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What is YISUN?
Mother
A lie we tell ourselves to have a purpose
Bliss
A paradox with no solution
Father
A strong female protagonist
The weakest thing there is and the smallest crawling thing
Creator
Everything in this miserable and hellish existence
A solution with no paradoxes
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Cryophage
Jan 14, 2012

what the hell is that creepy cartoon thing in your avatar?


Dr Christmas posted:

What kind of devils are Sweetie Pie and Honey bunch? Their masks are pale and red, but they don't have the vaguely insectoid or hairy and brutish bodies they're respectively supposed to have.

Abbadon, on the subject of Preem Nand and his daughters posted:

He's a Servant possessed by a gilded devil. He cuts the faces off ladies and sticks devils in them, because he's done it to himself in the name of power.

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ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


paranoid randroid posted:

e2. of course, Allison now has the surname Kill Six Billion Demons bestowed on her by Zoss, so maybe theyre not all that important

Both Alison and her creepy boyfriend have the name Kill Six Billion Demons.

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

Don't accept Trump. Vote Joe. Run Joe Run!

ElMaligno posted:

Both Alison and her creepy boyfriend have the name Kill Six Billion Demons.

Where was it said that Zaid has that name? The prophecy one of Jadis's followers read said the name, but it wasn't explicitly about Zaid, just "the Successor". Everyone just thinks it's about him, but given Cio and White Chain being in the picture as well I'm pretty sure that's Allison there, not Zaid.

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


Roland Jones posted:

Where was it said that Zaid has that name? The prophecy one of Jadis's followers read said the name, but it wasn't explicitly about Zaid, just "the Successor". Everyone just thinks it's about him, but given Cio and White Chain being in the picture as well I'm pretty sure that's Allison there, not Zaid.

http://killsixbilliondemons.com/comic/ksbd-4-76/
http://killsixbilliondemons.com/comic/ksbd-4-77/
http://killsixbilliondemons.com/comic/ksbd-4-79/

Edit: Jagganoth asked the divine corpse who the boy was. The reply is that he is is the successor and his name is kill six billion demons.

ElMaligno fucked around with this message at 08:00 on Oct 12, 2015

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

Don't accept Trump. Vote Joe. Run Joe Run!


Yes, that is exactly what I'm referring to as "probably about Allison, not Zaid". Jadis never finished her statement, she stumbled partway through "successor". Meanwhile, besides being accompanied by Cio and White Chain there, that picture of Kill Six Billion Demons has no pants. Unless Zaid's going to get into wearing skirts, I'm pretty sure Allison's name bestowed by Zoss is unique to her.

Roland Jones fucked around with this message at 08:01 on Oct 12, 2015

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


Roland Jones posted:

Yes, that is exactly what I'm referring to as "probably about Allison, not Zaid".

They are literary referring to Zaid, not Alison

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

Don't accept Trump. Vote Joe. Run Joe Run!

ElMaligno posted:

They are literary referring to Zaid, not Alison

And? They're probably wrong. The only person who knows anything there is Jadis, and again, she never finished her statement. Meanwhile, Zoss explicitly called Allison by that name, and he gave her the key, not Zaid, and asked her to avenge him, which is what the successor is supposed to do. Everything fits Allison being the one, except the Demiurges and Juggernaut Star thinking it's Zaid, which is the only evidence that it could be him.

Edit: Heck, a few pages before what you linked, Zoss calls her "kingling" and "my redeemer" and, again, tells her to kill the Demiurges. I'm pretty sure Zoss knows more about his successor than any of the Demiurges do, and unless he's playing her (unlikely, he doesn't seem lucid enough to be doing that, and that doesn't seem his style anyway) he, at least, seems to think Allison's the one who's going to take them down.

Roland Jones fucked around with this message at 08:10 on Oct 12, 2015

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


Roland Jones posted:

And? They're probably wrong. The only person who knows anything there is Jadis, and again, she never finished her statement. Meanwhile, Zoss explicitly called Allison by that name, and he gave her the key, not Zaid, and asked her to avenge him, which is what the successor is supposed to do. Everything fits Allison being the one, except the Demiurges and Juggernaut Star thinking it's Zaid, which is the only evidence that it could be him.

As of right now, the amount of information I have leads me to believe that either:
- Both are Kill Six Billion Demons and the succesor
- Either are Kill Six Billion Demons and/or the succesor
- None are Kill Six Billion Demons and/or the succesor

Jadis refers to Zaid as the succesor AND names him Kill Six Billion Demons. However Alison is most likely the successor to Zoss and Zoss refers to Kill Six Billion Demons.

