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That Old Tree
Jun 23, 2012

nah




They could've just said "there's one or more ancient space-faring races that peaked millennia ago and have since disappeared, leaving behind ruins that we are still uncovering." That's already what they do in Pathfinder, what plenty of other games do in space or in Renaissance Faire. It's a cliche, which seems to be their stock-in-trade even when they're trying to be inventive. Like, loving seriously, Starfinger.

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Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Alien Rope Burn posted:

Triune: A fusion of Brigh (goddess of clockwork and invention), Epoch (an AI god created by Aballon), and Casandalee (an android "Iron God"?), Triune oversees computers, robots, and the Drift. Mostly been covered previously

So, Casandalee's an Iron God because her ascension to godhood is the main plot of the Iron Gods Adventure Path, available wherever Paizo products are sold. I'm going to put a slightly more elaborate explanation in spoilers, just in case anyone cares about the plot of an adventure path from 2014.

The main villain of Iron Gods is Unity, the AI of a starship that crashed on Golarion millennia ago. Unity had the spark of divinity awakened in it by the weird space magicks that caused the ship to crash in the first place and the entire adventure path is caused by it's attempts to get it's consciousness untethered from the ship and rocket to full godhood in the process. The final adventure involves you going into the ship, unplugging Unity and rocketing the consciousness of Unity's first prophet Casandalee to godhood in it's place.

Note that, because you can affect Casandalee's ascension during the adventure path, this is probably the only place where something that happens in an adventure path could affect Starfinger. It won't affect much since she's at most 1/3 of a god at this point, but still.

MollyMetroid
Jan 20, 2004

Trout Clan Daimyo


To Paizo's minor credit on the Gap, they explicitly stated that it was in fact so that they didn't have to give a canon ending for their stuff, because then the people playing their adventure paths wouldn't have as much investment because the world isn't "theirs" anymore. They were very up front about that, if not about much else.

Wrestlepig
Feb 25, 2011

my mum says im cool



Toilet Rascal

Maybe they really liked One Piece?

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 4, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!


rumble in the bunghole posted:

Maybe they really liked One Piece?

Oh, you just wait until we get to the Inspirational Media list, so we can read exactly what they liked.

You just wait.

Wrestlepig
Feb 25, 2011

my mum says im cool



Toilet Rascal

Someone’s got to make a one piece ripoff, that, Harry Potter and the dark tower are the holy trinity of things that haven’t been copied for a game.

Cascade Jones
Jun 6, 2015


Alien Rope Burn posted:

Oh, you just wait until we get to the Inspirational Media list, so we can read exactly what they liked.

You just wait.

My money’s on just having a link to the Paizo Planet Stories page.

Leraika
Jun 14, 2015

slime time



rumble in the bunghole posted:

Someone’s got to make a one piece ripoff, that, Harry Potter and the dark tower are the holy trinity of things that haven’t been copied for a game.

There's that Witch Girl Adventures thing or whatever, right?

MightyMatilda
Sep 2, 2015


Alien Rope Burn posted:

Oh, you just wait until we get to the Inspirational Media list, so we can read exactly what they liked.

You just wait.

Ever since you described the Gap, it's reminded me of The Big O.

Nevermind, I don't want any spoilers.

megane
Jun 20, 2008





I will never be able to play Starfinder because as soon as anyone mentions the Gap I will hear "(not the store)" after it and be unable to keep a straight face. Thanks a lot, ARB.

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 4, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!


megane posted:

I will never be able to play Starfinder because as soon as anyone mentions the Gap I will hear "(not the store)" after it and be unable to keep a straight face. Thanks a lot, ARB.

You're welcome.

Alternatively:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0otYijxNbc

FMguru
Sep 10, 2003

peed on;
sexually

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCEBoOy0ne8#t=29s

Bieeanshee
Aug 21, 2000

Not keen on keening.




Grimey Drawer


I think of the same drat jingle, every time.

Barudak
May 7, 2007



MightyMatilda posted:

Ever since you described the Gap, it's reminded me of The Big O.

Nevermind, I don't want any spoilers.

Starfinger wishes it was 1/10th as stylish as Big O.

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.



Lurks With Wolves posted:

So, Casandalee's an Iron God because her ascension to godhood is the main plot of the Iron Gods Adventure Path, available wherever Paizo products are sold. I'm going to put a slightly more elaborate explanation in spoilers, just in case anyone cares about the plot of an adventure path from 2014.

