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Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Doresh posted:

On a WoD eelated note: Is it "safe" to pick up V20 as a total newb, or will I just be tempted to claw out my eyes, like every time I read Brucato meandering about chaos magick and his confusing understanding of trans people?

If you want a good game to play, I'd probably go for the second edition of Vampire: The Requiem over V20. It just has too much weird oWoD mechanics to recommend to anyone who doesn't know those mechanics already. But if you want to read a distillation of what people liked about Masquerade, go for it. Werewolf and Mage only got anniversary editions because of how good V20 ended up being.

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Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


ProfessorProf posted:

Night's Black Agents is one of many Gumshoe games. It is also one of the pulpiest.

That being said, is there a good proper Noir-ish Gumshoe game out right now?

I say you could get a decent pure mystery game out of Trail of Cthulhu by stripping out the Mythos stuff the same way you can get a decent spy game out of Night's Black Agents or a decent Law And Order game out of Mutant City Blues. It's still weird that the most noir Gumshoe product is the pulpier end of Trail, though.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Kai Tave posted:

I've actually heard, weird though it is, that the Abney Park RPG called Airship Pirates is supposed to be a game that deals with the oppressive and unpleasant side of the whole steampunk thing, but as I've never actually encountered a copy for myself I'm only going on hearsay.

The backstory of Airship Pirates is that a steampunk band somehow acquired a time machine and decided to go back in time and make things go in a cooler direction.

And suddenly the Neo-Victorians ruled over the blasted remains of what was once North America from their flying cities, crushing the lower classes beneath their heel in their oppressive super-factories and creating mutants and androids with their steampunk superscience while pirates and other undesirables live a harsh life outside their walls but at least they're free.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Zereth posted:

I think that was Shadowrun 5e, where the street sam appeared to have bought his cyberware at prices closer to those in 4e, which were waaaaay cheaper.

To be fair 4e's premades were garbage too, what with all the cyberwareless combat characters and detectives that own lockpicks that don't know how to pick locks in the slightest.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Kellsterik posted:

There's nothing about them in 2nd edition, but to be fair they did get a whole supplement for 1st edition and an appendix in the core book.

Well, there's some references to 1e's Boston. Like how one of the example Thyrsus is The Nemean after he got kicked out of the Diamond Order for being a bloodthirsty tyrant that made everyone fight and now he's roaming around building cults around himself and trying to evolve into his true bestial form.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Alien Rope Burn posted:

Triune: A fusion of Brigh (goddess of clockwork and invention), Epoch (an AI god created by Aballon), and Casandalee (an android "Iron God"?), Triune oversees computers, robots, and the Drift. Mostly been covered previously

So, Casandalee's an Iron God because her ascension to godhood is the main plot of the Iron Gods Adventure Path, available wherever Paizo products are sold. I'm going to put a slightly more elaborate explanation in spoilers, just in case anyone cares about the plot of an adventure path from 2014.

The main villain of Iron Gods is Unity, the AI of a starship that crashed on Golarion millennia ago. Unity had the spark of divinity awakened in it by the weird space magicks that caused the ship to crash in the first place and the entire adventure path is caused by it's attempts to get it's consciousness untethered from the ship and rocket to full godhood in the process. The final adventure involves you going into the ship, unplugging Unity and rocketing the consciousness of Unity's first prophet Casandalee to godhood in it's place.

Note that, because you can affect Casandalee's ascension during the adventure path, this is probably the only place where something that happens in an adventure path could affect Starfinger. It won't affect much since she's at most 1/3 of a god at this point, but still.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Maxwell Lord posted:



Part Who Actually Cares: The Locker Room, or, Straight Outta Crockett

I just realized that might be a joke about this post covering how backstage clout and popularity work, not you being sad about no one ever commenting on these reviews.

Anyway, since I'm doing this now, Kayfabe kind of feels like less of a game and more of a neat way to model your fantasy booking. Not that ways to model fantasy booking aren't cool, because it is neat and it does seem like it has rules for basically everything you'd need to do that. I think my problem is that it doesn't feel like there's enough goals for characters to strive for mechanically. There's becoming more popular as a wrestler, but that's what everyone wants and it just starts to feel weird for me.

