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These threads by me usually get closed by a mod for me freaking out but I will try not to and see what breaks and possibly fix it. So ask me about my journey through the mental health system to find my current diagnosis. About how I feel emotions and other stuff to get rid of some of the misconceptions about being sociopathic.
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Nov 3, 2015 20:20
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Is this starting this thread part of your therapy?
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Nov 3, 2015 23:46
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What do you consider freaking out? Have you killed anyone yet OP?
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Nov 4, 2015 00:56
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Most of the time I just give into one of the traits of either BPD or sociopath when I freak out. Imagined abandonment, delusions, or self pity. I know this is a strange topic, I am just trying to process things and felt like doing it in an A/T. To be perfectly honest this may be attention seeking to soothe the empty hole in me.  Sociopaths and sociopath tendencies don't derive pleasure from altruism and helping someone out due to bad wiring of the brain that used to be useful during prehistoric times. So the key to learning is deriving pleasure from helping for egotistical reasons. I am only sociopath tendencies which means sometimes I can derive pleasure from helping and being good but I can't control when it happens or learn from it without extreme effort. Most sociopaths either find some code to follow that tells them how to act in what situation or learn through punishment to some degree, while 'normal' people learn good and bad from the guilt center of the brain. So it takes a sociopath a lot longer to realize those things if at all. My father is a sociopath and completely cold, uncaring, and rage-prone when his mask falls off even in his 60s but somehow managed to keep up a stable job and stuff because he found god or something. it is mostly true that sociopaths are completely unable to feel normal love. Sociopath can feel love but it tends to be skewed in a way that benefits them and they are never the bad one in the relationship. The owner of my therapy place has a wife but admits he is completely unable to love her in a meaningful way but still is attached to her for whatever reasons he learned. He is the one who first diagnosed me with sociopath after many other diagnoses and my therapist is trying to get me to understand and control the part of me that is normal. As for me I am completely unreliable, unstable, and tell lies constantly. I can't seem to hold down a job due to my co-morbid disorders. I can say these things without guilt. It is hard for a normal person to relate to a sociopath due to the completely different mindsets. There is no cure for sociopathy only treatment to diminish the symptoms but that treatment takes an extreme force of will due to the fact that the sociopath would derive no pleasure from it and have to constantly keep at it to make sure they don't slip up. ShadowMoo fucked around with this message at 03:31 on Nov 4, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 01:23
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ShadowMoo posted:Most of the time I just give into one of the traits of either BPD or sociopath when I freak out. Imagined abandonment, delusions, or self pity. Clarify this. What is your exact diagnosis? Borderline Personality Disorder? Antisocial Personality Disorder? Just traits? If you don't provide this information then your thread will be worthless to anyone.
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Nov 4, 2015 04:08
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ShadowMoo posted:Most of the time I just give into one of the traits of either BPD or sociopath when I freak out. Imagined abandonment, delusions, or self pity. I know this is a strange topic, I am just trying to process things and felt like doing it in an A/T. To be perfectly honest this may be attention seeking to soothe the empty hole in me. See this is weird because I have a friend who was diagnosed with "tendencies" as well and she's basically constantly feeling guilt and shame (she's British ), in fact these seem to be dominant themes with her in relationships. She can also feel normal love that's not very one-sided. She does lie and manipulate people though. AlsoAsclepius Hot Rod posted:Clarify this. What is your exact diagnosis? Borderline Personality Disorder? Antisocial Personality Disorder? Just traits?
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Nov 4, 2015 05:47
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ShadowMoo posted:Sociopaths and sociopath tendencies don't derive pleasure from altruism and helping someone out due to bad wiring of the brain that used to be useful during prehistoric times. So the key to learning is deriving pleasure from helping for egotistical reasons. I am only sociopath tendencies which means sometimes I can derive pleasure from helping and being good but I can't control when it happens or learn from it without extreme effort. Sounds a lot like me growing up. For me what got me to develop a conscience was utilitarianism. Because while you derive no intrinsic pleasure from being nice to people, it is rewarding to believe you are serving an objectively useful purpose by doing so. Dunno if you've come across it but it might help you out some?