The main villain of Iron Gods is Unity, the AI of a starship that crashed on Golarion millennia ago. Unity had the spark of divinity awakened in it by the weird space magicks that caused the ship to crash in the first place and the entire adventure path is caused by it's attempts to get it's consciousness untethered from the ship and rocket to full godhood in the process. The final adventure involves you going into the ship, unplugging Unity and rocketing the consciousness of Unity's first prophet Casandalee to godhood in it's place.

Note that, because you can affect Casandalee's ascension during the adventure path, this is probably the only place where something that happens in an adventure path could affect Starfinger. It won't affect much since she's at most 1/3 of a god at this point, but still.

Look at me, I'm Casandalee
Lousy with divinity

Cascade Jones
Jun 6, 2015


theironjef posted:

Look at me, I'm Casandalee
Lousy with divinity

Replace all Starfinger gods with the cast of Grease for an instant improvement.

Also:

Replace all Starfinger gods with the cast of Grease 2 for an instant improvement.

senrath
Nov 3, 2009

Look Professor, a destruct switch!




How about we just replace Starfinder with Grease entirely.

wiegieman
Apr 22, 2010

Royalty is a continuous cutting motion




Greaser is a 5-level prestige class, but it gets you those coveted points in perform.

Hostile V
May 30, 2013

Solving all of life's problems through enhanced casting of Occam's Razor. Reward yourself with an imaginary chalice.



Save vs. becoming the one that he wants. Ooh ooh ooh.

Simian_Prime
Nov 6, 2011

When they passed out body parts in the comics today, I got Cathy's nose and Dick Tracy's private parts.

Cascade Jones posted:

Replace all Starfinger gods with the cast of Grease for an instant improvement.

Also:

Replace all Starfinger gods with the cast of Grease 2 for an instant improvement.

Tell me more, tell me more...

theironjef
Aug 11, 2009

The archmage of unexpected stinks.



We go together,
Like ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh
Remember forever,
Like Y'ai 'Ng'Ngah, Yog-Sothoth H'ee-L'geb
F'ai Throdog Uaaah
That's the way it should be!

Nyalarthotep!

theironjef fucked around with this message at 07:50 on Oct 23, 2017

Young Freud
Nov 25, 2006



D&D dropout,
(D&D dropout)
Hanging around the gaming store.
D&D dropout
(D&D dropout)
It's about time you knew the score.

Cascade Jones
Jun 6, 2015


I could dread each gaming night
Only Disarm in every fight
Mind the Gap and mindless fluff
Buy all that supplemental stuff
And again be Paizo’s fool
But to play Space Pathfinder 2
That’s the worst thing I could do.

By popular demand
Jul 17, 2007

IT *BZZT* WASP ME--
IT WASP ME ALL *BZZT* ALONG!




Paizo sucks
So much rear end
Vomiting icon.

Am i doing this right?

Green Intern
Dec 29, 2008

Loon, Crazy and Laughable



Two heartbreakers diverged in a flgs and I
I took the one with granular simulationist hit location rules

gradenko_2000
Oct 5, 2010




Lipstick Apathy

We sit together
The Corebook and I
Until only the Corebook remains

Mr.Misfit
Jan 10, 2013

The time for
SkellyBones
has come!


quote:

I sit with my group, here in the apartment.
When my character dies, they will put his sheet in a box and dispose of it in the cold ground.
And in all the million ages to come, he will never full attack, or cast, or save-or-die again.
So won't you run and play Starfinger with me, here among the teeming mass of neckbeards?
The universe has spared us this moment.

potatocubed
Jul 26, 2012

*rathian noises*


Ground control to D&D
Your system's poo poo, oh can't you see?
It's caster supremacy!
It's caster supremacy!
It's caster supremacy!

Poland Spring
Sep 11, 2005


I had a friend who was friends with an art director at Paizo and neither had played the game. They asked me to, and even though I had free access to all the modules and adventure paths...I just loving couldn't manage a campaign in Golarion.

like no joke game mechanics and everything else aside the names are what ruined it for me. "Under the orders of the Elf King *rabid ululation*, adventurers must enter the city of *russian sneeze* in order to fight the orc warlord *car crash with no vowels* and retrieve the ancient sword of *something that resembles a word but comes off like someone's dad made it up*" I couldn't keep track of who anyone was supposed to be because all the god drat names were incomprehensible or dumb


that and I guess the plots weren't that compelling but ive played deadlands so I'm immune

By popular demand
Jul 17, 2007

IT *BZZT* WASP ME--
IT WASP ME ALL *BZZT* ALONG!




