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Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
So, I have a question about the license sperging: what's the difference in practice for these digital entitlements?

For example, I finally got win10 just this weekend. Did a clean install on a new SSD. The key I used was the "7 Pro OA" key from a laptop that I'm getting rid of -- it activated no questions asked, no call to MS support needed. (The laptop still has 7 so technically I'm violating for the next few weeks but I've turned off updates on that so it won't try to get 10 by itself.)

At some point I'm gonna rebuild this desktop with a new CPU, mobo, etc, but the SSD that win10 is on will carry over. Based on past experience that means it will de-activate itself. When that happens, will I need to:
* Call MS and do some challenge-response code
* Buy a real Win10 key
* Something else?
* Nothing because new CPU/Mobo/RAM won't gently caress me if I keep the SSD exactly the same

This hypothetical rebuild will not happen until winter so the free upgrade period will be over.

________________


Unrelated question: what are some actual useful thing to do with tiles? I'm not totally opposed to this new start menu, but other than weather and news is there anything functional that makes use of dynamic bling?
(I don't need an email notifier, already got a very nice desktop background app for that.)

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Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Avenida posted:

This battle was lost the moment we, as consumers, accepted "replacing components sometimes makes it count as a different PC" as a reasonable assertion.

Nobody ever accepted it, but MS also never enforced it until now. At most they just made you call and pinky-swear that you were following the license rules.

This situation now where they can say "well you got it for free" is the only time they can get that trojan horse through the gates. Hopefully there will be pushback as soon as people get their computers turned into pumpkins.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Gray Matter posted:

I dunno, I did the direct upgrade from 7 in January and had about 2 weeks of using 10 before I left the country. I'm doing a format/clean reinstall when I get home. Seems like there was a whole lot of apps and bullshit in the start menu tiles they were trying to sell me. I just want it to look like 7 instead of the goddamn Google play store.

W10 does come with a bunch of included apps, but not really any worse than previous windows. Though solitaire becoming a F2P game is its own category of awful.

The only thing I was peeved about is that you can't remove a lot of that stuff from the start menu. If I never saw it, I wouldn't care that "Groove Music" is on the HD. But you can't even hide it. That seems to be the case for all of the new Universal Apps - they just show up, you can't move them or put them in sub-folders in the start menu. Annoying for those of us who are OCD about cleaning up the start menu.

On the positive side, the built-in apps seem a lot less integrated into the core of the OS now. You can remove them completely with relatively little effort, compared to XP & 7's protections. Just follow these powershell instructions:

https://thomas.vanhoutte.be/miniblog/delete-windows-10-apps/
http://mikefrobbins.com/2015/08/20/remove-app-packages-from-windows-10-enterprise-edition/


The ones that are just advertising to get office can be uninstalled with no extra effort though, just right click -> uninstall.

Klyith fucked around with this message at 18:44 on Jul 15, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Arsten posted:

They come back with a lot of updates, unfortunately. I removed the mail and contacts apps because it was linked to a Microsoft account and you couldn't get it to not scream that you were getting emails, even if you had never opened the Windows email program. "I use Outlook with a bunch of accounts, I don't need to be notified four times for each email, thanks." You can't turn them off - by design. So I uninstalled them.

But they keep coming back and the Microsoft account itself will start telling me three times that spam has come in.

Did you use the full Remove-ProvisionedAppxPackage, as in the second link? The first one with Remove-AppxPackage only removes apps from the user account -- they're still on the computer and I could see them re-appearing easily.

Nothing's come back for me yet, but I've only had W10 for two weeks so far. I'm kinda expecting them to re-appear in the Anniversary Update though. If it happens I'll probably make a ps script to one-click remove all the ones I don't want.



Also so far I'm finding the whole UWP App "just works" thing to be pretty laughable. For some reason Mail & Calendar were crashing at launch 100% of the time, until I removed them and reinstalled from the Store. But first Store was crashing every time I tried to download anything without a MS log-in, and I had to reboot it before it would accept one without crashing. :laffo: (Using an old hotmail burner now, maybe I'll make a real MS account and do the whole tie-in to Windows if that will allow me to extend my upgrade license digital entitlement across a hardware rebuild.)

Great job MS, this is a big step forward from exes & dlls! I'm glad we're leaving all that old and busted stuff behind!

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Robo Reagan posted:

honestly feels like google and microsoft should be paying me

I'm fine with payment in free services.
Not as fine with Win10's free upgrade! being more like "rent with the option to buy".