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Nov 4, 2015 20:41
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Like helping out a friend, I get no pleasure from the act. But I derive pleasure from the fact that he will like me more for it. I still do acts of random generosity but I get no real pleasure from doing so. I tend to be overly helpful to a fault to cover my illness. I also tend to be taken advantage of easily because I am trying too hard to cover my failings and don't know when to draw the line at too much helpfulness. I myself have never found a moral system that works in all areas and makes me feel fulfilled utilitarianism seems to cold, ones based on religion seem too self-flagellating and worshiping. Parallel Paraplegic posted:See this is weird because I have a friend who was diagnosed with "tendencies" as well and she's basically constantly feeling guilt and shame (she's British My therapist hasn't really talked about my diagnoses except for vague generalities. Every time I ask she says that the diagnoses don't really cover the spectrum of illnesses each person has and are only to be used as a diagnostic tool and not something you should base your life around. Some people learn to compensate for certain areas better than others. I also mildly freaked out when I got the sociopath diagnoses because it didn't fit my view of myself. And when I am feeling something akin to guilt or sadness I try to ask myself if the act is somehow beneficial to me. The sociopathic brain is focused on the self and benefiting itself from what I understand. Parallel Paraplegic posted:See this is weird because I have a friend who was diagnosed with "tendencies" as well and she's basically constantly feeling guilt and shame (she's British I only know about love from personal experience but I tend to stay away from affection due to BPD. For me every time I get into a relationship I am either overly-affectionate or extremely cold and distant with mild paranoia about abandonment sprinkled in. 'They are going to abandon me so I have to do it first' or 'i need to prove they don't actually love me'. quote:One of Thomas's main points is that sociopaths are often wrongly villainized. Not all sociopaths are criminals (most crimes are, in fact, committed by empaths who go off the rails). More than that, Thomas argues (persuasively) that many characteristics of the sociopathic personality—charm, ambition and impatience, an ability to attack problems with cold-hearted logic (not letting emotions get in the way)—are useful to society. We see the proof every day: The most successful lawyers, doctors, actors, politicians, statesmen, military leaders, and corporate executives frequently do exhibit many of the signature characteristics of sociopaths (if not also psychopaths). Indeed, capitalism is set up to reward those who have no qualms about profiting off the labors of others. (No less a champion of capitalism than Forbes Magazine has noted the "Disturbing Link Between Psychopathy and Capitalism.") Likewise, in politics, those who go far tend to be smooth-talking manipulators who carefully calibrate their moral code to the requirements of the moment. ShadowMoo fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Nov 5, 2015 |
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Nov 4, 2015 22:59
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I'm more curious about your therapist and diagnosis than anything since afaik sociopath hasn't been a proper psychiatric term or diagnosis for a long time if it ever was. What country/state are you in (if you don't mind saying), what sort of therapist(s) are telling you this and when were you first diagnosed? I hear it used as an informal way of saying non-violent psychopath which fits with your quote about sociopathy in capitalism and politics. You can also show psychopathic traits without full-on being one so I'm curious what the difference is?
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Nov 5, 2015 01:34
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ShadowMoo posted:Like helping out a friend, I get no pleasure from the act. But I derive pleasure from the fact that he will like me more for it. I still do acts of random generosity but I get no real pleasure from doing so. I tend to be overly helpful to a fault to cover my illness. I also tend to be taken advantage of easily because I am trying too hard to cover my failings and don't know when to draw the line at too much helpfulness. It is cold, that's why I like it. Because I'm fairly good at it, being kind of cold by nature. Mostly it's about internalising the beliefs in it. If you act knowing absolutely that you're serving a worthwhile purpose it can do a lot to substitute for an inability to gain pleasure from the gratification of others. If you get good you can even kind of view the wellbeing of others as inherently high utility and it's almost like what I assume you're supposed to feel when you see people happy. Utilitarianism works well also because it makes you believe that Utility is good for you, in the long run, so I find it helps with the desire to just use things around you. Actually, has your therapist mentioned that you might be depressed? Because the stuff you're saying about everything seeming very hard seems more akin to depression than anything. It could be helpful to you to perhaps seek some kind of treatment for that before working on the sociopathic tendencies because it's going to be much harder to do anything without the motivation. A holistic approach is sound but you seem to be describing the lack of motivation as a pretty big stumbling block. Might be worth focusing on that first?
