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Geostomp posted:He's the only one in this game to consistently have a clue. I just assume he was waiting to see how long it'd take for his teammates to put 2 and 2 together about Seymore being evil. Turns out a successful Summoner's Pilgrimage has you doing all sorts of things that don't make the history books.
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Oct 3, 2015 05:10
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Bufuman posted:SA account (though apparently it was already dying when I signed up, but whatever) SA isn't dying, alarmist assholes just like to say it is because for once we have someone fixing poo poo behind the scenes instead of posting here about it.
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Oct 3, 2015 05:13
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Malachite_Dragon posted:SA isn't dying, alarmist assholes just like to say it is because for once we have someone fixing poo poo behind the scenes instead of posting here about it. I was referring to the original FFX thread, since TDI says he last updated nearly 2 years + 10 months ago (my account was made a full 6 months after that point, you'll notice) but spread the word of SA dying anyway. Maybe we'll get even MORE improvements! 
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Oct 3, 2015 05:39
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It was a pretty big deciding factor for me too. TDI's making money for Yoko Taro and Lowtax.
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Oct 3, 2015 09:01
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It feels like the entire Seymour subplot was shoehorned in because someone at Square felt obligated to include a prettyboy charismatic Sephiroth kinda dude. Obligated, only to give him all the charisma of a moldy towel. At least Jecht makes it into crossover stuff like Dissidia instead.
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Oct 3, 2015 11:41
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Mazed posted:It feels like the entire Seymour subplot was shoehorned in because someone at Square felt obligated to include a prettyboy charismatic Sephiroth kinda dude. Obligated, only to give him all the charisma of a moldy towel. Fun fact: Square originally wanted to put Seymour as the FFX antagonist for Dissidia, and let's face it, he's more of a villain that Jecht is. Jecht only makes it in because they felt he's more of a primary antagonist for Tidus than Seymour, who's generally considered to be Yuna's foe more than Tidus's. Truth be told, it worked out for the best. Jecht's brawling beatdown style is unique in Dissidia, while at least half of the villains are effeminate mysterious spellcaster types, and adding another one would've looked lame.
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Oct 3, 2015 11:54
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I think Seymour is a good subplot because he's a direct result of Yevon teachings and the world culture, and the game needs a direct reminder that there's consequences to such absurd religious teachings and devotion if you go at it long enough. Not everyone is super loyal blind faithful like Wakka or the crusaders.
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Oct 3, 2015 11:57
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Tae posted:I think Seymour is a good subplot because he's a direct result of Yevon teachings and the world culture, and the game needs a direct reminder that there's consequences to such absurd religious teachings and devotion if you go at it long enough. Not everyone is super loyal blind faithful like Wakka or the crusaders. Agreed. Seymour definitely isn't shoehorned in, he's the antagonist that represents the Yevon part of the 'what the heck is wrong with Spira?' equation. Well, the one that you beat down anyway.
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Oct 3, 2015 12:02
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Tae posted:I think Seymour is a good subplot because he's a direct result of Yevon teachings and the world culture, and the game needs a direct reminder that there's consequences to such absurd religious teachings and devotion if you go at it long enough. Not everyone is super loyal blind faithful like Wakka or the crusaders. Rather he's the end result, Upon realizing that Spira is a never ending cycle of death and despair and the only bright light religion sacrifices people for a few months of peace, it's killing to lead to more killing later. Especially his aforementioned but not yet explored mother. And then you think about... say... the fact that he's a summoner to. Why didn't he pilgrimage to Zanarkand? Every other summoner we've met is currently doing so. And you can't even say it's because of his position, since the religion is so important to everyones lives and he'd be shunning that duty if he decided "I'm not going to kill myself for all of you, but I will have my super cool magic summoning powers."
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Oct 3, 2015 12:05
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Bufuman posted:
Counterpoint: TURTLE.
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Oct 3, 2015 12:54
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There's really nothing that Seymour could offer the story mode in that game when he's competing with the likes of Kefka for screen time. There's already very little that he can offer for the story of his own game.
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Oct 3, 2015 12:59
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Is it ever addressed why people like Tidus wouldnt be even worse than Rikku from Wakkas perspective? Tidus doesent even know who Yevon is and much less cares about his teachings.