This post in particular makes it feel weirder, since it's talking about ways for wrestlers to take control of their stories and screw with other wrestlers' pushes and all that. You can have a lot of fun playing Hulk Hogan and keeping the other wrestlers down because it's best for business brother, don't get me wrong. It just rings a little hollow when you're also playing four of the guys he's keeping down.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Night10194 posted:

Isn't Lamentations of the Flame Princess like 100% garbage?

No, the lore and setting info are complete garbage. The rules are just a dull but theoretically serviceable OSR game..

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Down With People posted:

Man gently caress Italy

As the SOE leaves Trieste, investigators see Winckelmann one last time on the platform. If they handed the medallion over to the lloigor, he waves farewell, his face peaceful as he fades away. They gain 1D3 SAN. If they didn't, his screaming face is pressed up against each window as the train moves past, costing them 1/1D4 SAN. They'll also get 1D4 SAN for recovering the Right Leg. The book suggests giving them more Sanity if they held onto the medallion for knowing they've helped stave off the return of the Great Old Ones but uh, did they? Would they? Seems more likely they'd know they've doomed themselves to carrying around a piece of the loving Wendigo for the foreseeable future, for no clear benefit.

Anyway, how loving good is it to not have to deal with any more Blackshirts?

Next time: a very different dream!

Honestly, I think it's just there so you aren't kicking your players when they're down if they honestly think they did something good by not giving the depression vampire a powerful mythos artifact. It's clearly the wrong choice in the long term, but I can't blame any parties for having a zero tolerance policy when it comes to giving horrible monsters things that they want.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


marshmallow creep posted:

Wait, why is giving the lloigor what it wants better long term?

Because it doesn't seem to give the Iloigor any actual benefit besides being a thing it wants and not giving it away gives you a curse and pisses off a ghost. You're taking a bunch of sanity damage for the sake of a moral stand that doesn't really seem to do anything, and I'm fine with blunting the edge of that particular price if they think they're doing something good.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


PurpleXVI posted:

What, really? Is that their reasoning for removing them? Then they might as well remove all of the factions as player factions, because almost any of them could be extrapolated into a really horrendous ideology. Besides, the Ultimates are about the most PC faction there is(at least when they're reasonably moderate). "Oughta go challenge myself with some gatecrashing and mercenary ops so I can grow as a person and become better, smarter stronger and more fit to fight the universe! These Firewall missions are about the coolest challenges around, too."

Listen, it's just a bad time for militarized eugenicists as a PC faction. The whole "you, person seeking something out of life, can join us and be a superior being above all the weak-willed masses" thing they kind of have going doesn't really help the comparison either.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?



I know we're all focused on Pouches Mcgee, but I want to call all your attention to the very serious man in the back who is 1950s D.Va.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Down With People posted:

The Accounts of Tilius Corvus: Did the investigators read it? Name-dropping things from the Accounts – like the name Tilius Corvus, the name of his wife, his commander – stuns Fenalik for one round and forces him to make a POW check or temporarily withdraw from battle to regain his composure. Guess you didn't put that as far behind you as you thought you did, eh Tilius?

Oh. Oh. That... actually makes sense. I probably could have pieced that together sooner if I read the actual text, but still. My mind's kind of blown.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


theironjef posted:

Yes! Exactly. People keep thinking it's disingenuous to suggest a fix for CTech that's "take the mythos out of there," but I'm being earnest. If I were fixing it, I'd be removing mythos, because I find it overrated, troublingly connected to a legacy of racism, and worry that it'd be impossible to run without people running in at dead sprints from the streets to well actually at me about how Hastur wouldn't do that. Putting in some less famous brain-rattling space monsters is a literal fix to my concerns.

That's the annoying thing about talking about how to run Lovecraftesque stuff in RPGs. On one hand, the best way to do that is to not use any actual Lovecraft stuff because that stuff has more iffy implications than you'd want and is generally documented to hell and back so you can't surprise anyone. That's why all the good modern Lovecraft RPGs do a bunch of weird stuff with it. (Trail of Cthulu gives a bunch of alternate versions of each major god that you can use or ignore, Breakfast Cult does weird anime cosmic horror stuff but cordones off all the Cthulu stuff to it's own book and does it's own thing in the core, etc.) On the other hand, just saying that has a real "if you want to play this, I recommend playing literally anything else instead :smuggo:" vibe and it makes me want to tell people to gently caress off immediately no matter how right they are.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Say what you will about... everything else, but I always enjoy letting PCs infiltrate cult meetings by having everyone assume they're from a cell they haven't met before.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


SirPhoebos posted:

Maybe I'm just confused about the difference between Onyx Path and White Wolf, because when I hear about poo poo like this:
*snipped tweet*

my opinion of White Wolf's roleplaying umbrella becomes incredibly negative.