TL;DR: speculation is kinda useless

Jackard
Oct 28, 2007

We Have A Bow And We Wish To Use It

Jadis never got around to adding 'consort' on the end of her sentence

Jackard fucked around with this message at 08:31 on Oct 12, 2015

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


Jackard posted:

Jadis never got around to adding 'consort' on the end of her sentence

I like this a lot

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

Don't accept Trump. Vote Joe. Run Joe Run!

Jackard posted:

Jadis never got around to adding 'consort' on the end of her sentence


ElMaligno posted:

I like this a lot

That's basically what I was saying, she never finished her statement; she said "He is the successor..." (spaced out some more), then tried to continue talking, saying "the s..." and stuttering, before her follower went all divine inspiration and began speaking over her. At which point, being the Demiurge associated with Sloth (each one of them is associated with a Deadly Sin), Jadis shut up because why bother. There's far more evidence that Allison's the one (Zoss's words and actions, the depiction of Jadis's prophecy, her being the protagonist, etc.), and the only stuff pointing towards Zaid are Jadis's likely-incomplete statement, the prophecy using masculine pronouns, and Juggernaut Star thinking it's him. Maybe. At the least, he's trying to get the key to Zaid (despite possibly being the one who killed Zoss when he was handing the key over; as others have said, the Thorn Knight that struck Zoss down does look a lot like him, though it also had the wrong sort of steed), and he probably has a reason for that.

BravestOfTheLamps
Oct 12, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


Lipstick Apathy

Everybody being too short-sighted to realise who the real successor is is much more appropriate for the story and its themes.

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


By “I like this a lot” I mean “I am imagining a picture of Alison sitting on a throne in a stereotypical angry kingly way with Zaid and white chain wearing stereotypical male (or possibly female) beefcake wear doing the stereotypical throne flanking female pose and Ciocie furiously writing her fanfic about Alison being a Coffee Barista a simple farm girl somewhere in the picture. Yeah, I would like that in a funny kinda way”

With that said I don’t disagree with you, all the current evidence we got points that Alison is the protagonist of the story ergo she is the big motherfucking cheese and Zaid is just the creepy bro in distress. But the problem is that the universe of K6BD is build around paradoxes and contradictory statements. So there is still a possibility that the Demiurges are ALSO right, or maybe they are wrong, or maybe they are both wrong, or maybe both Alison AND Zaid are the successor and Kill Six Billion Demons making both parties right and wrong at the same time.

Fish Noise
Jul 25, 2012

IT'S ME, BURROWS!

IT WAS ME ALL ALONG, BURROWS!


They are both Kill Six Billion Demons until one of them is more Kill Six Billion Demons than the other?

ElMaligno
Dec 31, 2004

Be Gay!
Do Crime!


Kill Six Billion Demons Plus One

MikeJF
Dec 20, 2003





Roland Jones posted:

At the least, he's trying to get the key to Zaid (despite possibly being the one who killed Zoss when he was handing the key over; as others have said, the Thorn Knight that struck Zoss down does look a lot like him, though it also had the wrong sort of steed), and he probably has a reason for that.

Huh, went back and read that bit. I reckon they followed Zoss because they knew he'd be going to the successor and they assumed it was Zaid just because of pronouns. Maybe they were trying to force the succession prophecy to accelerate.

I wonder how they got through to Earth? Can they follow through Zoss's gate? Or did they have the alliance of whichever of the Seven has the Earth key? Muttom, right? Okay probably not then.

MikeJF fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Oct 12, 2015

Say Nothing
Mar 4, 2013

by FactsAreUseless


It's actually a contest - the first one to kill six billion demons gets to be king.

Cat Mattress
Jul 14, 2012

I don't find this sort of thing funny


Maybe they could just kill about three billion demons each. It's not like that wouldn't still keep them busy for a while.

Tenebrais
Sep 2, 2011



MikeJF posted:

I wonder how they got through to Earth? Can they follow through Zoss's gate? Or did they have the alliance of whichever of the Seven has the Earth key? Muttom, right? Okay probably not then.

I dunno, reading that council scene, Mottom certainly looked pretty responsible for the angels.

KOGAHAZAN!!
Apr 29, 2013

a miserable failure as a person

an incredible success as a magical murder spider



ElMaligno posted:

By “I like this a lot” I mean “I am imagining a picture of Alison sitting on a throne in a stereotypical angry kingly way with Zaid and white chain wearing stereotypical male (or possibly female) beefcake wear doing the stereotypical throne flanking female pose and Ciocie furiously writing her fanfic about Alison being a Coffee Barista a simple farm girl somewhere in the picture. Yeah, I would like that in a funny kinda way”

With that said I don’t disagree with you, all the current evidence we got points that Alison is the protagonist of the story ergo she is the big motherfucking cheese and Zaid is just the creepy bro in distress. But the problem is that the universe of K6BD is build around paradoxes and contradictory statements. So there is still a possibility that the Demiurges are ALSO right, or maybe they are wrong, or maybe they are both wrong, or maybe both Alison AND Zaid are the successor and Kill Six Billion Demons making both parties right and wrong at the same time.