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Nov 5, 2015 02:46
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Saint Drogo posted:I'm more curious about your therapist and diagnosis than anything since afaik sociopath hasn't been a proper psychiatric term or diagnosis for a long time if it ever was. What country/state are you in (if you don't mind saying), what sort of therapist(s) are telling you this and when were you first diagnosed? Generally when a therapist says "tendencies" it's because you don't actually have a particular full-blown named disorder but just a few particular traits of it. The whole "diagnoses don't cover the spectrum" thing is accurate but also sort of misleading, since there's a lot of underlying things that can cause "sociopathic tendencies" that we do actually have terms for so leaving it at "sociopath" seems a bit odd. Nobody fits into these terms exactly of course since most mental issues are a bunch of sliding scales, but they're still somewhat useful. As a personal example, I have been diagnosed with "agoraphobic tendencies" where I feel more anxious and less comfortable when I'm not at home, but I lack other traits of full-blown agoraphobia. Anyway ShadowMoo, I don't mean to poo poo on your thread with all this or anything 
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Nov 5, 2015 04:29
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This is going to sound a bit odd, but could I have your response to the following short poem about selfishness? It's moderately famous, but if you haven't encountered it before and know nothing more about it (it would be great if this were the case), it would help if you didn't Google to find out more about the author. None of the books have time To say how being selfless feels, They make it sound a superior way Of getting what you want. It isn't at all. Selflessness is like waiting in a hospital In a badly fitting suit on a cold morning. Selfishness is like listening to good jazz With drinks for further orders and a huge fire. In particular, does this way of thinking strike you as more characteristic of sociopathy, or more characteristic of the general run of morality? How often, if at all, do you estimate that an ordinary person might expect to feel like this?
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Nov 5, 2015 11:51
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How do you support yourself? Do you have a learning disability too? Do you live in a group home?
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Nov 5, 2015 19:38
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Forgive me if I ask a stupid question, I know embarrassingly little about sociopathy. Why do you feel guilty about your sociopathic tendencies? Are you able to emotionally care for the well-being of others? Do you wish you didn't have sociopathic tendencies?
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Nov 5, 2015 21:01
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JohnsonsJohnson posted:How do you support yourself? I support my self through Mturk while my parents pay my bills and my DSS finds me a job that fits my strengths. I do not have a learning disability, but I do find it hard to learn the more stress and anxiety I feel. My mother tried to find me a group home but I live in bum-gently caress North Carolina which has next to no treatment centers for mental disorders. unwantedplatypus posted:Forgive me if I ask a stupid question, I know embarrassingly little about sociopathy. Because it literally keeps me up at night knowing I can't feel the same way other people do. I can care, but I can also be extremely distant and not care. It depends on how close I am to that person. When my mother had breast cancer I worried about her but still acted in ways that made it seem I didn't care about her. Yes, I do wish to be normal but the amount of effort to pretend to be normal is way beyond what I care to do. My therapist currently has me on Paxil, invega, and Buspar. Trying to get onto a stronger antianxiety but I think they avoid that because it would further numb my gut ability to determine bad from good, When I was younger before college I thought I was somehow better than everyone else and special. Then life finally made me realize how stupid I can be at times and now I am intensely self-denigrating. My therapist says that I am a good person at heart but that I tend to mess up if I don't think my options through and make a rushed decision. Anytime I get into the mindset of 'I am obviously better than everyone else, other people are just toys' is usually when I need to find a quiet place to calm down. It is also why I shun human contact. I never know when that little demon in me will wake up and I start yelling and making a scene. My therapist has said I may have mild agoraphobia because of it. I only feel safe at home and in certain places I have grown used to like my therapy office. I can usually tell when it is waking up because I get the feeling like 'let's have some fun here' and I have to press it out of my consciousness. The pleasure I get from listening to it is extreme, but I know that it is not worth the cost or ruined relationships. So I try to avoid it whenever I feel it by being completely passive and allowing others to direct me. If I can't escape the situation then I feel like I have to get my way *no matter the cost*. And if I am being passive then I always feel indignant, like the other person is trying to take advantage of me. Some sociopaths have learned to avoid getting into legal trouble while still giving into that high by doing victimless crimes or using people. I can't at all so I avoid it at all costs. The difference between a psychopath and a sociopath from my understanding is that a psychopath has learned to completely give in to that high and will do anything for it. And they base their life around getting the next fix. The worst thing a sociopath can do is focus on that dark hole inside to make it go away. It will either mislead you or make the pain worse. From what my therapist says. Best thing to do is to distract yourself from it constantly. There are such things as prosocial psychopaths/sociopaths that fill that dark hole by being really good at something or a captain of industry and being intensely competitive. ShadowMoo fucked around with this message at 01:48 on Nov 6, 2015 |
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Nov 5, 2015 23:33
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ShadowMoo posted:I support my self through Mturk while my parents pay my bills and my DSS finds me a job that fits my strengths. Please forgive me for being so blunt, but all of this sounds like total horseshit. Here is what I'm reading - You were an obnoxious and stupid libertarian in college - You care about close people, but you have trouble showing it -Sometimes, if you don't control yourself, you act like an rear end in a top hat - You feel most comfortable at home and familiar places; interacting with new people is difficult and sometimes frightening for you Look, this is true for every single person on this planet. Like, literally every single person. You really have to explain what exactly makes you such a monster. Did you try to set your parents on fire, while they were sleeping or something? Did you ever try to get a second opinion? All this talk about "sociopaths say this, psychopath do that" is triggering my scam alarm.