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Grog posted:

Is there any specific information yet about how the Anniversary Update account-linked licenses are going to work with hardware upgrades? All I've read so far has been kind of vague and unsure about whether it'll work for major component changes.

My sister's in the situation where she wants the free upgrade to 10, but she also wants to upgrade the parts in her system soon (motherboard, CPU, RAM, main drive). Will the license work if she does that account linking process, then does a fresh install on the newly upgraded parts and goes through the activation troubleshooter? Or is it still unknown at this point? e: To clarify, I'm just talking about one system using her license in the end.

All still unknown, the stuff about account linking was on the insider blog -- so official -- but vague enough to leave plenty of "that's not what we meant" room to walk back. And they've not responded to any of the legion of reporters asking for clarification. After the terrible messaging a year ago (like when real MS employees were saying 7&8 keys would become 10 keys and work forever) you shouldn't count on anything we see it happen for real.

I figure with the way that MS has been just so hosed up about consumer strategy the last few years, even as we speak there are 30 executives all screaming about which way to actually have it work, and how to release the news.


But snag a 10 upgrade on the old machine and link an account just in case.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Rexxed posted:

If your SSD is full it's probably having a lot of write amplification. It's probably time to quickly buy a new one, image your old one to it, expand the volume and do your upgrade.

kinda depends. if it's a Sandforce controller (likely) it isn't really "full" due to compression, and a drive that's not getting much data written to it won't have many writes to amplify. instead of just blindly saying he should buy a new one on zero evidence, I'd recommend getting CrystalDiskInfo and seeing what it says about drive health.

Though SSDs are so cheap these days, an upgrade to 120gb is really a no-brainer for $40.

chippy posted:

So, I've just noticed that Windows 10 doesn't have Libraries and has gone back to the old way of just having a special 'Pictures' (etc.) folder which you can set as any folder if you want. I never really used it but I always assumed other people found it useful, did they say why they removed it?

I feel like they were only useful for a small part of the audience. They're nice if you like to organize files in different locations, but if you look at the average user's desktop you know that filesystem organization is an unknown concept.

But they're still there if you want to use them. You can also hide the folder shortcuts in my computer to cut the overlap.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Avalerion posted:

But there does not seem to be a way to put them on the left, right? Or am I just missing something? I can move the icon around on the right half but if I try moving it to the left there will a red stop circle on it.

Basically want to use that free gray space under my profile pic and above those folder links, like this: http://i.imgur.com/Y1ZSe14.jpg

right-click -> more -> don't show on this list

repeat until the most used list has only things you use

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Arsten posted:

In order to get the free digital entitlement, you need to install over an activated copy of windows.
Not for months and months. I installed 10 to a blank SSD, using nothing but a 7 key. The drive that had 7 on it was sitting on a table at the time.


Knifegrab posted:

I also used magical jelly bean to get my cd key of my old windows 7 installation.
Knifegrab: is the PC you are upgrading where you got the 7 key a laptop or OEM (Dell/HP/Lenovo etc) computer? If so, that "key" is likely not the real one, and you need to find your actual key, the one printed on a sticker.


(Basic explanation is that major builders used to have a pre-activated OS image that they could install to all their models with the same hardware, and so they all have the same dummy key that won't work outside that initial image. The key stickers were there for when people needed to reinstall, there wasn't any step at the factory to put them into the OS. More recently in the Win8 days the OS does have a real key, because they figured out how to put keys into the BIOS chip. And the key in the BIOS is the same as the sticker.)

Klyith fucked around with this message at 21:42 on Jul 23, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Suaimhneas posted:

I know this was already debunked, but is there any downside to doing it this way if I'm not changing HDs or anything?
Not at all.

In fact, there is an option during the upgrade process to change what is kept. Check step 17 in this tutorial. If you say to keep nothing, it will be drat close to a clean format install. Windows will be activated and there will be a 'windows.old' folder with the previous OS backup, nothing else. Back up your stuff first obviously.

Or later on, the Reset + Remove Everything is effectively the same as formatting & reinstalling, just without install media or needing to reactivate or anything. Totally automated.



Even if you do the most standard upgrade that keeps all your programs and files, it feels like a lot of Win10 issues don't need a format + reinstall to fix these days. The cruft builds up in the user profile not the OS dir. A fresh user profile solves many problems.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Shalhavet posted:

I play older games and windows 10 refuses to even consider letting me register or install DirectX 9 libraries. d3dx9_38.dll is the main culprit, but xactengine3_6.dll (this one causes a fatal error trying to use the web installer for 9.0c) and x3daudio1_7.dll have also shown up. Any suggestions, or am I going to have to set up a VM which will kinda defeat the purpose of having a 1080.