Well, let's look at it like this:



One of our dear friends here is flanked by a black flame and a white flame and bears the terrible heat of the voice upon her brow- i.e., fulfils the actual substance of the prophecy- and it's not the doofus floating over the table.

Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007


paranoid randroid posted:

knights mendicant are broadly similar to the old cliche of the itinerant beggar-monk, so of course its not advisable to gently caress with them.

e. also, her full name is something like Maya Kill the Gods and Topple Their Thrones.

Mathangi Maya Mantra Murder the Gods and Topple Their Thrones.

Try to fit that poo poo on a business card.

paranoid randroid
Mar 4, 2007



Oxxidation posted:

Mathangi Maya Mantra Murder the Gods and Topple Their Thrones.

Try to fit that poo poo on a business card.

its a very tastefully done business card, but shes only got the one so you cant keep it, haha. reach heaven through violence, friend.

MikeJF
Dec 20, 2003





Oxxidation posted:

Mathangi Maya Mantra Murder the Gods and Topple Their Thrones.

Try to fit that poo poo on a business card.

I dunno, 82 White Chain Born Into Emptiness Returns To Subdue Evil fits pretty well.



That lead me on to nutting out a bit of geography. So the void manifests itself as basically a broken, eroded copy of the real world, right?



This scene was in the void, was it? Because Allison is there in black skin mode. So the demiurges enter the void fully for their meetings? For security? So is it the top of this tower here:



And we just don't see the rest of the red city around them because of the void's eroded incomplete effect?

Also, back to the mandala showing the universe:



So you've got throne in the middle, obviously, and the four orders of angels. Then the worlds surrounding come in pairs; of each pair, one has a sun and is presumably man's world, the real, and the other has either angels or devils, alternatingly. So I guess that's the void below each world? And for some reason angels and devils alternate. That seem a reasonable interpretation? And throne's void doesn't get shown because, well, art. (Or maybe it does; there's a faint ring around the red city that might be meant to separate it from where the angels are). Or possibly there's just one contiguous void under all worlds, and the alternating angels-demons is just artistic.

I have no idea if the placement of the flames have meanings.

Also, Mottom's palace is show in the map of Throne (on the ground) but it's totally different from the palace Allison was shown floating above her in the Void. Does she have one on Throne and one in the Void?

MikeJF fucked around with this message at 15:13 on Oct 12, 2015

BravestOfTheLamps
Oct 12, 2012

by FactsAreUseless


Lipstick Apathy


I find this kind of curious, since it shows Incubus even though the comic makes a point of obscuring him otherwise in the present (like in Jadis's prophecy and here).

BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 17:15 on Oct 12, 2015

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

Don't accept Trump. Vote Joe. Run Joe Run!

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

I find this kind of curious, since it shows Incubus even though the comic makes a point of obscuring him otherwise in the present (like in Jadis's prophecy and here).

I'm curious about that as well. Personally, I like the idea that he's old and decrepit now, the way Mottom and Jadis are, both to balance things out on that front and because the demiurge associated with Lust being a pathetic, shriveled old man seems ironically appropriate to me, but between that page and the concept art I've seen it seems like that's how he actually looks presently as well as in the past.

MikeJF
Dec 20, 2003





What're the sins again? Mottom's Greed, Jadis is Sloth, Jagganoth is Wrath, Mammon is Greed, Wormface is Envy, Solomon is Pride and Incubus is Lust?

I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up making a deal with one of them (and being quickly betrayed). Solomon seems the most reasonable and relatable so far, not to mention visibly the least horrifying, so I could see her getting fooled into that before he ends up being just as awful as the others.

MikeJF fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Oct 12, 2015

Roland Jones
Aug 18, 2011

Don't accept Trump. Vote Joe. Run Joe Run!

MikeJF posted:

What're the sins again? Mottom's Greed, Jadis is Sloth, Jagganoth is Wrath, Mammon is Greed, Wormface is Envy, Solomon is Pride and Incubus is Lust?

I wouldn't be surprised if she ends up making a deal with one of them (and being quickly betrayed). Solomon seems the most reasonable and relatable so far, not to mention visibly the least horrifying, so I could see her getting fooled into that before he ends up being just as awful as the others.

Mottom's Gluttony, but otherwise, yes, that's basically it.

Tangentially, on the topic of that and Solomon, I love how every time we see him, like during the Concordance of the Demiurges, he's statuesque in appearance. Like, while they're bickering and arguing, he's sitting upright, arms on the chair's armrests and making minimal movements, mostly just raising his hand dismissively, like he's a marble statue or posing for someone; him leaning forward angrily when Mottom blasts Gog-Agog is the closest he comes to breaking that. It's a minor detail but the moment I saw him there it stood out to me and it still amuses me.