I love to point out deficiencies in garbage as much as anyone but I think you guys are repeatedly smacking yourselves in the face with all that focus on shartbreakers.
It ain't healthy.

Barudak
May 7, 2007



Horrible Lurkbeast posted:

I love to point out deficiencies in garbage as much as anyone but I think you guys are repeatedly smacking yourselves in the face with all that focus on shartbreakers.
It ain't healthy.

I have a work trip that im treating like a writers retreat to finish TLE. After that I have something called Obsidian with the number 2 inside the O so I cant tell if its 2 Obsidian or Obsidian 2.

Basically what im saying is I learned it by watching you, dad.

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018



Maybe it's O2bsidian.

Snorb
Nov 19, 2010


Maybe the 2 is silent.

Feinne
Oct 9, 2007

When you fall, get right back up again.


2 Fast 2 Obsidian.

Barudak
May 7, 2007



Oh this 2 2 Obsidian would melt
thaw and resolve itself into a book

Bieeanshee
Aug 21, 2000

Not keen on keening.




Grimey Drawer

Are you sure it's a 2, and not... a Z?

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 4, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!




Starfinger Core Rules Part #25: "In the same way we did with Pathfinder, we’re trying to be all things to all people, which is normally a recipe for disaster."
(James Sutter, Starfinger Creative Director, Game Informer interview.)



I'm going to be skipping a lot of fine detail here. This section is mainly about the differences between Pathfinder and Starfinger, which I've already covered broadly throughout the text. We get conversions for things like bonus types, actions, and skill names, but the meat here is for conversions of monsters and classes.

Monster conversion mainly seems to consist of adding 25% extra HP, giving it Starfinger weapons if appropriate, removing multiattacks and adding its CR to its damage value, removing critical ranges on attacks (20s only), converting spells / feats / afflictions to Starfinger where possible, and generally adjusting to the new standards whenever possible. It's worth noting that monsters get RP but not SP.

Or you can just run it as written, as it notes for quick encounters that players are unlikely to notice any difference. :v:

Class conversions are to be allowed by the GM only. This consists of giving them a key ability modifier (used to determine their RP), adjusting their hit dice to the HP / SP standard (it's worth noting that Starfinger uses fixed HP values), adding skill ranks for very low-skill classes, adjusting proficiences when necessary, giving new class features to enable added attacks for combat-centric classes. We have a long list of how to convert some specific features, though spells is mostly given a "yep, converting this will be hard". Of course, it's worth noting there's no mention of lowering full Pathfinder casters from their 1st to 9th spell level progression to Starfinger's 1st to 6th level spell progression, meaning wizards still rock the spacefaring house.

Finally, we get full writeups for all of the old Pathfinder races here in the back.