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Oct 3, 2015 13:12
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Iretep posted:Is it ever addressed why people like Tidus wouldnt be even worse than Rikku from Wakkas perspective? Tidus doesent even know who Yevon is and much less cares about his teachings. Tidus is just a dumbass, not a filthy loving Al Bhed  so in Wakka's eyes he's automatically Better Than Rikku.Basically, potential convert vs filthy heathen. Auron seems to have quite a bit of distaste for Yevon as well, but Wakka knows better than to antagonize him 
Malachite_Dragon fucked around with this message at 13:29 on Oct 3, 2015 |
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Oct 3, 2015 13:16
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Malachite_Dragon posted:Edit: The mental image of Kimahri pile-driving a fool has me in stitches and I wish I had the talent to draw that. Even better if it could somehow be animated with the "Don't do THIS!" commentary clip from the WWE games which, coincidentally, I last heard before performing a piledriver.
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Oct 3, 2015 13:27
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Iretep posted:Is it ever addressed why people like Tidus wouldnt be even worse than Rikku from Wakkas perspective? Tidus doesent even know who Yevon is and much less cares about his teachings. The very beginning of the game, wakka is under the impression that tidus lost his memories because of sin's toxins.
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Oct 3, 2015 14:50
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Also Tidus is pretty good at Blitzball and Yevon has proven to be
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Oct 3, 2015 14:55
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Holy poo poo, the FFX LP lives!  Seeing as we're all sharing our old creations from the original thread, have you ever wondered what Lord Braska wears under that absurdly heavy robe?  You may be surprised .The Dark Id posted:Yuna teleports past Seymour and his posse to rejoin her party. Check the video. She literally teleports across the room between cuts...  Actually, if you look close you can see her walking towards the party while it's focusing on Seymour's face. It's a very quick cut in itself, but it still shows she's been getting the gently caress away from Seymour as quickly as she could while he was getting all smug about being evil.
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Oct 3, 2015 16:15
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The Dark Id posted:He is accompanied by an entourage of two guano red shirts While this seems really fitting, I think you have a small typo there. VVV Could be either way. That's the sort of thing spell check would mess up. No harm in pointing it out. cant cook creole bream fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Oct 3, 2015 |
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Oct 3, 2015 17:02
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Air is lava! posted:While this seems really fitting, I think you have a small typo there. 
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Oct 3, 2015 17:11
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The first update is missing a line from Brother after Rikku. It's in the video, but not the screenshot portion. It's something along the lines of "do not interfere". I do like that Yuna's agreement to marry Seymour was a ruse, even if not telling the party was unwise. But I can understand why, she wanted to protect the party and shield them from her plan to fight Seymour. Not the brightest move, of course.
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Oct 3, 2015 17:12
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Pretty much everything that ever happens (or happened in the backstory) in FFX could be described as "not the brightest move".
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Oct 3, 2015 17:19
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But it does sell Yuna's self-sacrifice personality. She's willing to die if it means protecting her friends, she's willing to face down Seymore alone and out gunned it if means doing good. Yune is willing to put her life on the line for everything. But it HAS to be her life, no one elses. I mean it should be clearest in regards to her Guardians, she doesn't really surround herself with them in the sense that she's trying to protect herself, They are all people who are choosing to protect her. If she had no guardians you can sure as hell bet she'd go at it alone if it meant stopping Sin. It was a stupid act, but it's one that fits her character perfectly and makes a tonne of sense.
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Oct 3, 2015 17:27
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Onmi posted:But it does sell Yuna's self-sacrifice personality. She's willing to die if it means protecting her friends, she's willing to face down Seymore alone and out gunned it if means doing good. Yune is willing to put her life on the line for everything. But it HAS to be her life, no one elses. I mean it should be clearest in regards to her Guardians, she doesn't really surround herself with them in the sense that she's trying to protect herself, They are all people who are choosing to protect her. If she had no guardians you can sure as hell bet she'd go at it alone if it meant stopping Sin. Exactly. Yuna is very much a selfless martyr, to the extent that she's almost given up her sense of self entirely. Part of it was that she was raised since birth with the knowledge that the single most important thing she could ever do is to kill herself just to buy the people of Spira a few months reprieve if that. And the fact that her father was last person to be successful at doing so only puts more pressure on her. She's just as much the logical conclusion of the teachings of Yevon as Seymour is, that summoners have no worth or value beyond making people happy, ultimately through their death.