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Nov 6, 2015 02:10
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Yeah, this thread is completely ridiculous. I'm not an expert on the subject by any means, but I have done a fair amount of reading about sociopaths/psychopaths because it is interesting to me. You are not a sociopath and your therapist is either an idiot or is scamming the gently caress out of you. If you were a sociopath you wouldn't give a flying gently caress that you are a sociopath. In fact, you would most likely consider "normal" people to be stupid or weak willed. You definitely wouldn't feel any guilt over it, because one of the key qualities of being a sociopath is that you don't feel guilty about anything. I don't want to be a dick or anything, but you're just a run of the mill person with personality issues, and this whole thing seems like an excuse to avoid any form of personal growth. Don't worry, I was a bit of an rear end in a top hat too when I was younger, self reflection and life experience has done wonders for me. (though I'm still a bit of an rear end in a top hat sometimes)
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Nov 6, 2015 05:27
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Born_to_Lose posted:Yeah, this thread is completely ridiculous. I'm not an expert on the subject by any means, but I have done a fair amount of reading about sociopaths/psychopaths because it is interesting to me. You are not a sociopath and your therapist is either an idiot or is scamming the gently caress out of you. If you were a sociopath you wouldn't give a flying gently caress that you are a sociopath. In fact, you would most likely consider "normal" people to be stupid or weak willed. You definitely wouldn't feel any guilt over it, because one of the key qualities of being a sociopath is that you don't feel guilty about anything. I don't want to be a dick or anything, but you're just a run of the mill person with personality issues, and this whole thing seems like an excuse to avoid any form of personal growth. Don't worry, I was a bit of an rear end in a top hat too when I was younger, self reflection and life experience has done wonders for me. I mean like I said "sociopathic tendencies" is not "sociopath," it's just a therapist saying you have a few symptoms/traits of sociopathy while not actually being one. This does sort of just sound like "every single person during their teens/early 20's" to me though, but I feel we're not getting the whole picture either way.
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Nov 6, 2015 05:34
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As an actual sociopath, this dude sounds like a pussy.
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Nov 6, 2015 06:09
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Born_to_Lose posted:Yeah, this thread is completely ridiculous. I'm not an expert on the subject by any means, but I have done a fair amount of reading about sociopaths/psychopaths because it is interesting to me.
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Nov 6, 2015 06:22
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are you sure you aren't just autistic, op?
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Nov 6, 2015 08:25
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ShadowMoo posted:As for me I am completely unreliable, unstable, and tell lies constantly. yeah lets follow an A/T thread with a guy that says this off the bat in his second post  anyone taking this thread seriously
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Nov 6, 2015 09:22
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Counterpoint: My psychiatrist called me a psychopath, furthermore pointing out that I hit a very signifcant portion of the markers on the psychopathy checklist. She was very mad, I made a gambit and decided to try and tell her the truth. The truth is that she couldn't handle the truth, she lost any since of objectivity because I had offended her personal senses of morality to such a great degree. I don't identify as a psychopath though because defining yourself based upon a classification of mental illness is loving retarded. Like on the 3rd date are you dropping that bombshell on people? Is it very important for people to know that you're a lying manipulating self centered narcissicist just generally poor excuse for a person? Let them figure out that part on their own.
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Nov 6, 2015 10:00
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Scald posted:Counterpoint: I don't know if you are a psychopath or not, but you seem perfectly unpleasant and anti-social. You should take over this thread as OP.
