deadline. Lets go guys. I will switch to pmush if I have to. AnonymousNarcotics posted:I did not vote for pmush simply because she was hammered before I got a chance to. I was getting out of rehearsal and for a second completely freaked out bc I thought I missed deadline but it was only 9:58 and when I looked, hammer had already fallen. Those don't seem to mesh. quote:I'm gonna do a thread reread today and see if I can find anything that seems suspicious or scummy. This didn't happen. Everything from that point on is "this thing happened" wrt me and met, verging into metacommentary about behavior or prior game claims. It's faking content again. I'd rather vote met, but I'm reasonably sure Narc is scum also.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:20
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Tremendous Taste posted:Daisy didn't case me. 
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Jul 2, 2015 21:20
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AnonymousNarcotics posted:Oh he knew what I meant. He's just trying to minimize her argument as nothing substantial or worth looking at. No, a case is something entirely different. Daisy talked with me and explained why she felt why she did. She didn't campaign for my scumminess or detail why, only gave meta-theory.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:20
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You didn't. I don't mean to come across as mafia dad again but saying you don't believe someone's claim and speculating as to motivations isn't casing.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:21
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I'm sorry that I didn't compile all the scummy poo poo you've said into one post to convince people to lynch you. I shouldn't have to do that because my responses are already laid out and speak for themselves.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:23
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Tremendous Taste posted:Throw in a couple more posts digging around old games to justify the vote you yourself claimed was bad , yuck.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:24
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DaisyDanger posted:I'm sorry that I didn't compile all the scummy poo poo you've said into one post to convince people to lynch you. I shouldn't have to do that because my responses are already laid out and speak for themselves. your responses center on "I don't think you'd do this as town," "I think you'd do this as scum," and "you value roles differently than I do" also "you're mean" I guess I am actually sorry you're not putting a real effort in but w/e
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Jul 2, 2015 21:26
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Tremendous Taste posted:You didn't. I don't mean to come across as mafia dad again but saying you don't believe someone's claim and speculating as to motivations isn't casing. You come across like you think of yourself as King of Mafia. A massive chunk of your posts are about how other people aren't posting enough content or how they're bad players or how good you are. I'm pretty sure that's all a part of your game plan though- piss people off to the point of apathy so you can win arguments by default.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:26
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Fast Luck posted:She didn't have to really dig around to find that other game she linked to, because in that example he was screwing over her. Which also explains why she wanted to vote him. Multiple games, fluck.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:26
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Tremendous Taste posted:I am actually sorry you're not putting a real effort in but w/e See?
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Jul 2, 2015 21:27
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DaisyDanger posted:You come across like you think of yourself as King of Mafia. A massive chunk of your posts are about how other people aren't posting enough content or how they're bad players or how good you are. I'm pretty sure that's all a part of your game plan though- piss people off to the point of apathy so you can win arguments by default. A third of this game is hovering around modkill territory, and there are a bunch of newbies. It's not personal.
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Jul 2, 2015 21:28
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