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P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Stay a while, and listen!

Alright, so this is just a playtest, we're not gonna go hardcore into story-mode or anything, but if you have any basic character ideas in terms of goals or adventures you wanna go on, post it as a brief backstory thinger and I'll work on rolling those into the gameplay.

A lot of this playtest is going to be me figuring out how to handle Skill Usage in practice, and taking those results and making them into codified rules. Be prepared to get hung up by me being a lovely DMretconning things if the result is unfun. I also might test out Terrain Features as well as Items, so if your character wants to find a golden axe, or something, lemme know.

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Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.

quote:

Tara Pembroke
Class/Die: Ranger (d8)
Archetype: Hunter
Hit Points: 8/8
Defense: 1d20+1d8
Skills: AGIL, WIS, Athletics, Detection

Proficient Skill:Wilderness Guide
When you use a Class Skill, you have Expertise on the d20 roll.
When an ally uses a skill from your Class Skill list, you can roll your Class Die and add the result to the check

Iconic Ability: Twin Strike
Iconic Attack: Make an attack and damage roll, both with advantage, and use the result for two attacks; each attack must target a different enemy. You can use Twin Strike as a ranged attack only

Iconic Ability: Hunter’s Mark
[Concentration]
Special: Designate one enemy on your turn as your mark. While marked, an enemy cannot become Hidden from you. You gain Expertise on all rolls against your mark. You can mark a different enemy at the end of your turn, but cannot have more than one mark at a time.
Basic Attack: Until the mark ends, you can make a basic attack against that enemy any time they attack one of your allies.

Iconic Ability: Ambush
Skill: When you roll initiative, make two different checks; use the higher result to determine your turn order, but gain the benefits of both checks.
Engagement: [Sustaining] When you are not Engaged, enemies you successfully attack with a basic attack become Restrained. This effect lasts until you make an unsuccessful basic attack.

Speaking of adventuring goals and terrain features, this might be just the fact that I've been on a huge Ryuutama kick recently but I've got a proposition for a playtest scenario: namely, traveling between two major locations. It's sort of a mainstay of this genre of fantasy, the adventure where the biggest part of the adventure is spent traveling from one place to another. Stuff like the Hobbit and other examples of fantasy literature put a huge emphasis on travel and all of its different dangers, and most of that book is about the trip from one place to another, with a few stops in between.

Also, would allow for a variety of skill tests with very clear consequences for failure, in the form of random encounters and hazards.

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

If we're not really focused on storytelling I'll keep things short:

Never one for the conniving and backstabbing of his fellow Ratfolk,
Snikt has left his warren to pursue his dream of killing monsters for
fun and profit. While he's surprisingly direct (at least compared to most of his kin), he still has enough of the old Ratfolk cunning
to know when to fight and when to slink away into the shadows.

quote:

Snikt
Class/Die: Warrior (d12)
HP: 12/12
Defense: 1d20+ 1d12
Skills:
FORT (Swim, Climb, Run. Break Objects, Intimidate, Medicine, First
Aid, Wind Instrument)
AGIL (Balance, Tumble, Escape, Jump, Hide, Move Silently)
WIS (Animal Handling, Nature, Dungeon Survival, Perception)

Proficient Skills: Brute Force
When you make a FORT (Athletics) or FORT (Influence) check, roll your
Class Die and add the result to the check.

Iconic Ability: Rage
[Concentration]
When you enter a rage, you gain all of the following effects:
Attack: You can choose to enter a rage after making a basic attack.
Until the rage ends, you have Expertise on all attack rolls, and
Advantage on the damage rolls of your melee basic attacks.
Defense: You can choose to enter a rage before making a defense roll.
Until the rage ends, you have disadvantage on d20s when you make
defense rolls.
Skill: While raging, you can only use skills which are your Proficient
Skills, and you gain Expertise with those skills.

Iconic Ability: Cleave
Damage: When you successfully attack an enemy with a melee attack,
roll your Class Die and deal the result as damage to one other enemy
Engaged with you. If you are raging, deal this damage to all enemies
Engaged with you.
Special: At the end of any turn in which you Dropped an enemy, you can
make a free melee attack or FORT check against any enemy on the field.

Iconic Ability: Martial Superiority
Basic Attack: You have Advantage on your attack rolls for melee basic attacks.
Special: At the start of each of your turns, roll your Class Die. If
you are not raging, you can use this roll in place of any result you
rolled as part of a Trade-off, before the start of your next turn. If
you are raging, you can add this roll to the damage of any successful
attack you make, before the start of your next turn.
Special: You can choose to Power Attack after making an attack roll.
If you are not raging, you can choose to Counter-Attack after making a
defense roll.
Engagement: While you are not raging, if an enemy provokes from you,
you have Advantage on the damage roll. When an enemy Disengages from
you exclusively, they provoke from you.

Out of curiosity, what do monster stats in this game look like? Mages only have 4 HP, which tells me monsters aren't exactly making multiple 1d12 attacks each turn.

I like Ratpick's suggestion to try and focus on the journey, especially since that seems like it would make it easier on P.dot to focus things on skill checks and terrain.

I noticed that Warriors seem a little behind the other classes in terms of breadth of skills available, but make up for it by being very likely at succeeding with the ones they have. It'll be fun to see how that plays out in game!