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Oct 3, 2015 17:36
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Who What Now posted:Exactly. Yuna is very much a selfless martyr, to the extent that she's almost given up her sense of self entirely. Part of it was that she was raised since birth with the knowledge that the single most important thing she could ever do is to kill herself just to buy the people of Spira a few months reprieve if that. And the fact that her father was last person to be successful at doing so only puts more pressure on her. She's just as much the logical conclusion of the teachings of Yevon as Seymour is, that summoners have no worth or value beyond making people happy, ultimately through their death. And then a beach-blonde dumbass washes up on her island and immediately sets to cracking that belief. It's surprisingly well done, considering this game is about as subtle as a piledriver.
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Oct 3, 2015 17:48
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I agree about Yuna's characterization being good. The game has shown that she has no sense of self-worth and is all too eager to throw her life away at a moment's notice if it'll potentially aid someone else. It's also depicted as stupid, (obviously) self-destructive, and leads to pyrrhic victories at best. She comes up with stupid plans that needlessly put herself at risk because she is so conditioned to sacrifice that she doesn't even consider whether or not the situation would call for something so extreme or if it would even improve things to any meaningful degree at all. The idea that someone would care enough about her to risk everything to save her from herself doesn't even enter her mind. If and when Tidus decides to pull his head out of his rear end and start being active in the story, he'll probably have something to say about the whole situation given that he's the only one who hasn't been brought up in a world dominated by a corrupt church or menaced by a space whale. Geostomp fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Oct 3, 2015 |
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Oct 3, 2015 17:54
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That's a large if.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:02
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Materant posted:And then a beach-blonde dumbass washes up on her island and immediately sets to cracking that belief. It's surprisingly well done, considering this game is about as subtle as a piledriver. Considering people still misinterpret scenes in FFX, I'd say it's still too subtle.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:12
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Tae posted:Considering people still misinterpret scenes in FFX, I'd say it's still too subtle. I have officially determined that people don't actually read or listen to any dialog. And the skip cutscene buttons only furthered that. I think the FF7 LP is one of the best examples of that. No one apparently remembers what the game actually WAS. Honestly I've written a tonne about FFXII and it's perceived 'Story' and what the story actually is, but this isn't the thread for that. Though to be fair that games pacing is loving bonkers which is the clear example of 3 directors 1 video game. FFX on the other hand flat out has a scene where everyone slowly and calmly explains exactly what the themes are and what everyones character is in regard to the overall plot.... I actually think they have at least two of these scenes.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:17
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I think one of the morals of FFVII was "fake it till you make it," heh. Worked for Cloud!
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Oct 3, 2015 18:23
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Materant posted:And then a beach-blonde dumbass washes up on her island and immediately sets to cracking that belief. It's surprisingly well done, considering this game is about as subtle as a piledriver. There are a lot of really great elements in X, both as a story and as a game, that simply weren't brought together cohesively and then got surrounded by a lot of really bad elements. I'm not sure if Square tried to do too much and botched the execution or what, but X seems to me to be a great example of wasted potential. Geostomp posted:I agree about Yuna's characterization being good. The game has shown that she has no sense of self-worth and is all too eager to throw her life away at a moment's notice if it'll potentially aid someone else. It's also depicted as stupid, (obviously) self-destructive, and leads to pyrrhic victories at best. She comes up with stupid plans that needlessly put herself at risk because she is so conditioned to sacrifice that she doesn't even consider whether or not the situation would call for something so extreme or if it would even improve things to any meaningful degree at all. The idea that someone would care enough about her to risk everything to save her from herself doesn't even enter her mind. Spoilers: Much how Vaan wasn't actually the main character of XII, Tidus isn't the main character of X, Yuna is and this is her story as told, or experienced rather, through Tidus as an outsider looking in. Definite spoilers next paragraph. Tidus does eventually realize this, at least partially, before the fight with Yunalesca when he tells Yuna that "This is our story, so let's see it through together!" He no longer considers himself an outsider, but part of the group, and also realizes that he isn't the only one with a "story", but they're all in it together. Like I said, there are a lot of good elements to X mixed with an equal amount of equally bad elements, but I feel the game gets a lot of undue flank that it doesn't deserve. EDIT Onmi posted:I have officially determined that people don't actually read or listen to any dialog. And the skip cutscene buttons only furthered that. I think the FF7 LP is one of the best examples of that. No one apparently remembers