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skipdogg
Nov 29, 2004
Resident SRT-4 Expert


That Horizon quote has their really long extended warranty baked into it as well. 10 years parts and labor isn't standard at all.


I'm a big fan of supporting local small businesses, they'll take care of you in the long run imo.

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MRC48B
Apr 2, 2012



How else is the ceo at Horizon going to afford another cabin in the Alleghenies?

skipdogg posted:

That Horizon quote has their really long extended warranty baked into it as well. 10 years parts and labor isn't standard at all.

That's pretty impressive actually.

skipdogg
Nov 29, 2004
Resident SRT-4 Expert


Well I'm assuming it's a long extended warranty.

MRC48B
Apr 2, 2012



As we've discussed before in this thread, SEER ratings are like MPG ratings for cars.

They are a mathematical approximation of average energy use, given a perfectly installed, brand new unit.

Because you're rather far north of the mason-dixon, energy for the AC is not a major part of your bill for most of the year.

The difference between the two quotes for you is going to be quality of install, and how much you think you will need that 10 year warranty service.

The independent guy has a lot less overhead, which is a significant part of why his quote is lower.

AFewBricksShy
Jun 19, 2003

of a full load.



MRC48B posted:

As we've discussed before in this thread, SEER ratings are like MPG ratings for cars.

They are a mathematical approximation of average energy use, given a perfectly installed, brand new unit.

Because you're rather far north of the mason-dixon, energy for the AC is not a major part of your bill for most of the year.

The difference between the two quotes for you is going to be quality of install, and how much you think you will need that 10 year warranty service.

The independent guy has a lot less overhead, which is a significant part of why his quote is lower.

Thanks. My local energy company is offering a $750 rebate to go to a 15+ Seer, so I'm going to have the local guy price up the higher seer unit. I might end up being able to get the better system for the same cost in the long run anyway. (york ycs to ycg.)

AFewBricksShy fucked around with this message at 18:02 on May 7, 2020

B-Nasty
May 25, 2005



I'd probably get another quote or two, while being more specific with the equipment to get an apples-to-apples.

Not that's I'd pay thousands of dollars for it, but a warranty that includes labor is very valuable. Most HVAC companies screw you on warranty repairs, even doing such shenanigans as charging refrigerants as labor to get around parts-only warranties. I'd definitely want at least a 1-year P&L warranty, so that you know if anything goes wrong, you don't pay a dime to fix it. Most major issues are going to show up in the first year anyway.

Alarbus
Mar 31, 2010


AFewBricksShy posted:

I need to get a new heating and AC system in my house. My old ac (which was replaced roughly sometime in 2007) went (the fan and capacitor went on the outside unit), and the heater (which is 30 years old) has a cracked heat exchanger.

I've gotten 2 quotes. One from Horizon (who is a local place that advertises all over). It's kind of the "anderson replacement windows" of the area. The other is from a local guy.

My house is 2500 feet, 2 stories, in the Philly suburbs.

Horizon's quote:
Lennox SL280V 135 variable speed furnace with a Lennox EL16xC1 ac CX35 Coil (17 Seer) - $15,000
10 Part/ 10 labor

Local guy:
York TM87 800% two stage variable speed furnace with a York YCS60 AC and cf60B coil (14.25 seer) - $6,800
10 part/5 labor

I knew horizon was going to be high, but this is absurdly high. I realize the 17 Seer is going to be more efficient, but I'm not crazy in going with the local guy, right?


Or the planes at the beach, or the billboards, or the scoreboards...

I found the sales slip to my Horizon installed system the PO did (6 months before having to relo, woo), and list was like $19k, but final sales price was about $9k. So somewhere they came up with a 50% discount. That's a hell of a margin!

I think Dkhelmet called every place in our area when he replaced his, might want to hit him up for info.

AFewBricksShy
Jun 19, 2003

of a full load.



B-Nasty posted:

I'd probably get another quote or two, while being more specific with the equipment to get an apples-to-apples.

Not that's I'd pay thousands of dollars for it, but a warranty that includes labor is very valuable. Most HVAC companies screw you on warranty repairs, even doing such shenanigans as charging refrigerants as labor to get around parts-only warranties. I'd definitely want at least a 1-year P&L warranty, so that you know if anything goes wrong, you don't pay a dime to fix it. Most major issues are going to show up in the first year anyway.

The local guy is giving me 10 year parts, 5 year labor. The expensive guy is 10 and 10.

Bird in a Blender
Nov 17, 2005

It's amazing what they can do with computers these days.


Alarbus posted:

I found the sales slip to my Horizon installed system the PO did (6 months before having to relo, woo), and list was like $19k, but final sales price was about $9k. So somewhere they came up with a 50% discount. That's a hell of a margin!