Are you not using the DXSetup installer for 9.0c? Get the 2010 redist here. (Or just look in the your steam folder, basically every drat game comes with it. Just search SteamApps\common\ for "Jun2010_d3dx9" and run the dxsetup.exe in one of those folders.)

All you need is to run the installer as admin. If the os is preventing it from installing there is something wrong with your system.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

then I'm gonna go with something wrong with either the redist files or the os. redownload it, and if that doesn't work you may need a reset.

I literally just installed 9c on windows 10 myself after looking at your earlier post. it worked fine. morrowind now works without complaints over d3d9 dlls.

(I hadn't tried playing an old game since upgrading to 10 until now, was actually under the impression that win10 came with dx9.)

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

chippy posted:

Yeah I did. Ok, I'll have a root around in there, and test the RAM too. Sleep has has been working for years on Windows 7 though, did that not use S3 or something?
If it was sleeping in a way that all the fans and everything turned off then yes that was S3. It's a bog-standard thing that's been around for a decade.


TBH is feels a little more like something wrong on the mobo/BIOS side, or even a coincidental hardware failure, the way that you get instant power on power off like that. Windows stuff like the AHCI HD driver wouldn't even be coming into play. Check your bios options for boot & power save areas, disable things like fast boot that might be interfering.

(also you can try setting it to use S1 sleep, just to check if that works. S1 is the sleep mode where everything is put into minimum-power state but not actually turned off. If that works fine, I would be suspicious of the PSU. If it doesn't work, I'd continue to look at BIOS & OS stuff.)


edit: if you need help finding these options, say the mobo model and I can look up the manual for where to go. now that everybody has a GUI in their BIOS things are a lot less standardized.

Klyith fucked around with this message at 22:05 on Jul 26, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Mr. Wynand posted:

My current win7 is on an SSD that's already close to capacity. How much room will Win10 need to install? Will it be reasonably simple to get rid of the win7 leftovers after? (like windows.old?)
Supposedly it required at least 10gb free for the upgrade, but I think that's an optimistic estimate with the install process cleaning out redundant stuff from the old OS. Other people have said they needed more.

On an SSD I would make all efforts possible to free up at least 15-20gb of extra space. Unless the SSD is already over-provisioned, being out of room when doing 10-15gb of writes is bad for it. Run disk cleanup, move stuff to a different drive or even thumbdrive, get rid of a steam game or two. Get a HD visualizer and find what's taking up all the space.

quote:

With the in-place upgrade do most applications remain available in the new windows without having to reinstall? I pretty much just use Steam (and its many games), Chrome and Sublime Text.
Steam needed a semi-reinstall but the client did everything for itself the first time I tried to launch it. Automatically went to the right location, didn't even need to delete blob files this time.

Chrome you can just copy over your User\AppData\Local\Google folder over to a new user profile. Open chrome and clear the cache, that will also help free up some space for your upgrade. (settings -> advanced -> clear browsing data -> cached images and files)

Sublime Text I can't say, I use it but have it installed as a portable app. The program itself shouldn't need to be reinstalled though.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Jewel Repetition posted:

Also can everyone check if their Windows 7 systems actually sleep right and it's not a universal problem? Because I put mine to sleep every night and that would be crippling to me.

Worked fine in 7 a few weeks ago, works exactly as fine in 10 now.

I have a mobo with UEFI type bios but all of the UEFI boot features turned off, because I enjoy seeing some old dos text when my pc boots up. Using the windows device manager to turn off the mouse for waking the computer did just that. That's everything on my list of sleep needs.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Arsten posted:

Basically, you can only get to a low level of tracking and reporting back to Microsoft via the settings app. (I think it's called Telemetry only?) With the policy editor, you could disable it entirely.

Well, now, if you care about your privacy you can no longer disable it completely this way.

HMS Boromir posted:

I've already resigned myself to Microsoft stealing all my worthless personal info. It's stuff like the "tips" and suggested apps that you can already turn off via settings that threw me off.

Basic telemetry & privacy isn't even the issue, apparently that policy isn't even changed so you can still disable all reporting if you want.


All 4 of these specific things they changed are places that they can show advertisements. Store and "consumer experiences" already are ads. The lock screen and windows tips have big potential for ads -- probably they'd do semi-subtle ones like "our app of the week is _____" (insert high bidder), not turn your lock screen into a mcdonald's hamburger ad.