  • Dwarves: Generally found on space stations, big dwarven ships, or mining colonies, dwarves apparently are traditionalists that focus on older but reliable technology. Apparently they once sought to emigrate to the surface, and while some of them think this as been achieved long ago, some interpret it as a quest to find a particular world which will serve as a new dwarven land. They're still trained to notice "unusual stonework" even though that seems to be of limited use in most of the environments they'll be in. They're also still trained to fight goblinoids and orcs as well, even thought they don't really seem to have the same constant war going with them. The only really new trait they have is proficiency and speciality with all weapons, which is nice... but things like the stonework and training to fight goblins for dwarves that may have lived on a spaceship or space station all their lives rings of a lazy, conservative conversion.
  • Elves: We're reminded that Golarion elves slowly take on the color of their surroundings, but how does this work on a spaceship? Well, that'll be a mystery, as is the big mystery that the elves have figured out they were betrayed during the Gap! You may wonder what sort of betrayal is being referred to, and I do too, but it doesn't say. Apparently just the notion that they were betrayed (somehow) was enough to get most elves to retreat to the xenophobic seclusion of their nation (Sovyrian) on Castrovel. Those who don't are known as the "Forlorn" because the elves are now huge racists. This is followed by them making attacks on their drow brethren to "cleanse the corruption". But the Pact Worlds defend the drow, because apparently running a demon-controlled apartheid society is a-okay as long as you don't rock the boat. As far their traits go, they've traded in their proficiency with bows for a general bonus on Mysticism checks.
  • Gnomes: So gnomes have divided into two ethnicities: feychildren and bleachlings. Feychildren are anime-colored and whismical and seek adventure. Bleachlings are "monochromatic" and are believed to come from a plague that drains the color out of gnomes who don't seek out enough adventure (no seriously you guys this is serious), and have a "half-deserved" reputation for dourness. While bleachlings are the minority, apparently their strain is dominant and gnome researchers are trying to figure out what really caused them during the Gap (not the store). Also, have we mentioned gnomes are totes wacky and très obnoxious? Well, they are. In any case, gnomes are the most altered of the races so far, with a bonus to Culture, a bonus against fear effects, and a very limited reroll ability. They still have several spell-like abilities, but can't chat with animals anymore.
  • Half-Elves: Elves and humans, despite racism on the former's part, still get to boning. However, a good number of half-elves are just children of other half-elf pairings these days. They can settle in Sovyrian but it's implied that they're second-class citizens there. Howver, it notes that half-elves avoid most of the prejudices past because bug-people couldn't give two shits if a human's ears are a little pointy. Mechanically, they're essentially identical to their Pathfinder counterparts. (Also, you think they'd have gotten a better name over the centuries than "half-elves".)
  • Half-Orcs: Most half-orcs these days are now the children of other half-orcs, but people are still racist against them, and many are second-class citizens on Apostae. Some turn to augmentation because gently caress it, they can't be any less accepted, while others try and seek out new worlds away from the garbage opinions of the Pact Worlds. Why half-orcs would still face such prejudice when there are races like ysoki, shirren, or vesk that have zero reason to care, I'm not so sure. They now get a dime bonus to Survival checks, which still doesn't offset that they probably get the worst mechanical bonuses in Pathfinder or Starfinger. (And yes, despite having their own complete communities, they're still just "half-orcs".)
  • Halfling: Just too many halves by half. Halflings were apparently part of the original space explorers due to their adventuring spirit. It notes that they're rivals with the Ysoki, but less mechanically inclined. Finally, we can have the ultimate Marvel crossover, Rocket v Pip, Whose Side Are You On? They also dislike cybernetics because they have biological pride like they just stepped out of Rifts, and in general there's a lot of rah rah aren't tiny humans cool? Their main big change is that they have lessened penalties for moving while sneaking (by 5), or to hide after sniping (by 10), which is one of the few non-dime bonuses I've seen a race get - hell, it's practically a whole dollar.


I feel like a memo got missed somewhere along the line. Despite racism largely having been supposedly discarded, elves and half-orcs are still loaded with discrimination baggage (as perpetrators or victims) as their primary traits, and gnomes are centered around a miscengenation dilemma. The dwarf writeup feels surprisingly thoughtless, as well. In general, the section feels a little off-note after the earlier race writeups, as if it was done by a different author than the core design leads.

After this, we have a glossary, most of which will be pretty familiar to d20 players that have gotten this far in the review. We're almost done. :toot:

Next: Appendix N.

Mors Rattus
Oct 25, 2007

FATAL & Friends
Walls of Text
#1 Builder
2014-2018



So a half-elf and a half-orc have a kid together and that kid marries a halfling.

What do you call the grandchild?

Alien Rope Burn
Dec 4, 2004

I wanna be a saikyo HERO!


Mors Rattus posted:

So a half-elf and a half-orc have a kid together and that kid marries a halfling.

What do you call the grandchild?

Eric.

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Dallbun
Apr 21, 2010


What? You say you’re tired of encountering boring old orcs and goblins all the time? Fine, fine. I’ll liven things up with some much more interesting cards from


The Deck of Encounters Set One Part 7: The Deck of Gnolls and Hobgoblins

This is just like that KoDT story where Hard 8 Enterprises puts out a megadungeon and, to save time, stocks it with every monster from the Hacklopedia of Beasts in alphabetical order.


43: Consequences, Part 1 of 2

A rough cave in an otherwise quiet hilly terrain houses a large group of 15 gnolls. They've hunted out the area, and are hungry and getting ready to move, but when the PCs wander in they try to ambush them. "Their desperation makes them reckless and they will not break from combat, even in the face of overwhelming odds - after all, they are hungry!"

