Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Ross Angeles posted:

Declan can you break down Malik Pope from SDSU for me because he owns

He's really bad at actually playing basketball and chad ford needs to chill

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Ross Angeles posted:

He hasn't looked good at all so far and it's really weird

He was bad last year too.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
He averaged like 5 and 2 last year on pretty crappy percentages for a 6'10" dude and struggled to get minutes.

MourningView fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Nov 19, 2015

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I'm pretty sure Chad Ford is the biggest reason anyone thinks of Pope as a big prospect right now and he has a tendency pump up toolsy guys when it's early in the draft cycle, even if they haven't done much on the court to back it up. See also: Chris Walker.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
That is the reason he is bad but it doesn't make his current badness less true.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
The passing is as advertised, and the rest of his skill set seems lot farther along than it was supposed to be. He's a lot more smooth with the ball in his hands than I thought he'd be based on the little bit I'd seen before, which is a nice surprise. If he tightens up his jumper he can probably play on the wing, which is good because he can't really play in the post right now for the most part and is really skinny. His defense kinda sucks aside from being able to block some shots, but that's always slow. Same with the not being able to play off the ball thing. He hasn't really had to very much.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

C. Everett Koop posted:

In terms of young guys, I saw LeBron in his senior year of high school and it was obvious that he was a man among boys (literally) then, and he didn't give two shits about defense, so giving demerits to Simmons on that account is kinda whatevs. Other than Davis due to his shot-blocking, who was the last big-time guy to hit the draft and be known for their D anyway?

It happens a lot with big guys. The most notable example post-LeBron would be Oden in terms of draft hype, but it was also true of Karl Anthony Towns way back uhhhh...last year. And for wings Wiggins was probably farther along defensively in college than he was offensively, although it's been the opposite so far in the pros.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

euphronius posted:

Huge gamble for #1 that he learns to shoot.

I think less so given that there isn't really anything approaching a sure thing behind him (with the caveat that I know literally nothing about Dragan Bender beyond that he has a really dope name)

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Rick posted:

So he doesn't have a funny name but Kris Dunn looks really darn good.

He's really good. I thought he hosed up not leaving last year since he'd have probably been a late lottery pick, but he can do even better than that this year if he keeps it up

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Declan MacManus posted:

If you have a superlative prospect, they are often able to shore up their shooting or if they can't then they can compensate in other areas.


He's "matched up" against Denzel Valentine tomorrow so that's a good opportunity to see him play if anyone's missed it. He's been phenomenal but he doesn't have a ton of range

He hit like 35% of his threes last year, although not on a ton of attempts

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Redgrendel2001 posted:

43 points
15-20 FG
14 rebounds
7 assists
5 steals
3 blocks

All right at the rim against a pretty crappy team, but still pretty great.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I only watched Henry Ellenson once and he got thoroughly owned by Jarrod Uthoff and Adam Woodbury so psh.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I love Sabonis The Younger. He isn't super polished but he's big and plays so loving hard. He rebounds like a motherfucker.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

NickRoweFillea posted:

So Buddy Hield

Is a like 6'2" shooting guard who is pretty old for a draft pick.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
Those guys are mostly point guards and Valentine is probably like a mid first rounder too

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Dejan Bimble posted:

I thought Ben Simmons was just supposed to be a future all star with questions about his shooting and engagement, he looks a little bit better than that

He still can't really shoot but he's better at everything else than expected

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I've been hating on this draft, and I still think it's really shallow, but Simmons and Brandon Ingram is really really good top 2

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
It's almost like there is a reason people are skeptical of prospects who make a big leap as a senior

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Probably Magic posted:

I mean, it's not like Buddy was bad last year.

He wasn't but he's taken a huge jump in efficiency this year and that becomes less meaningful when trying to project someone's NBA future the older the player is and the longer he's been in school because there are a lot of inherent advantages to being older and more experienced than a large portion of the guys you're competing against.