The way that they're removing the gpedit settings first is what makes me most suspicious, especially when 2 of them don't really do anything ATM. That's the boiling a frog approach. Get rid of the thing that only nerds know about right now to reduce the pushback, turn on ads later when they have more lock-in. And crucially, they aren't taking away anything that the :tinfoil: privacy people will throw a fit over.

Anyways I'm not massively worried, I bet that people will find ways to hack any lock-screen ads about 10 minutes after they come out. The only really annoying one right now is the consumer experiences one, since that's the thing to prevent candy crush from getting pushed to your start menu.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

el_caballo posted:

So if a Windows 10 install is activated (in place upgrade from 8.1 Pro) but does not say "digital entitlement," it needs to be wiped and reinstalled before the 29th?

Using ProduKey, I can see I have a generic 10 Pro key. Entering my 8.1 key off the key card results in a 0xc004e016 error. All the Win 10 installs that I've done clean on a freshly formatted drive say "digital entitlement."

My Computer -> Properties: says just "windows is activated" and a product ID

Settings -> Update & Security -> Activation: says "windows 10 on this device is activated with a digital entitlement"

mobby_6kl posted:

Lol so of course I finally upgraded to 10 right before the news about removed policies came out. Guess who's never installing AU now!

welp better roll back to your old windows then because updates aren't optional unless you have the Enterprise version

but really I would just chill out, somebody will figure out how to hack some dll so those policies can be re-implemented (or block the address where ads come from, or completely remove cortana). MS has never yet made something locked down enough to keep out a bunch of annoyed nerd refuseniks.

Klyith fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Jul 29, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

el_caballo posted:

Just thought it was odd that out of the half-dozen PCs I've installed 10 on over the past year, only my main desktop is missing the entitlement text. If it doesn't get entitled, I'm going to hurt myself. I have a plan.

Psssh, quit acting so entitled about it. :v:


But if you're activated and don't have a digital entitlement maybe that's a good thing? Digital entitlements from free upgrades are the lowest rung of license. Maybe you have something better than entitlements! If it's a new-ish PC with an OEM license, maybe it was supposed to get a Windows 10 upgrade anyways even if they hadn't been giving them away for free? I know that's been a thing during the Vista->7 and 7->8 transitions.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Mourne posted:

Hey guys -- I could use a hand with this situation. I upgraded a windows 7 think pad I got from school to windows 10. After the upgrade finished it kicks me to the login screen and I have two accounts Administrator and now Manager. When I type my old windows 7 password into administrator it says that the administrator account has been disabled and it wants a password for the manager account it just created during the windows 10 install. I never created a password for the Manager account.

I can't even get into safe mode. When I try to boot in safe mode it says the administrator account's name and password are incorrect and it leaves me at the login screen asking for the manager account password. I also can't do an image restore or reinstall because windows wants the manager account password.

Where the hell do I start? Do I need to find a copy of windows 10, format the drive, and start fresh? I'd hate to lose everything on that drive. I know I could fix this if I could get to a command prompt but it won't let me.

Any ideas would be much appreciated.

Your files are still there and if all else fails can be extracted by getting a bootable linux USB/CD and copying them off. This is your warning that anything you don't make backups of = you don't really care about.

1. Use a different PC to download the Windows 10 media tool to make a bootable USB stick with the installer & recovery stuff.
2. Using that you can try a couple options, I'd start with this as the simplest method which should re-enable the local administrator account, but falling back to either this more complicated one or just using the win10 "reset PC" option from the recovery media (be sure to keep files).


What user account did you use on 7? If it was the default "Administrator" one, you need to stop doing that. edit: oh or it thinks it's on a domain, that should be fixable too as soon as you get admin.

Klyith fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Jul 29, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Mourne posted:

Yup, on 7 it was the default Admin.

OK it may just be that then. Did you try logging into "Manager" with your previous admin password, or just blank no password? Basically since admin is supposed to be a restricted thing on 7 and up, the upgrade might have done one of two things: moved all user settings over to Manager including password, or made a new administrator-privileged account with no password because Administrator was taken and locked with a password.

But once you can get access to safe mode or normal log-in with a recovery USB you can look to see if it's still set up for a domain with system properties -> computer name and workgroup/domain



And please interpret my somewhat curt & harsh instructions and reprimands as "stern teacher voice", not a you stupid idiot type thing. It's not exactly made clear why windows wants you to do the things it does, and using administrator is an easy shortcut to make something work that was set up for a domain before. Used to be pretty much fine in the XP days too.