Tenebrous Tourist fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Jul 28, 2015

Ergonomix
Apr 14, 2009

pffffff
Kanira grew up in a rough city and became a killer for hire thanks to a natural aptitude for it. Unfortunately that's not the kind of occupation that makes a lot of allies, so now she's traveling to get away from the business.

quote:

Kanira
Class/Die: Rogue (d6)
Archetype: Assassin
Hit Points: 6/6
Defense: 1d20+1d6
Skills: AGI (Balance, Tumble, Escape, Jump, Hide, Move Silently)
-DEX (Search, Thievery, Sleight of Hand, Stringed Instruments)
-CHA (Persuasion, Local Knowledge, Streetwise, Insight, Bluff, Disguise, Acting, Storytelling)
-Athletics (Swim, Climb, Run, Break Objects)

Proficient Skill: Jack of All Trades
You have Expertise on the d20 rolls of all skill checks.
When you use a skill that is not one of your class skills, you can roll your Class Die and add the result to the check.

Iconic Ability: Sneak Attack
Attack: You have advantage on attack rolls when you are Hidden or the target is Engaged with an ally.
(Assassin) Attack: You have Expertise on attack rolls when you are Hidden.

Damage: When you successfully attack an enemy, deal 1 Class Die of extra damage for each ally Engaged with the target.
(Assassin) Damage: When you successfully attack an Enemy that is not Engaged with you or any of your allies, you deal an additional 1d20 of damage.

Assassin Ability: Cloak & Dagger
Skill: If you roll initiative and become Hidden, enemies cannot spot you as part of their initiative check.
Engagement: When you successfully attack or defend against an enemy, you can also Disengage from that enemy, using no action to do so.
Engagement: You can make an AGIL (Deception) check to become Hidden (using no action to do so) at the end of any turn in which you either:
a) Dropped an enemy with an attack and you are not Engaged, or;
b) became completely Disengaged

I am in favor of a fantasy roadtrip. Also reminds me I should try and actually get some use out of my Ryuutama copy at some point. :v:

Ergonomix fucked around with this message at 00:05 on Aug 2, 2015

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

Jimmeeee posted:

Out of curiosity, what do monster stats in this game look like? Mages only have 4 HP, which tells me monsters aren't exactly making multiple 1d12 attacks each turn.

The short/broad answer is that the monsters are reverse-engineered from the PC stats, and ~generally~ do damage 1-2 points at a time; since you guys are doing more damage than that, the monsters (you guessed it) will have more HP than you. There's also "simple monsters" which need to be whacked either harder or more often to die.

A rough outline of the basic monster math is available here. I've changed it so that simple monsters do damage equal to their current Hit Dice, and the DM can have hits do more damage than just 1 HP for standard monsters, instead of having to rely on multiple attacks to make the math work.

P.d0t fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Jul 28, 2015

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
The Saga Begins

"Stop me if you've heard this one: A ranger, a rogue, and a warrior walk into a bar..."
The withered old man stops himself as he sees literally a ranger, a rogue, and a warrior walking in through the saloon doors. He was about to tell the world's greatest joke to some drunk imbeciles.

"Aw crap."



Yes, you all meet in a tavern. :dealwithit:
What do you do/what is the punchline of this joke?

Feel free to use Skills!

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

Snikt

Before the old man can collect himself (or continue with the joke), the brawny ratman blurts out the punch line:

"And the warrior says to the rogue, so that's where all my knives went!"

The armored creature immediately bursts out into chittering laughter. He looks over to the bartender and calls out,"Fetch me your strongest ale, man-thing! Nothing Dwarven, though. And pour one for my new friend here!"

As the bartender pours the drinks, Snikt sits down at the old man's table and surveys the crowd.

Perception check: I'd like to see if there's anyone more interesting than typical yokels in the bar.

Perception check=2. Don't suppose I have expertise on Perception?

Before the ratman gets too much of a chance to check out the crowd, the bartender arrives with two pints of ale. Snikt noisily gulps down his drink, lets out a high-pitched belch, and turns to the old man. "That was a great story. Know any others? Preferably with terrifying monsters and very preferably nonfiction?"

Now that we've gotten the worst roll possible in this system out of the way, hopefully it's smooth sailing from here on out!

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

Jimmeeee posted:

Perception check: I'd like to see if there's anyone more interesting than typical yokels in the bar.

Perception check=2. Don't suppose I have expertise on Perception?

:vince:

Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.

Jimmeeee posted:

Perception check: I'd like to see if there's anyone more interesting than typical yokels in the bar.

Perception check=2. Don't suppose I have expertise on Perception?

If it helps, you can add my class die to your roll, since you're using one of my class skills!

Class Die for Perception: 1d8 2

That's probably not much help, is it?

e: Adding a bit of narration here.

The ratman's companion, a no-nonsense woman dressed in hunter's garb, sits on a chair next to Snikt. While not steeling her senses to the same extent as Snikt, she tries to help him by trying to catch any details that Snikt may have missed. As Snikt starts trying to get the man to share a story, Tara simply sits back and listens expectantly.

Ratpick fucked around with this message at 12:14 on Jul 29, 2015

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Alright, so with his whopping Perception check of 4, Snikt gets this result

quote:

<10: setback

Probably it might be more helpful to describe this as "the DM gets to say what happens." Maybe. I mean, the DM gets to do that all the time, but if you're making a skill check, it's to take some narrative control.