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Nov 6, 2015 10:12
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how many times do you say gently caress YOU DAD on any given day OP?
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Nov 6, 2015 16:03
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OP, how often have you watched season 1 of Dexter, and do you have a name for your "Dark Passenger"
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Nov 6, 2015 16:03
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faarcyde posted:Wow, you have read a Wiki on a mental disorder? Tell us more. No, douchebag, actually I meant books. You know those things one reads when they're interested in learning about certain subjects? Parallel Paraplegic posted:I mean like I said "sociopathic tendencies" is not "sociopath," it's just a therapist saying you have a few symptoms/traits of sociopathy while not actually being one. Yeah that's true, but what I was getting at (poorly) is that I assume 'sociopathic tendencies' would be fairly extreme personality issues, such as severe narcissism, a marked lack of concern for anyone but OP's self, or an almost complete inability to feel remorse/guilt. From what he's wrote it sounds like OP's evidence for being a sociopath is that he's kind of a dick sometimes and doesn't enjoying helping other people. I just think that around his age you're really struggling to understand yourself so it can be easy to attach lots of weight to certain labels, especially if a perceived authority figure or otherwise important person in one's life reinforces them. I went through the same phase, as I think everyone does.
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Nov 6, 2015 16:20
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Am I wrong in saying that real life sociopaths probably aren't hollywood villains with absolutely everything except
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Nov 6, 2015 16:21
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ShadowMoo posted:My therapist currently has me on Paxil, invega, and Buspar. Trying to get onto a stronger antianxiety but I think they avoid that because it would further numb my gut ability to determine bad from good, AFAIK, the defining characteristic of a sociopath is that they are really not a good person in practice, never mind 'at heart'. They deliberately take, as no more than their due, far more than they give in relationships, at work, and in business dealings, and they will knowingly and without embarrassment take from people much worse off than they are themselves. It's not their self-reported internal emotions - whether rich or impoverished - that present the red flag, it's how they treat other people. More questions: Why does someone who has aspects of a personality disorder need to take an antipsychotic, plus a drug generally used to treat Generalised Anxiety Disorder? Have you got a stack of former diagnoses (or current co-morbid diagnoses), and if so, what are they? Most importantly, why on earth are you or your parents paying for psychiatric advice from someone who is a self-admitted and possibly self-diagnosed sociopath? And how big a mental health service is this guy running?
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Nov 6, 2015 16:31
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I went through a similar thing in my 20's where I brought up the idea that maybe I had some sociopathic tendencies to my therapist. Turns out nope, I'm just someone who has a hard time fighting through my various insecurities, connecting with people and maintaining relationships. Looking back I think the sociopath thing was me desperately wanting a fancy label to explain why I felt different than other people, when the truth is there's really nothing special about my issues whatsoever. When you're depressed, have a poo poo self-image, and just generally feel not good enough, its easy to latch onto something that would make you feel like some sort of special case. Something that makes it ok to continue thoughtlessly along the same path, because hey, none of the "normal" people really understand what you're going through. Luckily my therapist isn't a shithead and knowing me pretty well at that point, he was able to call out that bullshit pretty much right away.
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Nov 6, 2015 17:13
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ITT: people who don't know the selfish gene
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Nov 6, 2015 17:25
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Basebf555 posted:I went through a similar thing in my 20's where I brought up the idea that maybe I had some sociopathic tendencies to my therapist. Turns out nope, I'm just someone who has a hard time fighting through my various insecurities, connecting with people and maintaining relationships. Looking back I think the sociopath thing was me desperately wanting a fancy label to explain why I felt different than other people, when the truth is there's really nothing special about my issues whatsoever. There's this old Pictures for Sad Children about a woman going to the doctor, the doctor explains that her lack of motivation, general apathy towards the world, failure at life and inability to function are all due to easily treatable problems. Then it turns out she was imagining the whole thing and the doctor says she's healthy as a horse.
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Nov 6, 2015 18:15
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ShadowMoo posted:
Maybe you should learn from his success and seek God yourself?