The backups thing is for real tho, a $10 USB stick is good enough for basic backup of things that are really important. For anyone else reading the thread this is a teachable moment!

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Mourne posted:

Edit: Any idea where to look for the documents for the Admin profile? I checked C:\Users\Admin, Default.migrated, and Public and there's nothing.

Documents are hopefully in windows.old, there should be a users folder in there.

I guess there's a possibility that upgrade doesn't save stuff in Administrator because it's supposed to not have user stuff in it, which would suck for you. If not in windows.old or any user folder it may be gone.

Mourne posted:

But lusrmgr.msc brings up a screen that says "This snapin may not be used with this edition of Windows 10." It wants me to go through user accounts in the control panel, but admin doesn't appear there.
Yeah home version has always disabled a bunch of the advanced user management tools. The command prompt method in part 2 should work though.

But honestly I'd advise doing a drive image, or hunting for all your stuff that you can find to save to another location, rather than trying to poke that install back into working order. Once you have your stuff saved (or as much of it as is left :( ), using the full reset method to wipe windows back to square one is easy. It's pretty much the same as format / clean install. As long as it's activated now it'll stay activated after the reset.



mobby_6kl posted:

Is there any way to do an in-place upgrade without a full wipe, given that I have a Win7 Pro license for this machine?
Probably not. Upgrade works off the installed OS. There might be some way to hack it (ex forcefully delete just the windows folder from recovery console) but the flipside leaves you with a non-functional OS. With only 8 hours left I wouldn't want to try.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Mischievous Mink posted:

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/accessibility/windows10upgrade Looks like the upgrade window being extended came true, not super surprising.




(The announcement that 10 upgrades would remain free for assist tech users was made back in May, this is not news.)

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

redeyes posted:

confirm you use Assistive Technologies (WTF does this mean anyways?)

It means you're blind or stephen hawking or some poo poo like that.

MS is continuing to give away 10 to disabled people because they've made some improvements to assistance tech and so they're gonna give people the upgrade rather than try to backport it.


For all the poo poo I give and will continue to give Microsoft over data collection, advertisements, and trying to turn windows into a lock-in platform like ios, this is a genuinely good and nice thing for them to do. Anyone who clicks that button despite not being handicapped just to get a free upgrade (when they've had a year to do it) should just save some time and kill themselves instead. Just pirate a torrent or whatever, don't make them close down the program with a statement that starts with "due to overwhelming fraud..."

Jewel Repetition posted:

After a terrifying hour I've got Windows 10 installed and I have a few questions.

1. Is it possible to make the subfolders in a folder display before the files? I want this for my images folder because it's huge and I don't want to have to scroll to the bottom to see the folders. It was how it should be in Windows 7.

2. Is it possible to make the systray and time/date show up on both taskbars if you have multiple monitors?

3. Where can I find the contents of the old "startup" folder that was in the Programs part of the start menu in Windows 7? I had a homemade executable in there and I want to recover it.
1. sort by name again? folders are still sorted first by default for me even in a pictures folder.
2. not without various 3rd party programs
3. in windows.old if you upgraded. should be something like windows.old\users\username\AppData\Roaming\Microsoft\Windows\Start Menu
or just search users for the exe name

Klyith fucked around with this message at 00:24 on Jul 30, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
So for the last 2 years I ran win7 with updates turned off, because something in there was hosed and always wanted to download a .NET version I already had, and when it did it would completely ruin .net such that I'd have to reinstall it. (Which is an hour of fun on 7, since afaik there was no all-in-one installer. You had to go in order v1 v2 v3 v3.5 v4.) But I downloaded the security update rollups every other month, and I browse enough tech websites that if there was some :siren: zero day exploit patch NOW :siren: I'd see it within a few days and patch.

If I had known there was an ability to hide an update so you'd never see it again and windows would never try to get it, I'd have done that! Never heard about that until the 10 upgrade shenanigans. :/



Sir Unimaginative posted:

Pretty much the entire Web runs off of JavaScript these days, and everyone else's JavaScript at that. Piecing together a working Web with a JavaScript whitelist sounds like a hell of a time investment.