So, what would a 'setback' at

Jimmeeee posted:

Perception check: I'd like to see if there's anyone more interesting than typical yokels in the bar.
look like?

Well, the opposite of finding anyone interesting, would be either not finding anyone interesting, or specifically finding very boring people.
Or maybe the existing yokels think you're looking at them funny and start to get uppity :v:


anyways, What's everyone else doing? If you wanna sit back and let this play out, that's cool.

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:

Alright, so with his whopping Perception check of 4, Snikt gets this result


Probably it might be more helpful to describe this as "the DM gets to say what happens." Maybe. I mean, the DM gets to do that all the time, but if you're making a skill check, it's to take some narrative control.


So, what would a 'setback' at

look like?

Well, the opposite of finding anyone interesting, would be either not finding anyone interesting, or specifically finding very boring people.
Or maybe the existing yokels think you're looking at them funny and start to get uppity :v:


These options are fine by me. Would you like me to pick one and roll with it? Or shall we wait for one of my co-adventurers to hop in? I can edit this post with my next action either way.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Since it's your roll, you can pick. I'm gonna assume other people would be doing different stuff, so I'll resolve that separately when we get to that bridge.

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:

Since it's your roll, you can pick. I'm gonna assume other people would be doing different stuff, so I'll resolve that separately when we get to that bridge.

That works for me! I'll go with the "supremely boring yokels" option then.

As Snikt guzzles down his drink, he can't help but feel he's being watched. He looks up from his pint to see nearly every pair of eyes in the room staring at him and his fellow adventurers. He gets the distinct impression that this area doesn't get outsiders very often. In fact, this may be the first time they've seen such a group of travelers before.

Quickly adjusting to his role as "the most interesting thing these yokels have ever seen," the hulking ratman stands up and shouts to the room,
"Attention locals! My friends and I are great heroes from far away lands! We find ourselves between adventures right now, so if anyone can point us in the direction of some action we would be very grateful. So grateful, in fact, that we'll pay for your drinks for the night!"

I'm going to do a persuasion check to try and get some helpful information out of the locals. I'm not proficient in persuasion but I can use Brute Force to add a d12 to the roll.

Persuasion check = 19! Note to self: always bribe the locals with free booze.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Alright, so let's clarify this, since you're doing it wrong :v: (but it won't effect the result because the difference between a 16 and 19 mechanically is literally nothing)

quote:

Proficient Skills: Brute Force
When you make a FORT (Athletics) or FORT (Influence) check, roll your
Class Die and add the result to the check.

When you see a Basic Ability combined with a Skillset, it means you have to use the specific skill(s) that fall under both domains.
That is to say, I wrote it in a really :spergin: way.

So what this means is you add the d12 to/are SUPER good at:
  • Swim
  • Climb
  • Run
  • Break Objects
  • Grapple
  • Intimidate

Now, if you had picked the Influence skillset for your Warrior, you would have Advantage™ on a Persuasion check, because it's part of that skillset. But that's still different from Proficient skills.


Jimmeeee posted:

Note to self: always bribe the locals with free booze. [/url]

It always works in Monster Hunters! :v:

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

Jimmeeee posted:

"Attention locals! My friends and I are great heroes from far away lands! We find ourselves between adventures right now, so if anyone can point us in the direction of some action we would be very grateful. So grateful, in fact, that we'll pay for your drinks for the night!"

I'm going to do a persuasion check to try and get some helpful information out of the locals.

Success!
After establishing himself as The Most Interest Man in the World (or at least the most interesting one these yokels will likely ever encounter) Snikt is able to get the cagey and utterly boring commoners to open up to him and tell of totally awesome adventures the party could go on.


Alright so Snikt wants to kill things and take their stuff; Kanira is kinda heading "anywhere but here"

You learn that down the road and at the bottom of the hilltop where the tavern is seated, there is a well that has mysteriously run dry. The locals are not overly reliant on it, but it is often used by travellers; the lack of water might screw up how they gauge their trips. It seems pedestrian to you, but it could be a sign of more sinister things to come.

Ergonomix
Apr 14, 2009

pffffff
Kanira sits at a table in the general vicinity of the other two, mostly just following the ratman because he makes a good distraction from herself.

"Interesting things often find their ways to the bottom of deep places, might as well check it out," She says half to herself.

Assuming we're going to head down there, I'll make a climb check. Since it's a class skill, I have Advantage, and my proficient skills gives me Expertise with all skill checks, so here we go: 15

quote:

When you see a Basic Ability combined with a Skillset, it means you have to use the specific skill(s) that fall under both domains.

Just so you know, this is the opposite of what the rules currently say:

"If a skill check calls for a basic ability AND a skillset, you gain your class skill benefit to the check if EITHER the basic ability or the skillset are on your class skill list."

Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.

Ergonomix posted:

Kanira sits at a table in the general vicinity of the other two, mostly just following the ratman because he makes a good distraction from herself.

"Interesting things often find their ways to the bottom of deep places, might as well check it out," She says half to herself.