I don't think he's going to be a terrible NBA player or something, I just think he's more like a mid first round type guy who will probably top out as a good off the bench gunner. There are legitimate explanations for his stock being lower than you'd expect it to be for a guy who is as productive as he's been this season.

MourningView fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Jan 21, 2016

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
He is extremely fun to watch and I will be happy if he's good.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

ButtWolf posted:

Has anyone watched Gary Payton II play? Stat-wise, he looks similar to his father. Just wondering if the eye test shows the same. That would be cool to literally have a Glove clone.

Defensively he looks a lot like his dad. He's really long and athletic and gets a ton of steals. He's also a great shot blocker and rebounder for his size. He's not even close to his dad offensively though. He can't shoot at all, and doesn't always look like the most natural point guard, although he's gotten a little better in that regard (his shot selection used to be absolutely horrible but it seems to have improved a lot this year). He's still pretty raw for a 23 year old, but he's interesting from a tools perspective. He'll get drafted. Could be late first but probably more like early second.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I really like LaVert aside from the injury thing

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Hand Row posted:

What are your guys thoughts on Ellenson? I think I would be pretty happy to get him at 7 or later.

I think his game will improve and translate pretty well. He should develop a long range game and can at least abuse smaller players in the post off switches. Has the handle to immediately run the break.

Defense is iffy but his wingspan alone should help there.

I need to watch him again because the only time I've seen him play this year was against Iowa and he was awful.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Declan MacManus posted:

Not a fan of Ellenson higher than 10 or so. Garbage defender and his jump shooting is overrated at this stage.

Yeah people talk about him like he's going to be this elite stretch 4 but he's not even cracking 30% from three this year. It seems to be the typical deal where people just assume any white dude who isn't a center can shoot.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Henchman of Santa posted:

So I'm watching Bryn Forbes hit 11 threes in a game and I've gotten to wondering if he can make the league in a JJ Redick lite role. Am I just being a homer? He's gotta at least get a look in Summer League, right?

No, yes, and probably, respectively

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

PotatoJudge posted:

Questions about Big 10 prospects:

Any chance AJ Hammons moves up / becomes a useful player? Right now most mocks I've seen put him early - mid 2nd round. Is he too slow for pace and space, or does size still count? I'm worried he'd be a Roy Hibbert with a slightly better touch

Is Indiana going to lose Thomas Bryant and / or Troy Williams? They're on some mocks in late 1st / early 2nd but completely missing from others. Losing those two plus Yogi graduating would be sweet.

Has Melo Trimble totally sunk his chances of leaving this year with this long-rear end slump he's in? And why is Diamond Stone so high on boards? He's a shorter Hammons with less range.

Diamond Stone is a way better offensive player than Hammons, especially when you consider that he's a lot younger and presumably has more room to grow and develop. I don't get the comparison between those two at all aside from both being tall guys from the Big Ten. Hammons has improved a lot offensively but Stone might be the best player in the conference on a per minute basis and he's only a true freshman. And I dunno about less range. He doesn't take a ton of jumpers but he's a really good free throw shooter which tends to be a good sign when it comes to projecting range at the next level. It's not like Hammons is drilling a ton of threes. He has a good percentage this year but he's shot 10 of them all season.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I like Jamaal Murray and would take him top 5*. He's not a point guard in the slightest but dude can score and shoot and 6'5" is fine for a shooting guard.

Skal is still super raw but he looks a lot better lately and it seems like Cal is letting him show more flashes of the perimeter game he's supposed to have. He looked lost early on but lately you can at least kinda see what people saw in him. I think anywhere from 10 down he's worth a shot.

*1. Simmons
2. Ingram
3. Poeltl
4. Murray
5. Bender (I know almost literally nothing about Dragan Bender)

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Hand Row posted:

Billups is who I have heard the most.

Nah, he's not as good at running a team as Billups was. Maybe like Eric Gordon pre-injury problems?

