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After reading merk's case I went back through Asiina's post history because I thought there were a couple posts from her late D1 that I liked and wanted to read, but I couldn't find them. They must not exist! ##vote Asiina
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Sep 19, 2015 17:29
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merk posted:I guess to add to this: I'm not thrilled we lynched a Doctor, but I think we got way more information out of d1 than we would have if we lynched TMM on the wet fart end of day I saw from the airport. Are you saying this in hindsight of TMM's flip? I agree with the info from the Asiina/MiR race, but everyone posted about TMM and there would've been info there too.
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Sep 19, 2015 17:31
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Asiina posted:I've never been the kind of person to try to force people to see things my way. I make my case and make my vote, and if people want to agree with me or not then fine, I'm not going to belabour the issue. What? This isn't true. When people post meta reads on themselves it is always unhelpful and generally false.
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Sep 20, 2015 02:53
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merk posted:Cool. I Don't intend to full claim. Let's run this lynch through. I'm not asking you to claim but there's no reason to turbo. Discussing this and having people post their reads is good for town, even if our lynch is predetermined.
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Sep 20, 2015 02:54
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Could you post your other reads LJ? You posted quite a bit about me being scum in the hours before D1 deadline. I don't understand why you're confused on who is scummier between Vimes and PoP.
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Sep 20, 2015 22:59
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SirSamVimes posted:The flavour specified a venomous dagger. I remember when I was scum that flavour was relevant, so do you think this means that the scum team has an assassin kill? TMM was stabbed as well. I think it's safe to assume that it's the scum night kill. The rest is WIFOM. This post does read as really forced though.
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Sep 20, 2015 23:01
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I reread Vimes and my previous biggest red flag on him (the whole 'apply pressure with votes' comment on LJ) is just something he believes. I think Vimes really does think you should vote people to incentivize them to post content and that you can vote to prod instead of voting who you think is scum. So he's probably town.The Ninth Layer posted:So you didn't see the case on Asiina and refused to vote her, but you *literally* didn't see the case on MiR and bandwagon voted? I thought a lot of people came out looking bad from that deadline but this is a great point. ##vote ANarc
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Sep 21, 2015 00:01
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Pinterest Mom posted:No. His reason to vote Asii yesterday was complete bullshit. He's scum. I just don't know how I feel about the case. I read him as a player who is much more interested in piecing out the layout. I don't know if his lack of posting reads is a scum tell. I mean I also don't like him randomly switching around with ANarc D1 but that's another case of WIFOM where I just don't see scum doing that. His posting is not good but I don't really read it as scummy either.
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Sep 21, 2015 00:09
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ljtrigirl posted:Scum: Pecota, Vimes, Anon, and Grandi. Okay. I've done a lot of rereading today and apologies if I missed it or forgot it but why did you turn around on Grandi, exactly? Was it just you realizing that he wasn't new? Because I'm not sure I buy that someone new to our community would make such a brazen meta call on someone else.
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Sep 21, 2015 01:45
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Kashuno posted:Hi guys! Anarc has been posting poop, so ##vote anarc Do you have any other reads?
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Sep 22, 2015 04:29
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Grandicap posted:Yeah, I know, I thought I had a nugget and I didn't, so I posted my thought process. Would you have preferred I manufactured a case on you or that I had said nothing? Because those are the other options. I think that you are being needlessly antagonistic. I just see this as you asking him to stop being suspicious of you. It is a really weird post.
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Sep 22, 2015 04:30
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The Ninth Layer posted:Yeah I believe you are a scum tracker which is why you haven't claimed anything. Can I hear your thought process behind this? I was trying to parse claims in another game recently and totally failed at it, so I would like to hear why you believe this to see if I agree.
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Sep 22, 2015 04:32
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Grandicap posted:Vimes went nowhere N1, Kash went nowhere n2. How is this a helpful thing to claim? The only thing that immediately hits me is that either you are telling the truth or there is a scum rolecop on your team. I'm trying to think of other possibilities, and which one I find more likely.
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Sep 22, 2015 04:34
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The Ninth Layer posted:Hey how about some opinions on who the scum are then... Was literally about to post this. Grandi seems to be defending himself far more than actually trying to hunt scum. But I don't know if I want to go all in on him being a rolecop and lynch him today.
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Sep 22, 2015 21:22
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Power of Pecota posted:I was expecting you to say yes and then I was going to ask why you hadn't mentioned Vimes like at all this game but idk how to respond to that. This is the only thing you have to say to that post? There are a lot of red flags to someone not posting their reads, and then when asked about a player getting heat they just admit they would, but wouldn't like it. What do you mean you don't know how to respond to that?