Kinda depends on how many new sites you visit in an average day, and how much of your internet is ajax-y webapps vs text. It's getting worse as more places start putting content behind js loads, but noscript whitelist doesn't make the web totally unusable yet.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

EoRaptor posted:

Tightening their grip:

https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/windows_hardware_certification/2016/07/26/driver-signing-changes-in-windows-10-version-1607/

They will eventually enforce secure boot, causing all of this to be mandatory, and that will be the end of the small hardware developer.

They will eventually force all programs to be UWP, and that will be the end of small and open source programmers!

They will eventually force all directx apps to be signed through the Windows Store, and that will be the end of steam / indie games!

:tinfoil: :tinfoil: :tinfoil:



(a 10 second google will show that this has been in the works since 2015, and does not mean that drivers have to go through a complete Windows Certification test. it does mean some additional hoops to jump through, but the smallest of hardware developers can fit through those. It does gently caress over the tinkerer / independent guy making new drivers for re-purposed hardware, except that anyone doing that, or even running someone else's weird one-off drivers, probably already has secure boot turned off. Or doesn't need to run kernel drivers in the first place, for example the DS4tool project is totally unaffected.)


MS being able to revoke certs for kernel mode stuff that turns out to be malicious -- actual malware, bad-ideas OEM crapware that turns out to have massive security holes, or junk like that Sony cd driver that hosed your pc to try to prevent you from ripping music -- is a good thing. Abuse of that ability would be bad but they haven't done it yet.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

none of these strategies include "be a complete retard in ways that drive large numbers of people away from windows"


I don't doubt that they would love to get rid of steam and capture all PC games revenue for themselves. But there is just zero chance they can do that without either a massive gently caress-up by valve (such that nobody wanted to use steam anymore), or facing a revolt by the entire gaming audience. Valve put in a few months of effort on SteamOS linux just to prove that they could, then let the whole thing slide into the land of abandoned valve projects. It was a warning shot.

Platforms have a lot of strengths that can be used to bully the competition and control an industry, but the big con is that anything that damages the user base is damage to the platform as a whole. Just look at how fast they got reversal of fortune'd with the xbox one. None of the people who made those decisions still have jobs.

DSLAM posted:

Of all the things i have connected to my PC, why would Win10 decide that my Kingston Datatraveler DT2000 needs to communicate with Phone assistance app? I get a little :tinfoil: since I got the DT2000 for work stuff and personal information.



Telefonassistent in english is the "Phone Companion App", a thing for syncing smartphones, not a thing for phoning home to microsoft. It wants to look at other devices because maybe there are multiple devices to sync.

The thing about these settings is that it's a new way to block access. Older versions of windows, once you plug in the USB stick (plus the key for that DT2000), anything running on the computer could look at it. So if you have sensitive info on the DT2000 you could certainly block apps from reading it -- though this also means that you wouldn't be able to open a doc with office or whatever.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
efb :argh:

GreatGreen posted:

I tried that and it doesn't work. Windows detects the shortcut and circumvents it, linking the actual folder instead.

So am I wrong or did Microsoft actually think of how people might customize this list and actively spend energy loving them out of it?

You could make junction links into a new folder with a custom name, and then pin that to quick access. Potential for confusion though.

I can't find where quick access is even kept, it's not searchable in the registry or user appdata.


(I think the upside of this change is that quick access is more transparent to programs, because it is presented as actual folders rather than shortcuts.)

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

dpbjinc posted:

I'm having the same problem. The Media Creation Tool for Education doesn't seem to be updated, despite the ISOs reportedly being available in the VLSC, and the Updater that pops up for the main Media Creation Tool doesn't work for Education. I guess they don't want to push it out yet. I don't know if it's in DreamSpark Premium, which is where I originally got it, because my classes don't start for two weeks. (The tool does work, but it still downloads 1511.)

On the upside, once you get the update for Education you get to ditch Cortana. And they're doing that because education versions are ad-free.

Almost makes me want to go borrow a student id and buy a copy, but iirc edu pro is still nearly as expensive as retail.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
:siren:

Zero VGS posted:

Also, the update uninstalls Classic Shell. Thanks fuckfaces!

:siren: holy poo poo don't re-install classic shell they got hacked :siren:
http://www.classicshell.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=6434
:frogsiren: :frogsiren:

:siren: :siren: :siren:



(unless you're using a previously saved known-good installer file)

Klyith fucked around with this message at 03:37 on Aug 3, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
reposting for new page :siren:


:siren: holy poo poo don't re-install classic shell they got hacked :siren:
http://www.classicshell.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=6434
:frogsiren: :frogsiren:

https://twitter.com/CultOfRazer/status/760668803097296897

Zero VGS posted:

Edit: that's pretty brilliant if they waited for the Anniversary Update to do that hack, knowing that MS would completely uninstall the thing and most savvy users would immediately go to reinstall it.
Yeah.