Assuming we're going to head down there, I'll make a climb check. Since it's a class skill, I have Advantage, and my proficient skills gives me Expertise with all skill checks, so here we go: 15


Just so you know, this is the opposite of what the rules currently say:

"If a skill check calls for a basic ability AND a skillset, you gain your class skill benefit to the check if EITHER the basic ability or the skillset are on your class skill list."


I think what P.d0t meant was that if an ability calls for both a Basic Ability and a Skillset, that ability is only active for abilities that, by their narration, match a specific skill under both domains.

For an example, Snikt has the ability that allows him to add his class die on FORT (Influence) tests. The only skill under both domains is Intimidate, so to get the benefits of that ability he'd actually have to narrate his action as him bullying and intimidating people into doing what he wants.


Tara climbs down into the well with Kanira, all the while offering Kanira words of encouragement and warning. "Now, that brick there is loose, careful now, watch out for that vine there, it's dry as a twig." (Class Die for Athletics: 1d8 7, enough to push Kanira's check over 20!)

(However, Tara's own Athletics test: 2d20k1 14. In a combat situation a result of 10-14 would be "no change," but in a less strict narratively-timed environment how would you rule a result of 10-14?)

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

Thanks for clarifying this, P.dot. I read the rules on skills over a few times before the roll and interpreted the rules the same way as Ergonomix. Just to be clear on the intent of the rules, abilities that are listed as something like FORT (Athletics) or WIS (Detection) only apply to skills that fall within the intersection of those two, NOT on every skill that falls under either.

This makes a lot more sense to me, but I'd recommend re-wording the "Skills" section of the rules to make it clearer.

Out of curiosity, how would this work for something like the Initiative skill Check using Knowledge (INT or WIS)? Since I only have WIS (Knowledge) does that mean I can only use that initiative skill check in situations where our enemies only normally occur in nature or in dungeons (and not, for example, when fighting things like human soldiers)?



A dried-up well seem like a Druid's problem, not a warrior's, but Snikt will take what he can get. He nimbly descends into the well along with his cohorts.

Climb check = 23. Since I get a success with a bonus, could I use the bonus to assist Tara in her climb? Or do I specifically need something in my class skill that allows me to help other players like this?

As he drops to the floor, he turns to the others and whispers,

"I'm going to sniff around and see if I can find anything strange. Tara, could you keep your eyes peeled too?"

Snikt begins studying the floor of the well for tracks or animal droppings. His ears perk up and he begins sniffing the air, trying to detect hints of anything out of the ordinary.

I'd like to do a perception check to see if I can find a hint of any creatures down here that would be out of place at the bottom of a well.

Perception check = 7, womp womp. Setback time!

EDIT: P.d0t, I just noticed that with the Ranger's Wilderness guide ability it's basically always better for me to roll WIS checks and have Ratpick use their Wilderness Guide ability than to have Ratpick do the rolls themselves. Is this working as intended? It looks like Warriors and Rangers are the only ones with WIS as a potential class skill so maybe it would come up only rarely, but it feels like I'll end up stepping on the Ranger's toes a lot when it comes to ability checks.

Tenebrous Tourist fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Jul 30, 2015

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

Ergonomix posted:


"If a skill check calls for a basic ability AND a skillset, you gain your class skill benefit to the check if EITHER the basic ability or the skillset are on your class skill list."

Man, I wrote that? :wtf:

Ok so, to further clarify:
"class skill benefit" (as written here) is Advantage™ i.e. when you use a Class Skill, you roll 2d20k1. That's explained in a different part of the text, so MY BAD.

What this quoted text should mean, is if the check you want to make uses "FORT (Athletics)", you don't have to have FORT and Athletics as Class Skills, to have advantage on the check; either or will do.

In the case of the Warrior's Proficient Skills (not the same as class skills :siren: this is important) it says you add your class die to FORT(Athletics) and FORT(Influence). In this case, it's like multiplying fractions, where the broad skillset and the broad basic ability combined together make a narrower skill (or two or three). So Proficient Skills are a little bit spergy, and contradict the rules for Class Skills. I'll have to fix that.

:siren:Rules-As-Intended, the bonus d12 is basically meant to apply to just Intimidate, Grapple, and Climb, so if thinking of it that way is easier, go for it; I'll rewrite the text at some point.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

Jimmeeee posted:

Out of curiosity, how would this work for something like the Initiative skill Check using Knowledge (INT or WIS)? Since I only have WIS (Knowledge) does that mean I can only use that initiative skill check in situations where our enemies only normally occur in nature or in dungeons (and not, for example, when fighting things like human soldiers)?

Yeahhh... Combat-time skills and noncombat-time skills don't always perfectly line up, and this is one of those cases. I'll have to ponder this.

Jimmeeee posted:

EDIT: P.d0t, I just noticed that with the Ranger's Wilderness guide ability it's basically always better for me to roll WIS checks and have Ratpick use their Wilderness Guide ability than to have Ratpick do the rolls themselves. Is this working as intended? It looks like Warriors and Rangers are the only ones with WIS as a potential class skill so maybe it would come up only rarely, but it feels like I'll end up stepping on the Ranger's toes a lot when it comes to ability checks.
It's mostly intended for the situation of "everyone needs to make a check, only the Ranger has it as a Class skill" and thus can be used to help the whole party succeed. The interaction you describe is not unforeseen, but yeah, it's definitely more useful in the situation of "one person (who's already good at the skill) needs to make a check, and the Ranger also has it as a class skill."

