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What is YISUN?
Mother
A lie we tell ourselves to have a purpose
Bliss
A paradox with no solution
Father
A strong female protagonist
The weakest thing there is and the smallest crawling thing
Creator
Everything in this miserable and hellish existence
A solution with no paradoxes
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the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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I like the exsanguinated maiden swaying like the world's most macabre wind chime (visually speaking.) It's a nice little touch of morbid absurdity.

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the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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I was wondering if Mammon was just going to go out as a sympathetic (ish) character or if he was going to flip out like Mottom, guess we know the answer now

I like how all his ancient battle scars are glowing from within, very cool visual

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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OhFunny posted:

I think the tournament is going to be disrupted when the other contestants notice the, now visible, key in Allison's forehead.

I suspect Solomon is going to clamp down on that immediately and make everyone play out the remainder of the tournament anyhow. Nobody fucks with his show.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Fister Roboto posted:

If the first thing Allison does is form a posse of lesser fighters I will lose my poo poo.

only if the second thing Allison does is rally them to take on Solomon David directly

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Lights posted:

I'm curious if perhaps the whole "Angels need a shell to remain in the physical world" thing is less true than expected. White Chain was very definitely able to use her white flame form to beat the poo poo out of Allicio; perhaps the requirement of a shell is merely another piece of the Old Law to be outgrown, and after Dave annihilates her shell, she'll remain in her white flame form going forward.

I think they do need a shell but it's entirely possible that they find a way to seriously stretch the definition of what can be used as a shell. like, say, a devilskin warrior empowered by the original Key of Kings.

either that or Jagganoth crashes the party and turns Davy into a smear

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Hypocrisy posted:

It seems fair. If you want wealth and power you can just sit. If you want revenge on Solomon for the massacre at whatever lake you get your shot.

I like how it plays into his thematic sin of pride in two ways, since in addition to his own sheer hubris he's also baiting every schmuck in the arena who thinks they're too good to sit this one out.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Rhaka posted:

Not being part of the problem doesn't change the fact that people have a problem--a problem you will not experience because you already ruined your life yourself. It's a weirdly privileged position to take.

There are two problems with this. One, it is absolutely a problem that you will experience even after you ruin your life. There is always a bigger badass, you cannot escape a violent end just by being the biggest badass; Meti learned this.

Two, mastering the sword means ruining a lot more lives than your own. There seems to be a very high correlation, approaching 100%, between being a kung fu badass and being a war criminal. Maybe the monks of ki rata managed to get where they were without doing a war crime along the way... maybe. But even if they did, what good did it do anyone in the end? They're all smears and so is everyone who ever opposed their student. The universe as a whole would be way better off if they had decided to master baking instead.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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This scene is just a non-stop barrage of incredible Dave faces on every page :allears:

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Archenteron posted:

Abbadon said we're going to hate the ending of this, so it's probably just gonna be "White Chain dies, Gog does nothing, no moral"

It does kind of feel like this is just a setup to White Chain getting pasted, and the twitch is just "hey look White Chain is so badass that she moved several millimeters during Dave's time stop attack"

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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dave's attack did so much damage that white chain's hp underflowed

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Schwarzwald posted:

So, the match is being broadcasted across most the multiverse, right?

So The Concordance, who have members who would be able to follow the high speed kungfu bullshit, are freaking the gently caress up now, right?

Well, the ones that bother watching.

Gog-Agog is, obviously. Incubus has a horse in this race, so he'll be paying attention. Jadis is all about watching and knowing so she'll be aware. So that's half. But Mottom and Mammon have their own pressing concerns absorbing their attention, and the scurrying of insects is beneath Jagganoth's notice anyhow.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Who What Now posted:

I think you're all missing what's really going to be important in these next few updates: who's going to get White Chain some pants?

Dave is either going to turn her into a fine red mist or hand her some clothes in a sign of respect, either way the problem is solved

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Wittgen posted:

I was responding to your assertion that White Chain saying she did not have to win in order to win implied that it would be narratively unsatisfying if she ended up winning. You are laughably wrong. She fought without attachment to winning. She fought with pure will to do what was right and in so doing she was guranteed to win on a personal level.

This just happens to be a world where fighting in the right frame of mind lets you do crazy magic poo poo.

God this development rules. I hope white chain lives.

I think a big part of what sells it for me is that this is all completely unexpected to her. She threw everything she had into striking the biggest blow to David possible without thought or regard for consequences. She's given up on the goal of actually hitting David and is pouring her whole being into throwing a punch at him just for the sheer sake of defying him with no desire or expectation of success, let alone any intent to kung fu magic herself into a flesh and blood body.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Dead Reckoning posted:

Something has to separate people who shake the pillars of heaven and flout physical laws from the hundred or so chumps that Solomon David punched into chili despite their skill at death matches and desire for universal power.