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Sep 22, 2015 21:35
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Power of Pecota posted:Do I really have to point out that Grandi isn't offering up any other voting targets? I was looking through interactions this morning and iirc everyone but bowmore (who I don't think has even read the thread yet) and Vimes (says Grandi seems more confused than anything else D1, doesn't say anything directly about him outside of that) has a scum read on Grandi. I like this post a lot more than the one I quoted before, fwiw.
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Sep 22, 2015 21:43
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Power of Pecota posted:BK, why did you bring the rolecop thing up again, why couldn't he just be a scum tracker? Occam's razor is Grandi's a tracker regardless of alignment, if he claimed tracker as a rolecop and rolecopped someone with a night action he'd have to fudge results unnecessarily. It was just this theory in my head, that either him or someone else on his team is a rolecop and they got enough information to fudge his targets. But considering he claimed tracker D1 that would be pretty bold. Your post makes sense. I'm going to keep thinking about it and maybe do a reread.
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Sep 22, 2015 21:52
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Yeah I don't see much of a difference in effort between Grandi, Anarc/bowmore and Sam, so I'm trying to discern which of them is more likely to be scum. But the complete playing-dumb of not voting Asiina still leaves a really bad taste in my mouth so I'm gonna leave my vote where it is.
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Sep 23, 2015 00:31
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bowmore posted:I just woke up, woo As the person who modded that game, what do you mean? And why are you so sure of Grandi's position? I do not understand your statement at all.
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Sep 23, 2015 01:39
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bowmore posted:Pretty sure Ninth is scum, on day one he votes Asiina with no comments about her alignment just wants to jump on the lynch because that's what is looking like is going to happen before the last minute swing back to mer, then berates the town day two about how terrible the lynch was. The biggest thing I disagree with is that not posting a huge opinion on Asiina is some sort of scumtell. PMom's case early on was pretty cut and dry and you either agreed with that point or you didn't. The second day was equally as cut and dry. There wasn't a lot of time for theorizing on Asiina, but ANarc still managed to say she wouldn't vote someone who ended up flipping scum and then had no justification for it. If Asiina is the boiling point you still turn up way way worse.
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Sep 23, 2015 02:24
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bowmore posted:Not sure how I turn up worse, I didn't make those posts - the person I replaced did. Okay. If I were personally attacking you this may be a valid response? You know what I mean.
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Sep 23, 2015 02:27
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Grandicap posted:Well, yeah. Game quality is a thing. It takes more scumminess to make me want to vote an active player over an inactive one. The threshold is higher, not that I won't pull the trigger, just that it takes more to make me want to do so. I'm able to follow you but I definitely don't agree with you. This seems like a constructed reason to vote or not vote something. bowmore posted:still confused, you'd rather lose the game as town if the quality of the game was good? is that correct? but you literally got on TNL 5 minutes ago for bullying and now you're unable to see the nuance he added to his post? He literally said it will just take a bit more convincing. It's not that hard to follow, but you intentionally mischaracterize it.
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Sep 23, 2015 02:34
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BottleKnight posted:but you literally got on TNL 5 minutes ago for bullying and now you're unable to see the nuance he added to his post? mafia edit: the nuance grandi added to his post
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Sep 23, 2015 02:35
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Wow I was not expecting this thread to open this fast. It didn't seem like everyone was around at deadline but looking again everyone kind of was?SirSamVimes posted:Woah that was really quick. I'm going to go back to my previous opinion of who is scum. I would like you to state why you agree with Pecota's case on LJ that even PoP agrees she missed a post on. I really want you to state your thought process here. Pinterest Mom posted:it's still sam~ I think I agree.
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Sep 23, 2015 04:28
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Hey Kashuno why weren't you around at deadline? You kind of just stopped posting. But you were around tonight, on the forums?
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Sep 23, 2015 04:35
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Power of Pecota posted:LJ do you still want to hammer? ljtrigirl posted:Yes. But I want to give him a bit more time. What's it hurting? Also this exchange bothers me. bowmore was posting reads and interacting and stuff, even if it wasn't going to change anything it was still worth listening to. The whole "let's hammer hammer hammer" was a dick move, even if he flipped scum tbh. I figured when you posted that LJ that you wouldn't actually do it so quickly.
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Sep 23, 2015 04:37
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Oh we only had 20 min. I thought we had more! Still, people were talking. I don't know. At least you were interacting with him, Pecota. But I don't really like the way either of you were talking about the hammer like that.