White Wolf the Paradox company owns the rights to the World of Darkness and Chronicles of Darkness lines, and thus can mess with any World of Darkness stuff Onyx Path is putting out if it doesn't fit their ~vision~ for WoD. (They're basically leaving Chronicles of Darkness stuff alone, by the way, so don't worry about that.) Onyx Path bought the rights for Scion and I believe Exalted, so they don't have that kind of editorial interference and obviously won't have any for any new properties they make such as Pugmire.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


JcDent posted:

What are Chronicles of Darkness and Trinity and... Pugmire?

Also, Edgy Dracula?

Chronicles of Darkness is what the nWoD was renamed to when Paradox bought the rights to WoD and wanted to separate the brands. Trinity is Adventure! (White Wolf's old pulp game), Aberrant (White Wolf's old supers game) and Trinity (White Wolf's old scifi game) which were all actually part of the same universe at different points in time, which Onyx Path is working on new editions of that aren't a mechanical and metaplot clusterfuck like those games were. Pugmire is kinda like Redwall but with dogs instead of badgers, and I kind of hate it for being a fantasy game where you play as a pug that uses a generic d20 system of all things but it's a fine game.

Edgy Dracula is Tobias Sjögren, the man who runs Paradox White Wolf. He's called Swedracula because he's Swedish and a picture of him was used for Dracula in one of the Vampire: The Requiem books iirc. Also he's an edgelord rear end in a top hat who thinks WoD needs to be mature in that incredibly immature way.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Kurieg posted:

Swedracula is Martin, not Tobias. Tobias has a decent head on his shoulders, but a gigantic blind spot where is friend is concerned.

I was worried about that. Sorry Tobias, I should have realized when Lead Storyteller Martin Ericsson looked like much more of a Dracula than you.

(Also I was corrected, he was Dracula in Vampire: The Masquerade 20th Anniversary Edition, not one of the three separate people claiming to be Dracula in VtR.)

Lurks With Wolves fucked around with this message at 20:28 on Jan 27, 2018

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


You know, I was kind of creeped out until his forehead pulled itself up into a flesh-fez and he turned into a fez zombie.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Zereth posted:

... Wait, no, I checked, and it's "Ravenwolf Grigori". Which sounds even less like an actual name than the way I'd remembered it.

Ravenwolf Grigori is an uncommon card from a bad MtG ripoff.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


rumble in the bunghole posted:

rape ogres are all over the place, I think they were even in pathfinder

Pathfinder specifically has The Hills Have Eyes inbred mutant ogres, which they quietly ignore whenever they aren't actively reprinting Rise of the Runelords.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Young Freud posted:

Isn't this the same reason why Riker did his weird leapfrog chair mounting manuever? Frakes couldn't bend over when sitting down because of the outfit.

Frakes' back is also legitimately messed up, so he just kind of sits like that to avoid the issue whenever possible.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Deptfordx posted:

Ooh. I was very interested in that, in fact I had a question. I don't know much about 13th age. It's based on 4th edition Dnd correct? At least as a starting point design wise. So is it designed with the assumption that you play with a battlemap and figures/tokens like 4th edition does*? I ask because we have a weird setup where 3 of us are in the room, and 2 of our group who moved away just Skype in. It works suprisingly smoothly (once we got a decent microphone and camera and our host upgraded his internet) but it does make any system that requires use of maps and figures a non-starter.


* Yeah I know you could just play it theatre of the mind style with some goodwill and glossing over detail, but ruleswise it's clearly not meant to be played that way.

Honestly, it's only based on 4e in that it has at-will/encounters/etc and is set in a semi-generic D&D fantasy milieu. They aren't that similar when you look at them objectively.

Anyway, 13th Age was actively made with theatre of the mind stuff in mind, so it should work fine for your purposes. There's no 30' ranges that the game pretends can be mapped out perfectly to the GM's mental map of the battlefield or anything like that.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Deptfordx posted:

That's good to hear thanks. Do I need the main 13th age Rulebook as well as the Glorantha PDF?