what the game actually WAS. Honestly I've written a tonne about FFXII and it's perceived 'Story' and what the story actually is, but this isn't the thread for that. Though to be fair that games pacing is loving bonkers which is the clear example of 3 directors 1 video game. FFX on the other hand flat out has a scene where everyone slowly and calmly explains exactly what the themes are and what everyones character is in regard to the overall plot.... I actually think they have at least two of these scenes. To be fair this is a problem with all the games after VII. Like in VIII how people complain that Squall was emotionless and emo, the same criticisms that Cloud gets, when both characters were actually very proactive. I think a lot of it stems from most of us having played these games so long ago that it's hard to remember much about them, and what we do remember is clouded by having been moron teenagers at the time. Who What Now fucked around with this message at 18:38 on Oct 3, 2015 |
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Oct 3, 2015 18:32
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I think if there was somehow a reveal that Auron was full Al Bhed Wakka would just keep his mouth shut.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:35
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Med School posted:I think if there was somehow a reveal that Auron was full Al Bhed Wakka would just keep his mouth shut. Heh, how would anyone know? He's got sunglasses! I wonder if the in-universe reason Al Bhed wear goggles all the time is to hide those swirly eyes.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:43
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^^ It's mentioned that that's the reason for the goggles, yeah. If Auron were Al Bhed, Spira as a whole would shut up and get over this racism thing. Hell, the prologue proves that even Sin doesn't gently caress around with Auron too much.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:45
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Who What Now posted:
On FFX It is Tidus's story, but it's not just HIS story, it's her quest, but from his perspective. But after the moment you said yes, it very much changes. Which is always why that's where the game picks up after Tidus says "Listen to my story". He is also very much the main character. Yuna spends a lot of the game until the game catches up to Tidus's narration off doing her own thing. It's not a coincidence once the narration catches up with the game, Yuna and Tidus become much more intertwined in what's going on, and it's not just because the game is wrapping up. It signifies the end of Tidus's story and really the end of Yuna's story and the beginning of their story. It's where the truth of everything comes out and it's where Tidus changes into Yuna's role, he takes up the position of the sacrifice with her taking up the position of the one trying to save everyone with no one dying. On FFXII Vaan isn't the main character. But people are hilariously wrong when they say 'he has no purpose' since much like Tidus is here to eventually kick the door in and go "Has everyone gone loving insane?" Vaan is there to help Ashe when she's very much tempted to go Dynast-Queen after her revenge filled streak across the entire plot. The game is very bloody clear about that. But then again this is the same game where people say "I don't understand why Vaan is travelling with the party" after Vaan flat out says "I'm travelling with you because I've lost my purpose in life and I think with you I can find a new one" After characters in game had asked him why he was travelling with them. So yeah, in short, no one actually pays any god damned attention to these games. Onmi fucked around with this message at 19:01 on Oct 3, 2015 |
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Oct 3, 2015 18:56
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Aurain posted:^^ Well he is Sin/Jecht's best/only friend.
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Oct 3, 2015 18:58
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By now, we know that Sin is Jecht and that Jecht and Auron were friends, no need to tag it.
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Oct 3, 2015 19:07
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Materant posted:And then a beach-blonde dumbass washes up on her island and immediately sets to cracking that belief. It's surprisingly well done, considering this game is about as subtle as a piledriver. I must be dense as heck because it's still not landing home. I haven't really thought about FFX since I first played it ages ago.
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Oct 3, 2015 19:13
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On the subject of characterizations, one thing which struck me was that in this LP, the impression I and some other people got was that Tidus was just constantly blurting out that he was from Zanarkand. That's actually not the case. Tidus tells Rikku on the ship at the start, which was when he learned that Zanarkand was destroyed 1000 years ago. Then after being sucked away by Sin again, he washes up on Besaid and tells Wakka, but then immediately tries to backtrack with the "Sin toxin" excuse. Wakka is the one who tells everyone else about it.
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Oct 3, 2015 19:40
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Who What Now posted:
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Oct 3, 2015 19:52
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TDI, this seems like a great time to post that Wakka image you tweeted earlier this week.  Bufuman posted:Holy fuckbiscuits, how long has this been back? Use my SA LP Alerts IFTTT Recipe. Mazed posted:It feels like the entire Seymour subplot was shoehorned in because someone at Square felt obligated to include a prettyboy charismatic Sephiroth kinda dude. Obligated, only to give him all the charisma of a moldy towel. Jecht is the best. And has a great emote here. :human being:
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