Again, the key difference is that White Chain had already given up any hope or thought of victory. If any of the chumps in the melee were thinking "hell yeah I'm going to go get turned into paste throwing myself against an invincible god with every fiber of my being" maybe they could have done kung fu miracles too. I mean, I assume there's a certain minimum level of hardcore it takes but there were some pretty badass dudes there.

Zoss sez: do not care about winning
WC sez: I do not care about winning

narrative: preserved

like OK this arc is not necessarily a literary masterpiece but it is self consistent on the face of it

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Dead Reckoning posted:

But again, we saw Pryan Sor's son try the same thing and get blown into flower petals for his efforts. Are we really expected to believe that in the whole history of this tournament, there has never been anyone else who was in it purely to overthrow the dictator and didn't care what happened to them after? If rules and limits are just a lie, why isn't every single person in Throne an unstoppable badass?

She's explicitly not in it to overthrow the dictator, because that is impossible and she knows it. This is about striking at a concept, not even to topple it, but simply because opposing it is the correct thing to do. She's probably not the first person to come at David with the same thought, but she's basically the strongest contender David has ever seen; I think it is permissible to assume that an incredibly disciplined, powerful martial artist who has already done several impossible things through sheer force of will is probably able to apply herself in ways that others are not even if they arrive at the correct mindset.

Dead Reckoning posted:

This also fixes her gender dysphoria. See where the writing goes sideways? Having the fairy god-father just magic a solution to her other major conflict flattens her character: rather than having to grow and find a way to reconcile her life as an angel with her identity, magic wish fulfillment just deletes the whole question and gives her the solution she wanted from the start without any effort or development on her part.

You just described an awful lot of effort and development on her part, though?

Your argument seems to be that these are two different issues that must be dealt with separately but a huge part of White Chain's arc this chapter has been the realization that they're not. Solomon oppressing his empire, the Concordance of Angels oppressing White Chain, and White Chain oppressing Allison are all interconnected expressions of systemic oppression. The comic's explicit text has called this out several times by now and thematically it's been hammered home repeatedly with Solomon continually misgendering WC and parroting her harsh judgments of Allison.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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eke out posted:

'master' is literally a gendered title my dude lmao

no no, clearly he's just acknowledging that she has completed the journeyman stage of her angelship

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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there's Jadis's whole prophecy about the heir being flanked by a white flame and a black flame, which suggests that either WC is still fundamentally a creature of white flame or else WC is not going to be in the picture for much longer (conveniently the comic just introduced a new angel tagalong, and there's nothing that says it has to be the same flame; the 108 followers have a lot of turnover, after all)

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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ThingOne posted:

Spoiler for sorta :nws:


Wait, has this panel been revised twice? I saw a link to the page itself in the comments on the Yes Homo review and the new version isn't what I remember, either; I distinctly remember seeing her torso covered but I don't remember there being as much coverage on her arms & legs.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Patrick Spens posted:

It's interesting to me that folks think he's mad he didn't get cut. To me it seems like relief.

He's simultaneously disappointed/frustrated in himself that he let himself get tagged and disappointed/frustrated in White Chain that she didn't win by his rules. It's the worst of all possible worlds for him.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Rigged Death Trap posted:

It isnt even the first tiddy

It's weird how the comic can show tiddies as victims and fetish objects but as soon as a tiddy shows up as part of a powerful statement of self-actualization people melt down :thunk:

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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It seems extremely in-character for Gog to massively exaggerate the extent of her reach and influence, so I'm not really expecting Oops, All Worms! either.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Xand_Man posted:

10 VG save us from the tyranny of nipples

10 vigilant gaze averted

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Pretending to be another angel sounds suspiciously similar to lying, which angels aren't good at in general.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Lights posted:

His beard is kept meticulous by the power of his Key of Kings - a full seventh of a seventh of Creation is tuned solely to the job of maintaining it.

The economies of entire worlds are structured around producing the beard oils necessary to keep it in perfect condition.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Homeless Friend posted:

I dunno why you'd need to make huge post to say it was too shounen a turn, perfectly reasonable imo. Not sure what they expected from a comic tho lol.

This entire chapter has been an extremely shounen arc.

Absolutely nobody seemed to mind this, right up until the point that the shounen idiom was channeled into the extremely unshounenlike goal of affirming a trans character's gender identity. That is pandering, unlike watching badass kung fu superhero dudes punch the poo poo out of each other, which is good storytelling and not pandering to anybody. :eng101:

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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I'm sorry but if you put Dave in the "Order and Peace" camp over "Self Absorbed Jerks" you haven't been paying much attention this chapter.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Zernach posted:

Next Intra is going to dig a well, and THEN he brains the lord with the rock when he proclaims that the rock will now turn to food. Or turns the rock into air by throwing it so hard that it vaporises along with the lord.