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Alright, so since you're all climbing down, this is effectively a "Group Check"
How this is handled in the rules is currently undefined, but let's look at the results:


Ergonomix posted:

Assuming we're going to head down there, I'll make a climb check. Since it's a class skill, I have Advantage, and my proficient skills gives me Expertise with all skill checks, so here we go: 15

1 Success for Kanira

Ratpick posted:

Tara climbs down into the well with Kanira, all the while offering Kanira words of encouragement and warning. "Now, that brick there is loose, careful now, watch out for that vine there, it's dry as a twig." (Class Die for Athletics: 1d8 7, enough to push Kanira's check over 20!)

(However, Tara's own Athletics test: 2d20k1 14. In a combat situation a result of 10-14 would be "no change," but in a less strict narratively-timed environment how would you rule a result of 10-14?)

1 Success for Kanira 1 Success with Benefit for Kanira
1 "no change" for Tara


FINAL RESULTS:
1 Success for Kanira 1 Success with Benefit for Kanira
1 "no change" for Tara
1 Success with Benefit for Snikt


A logical interpretation of this would either be "the majority of the party needs to succeed for you to be fine" which you did, or else "you all need 1 success" which you could reasonably attain by spending 1 "Benefit"
Which one to use could be a dial by which the DM could turn the difficulty up or down. In this case, we'll say only a majority was needed to succeed.

This leaves you with 2 Benefits: what would you like as a Benefit? Off the top of my head, you could become hidden at the end of the group check, but I'll take other suggestions :)



Jimmeeee posted:

"I'm going to sniff around and see if I can find anything strange. Tara, could you keep your eyes peeled too?"

Snikt begins studying the floor of the well for tracks or animal droppings. His ears perk up and he begins sniffing the air, trying to detect hints of anything out of the ordinary.

I'd like to do a perception check to see if I can find a hint of any creatures down here that would be out of place at the bottom of a well.

Perception check = 7, womp womp. Setback time!

Alright, so let's let the action flow from the fiction, or whatever the gently caress they teach you in Dungeon World I've never read that poo poo :v:

Snikt was trying to sniff to find anything strange. A setback could be that he finds something completely normal/expected, or that he can't find anything at all (maybe because he's lost his sense of smell :stonk:)

Actually I think I like that :getin:

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:

Man, I wrote that? :wtf:

Ok so, to further clarify:
"class skill benefit" (as written here) is Advantage™ i.e. when you use a Class Skill, you roll 2d20k1. That's explained in a different part of the text, so MY BAD.

What this quoted text should mean, is if the check you want to make uses "FORT (Athletics)", you don't have to have FORT and Athletics as Class Skills, to have advantage on the check; either or will do.

In the case of the Warrior's Proficient Skills (not the same as class skills :siren: this is important) it says you add your class die to FORT(Athletics) and FORT(Influence). In this case, it's like multiplying fractions, where the broad skillset and the broad basic ability combined together make a narrower skill (or two or three). So Proficient Skills are a little bit spergy, and contradict the rules for Class Skills. I'll have to fix that.


This make more sense. Maybe you could clarify it by changing the notation on them? For the first case (needing one or the other to get advantage) maybe you could represent it with something like FORT/Athletics. Using the existing notation for the second case makes sense to me.

quote:

:siren:Rules-As-Intended, the bonus d12 is basically meant to apply to just Intimidate, Grapple, and Climb, so if thinking of it that way is easier, go for it; I'll rewrite the text at some point.

OK, just to check: my interpretation of the rules (including what you discussed above) is that I get to add a d12 on everything that is an intersection of FORT and Athletics or FORT and Influence. Looking through the rules, it seems like this is everything that would apply to:
In combat:
-FORT (Athletics) check to charge into battle and engage an enemy
-Grapple
-Intimidate (force restrained enemy to surrender)
Out of combat:
-Swim
-Climb
-Run
-Break Objects
-Intimidate

Hopefully I'm interpreting the rules as you intended, let me know if I missed something.


P.d0t posted:

It's mostly intended for the situation of "everyone needs to make a check, only the Ranger has it as a Class skill" and thus can be used to help the whole party succeed. The interaction you describe is not unforeseen, but yeah, it's definitely more useful in the situation of "one person (who's already good at the skill) needs to make a check, and the Ranger also has it as a class skill."

Gotcha. Do you mind if I brainstorm a little about some alternatives for this? My first thought is that the Ranger can add their class die to all skills that are the intersection between a proficient Basic Ability and a proficient Skillset. It looks like this would add a d8 to AGIL (Athletics) and WIS (Detection).

You could also make it so the Ranger can add their class die to other party members' skill checks, as long as the Ranger is proficient in the skill and the other character isn't. That would help encourage other players to vary their skills instead of doubling down on the ones the Ranger has.

Just some thoughts! I like it as it is, but it seems like it would make it a little too likely to succeed at certain checks.