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

straight up brolic posted:

lol at comparing a dude with a 40 inch vertical to Jeff Hornacek. From what I've seen there's not a very good comparison for Murray, maybe a better shooting OJ Mayo??. 6'4 guys who are both athletic and can shoot are fairly rare.f

If he has a 40 inch vert he doesn't play like it. Lack of explosiveness is probably his biggest weakness (that's not just me either, it's in literally every scouting report of him that's d I've seen), the Hornacek comparison actually isn't that bad. He doesnt get to the rim a ton (when he does drive he tends to settle for a little floater, which he's actually pretty good at) and his free throw rate is just so so. You very rarely see him get all the way to the hoop and finish over or through people. He and Kentucky exploded after Cal started playing him almost entirely off the ball, running him around a ton of screens, and letting him light it up from outside

MourningView fucked around with this message at 14:04 on Mar 15, 2016

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
"Everyone" in this case being "DraftExpress", who doesn't even really do a mock in the traditional sense this early in the process, they just have Ingram as their top ranked player right now. Simmons is not the absolute lock he was two months ago and there's a lot of grumbling about his effort, but most people still have him projected to go first, I think. Ingram has been closing the gap for most of the season and could pass him with a really good tournament (although I think Duke could get bounced fairly early) but Simmons is still probably the favorite to go first right now.

MourningView fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Mar 15, 2016

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Rick posted:

I watched most of Simmons games the last 1/4 of the season and I honestly don't think his effort was that bad. He was at times openly frustrated with his teammates, but, deservedly so I'd argue. One of the national commentators put it very nicely, when he said he didn't think that Simmons teammates embraced the opportunity to play with someone like Simmons this season. Of course, the Sixers and Lakers might worry about this since they're gonna be a frustrating situation next year . . .

He is really lazy defensively. But offensively I'm mostly inclined to agree. A lot of the "lack of aggression" he got hammered for (and remember Wiggins got poo poo on for the same thing) was bad coaching and playing with crappy guards who chucked up a ton of bad shots (though Simmons does legitimately seem kinda terrified to take a jump shot which is a genuine worry). And he may have checked out a bit and started looking ahead to the NBA at the end of the year when it became clear they weren't going anywhere but I have a hard time blaming him too much. He shouldn't have had to play college basketball in the first place

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
A skinnier, taller, and less crazy Royce White sounds exactly like the sort of dude who should be a number 1 pick. The issue with him was never skill. He and Draymond were basically the exact same player in college.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
He can score though. He averaged almost 20 a game on a team that pretty much everyone agrees didn't do enough to get him the ball (along with 11 rebounds and 5 assists as a power forward) He just can't shoot well yet. And if you're eliminating someone from number one pick contention solely because they don't have a great jumper yet, congrats on passing on LeBron James.

MourningView fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Mar 16, 2016

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
The blind man was cheating to sign him to a way below market deal. gently caress him and good on Carlos for getting paid

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
Kyrie played like 10 games for Duke he doesn't count

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
No the hipster dude on Stephen F Austin is not going to be a first round pick

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

ButtWolf posted:

Wasnt Jalen Brunson really highly touted? Havent heard m7ch about him this year.

He's fine for a freshman. He was a big recruit but not like top 10 or something. I don't think he was expected to be one and done

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

ButtWolf posted:

I had seen a lot of mixtape stuff last year so i presumed top 10. He looks pretty good.

Like literally every prospect who is even moderately notable gets a bunch of mixtapes and they all look good in them because that's the whole point of a mixtape.

He's a 6 foot dude who averaged 9 points and 2.5 assists a game on meh percentages; he's not really an NBA prospect right now.

MourningView fucked around with this message at 04:40 on Mar 21, 2016

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
The random free throw in the Vesley mixtape is still funny even after watching that tape like 500 times

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
I like him but he's probably like a back half of the first round guy at best because of the things you mentioned. He's below average athletically by NBA standards, has short arms relative to his size, and doesn't do much offensively outside of the post. I think he can find a place in the league though. He plays his rear end off and rebounds like a motherfucker.

  • Locked thread