I'm getting a strong Stone Soup vibe from the whole story, so I'm guessing he's going to con them into feeding the village and then kill them when they get pissed and attack him.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Neddy Seagoon posted:

He was pretty pissed at the Count being ruined. Now he has to actually calculate and think again rather than just watch numbers go up.

He can be pissed about more than one thing.

I dunno, I always got the impression that Mammon's whole schtick was more about the priests than about Mammon. Mammon's dotage seems to have been something carefully cultivated by the bondage nun and her followers, ostensibly for Mammon's own sake, and the whole ritual of the count seems to have been devised as a distraction more than anything. His reaction to an intruder popping up and throwing off the routine was to immediately get super loving depressed and wish for death, which the priests don't appreciate for whatever combination of reasons, so they try to keep him focused on this endless, pointless task so that he doesn't have to dwell on his many regrets. He openly admits that it holds no interest or meaning to him, but it beats thinking about anything else.

That's why he was "cured" so quickly when Mottom showed up--he wasn't exactly senile, but he had been lulled into this senseless routine by his handlers to keep him docile and complacent. Mottom blowing his poo poo up simultaneously shook him out of that and also gave him a much more pressing distraction.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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ThaumPenguin posted:

We're about to learn that Zaid has become a gamer

Impossible. Dave would never allow such degeneracy in the very heart of the Celestial Empire.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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now I can't help but wonder if he was saying "rightly" or "lightly"

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Tenebrais posted:

or she doesn't have the right to ask (and this is definitely in the vein of requests he's hoping to get, so not that either).

He was very specifically waiting for a bigger, stronger punchman to come along and be Solomon 2.0 so that he could abdicate and still leave the empire running basically as it ever had. This isn't how he wanted to be bested and it's not how he wanted to abdicate. He could have turned the empire over to the people at any time without waiting to find the strongest punchman.

If "rightly" didn't fit, Abaddon wouldn't have bothered covering up the word. We'll never actually know if he was starting to say "this idea sucks and I'm not doing it" or if he was saying "this idea sucks, are you really really sure".

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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pseudorandom name posted:

Everybody! The next sequence is going to be a pain in the rear end to draw!

i dunno, a smear on the ground doesn't seem all that hard to draw

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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I always assume that just meant that Mammon bought in on the ground floor and worked his way up from there. No one is going to sell one-seventh of the power of God but you could maybe pony up enough to buy 1/777777th.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Donkringel posted:

So all these names are from discworld?

Does anyone know how the audiobooks are?

No firsthand experience but I know a few people who have been listening through them this year and they seem to approve.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Neddy Seagoon posted:

On a side note... I actually like the punk-rock style they've taken with the upcoming TV series of The Watch. It's trying to be its own thing rather than cribbing direct from the books verbatim, and I'm hoping it turns out fun.

I'm torn. On the one hand, it's the kind of adaptation butchery that Terry Pratchett would have hated. On the other hand, if you are going to completely change it up there are worse directions to go than radically inclusive punk rock.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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I am amused that when you gently caress up bad enough the Paternum uses your full name so you know you're really in trouble

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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PMush Perfect posted:

The real question is whether killing Metatron does destroy the Wheel. Because it sounds an awful lot like Jagg is convinced that Metatron is the actual Gnostic Demiurge.

I've been wondering about this one a lot tbh. Metatron seems like the only firsthand source for a lot of cosmology so we basically only have Metatron's word on a lot of stuff.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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It's not really clear what Incubus's plan really is, or if he's even planned that far ahead. I don't think he necessarily wants to rule the multiverse (he doesn't even seem very interested in ruling 1/7 of it) so it's entirely possible he's betting on Allison to win it all and then be grateful enough to let him do whatever he wants. Or, he's hoping there's no clear winner and the multiverse descends into chaos.

the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Grouchio posted:

I find it strange that we've never seen Mottom's influence over the planet Earth she claims as part of her empire.

The multiverse has not been conquered in its entirety. The pact of the seven part world is more like the 1494 Treaty of Tordesillas where Spain and Portugal divvied up the Americas before they had even finished exploring the easternmost coast. Mottom has dibs on 111,111 worlds and the other demiurges are supposed to keep their hands off them, but she hasn't actually conquered all of them yet, so Allison's Earth is untouched.

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the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

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Tulip posted:

A decade or more ago Sluggy Freelance had a moment where a guy broke a super-teleporter so that instead of teleporting you it instacloned you, set it to "transit to all locations" and jumped through it a few times, immediately becoming a sizeable minority unto himself.

Are you thinking of Schlock Mercenary or did both of those comics independently use the same plot point

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