Edit: Seriously, look at him here and on the proceeding pages. The man is posing for the people looking at him, both real and imagined, and it's glorious. (Also, Gog-Agog's impression of him is spot-on, and her imitating everyone until Mottom blows her head off is great too.)

Edit again: Also, he has the biggest halo, outside of Jagganoth's, because of course he does.

Roland Jones fucked around with this message at 17:48 on Oct 12, 2015

wiegieman
Apr 22, 2010

Royalty is a continuous cutting motion




Ultra Carp

His throne is higher, too. He's always just a little bit taller than everyone else.

Cryophage
Jan 14, 2012

what the hell is that creepy cartoon thing in your avatar?


MikeJF posted:

So you've got throne in the middle, obviously, and the four orders of angels.

Wasn't there only three orders of angels? (Roots, Petals, Thorns)

MikeJF posted:

Also, Mottom's palace is show in the map of Throne (on the ground) but it's totally different from the palace Allison was shown floating above her in the Void. Does she have one on Throne and one in the Void?

To be fair though, the Throne map lists it as her "summer" palace. It kind of makes sense for the Demiurge associated with Gluttony to have multiple superfluous palace-fortresses.

MikeJF
Dec 20, 2003





Cryophage posted:

Wasn't there only three orders of angels? (Roots, Petals, Thorns)

Oh yeah, I was getting mixed up with the four orders of knights.

SexyBlindfold
Apr 24, 2008
i dont care how much probation i get capital letters are for squares hehe im so laid back an nice please read my low effort shitposts about the arab spring

thanxs!!!


I'm not sure if I'm more impatient for Auntie Maya to wreck poo poo or for Juggernaut to pop a wheelie on his skellycycle. I just want 823 to be okay though

Comrade Gorbash
Jul 12, 2011

My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.


Cryophage posted:



The greatest Art is lying to the face of God.
This is amazing! Do you mind if I crop it for use as an avatar?

Tollymain
Jul 9, 2010

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS


operant i'm pretty hype for broken world but i'm hoping you take more design cues from apocalypse world than dungeon world

i wanna murder fools with 2-harm, not roll for damage

Cryophage
Jan 14, 2012

what the hell is that creepy cartoon thing in your avatar?


Comrade Gorbash posted:

This is amazing! Do you mind if I crop it for use as an avatar?

Sure! Glad you like it!

How exactly were you thinking of avatarizing it? I still have the original png, so if you like I could push Allison and Ciocie closer together so as to maybe help the framing.
Or if you just wanted Ciocie, for instance, I could get you a copy without the speech bubbles.

Cryophage fucked around with this message at 01:24 on Oct 13, 2015

the future is WOW
Sep 9, 2005

I QUIT!


Cryophage posted:

Sure! Glad you like it!

How exactly were you thinking of avatarizing it? I still have the original png, so if you like I could push Allison and Ciocie closer together so as to maybe help the framing.
Or if you just wanted Ciocie, for instance, I could get you a copy without the speech bubbles.

I would definitely take the one with just Cio and no speech bubbles if Gorbash doesn't use that idea (and if you don't mind making it).

paranoid randroid posted:

it took me a little while to figure out that cio did not in fact have four arms, but rather that she just gestures like a spaz and the art is meant to reflect her hyperactive flailing

It definitely looked like she had more than two arms here:



I just assumed she had them folded up under her shirt currently, but your idea also sounds cool.

the future is WOW fucked around with this message at 03:04 on Oct 13, 2015

Cryophage
Jan 14, 2012

what the hell is that creepy cartoon thing in your avatar?


The Mentalizer posted:

I would definitely take the one with just Cio and no speech bubbles if Gorbash doesn't use that idea (and if you don't mind making it).



the future is WOW
Sep 9, 2005

I QUIT!



Hell yeah, thanks man!

Now I just have to think of some text to go with it.

paranoid randroid
Mar 4, 2007



The Mentalizer posted:

Hell yeah, thanks man!

Now I just have to think of some text to go with it.

redtext NOT VERY BRIGHT, THA

Cryophage
Jan 14, 2012

what the hell is that creepy cartoon thing in your avatar?


paranoid randroid posted:

redtext NOT VERY BRIGHT, THA

Blasted poxerly vacuous gaperly whoreson!
<What?>

or redtexted:

MY PAPER SOLDIERS FORM A WALL
FIVE PACES THICK AND TWICE AS TALL

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Comrade Gorbash
Jul 12, 2011

My paper soldiers form a wall, five paces thick and twice as tall.



This was very much what I had in mind!

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