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Nov 6, 2015 20:03
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CISMALES DID 9-11 posted:OP, how often have you watched season 1 of Dexter, and do you have a name for your "Dark Passenger" Watched the series 6 times, got worse every time but that first time I totally just wanted to up and become a crooked cop. Dark Passenger is a pretty fruity way to describe it, I think a closer analog is Barry & other Barry from Archer. It's still you, just the other side that contains what most people would consider to be the worst personality traits. Very useful traits to possess at times, but very, very ugly. I'm really far from the worst example though, Carnival of Shrews posted:AFAIK, the defining characteristic of a sociopath is that they are really not a good person in practice, never mind 'at heart'. They deliberately take, as no more than their due, far more than they give in relationships, at work, and in business dealings, and they will knowingly and without embarrassment take from people much worse off than they are themselves. It's not their self-reported internal emotions - whether rich or impoverished - that present the red flag, it's how they treat other people. This guy right here you are describing is my roommate, possessing a sort of superficial charm that initially makes you think highly of them. But as the months go by and you do the math you'll find that all of their actions are motivated by self interest and gain. They'll offer you (lovely) favours and in exchange feel justified in asking you for anything that comes to mind. Call them out on their poo poo though and cut them off and be prepared to see a whole different side of them, before you extricate them completely from your life.
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Nov 6, 2015 20:09
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CISMALES DID 9-11 posted:OP, how often have you watched season 1 of Dexter, and do you have a name for your "Dark Passenger" Watching dexter was too close to home for me. I don't have a name for my dark passenger I just wish he would go away at times but other times I need him to deal with certain things in life. The meds help with that. Me and my therapist did playacting and we found most of my triggers. I am a normal person until one of my triggers goes off, then all bets are off. Once that switch is flipped I become a completely different person until I regain sanity. I use the sensations of my body to tell when I am out, stress reactions of my body usually bring me back to sanity which is why they don't want to give me strong anti-anxietys i think. ShadowMoo fucked around with this message at 05:40 on Nov 7, 2015 |
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Nov 7, 2015 05:36
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Born_to_Lose posted:Yeah, this thread is completely ridiculous. I'm not an expert on the subject by any means, but I have done a fair amount of reading about sociopaths/psychopaths because it is interesting to me. You are not a sociopath and your therapist is either an idiot or is scamming the gently caress out of you. If you were a sociopath you wouldn't give a flying gently caress that you are a sociopath. In fact, you would most likely consider "normal" people to be stupid or weak willed. You definitely wouldn't feel any guilt over it, because one of the key qualities of being a sociopath is that you don't feel guilty about anything. I don't want to be a dick or anything, but you're just a run of the mill person with personality issues, and this whole thing seems like an excuse to avoid any form of personal growth. Don't worry, I was a bit of an rear end in a top hat too when I was younger, self reflection and life experience has done wonders for me. Or maybe he is getting treatment and doing better? Seriously, gently caress off
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Nov 7, 2015 16:30
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A few questions OP. Do you have any trouble making new friends? How do people generally view you, as a mess or as a well put together person? Are there any behaviors that get you into trouble, yet you have a hard time avoiding repeating them?
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Nov 7, 2015 17:57
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ashgromnies posted:Or maybe he is getting treatment and doing better? Seriously, gently caress off Okay, I apologize- rereading my initial post it comes across a lot more abrasive than I intended. I don't want to mock OP or make him feel bad, quite the opposite. I'm concerned that he is a person with legitimate mental/personality stuff that he needs to work through and it is great that he's trying to get help. However, it sounds like the therapist he is going to is filling his head with nonsense that could quite possibly be detrimental to his overall well being. I mean, the fact that he started a topic imploring people to ask him what it's like having "sociopathic tendencies" makes me think he's putting a lot of weight into what this person is telling him, and the advice he's getting (based on OP's description) seems pretty dubious to me. That's all.
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Nov 8, 2015 05:23
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What the gently caress is this poo poo? Pure altruism is bullshit and everyone does poo poo to help others for some kind of personal gain at some level even if no one likes to admit it. I remember one psych study stating that throwing yourself in front of someone to take a bullet is in some manner self-serving since it preserves a similar genetic line to your own. What's important is to strive towards pure altruism even if it is an impossibility in the tangible world. But I certainly would not let someone get you down over not being 100% selfless because no one is. Being manipulative and constantly using people for personal gain is one thing, but doing poo poo for people because it's nice and strengthens your relationship with them is pretty normal human interaction.
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Nov 8, 2015 18:56
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Avalanche posted:What the gently caress is this poo poo? this is the most  post in the entire freaking universe
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Nov 9, 2015 05:06
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