Yeah, you'll need the core rules. Anyway, if you want to talk more about this you should probably head over to the 13th Age thread.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Ratoslov posted:

Pan-Pacifica looks awesome too. I'm not sold on new Orrosh, but a good implementation of the basic idea could go well.

I wasn't expecting much out of Pan-Pacifica, but having it go full Umbrella and driving out some of the 80s cyberpunk orientalism really does a lot to make it a good setting.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Ah, Dark Heresy. I have a lot of good memories of that game. Also a lot of memories about how FFG's entire 40k line got increasingly iffy mechanics as time went on, and it didn't start at a great spot in the first place.

Also, Alves Alighari, Imperial World Adept that wasn't even supposed to be here today.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Kurieg posted:

My question probably could have been better worded as "should I finish pugmire first or come back to it later?"

Just finish Pugmire. Beast will still be here when you're finished.

Night10194 posted:

There's going to be more to talk about in the Dark Heresy review as soon as I get to equipment, combat, fear/corruption, and the setting, but man. The first couple updates really do drive home how much the basic skeleton of it is 'the game we already made, but fiddlier, and finished by another developer'.

Personally, I'm just waiting until it gets to difficulties and how much easier the skill system is despite it's flaws when you go by them, cough cough looking at you premade adventures. Also until we all see how the semi/full-auto rules are kind of busted and remained busted until Black Crusade.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


In Monte Cook's defense, the original ivory tower game design article was him admitting that it was a mistake and they really screwed up the whole Timmy/Spike/Johnny dynamic.

Not in Monte Cook's defense, he keeps making those exact mistakes in every game.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Night10194 posted:

Later, at the foothills of the mountains, PCs will spot a dark figure watching over them from an outcropping, and any psykers in the party will get a +30 Psychic sense test (Per) to see if they can feel that something very, very wrong happened at that outcropping at some point. If they have no psykers, fail, or don't try using Psyniscience, Aristarchus just does it for them so the test was pointless. He tells them to investigate. PCs need to make a Climb+10 check, or if they fail it, a Agi+20 check or take d5 damage (affected by TB but not Wounds) as they climb up to investigate, which is a very exciting use of the skill system trust me. They find no sign of the dark figure, but do find a pictogram of an eagle clutching a skull burned into the rock, which is still hot. A -20 Common Lore (Imperium) or a +0 Scholastic Lore (Legend) test tells them this is a rendering of the sign of St. Drusus. A success by 2 DoS or better points out the skull and starburst were the symbol of the 2nd Army Group, which conquered this planet. Aristrarchus will make the sign of the Aquila and mutter to himself a bit, but won't volunteer any of this information. If the PCs mention it, he says this is an 'age of miracles' and fingers his tarot deck nervously.

This is the skillcheck that made me hate how Dark Heresy adventures treat skills. A 50% chance to climb a hill without spraining your ankle to find a clue that's only a vaguely ominous bit of stock 40k iconography if your party can't make a check they have a 20-30% chance to succeed on if anyone even took one of the relevant skills in the first place. It's all just pointless.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Night10194 posted:

Boy are you going to hate the climax of this adventure, then!

Trust me, I already do.

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Night10194 posted:

I've mentioned it before but I don't actually own Ascension. Also, from what I can see, very little material in either the rest of the DH1e books I have or the rest of the line references it much.

Ascension came out pretty late in Dark Heresy 1e's lifetime, and it kind of escalates the system to a point where it kind of falls apart. It's interesting as part of FFG's 40k line and how it grew in scale over time, but it's not a lynchpin of the line. (At least, iirc. It's been a while since I looked at it.)

Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


Night10194 posted:

Also given you mentioned you hated the skill system and all from that adventure, am I to take it you actually played it? If so, how badly did your group die in the final confrontation? I'd be curious to hear from anyone who actually played out the example adventure.

I tried to run it as a pbp once. I'm pretty sure my players read the adventure beforehand, though, because they saw the shadowy figure, went "well that's hosed up" and kept driving. (I let them, because come on.)

Anyway, it's less personal experience and more that that adventure just typifies so many of the things that made me stop caring about FFG's 40k line by the time Black Crusade came out.

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Lurks With Wolves
Jan 14, 2013

At least I don't dance with them, right?


marshmallow creep posted:

Sorry I am not up on the lingo. What is an AdMech? Sounds like a Mechwarrior Wildcat crossed with NASCAR.

Adeptus Mechanicus. Where all the techpriests and all that come from.

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