And I was writing a post kinda defending MS removing classic shell* when I saw the news! I spent 20 minutes fixing my computer because I stupidly clicked on the 3rd party theme I was using previously, just before remembering that themes get compatibility broken every big update for windows 10. So shell stuff with broken compatibility is a problem either way.

*obviously in retrospect it would have been better if they'd just disabled it

Ghostlight posted:

Now that's a hack message.
as someone who was a basic computer janitor back in the last days of Chernobyl/CIH, I kinda get some nostalgia

helps that it's much easier to fix a MBR today than it was back then

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Zero VGS posted:

Edit: that's pretty brilliant if they waited for the Anniversary Update to do that hack, knowing that MS would completely uninstall the thing and most savvy users would immediately go to reinstall it.

lol it wasn't a planned thing, or so they claim
https://twitter.com/CultOfRazer/status/760679570550956032
hell of a coincidence for that to happen. Did the insider builds remove classic shell?

Captain Novolin posted:

windows defender is all you'll need as long as you have a solid adblocker (ublock origin) and arent randomly downloading poo poo from russia a commonly used open-source hosting service?

Defender is helpful, but zero-days gonna zero-day. Anyone who got hosed by this was by definition running defender.

As much as this hack was a destructive black-hat type action, they do have a point that even "known-good" programs you download aren't always trustworthy. I've been thinking about stuff I use that updates itself automatically, but often still asks for admin access while doing so. If someone compromised those, I'd get hosed by it no question. Mozilla & valve probably secure their distro servers really well, but does ds4tool or hexchat?

This is where I see the Microsoft perspective that if everyone just used the windows store, we'd all be safer. (then I vomit in my mouth a bit :barf:)

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Morter posted:

Oh son of a bitch, I just realized i downloaded irfanview from fosshob earlier. What does this mean. What should I do? :ohdear:

if you believe their twitter, they only hit classic shell & audacity. and if it actually installed ifranview you are supposedly ok: "Our infected installer pops up a command window and then doesn't do anything more."

but if you don't trust them:
1) have a recovery USB stick ready
2) bitlocker encrypted drives are not recoverable by simple repair so if you have that don't reboot the PC until you have backups or decrypt the drive or soemthing

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Morter posted:

One last rando question:

I have 2 monitors: My main is 144hz and my secondary is 60hz.

Ever since jumping onto win10, there's weird screen tearing whenever I move windows around in the secondary monitor. I mean obviously, I'm noticing a difference between the two monitors but the kind of graphical stuttering I'm seeing isn't stuff I'd never gotten even when the refresh rate was 60hz.

The only thing I saw related to this was a recommendation to get the latest graphics drivers, which I'm sure I do.

looking around, this seems to be a pretty common problem with no good solutions. it comes from DWM, the compositor that draws & layers all the stuff on the screen, rendering to a single large surface for all monitors. It's drawing the frames synced to the 144hz monitor, so the 60hz monitor is getting them at the wrong time. sucks that microsoft has not accounted for this, there are definitely ways to overcome this issue.


things you could try:
1. if the monitor has the option, run the 144hz one at 120hz instead. Since that's exactly 2x, the frames will be in sync and the 60hz screen will just show every second frame.
2. run the 144hz monitor at 60hz, which kinda sucks but is adequate for windows desktop. games can switch to 144hz if you're running them fullscreen (but if playing windowed or borderless windowed, you'd have to switch back to 144hz manually)

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Cugel the Clever posted:

The site's feature list and screenshots leave me with the impression that the primary user base is people who grew up with Windows XP/2000 and somehow decided it was the golden era of computing that should never have evolved in the decades since.

If they were linux people they'd still be using enlightenment or some other ancient window manager, and nobody'd think twice because of course a linux guy is a weirdo. But instead they use windows so they have to mod the UI with hacky programs or replaced system files.

To be fair UI is a thing where MS takes 2 steps forward 1 step back every time, so I can see somebody being really annoyed by the backwards step. Win10's start menu is ok but it ain't perfect. I still don't get much use out of live tiles. And the new change with anniversary update actually made it worse for me -- I have the taskbar vertical on the left, so the addition of the border strip and hamburger menu is now a strip of wasted space between start and my programs.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
if you have a Education version, cortana was turned off by mictrosoft. someone in their PR dept realized the optics of serving ads to school kids was terrible. (especially if they were to show inappropriate ones because some kid searched for naughty stuff one time while the teacher wasn't there.) so they've disabled cortana until they figure out how to make it not show ads*.