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Sep 23, 2015 04:40
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Kashuno posted:Hi. I had thought that Asiina was town d1, but that I would watch her more closely d2. I didn't understand merk's logic of not revealing his role and just saying "I have the ability to know unequivocally that you are scum," because saying that at all means he's gonna be the target for the NK anyway. It seemed like a gambit to me that would lead to a chain lynch when asiina flipped town. Do you say that stuff about merk somewhere? Because I think it's a lot easier to say that stuff about the NK in hindsight.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:40
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Thank you. Alright. I'm gonna try to do a reread of people and their interactions with Vimes.
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Sep 23, 2015 19:44
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The Ninth Layer posted:So of all the other players around I think SamVimes has the worst-looking record with flipped scum Asiina. Voted TIMM, apparently wasn't around for the Asiina discussion but came in with time to spare on switch candidate MiR. Next day makes a tepid Asiina defense before merk claims and then votes after merk has claimed, with a token justification for voting. I just got burned for going after what I thought was a connection between two players so I feel reluctant to rush into another obvious-looking lynch, especially because it seems like everyone else agrees on this one, but that's really my only reservation. Someone said earlier (Grandi?) that you've been super surface-level this game, and while I mostly disagree on that, your last sentence here is pretty superficial. Do you think it's an easy case for the scum to jump on? If so who looks the most opportunistic? You seem to pretty clearly state that you don't feel comfortable with him, but you give none of the additional suspicion that I know you've given before for similar situations. PMom has been casing Vimes for days so what do you think of PMom? The Ninth Layer posted:If I'm just going by my gut then my biggest suspicion right now is BottleKnight. He's someone that I've felt has been pretty reasonable all game, but probably mostly because he's agreed with me a lot lately. He went for TMM on a pretty dubious meta claim and his vote sat on TMM until the day ended, so he completely missed the Asiina swing too. He voted with merk's case on Asiina yesterday, which is probably the best thing I can say about his post history, but it could have just been him trying to ride the merk boat. He also rode hard with me on ANarc and was happy to echo me at times. I was riding the merk boat, because I had a town read on him, just like I did in Pearl of Port Lourde. His busyness seemed to be something in both games that was genuinely holding him back and I don't think he would've been earnest about that at all as scum. Maybe I'm not giving him enough credit, but after not finding the good posts from Asiina I thought she had and reading PMom's D1 arguments on her I was already swinging that way. If bowmore had flipped scum I was ready to come after you because his case seemed incredibly manufactured and I thought it might be some kind of last-ditch play to make his scumbud look good. But that turned out not to be the case and I agree, reads are quite a bit harder now which is why I've been rereading certain events.
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Sep 23, 2015 23:21
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I was trying to remember why you think Kash is good LJ so I skimmed your post history and the only thing I found was 'tonal consistency.' Is your townread on him just that? Because he has read very neutral to me.
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Sep 24, 2015 03:01
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The Ninth Layer posted:This is really backwards and I don't understand it, why would I bus a scumbuddy so hard in any event? How does it make me look better for bowmore to flip town? I started typing up this post and then suddenly remembered that you were pushing the ANarc lynch the whole time. I think the substitution got me confused. I don't know why I forgot that. So it's probably a good thing that I didn't have to explore that line of thought, though if I had reread your interactions after a potential bowmore scum flip like I was planning to do I'm sure I would've caught that and erased it from my head.
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Sep 24, 2015 03:59
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It has been a looooooong day for me. Vimes, please come in here and post your reads and stuff and claim.
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Sep 24, 2015 21:26
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I have to be up early to drive for hours tomorrow and I only got 3 hours of sleep in the past 30 so I don't know how much I'll be around tonight, so I'm gonna vote Vimes in about half an hour if nothing picks up.
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Sep 24, 2015 23:54
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SirSamVimes posted:I've already given my opinion on my prmary scum candidate. Why did you go from reading me as "probably town" to considering me your top lynch? These are exactly the kind of discussions we could've been having since last night! I really do think you believe that stuff about applying pressure with votes. But me clearing you on that was stupid to begin with and rereading you proved that my read on you was neutral. The reason it's neutral is because you've basically stated no opinions, and nothing's stopping you from posting some now!
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Sep 25, 2015 00:11
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SirSamVimes posted:Alright then, let me try and give a comprehensive OpinionPost! This may take a bit because the forums are taking thirty seconds to load new pages right now. same. But I would appreciate this nonetheless.
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Sep 25, 2015 00:25
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That's a good post Vimes and I like it. I find your suspicion of Kash very interesting as well. I need to find that TNL post about night actions and think about it some more. But for not posting much this game day, that is a good effortpost.
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Sep 25, 2015 01:07
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My first scum win! Hooray! Coming back to that first town lynch was completely crazy and kind of a Christmas present. Neither me or PoP had anything to do with it, somehow. Scumdoc
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Sep 26, 2015 06:31
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