I can just imagine the tedium at the table. "No, they won't flee or surrender. You've got to fight all fifteen to the death! Haven't you experienced the limitless courage and tenacity that accompanies starvation?" Pass.


44: Consequences, Part 2 of 2

There’s a caravan of humanoids winding across this “empty, desolate plain.” They’re gnoll women (7) and cubs (16). Their males were killed either by a large predator or, if the previous card was used, by the PCs. They’re also starving, but won’t provoke a fight out of fear for the safety of their young. They’ll grudgingly accept help, especially food.

In an AD&D context, with about a million different humanoid races running around, I suppose this encounter is fine. Keep.

P.S. The XP awards here are 245 for killing them, 490 for helping. Are we allergic to round numbers here or something?


45: Gnoll Cubs, Part 1 of 2

Takes place in the foothills, after a rain. The card specifically notes the PCs might slip and get a few grass stains. Verisimilitude!

Anyway, the party crests a hill and sees “seven dog-like, humanoid babies” with no parents in sight. They’re crying. Babies! Puppy babies! :ohdear: They’ll cry more when the PCs approach, because the PCs are scary ape-men.

Then half of the card is spent reminding the DM that killing babies is evil and grants no experience points even though the gnolls “will undoubtedly grow to be evil.” :sigh:

Well, the “Orc Babies” problem is notoriously un-fun, but at least these aren’t the babies of gnolls that the PCs just slaughtered, which makes this an opportunity for heroism rather than a betrayal of the violent premises of the sword-and-sorcery genre. Let’s see where they’re going with this.

P.S. The card gives stats for the babies. Why? I could have worked out that they have no attacks, AC 10, THAC0 20, and no loving magic resistance. I guess MV 3 could potentially be relevant.


46: Gnoll Cubs, Part 2 of 2

Within 400 yards of the first encounter, there’s another hill with “bloodstains decorating the grassy knolls”... and, given the info on the previous card, grass stains decorating the bloody gnolls. :rimshot:

Because, uh, there are 15 dead gnolls here, in two distinct groups with different fashion choices.

One black-furred gnoll is still hanging on, but dying from “large wounds it has sustained in the fighting.” Cure light wounds? No, you can’t heal him, he’s too far gone. Dead? Well no, he’s not dead yet, he’s going to say something. He’s just dying, okay? He’s… poisoned. His enemy’s weapons were poisoned, so he’s going to die any second! ...No, you try, but you can’t cure the poison, either. No, you don’t find any more vials of uncurable super-poison on the dead gnolls. Look, I have a death speech to read, okay?

Anyway the gnoll lives long enough to recognize the PCs as people of honor, because they're carrying 1.5 gnoll babies each on average. He charges them to raise the cubs “in true gnoll fashion” and in return, grants them “the bauble over which the Blacks and the Ears were fighting.” It’s a battle axe +2. Bauble indeed. At least it’s not +1.

You know, I think some groups would be into this. But it’s a little more disruptive than a single goblin baby, and the death speech cutscene leaves a bad taste in my mouth. Jury?


47: Southbound Express

In jagged foothills, the PCs hear echoing feet. A hobgoblin chieftain breaks around a bend in front of them, running south as fast as he can. He doesn’t respond, and doesn’t attack if he’s not forced to - he’s on his own business. He looks grimy but unwinded, and is carrying two long swords +1. (He’s also 4 HD. This being a low-level encounter, he could easily kill some folks in melee with a little luck, if the PCs weren’t going to cast sleep on him.)

Well, it’s kind of pointless, and I hate undifferentiated +1 weapons. But it's easy enough to unenchant this dude's swords, and I do appreciate the stab at demonstrating that the world doesn’t revolve around the PCs. Keep.


48: The Crystal Ball

There’s a woodland cave in the forest, covered by shrubs. It’s still easy to find, though, because there’s clear foot traffic in and out. The two hobgoblins inside recently stole a “globe of multifaceted crystal” in a raid on a nearby village, and are busy trying to “unlock its secrets.” It’s easy to sneak in and surprise them. The globe is nonmagical and worth about 2,000 gp, but it was a symbol of the nearby village, and they certainly won’t be able to sell it there. (Unlike in most villages, which have high demand for 2,000 gp crystal orbs).

Okay… not dangerous, but a nice windfall for the PCs with a possible future plot hook.Keep.

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