P.d0t posted:

Alright, so since you're all climbing down, this is effectively a "Group Check"
How this is handled in the rules is currently undefined, but let's look at the results:


1 Success for Kanira


1 Success for Kanira 1 Success with Benefit for Kanira
1 "no change" for Tara


FINAL RESULTS:
1 Success for Kanira 1 Success with Benefit for Kanira
1 "no change" for Tara
1 Success with Benefit for Snikt


A logical interpretation of this would either be "the majority of the party needs to succeed for you to be fine" which you did, or else "you all need 1 success" which you could reasonably attain by spending 1 "Benefit"
Which one to use could be a dial by which the DM could turn the difficulty up or down. In this case, we'll say only a majority was needed to succeed.

This leaves you with 2 Benefits: what would you like as a Benefit? Off the top of my head, you could become hidden at the end of the group check, but I'll take other suggestions :)


Alright, so let's let the action flow from the fiction, or whatever the gently caress they teach you in Dungeon World I've never read that poo poo :v:

Snikt was trying to sniff to find anything strange. A setback could be that he finds something completely normal/expected, or that he can't find anything at all (maybe because he's lost his sense of smell :stonk:)

Actually I think I like that :getin:

Back to the game!

As Snikt drops onto the floor of the well, he silently presses himself against the wall, his dark fur letting him blend seamlessly into the shadows. When he sniffs the air, he comes to a disturbing conclusion: he can't smell anything. His mind reels as he realizes he can't even smell his companions standing right next to him. For a creature that relies on smell the way humans rely on sight, this is devastating.

The ratman's mind begins racing with possibilities. Could there be some creature that scrubs scents out of the air? Could the villagers have done something to purify the well that's eliminated all smell from the area as a side effect? Could there be some sort of (Snikt feels a brief shiver of fear go down his spine) magic at work down here? He shakes his head, as though to try and dislodge the petrifying idea from his thoughts. With a deep breath, he collects himself and tries to think rationally. He attempts to recall natural means that could remove all scent from an area like this.

Nature check = 15. Success!

Here's my interpretation of a success here: I'm able to recall a few natural effects that could erase scent like this, but I can't tell which one specifically caused this. Does that sound reasonable? If not I can edit the stuff below.

A few possibilities cross his mind. Ratmen grow some fungi that can filter scent out of the air around it. The fungus can be ground into paste and retain its effects, useful for an assassin trying to conceal themselves. There are also some predatory animals that release scent-suppressing pheromones so they can better sneak up on their prey. While both of those options carry their own risks, at least they're ones Snikt knows how to handle. Assassins and big predators can be killed just like anything else. Newly emboldened , Snikt begins pressing deeper into the well.

Dungeon Survival check = 20!

I was torn between rolling for Dungeon Survival and Move Silently here. I'm proficient in both so it won't change the roll. Since I got a 20, I'm treating the Success as "I maneuver successfully through the cave" and the Bonus as "I also do it silently". Is that in line with what you'd say?

After a lifetime of crawling silently through tunnels designed for Ratfolk half his size, Snikt is almost uncannily good at maneuvering underground. He effortlessly moves through the tunnels, leaving no trace and moving as quietly as is possible for someone of his size. As he approaches the end of the tunnel, he pauses to wait for his companions.

Tenebrous Tourist fucked around with this message at 13:51 on Jul 31, 2015

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
That all sounds good to me; we'll let the other player pick up from there.

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:

That all sounds good to me; we'll let the other player pick up from there.

Sounds good. Let me know if I'm doing too much on my turns, I don't mean to take the game over or anything.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Yeah, since we're in "Skill Challenge Mode" of the Exploration-flavour, I'd try and keep it to 1 skill check at a time; we should probably go "around the table" so to speak, where everyone declares a course of action they want to take/proffers a skill or skills they want to use, and then I'll resolve them in some order or another.

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:

Yeah, since we're in "Skill Challenge Mode" of the Exploration-flavour, I'd try and keep it to 1 skill check at a time; we should probably go "around the table" so to speak, where everyone declares a course of action they want to take/proffers a skill or skills they want to use, and then I'll resolve them in some order or another.

Works for me, I'll sit back for a bit. In the future I can end my turns with a die roll for you to interpret, if that's more helpful for figuring out skill check stuff.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Here's the updated text for skills; the annotation of "Basic Ability(Skillset)" can/will probably still have its usage refined, but mechanically this should convey the intent better:

    Each skill has 2 descriptors: a skillset and a basic ability. If your class lists a basic ability for its class skills, you gain advantage on all skills under that ability heading; if your class lists a skillset for its class skills, you gain advantage on all skills within that skillset.
    If a skill check calls for a basic ability AND a skillset, you gain advantage on the check if EITHER the basic ability or the skillset are on your class skill list.
    If a Proficient Skill calls for a basic ability AND a skillset, you gain the Proficiency benefit only to the skills that fall under both descriptors.

Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.
Tara is having a somewhat hard time keeping up with Snikt: these tunnels are much better suited for the nimble ratfolk than her, being more at home in the woods.

Tara stays a bit behind Snikt, letting him blaze the trail for them, trying her hardest to move as quietly as humanly possible. (Moving Silently: 2d20k1 17)

So, that's a no frills success, so Tara manages to move quietly behind Snikt. Also, doubles. I don't know why, but I feel like that should do something (not a serious suggestion, really).

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

Ratpick posted:

Tara is having a somewhat hard time keeping up with Snikt: these tunnels are much better suited for the nimble ratfolk than her, being more at home in the woods.