I think Dkhelmet called every place in our area when he replaced his, might want to hit him up for info.

List price has absolutely no relation to real price. Stuff is often discounted 50-80% off list depending on a lot of factors.

H110Hawk
Dec 28, 2006


As with all hidden-price poo poo shows you don't get out bed below 50%. Dealer-driven HVAC is no different.

elise the great
May 1, 2012

NECROTIC BUTTSLOUGH


God, I hate to drop into a thread full of experts and beg for free advice, but here I am: last summer we had a Fujitsu Halcyon system installed, and now itís not working. And the people who installed it have fuckiní covid. No, literally, the entire business has shut down because both of their A/C guys have the coronavirus.

Anyway, it was 86įF here in Seattle today, with more scorchers on the horizon. The remote controls work, but the units donít respond at all. I flipped the breakers and still no dice. Anybody got any magical hints or tips before I start trying to find some non-warranty folks to fix the things? Cause Iím guessing the first guys caught covid from all the home entries, and Iíd rather not risk that bilateral exposure if thereís any way around it.

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007




Hey, I'm looking for some thoughts on what I should look for in a window unit (or maybe portable) AC.

I've got a 5000BTU window unit that I got for free from the last person who rented my apartment - it's kinda old, noisy, and isn't really doing the job, though I suspect that there's two factors that might be at fault:

1) It's not strong enough - the room I'm trying to cool is a living room with other spaces attached with no real ability to close them off, totaling something like 350sq ft? Some quick googling suggest I might want closer to 8000BTU for that much space. (Though i suspect I can maybe get away with less because I'm somewhat close to where the AC would go and I don't need the far corners of my room icy cold?)
2) I'm maybe not doing the best job insulating/sealing the unit? I basically inherited the unit and sorta just figured how to stick it into the window out of desperation, there was some foam padding stuff that was with the unit and I try to stick that in the gaps between the window frame and AC, but it's only doing so good of a job and I still end up with some gaps. The window style is like this 2-wide frame with 4 windows in tracks, and I need to pull out 3 of the 4 panes in order to get the unit in.

Is there much considerations beyond BTU/fan control and if it will fit your window? I understand portable style units are less efficient (particularly if they have a single hose) but for what it's worth, electricity is included in my rent - does that change much, or will it just be cycling a lot adding to the noise factor?

e: Sorry if this isn't quite the place of this sort of question?

Oxyclean fucked around with this message at 21:29 on May 10, 2020

MRC48B
Apr 2, 2012



elise the great posted:

a Fujitsu Halcyon system

Find the user manual for your unit and see if you can get an error code. most name brand mini splits will tell you what is wrong with them. also, basics. power at the unit, fresh batteries in the remote. etc.


Oxyclean posted:

Hey, I'm looking for some thoughts on what I should look for in a window unit (or maybe portable) AC.

I've got a 5000BTU window unit that I got for free from the last person who rented my apartment - it's kinda old, noisy, and isn't really doing the job, though I suspect that there's two factors that might be at fault:

1) It's not strong enough - the room I'm trying to cool is a living room with other spaces attached with no real ability to close them off, totaling something like 350sq ft? Some quick googling suggest I might want closer to 8000BTU for that much space. (Though i suspect I can maybe get away with less because I'm somewhat close to where the AC would go and I don't need the far corners of my room icy cold?)
2) I'm maybe not doing the best job insulating/sealing the unit? I basically inherited the unit and sorta just figured how to stick it into the window out of desperation, there was some foam padding stuff that was with the unit and I try to stick that in the gaps between the window frame and AC, but it's only doing so good of a job and I still end up with some gaps. The window style is like this 2-wide frame with 4 windows in tracks, and I need to pull out 3 of the 4 panes in order to get the unit in.

Is there much considerations beyond BTU/fan control and if it will fit your window? I understand portable style units are less efficient (particularly if they have a single hose) but for what it's worth, electricity is included in my rent - does that change much, or will it just be cycling a lot adding to the noise factor?

e: Sorry if this isn't quite the place of this sort of question?

1: The most important for portable/windows is to make sure you have the power outlet you need for the size you want. some need 240v oven/dryer style outlets. some can get away with 120v regular outlets, but need to be on there own breaker.

2: more insulation is always more better. get some rigid pink foam and cut a window adapter. edge it with soft rubber foam tape for sealing.

3: this thread is slow, and hvac is complicated, and can't always be solved via forum post.

there are a wide variety of reasons that unit isn't doing the job you want. it could be undersized, low on refrigerant, the coils are dirty, the compressor has worn out valves, a lot of things.

undersized is probably the first problem though.

EssOEss
Oct 23, 2006
128-bit approved

We have a central exhaust fan on the roof of the apartment building, hooked up to every apartment (total 43). The inlets are theoretically balanced but in practice everyone fucks with them and opens them wide, removing any balance from the airflow.