*translation = until they can figure out how to hide the change deep enough that everyone else won't just copy the bit that stops ads from showing up



Otherwise you have something going wrong, and win10 troubleshooting seems to be "turn settings on and off until it works". Other people upthread have said turning bing search back on helped. The last big update some people had to create new user profiles to fix broken stuff.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week
Just manually delete registry entries. they're in:
HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\SystemFileAssociations\.bmp\Shell\T3D Print
(.jpg, .png, etc)

SystemFileAssociations is also where you will find lots of other useless junk for the context menu, like setting images as the desktop background or casting audio & video.

Unfortunately it looks like win10 will be resetting edits to Classes with every major update which will kinda suck.


this one isn't a shellex, it's just a regular shell command. but stored in a different place.

Klyith fucked around with this message at 14:23 on Aug 5, 2016

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

sarr posted:

Okay so I have an empty folder in this path: C:\Windows.old\WINDOWS\System32\DriverStore\FileRepository\nv_dispi.inf_amd64_1e985103ceaab421

and I can't delete it. Is there some regedit magic I can do to make this happen?
you can't delete it because it is in use, or because windows won't give you permission? if the first you need to try a reboot cycle, or reinstall nvidia drivers because for some reason they're still looking at windows.old which is not the place for them.

if the second, you need to take ownership of the folder:

properties -> security tab -> advanced button
at the top where it says Owner: TrustedInstaller*, click the blue text for Change
type in your own user name in the box, click Check Names to make sure it's right, then click OK. make sure the box "replace owner on subcontainers" is checked.
OK all the things
now you can delete it.


with this power you can delete anything, including stuff that will make your computer not work. use it wisely.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

baka kaba posted:

What's with the developer mode anyway? I get that it lets you run unsigned apps, but is there a (significant) security risk for driveby attacks? Disabled protections, that kind of thing. And can it be enabled per user or is it per machine?

UWP apps run in a semi-sandbox, so if anything the risk for attacks should be less than the equivalent normal program. The one risk I can see (i am not a security professional) is that installed uwp apps by default are allowed to stay resident all the time. So potentially good for a keylogger or spyware type program.

Driveby attacks: maaaaaybe? But as previous, a driveby load of a UWP app is much less nasty than a standard executable. Until it actually happens I'd say the security risk for that setting is very low. It is a system setting, not per-user.



So why is it set up like that in the first place? That's one of the walls of the walled garden. If most people can only get UWP apps through the windows Store, that's where anyone selling apps will need to be. It's the wall that keeps competitors out. Once your customers have a bunch of stuff that only works as UWP from Store, that's the wall that keeps people in.

Unfortunately for MS, the problem with the whole walled garden approach on windows is the garden outside the walls is currently way better than the weedy empty lot on the inside. It only worked for iOS because there was no alternative smartphone ecosystem back then, and the rest of Apple's software was deep in who-gives-a-poo poo territory. If you had a Mac you by definition liked apple's software offerings.

Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

baka kaba posted:

I suppose the software thread is better for recommends, but is it actually worth installing things from the Microsoft store? I've never even bothered opening it, does it have better versions of anything? Applications that update themselves automatically even if you don't open them, so it acts like a package manager?

I found a little program I like called Action Note, which lets you put simple text notes in the action bar.

Of course I only found that because I was looking for something useful to do with the action bar!

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Klyith
Aug 3, 2007

GBS Pledge Week

Factor Mystic posted:

It was already useful because that's where the standard windows bubble notifications now go. You ever have one of those situations where you glance at the screen right as a bubble notification is fading out and you were like "hey what was that message???" but then it's gone forever?
No, not really. 90% of windows bubble notifications are stupid junk. If it's important it should stick around until I see it and take real action. If it's a pointless reminder from the OS that I've dismissed a million times before, I don't want to see it.

And if it's some program that wants to go "hey listen!" :wave: every time a new song starts playing or similar trivial crap, it should be purged with extreme prejudice. The whole toast style notification system was an ok idea, which has gotten progressively abused by attention-deficit users and bad app writers trying to make their program visible.


I might be semi-ok with email notifications in the action bar, except for the fact that I already have a program that puts a header / sender list of new mail on the desktop background. It's totally passive and I can see it all the time without clicking anything.

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