Tara stays a bit behind Snikt, letting him blaze the trail for them, trying her hardest to move as quietly as humanly possible. (Moving Silently: 2d20k1 17)

So, that's a no frills success, so Tara manages to move quietly behind Snikt. Also, doubles. I don't know why, but I feel like that should do something (not a serious suggestion, really).

They do! Doubles count as the maximum value on the dice, so you just got a 20!

Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.

Jimmeeee posted:

They do! Doubles count as the maximum value on the dice, so you just got a 20!

Oh, what do you know, you're right! I thought I'd read something like that in the rules, but I wasn't quite sure if I just dreamed that.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Yup! Rolling doubles when you have adv/dis is kinda annoying in 5e, so I added this stuff in:

SRD posted:

When you have Advantage:
  • roll 2 of the specified dice and use the higher result
  • if the rolls are tied, use the maximum number on the die as the result

When you have Disadvantage:
  • roll 2 of the specified dice and use the lower result
  • if the rolls are tied, use that number as the result, or make the roll again

If you have both Advantage and Disadvantage on a roll, you can either:
  • roll 1 of the specified dice, or;
  • roll 3 and take the middle result


Back to the Game

Snikt has a hunch that some sort of naturally-occurring phenomenon has plugged his sense of smell. He also manages to steathily bob and weave through the sewer-like tunnel system (a Rat-man? whodathunkit?) beneath the well, nimbly avoiding stepping on any poisonous flora and fauna.

Tara, the master assassin, is so stealthy that ________


I'll let Ratpick proffer a benefit for Tara, but it seems like we're starting to lean towards a couple options for "Success with Benefit"
1. You can give an ally a success on a skill (maybe limited to skills from your class list)
2. You can gain a success on a follow-up skill check of your own without having to roll (probably limited to skills from your class list)


any other request/suggestions?

Also, gogo Kanira!

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:


[i]
1. You can give an ally a success on a skill (maybe limited to skills from your class list)
2. You can gain a success on a follow-up skill check of your own without having to roll (probably limited to skills from your class list)


any other request/suggestions?

I like these as options. You could look into making it so you can bump an ally's roll up one "bracket", like from a setback to no change, or from no change to a success.

Have you considered adding a tier for 25+ rolls? It looks like most classes are capable of getting 25 or higher, it might be cool to have an extra reward for mega-high, unlikely rolls.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...

Jimmeeee posted:

Have you considered adding a tier for 25+ rolls? It looks like most classes are capable of getting 25 or higher, it might be cool to have an extra reward for mega-high, unlikely rolls.

"I rolled a 30. I cast Vance's Polysyllabic Incantation; we win the fight/skill challenge/whatever." :smugwizard:

Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.

P.d0t posted:


Tara, the master assassin, is so stealthy that ________

"Master hunter!" Tara half-shouts at the disembodied voice of the Game Master narrating events, almost forgetting that she's supposed to be quiet.

P.d0t posted:

I'll let Ratpick proffer a benefit for Tara, but it seems like we're starting to lean towards a couple options for "Success with Benefit"
1. You can give an ally a success on a skill (maybe limited to skills from your class list)
2. You can gain a success on a follow-up skill check of your own without having to roll (probably limited to skills from your class list)


I'm thinking number 2, success on a follow-up skill check.

As Tara reaches the end of the tunnel she whispers to Snikt: "Let's stay put for a while: I'm pretty sure we're not the only ones to have come this way, so I'll just poke my head around the corner and see if I see or hear something."

Using my auto-success on Perception.

Ergonomix
Apr 14, 2009

pffffff
Well I'm going to go ahead and do what the cool kids are doing and sneak: 8

:yikes: I'm the greatest rogue. Is the setback a trap? I bet it's a trap.

P.d0t
Dec 27, 2007
I released my finger from the trigger, and then it was over...
Alright so while Kanira the Rogue fails at trying to Move Silently, Tara the Hunter succeeds at Moving Silently and then at Perceiving... something.

meanwhile:

Jimmeeee posted:

As Snikt drops onto the floor of the well, he silently presses himself against the wall, his dark fur letting him blend seamlessly into the shadows. When he sniffs the air, he comes to a disturbing conclusion: he can't smell anything. His mind reels as he realizes he can't even smell his companions standing right next to him. For a creature that relies on smell the way humans rely on sight, this is devastating.

The ratman's mind begins racing with possibilities. Could there be some creature that scrubs scents out of the air? Could the villagers have done something to purify the well that's eliminated all smell from the area as a side effect? Could there be some sort of (Snikt feels a brief shiver of fear go down his spine) magic at work down here? He shakes his head, as though to try and dislodge the petrifying idea from his thoughts. With a deep breath, he collects himself and tries to think rationally. He attempts to recall natural means that could remove all scent from an area like this.

Nature check = 15. Success!

Here's my interpretation of a success here: I'm able to recall a few natural effects that could erase scent like this, but I can't tell which one specifically caused this. Does that sound reasonable? If not I can edit the stuff below.

A few possibilities cross his mind. Ratmen grow some fungi that can filter scent out of the air around it. The fungus can be ground into paste and retain its effects, useful for an assassin trying to conceal themselves. There are also some predatory animals that release scent-suppressing pheromones so they can better sneak up on their prey. While both of those options carry their own risks, at least they're ones Snikt knows how to handle. Assassins and big predators can be killed just like anything else. Newly emboldened , Snikt begins pressing deeper into the well.

Dungeon Survival check = 20!

I was torn between rolling for Dungeon Survival and Move Silently here. I'm proficient in both so it won't change the roll. Since I got a 20, I'm treating the Success as "I maneuver successfully through the cave" and the Bonus as "I also do it silently". Is that in line with what you'd say?

After a lifetime of crawling silently through tunnels designed for Ratfolk half his size, Snikt is almost uncannily good at maneuvering underground. He effortlessly moves through the tunnels, leaving no trace and moving as quietly as is possible for someone of his size. As he approaches the end of the tunnel, he pauses to wait for his companions.

Alright, so let's say Kanira steps on some totally not-poisonous (:v:) mushrooms; how about Disadvantage on your next Action? Turns out these are the fungus that is blocking Snikt's sense of smell.

Let's say Tara's perception notices some kind of hideous bog hag that was trying to hide from you guys.


WHAT DO YOU DO?

Tenebrous Tourist
Aug 28, 2008

P.d0t posted:

Alright, so let's say Kanira steps on some totally not-poisonous (:v:) mushrooms; how about Disadvantage on your next Action? Turns out these are the fungus that is blocking Snikt's sense of smell.

Let's say Tara's perception notices some kind of hideous bog hag that was trying to hide from you guys.


WHAT DO YOU DO?


I'm guessing this means fight time! Quick strategy talk: if I do the "charge in" initiative ability my result will likely be extremely high, since I roll with advantage and add a d12 since it's a class skill. Hopefully my turn will come before Kanira's, so I can attack and disengage before she does her sneak attack.

Eager for a fight, Snikt barrels into the cave towards the bog hag, letting loose a piercing battle cry.

Initiative check (Charge) = 29. I'm guessing this means I go first. I'm choosing to become engaged with the hag.

Since my initiative result is so high, I'm guessing I'm first in the turn order. If someone beats me, I can edit this out until after they take their turn. Is that ok?

First things first: Martial Superiority roll.


Martial superiority = 8.

Before the hag can get out of the ratman's path, Snikt smashes his shoulder into the hag, pushing her off-balance. In one practiced motion, Snikt draws his sword and executes an upward diagonal slash across the hag's torso.

Attack roll = 16, that's a hit!

I'm choosing to power attack, so I'll do that roll before my damage roll. Hopefully this doesn't make me miss.

Power attack trade-off = 5,5. These simulated dice are on fire right now.

Since the results are tied, I add 12 damage to my attack damage and only lose 1 off my attack roll. Not bad! Up next is the damage roll.

Damage roll = 8.

So I hit the hag for 20 damage total. I like this combat system! After my attack, I'll use my move action to disengage from the hag.


Snikt puts a huge gash in the chest of the monstrous creature. She swings her inhumanly long arms at the ratman as a retaliation, but he skitters out of her reach with uncanny speed. As he backs away from the monster, he chitters with laughter as he positions himself for a counter-attack.

Ergonomix
Apr 14, 2009

pffffff
Kanira can't believe her clumsiness as she coughs at the spores released by the mushrooms. She hears the sound of fighting and tries to blend into the shadows and assess the situation.

Since I got Disadvantage on my next action, but I would have Advantage, it balances out so I'll just roll 1 die. I still have Expertise as a Rogue, though. And I got 6. Unless the Bog Had manages to do worse, I guess Kanira is just standing nearby in an awkward sneaky pose.

Ratpick
Oct 9, 2012

And no one ate dinner that night.
We rolling Initiative now? Alright, we rolling Initiative now.

The Next Project posted:

Iconic Ability: Ambush
Skill: When you roll initiative, make two different checks; use the higher result to determine your turn order, but gain the benefits of both checks.

I really like this ability, by the way, especially given how Initiative checks are skill checks. Let's see.

As Snikt charges into the fray, Tara opts for a more careful approach, staying behind in the shadows a safe distance away, while also keeping an eye out for further danger. There's never just one monster, right?

(Initiative with AGIL (Deception): 2d20k1 16, Initiative with WIS (Detection): 2d20k1 11)

However, since I rolled a 1 on the other die for my WIS (Detection) check, it counts as a 20 because of expertise. So, my Initiative is 20, Tara is Hidden, and she also spots any one Hidden enemy with an Initiative lower than 20. Like, I don't know there are Hidden enemies, but I'm guessing maybe?

e: Just a question: my initiative is 20, but for the sake of me being detected does my Initiative count as 20 or 16 (the roll I made for the AGIL [Deception] check)?

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gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010

HELL SERPENT
Lipstick Apathy
If I could get slotted in after the current combat or next convenient junction:

pre:


Djeni, the Man-who-Walks

Class: Knight-Paladin
Class Die: d10
Class Basic Ability: FORT
Class Skillsets: Influence, Detection
Today's HP: 10/10 (http://invisiblecastle.com/roller/view/4839110/)

Class Abilities:
Holy Aura
Zeal
Lay-on-Hands
Djeni's father told him during his coming-of-age ceremony that "a man is only as strong as those he protects". He took those words to heart and went out into the world with a strong hand, a brave heart and a willingness to face peril for the sake of his companions.

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