As a result, my top floor apartment is stuffy as hell, with not much air movement through the ventilation system. In some other apartments, it's much better. I imagine any balancing of the system would only bring temporary resolution until the people mess up the inlet sizes again.

Is it a wise idea to just stick an extra exhaust fan inline for my apartment? Or would this cause undesirable side-effects?

Bird in a Blender
Nov 17, 2005

It's amazing what they can do with computers these days.


Is the fan just for the bathroom exhaust, or do you have general exhaust in your unit? A bathroom exhaust is usually 25-50 CFM, so I'm surprised you can even tell the difference honestly.

For bathroom exhaust, I doubt adding an inline fan really affects anything. If it really means that much to put one in and wire it up. Something like that could be more involved that you think.

DkHelmet
Jul 10, 2001

I pity the foal...


Alarbus posted:

I think Dkhelmet called every place in our area when he replaced his, might want to hit him up for info.

What a fun thing it was too. Two months after I bought the house the AC coils started to cave in.



You do want to make sure you're getting something with an AHRI Certificate, some installers just mix-n-match and bullshit.

Based on our usage patterns, going from a 80 to 96% AFUE saves around $3000 over 10 years, so it's worth considering break even points when chasing AFUE and SEER. My original calcs for the Delaware Valley put SEER 16 at the max, anything you're paying over that is wasted money and won't ever be effectively realized.

I called 4 vendors and got multiple quotes for each. Goodman is the bargain bin of brands and doesn't really have a vendor certification system, so you can either get a great installer or a lovely one- it's worth keeping that in mind. Not that you're guaranteed a bad install, just that they can be really all over the map. Other nameplates will boot them from reselling if there's too many complaints.

My house is 2200ft, two story, 1993 construction 2x4 wood framed with insulated walls, forced air and low-e windows.

Of all the vendors, we liked Walton and IT Landes best, with IT Landes winning since they did an actual drat Manual D calc for my house. They also had a ton of good references both residential and commercial and are employee owned. 2 year labor on install, 10 on parts. We went with a variable speed 17.5 SEER, 96% AFUE unit. We'd do 16, but there wasn't a pairing for it. $9148.60 installed. It was a premium over the smaller, less technical installers, but we really liked the professionalism and they brought to the table. That, and we wanted to just get it done and have a quality install without having to pester a smaller group like Anytime.

Other things to consider is going from single to two stage, and single to multi to variable blowers. Even "variable" blowers aren't truly variable, they're more "selectable". You only get truly variable systems once you get into the absolute top of the line systems, with actual computer controls and not just thermostats. Going to multi-stage can make you more comfortable by evening out smaller temp swings without having to turn the system onto full blast, which is one reason why we selected it.

10 years warranty on labor is awesome, but I wouldn't pay $5000 for it. My bottom barrel quote for a whole install, AC and furnace was $5,242.00. For $15k I'd just keep replacing the whole drat thing every three years, wearing a tuxedo the entire time.

DkHelmet fucked around with this message at 21:05 on May 12, 2020

Nevets
Sep 11, 2002

Be they sad or be they well,
I'll make their lives a hell


I've got an oil furnace that runs off 2x tanks in the basement, and it keeps getting air in the line (I assume, since draining the pump always fixes it). The furnace and tanks are in opposite ends of my L shaped basement so there's about 70ft of copper line hanging from the joists between them. My oil delivery/repair gal says air in the line is just something you have to deal with with dual tank setups.

Is there something else I should be looking at? I'm planning on getting the whole thing serviced soon, beside changing the fuel filters is there anything else I should make sure to have them to do?

Plastik
Oct 14, 2005

ARE YOU TELLING ME SITTING HERE DOING NOTHING ISN'T HELPING? DAMN, WELL YOU JUST CONVINCED ME NOT TO TRY AT ALL!


Lipstick Apathy

Okay, here's a really weird question:

I'm in Central Florida working at a buddy's 60s-era house with a semi-detached unfinished 1 car garage. In the back of the garage is a finished laundry room with a mostly-sealed door into the garage. The laundry room has an AC vent attached to the house AC by a 30 foot insulated flex duct with about 360 degrees of turns, but no return (thanks, PHO!). It works well enough, replacing the air the dryer exhausts outside with conditioned air from the interior system, and generally the laundry room is no more than 10 degrees off from the home interior. There is an electric heater in the room for the 3-10 days of winter a year we experience here.

The problem is that the garage is being converted into a woodshop and I'm worried about dust intrusion into the laundry room. We're going to have a dust collector and exhaust fan in the garage, so the garage should theoretically operate at negative pressure, but again it's unfinished and from the 60s so it leaks air like a sieve and the 1000 cfm exhaust fan won't make an appreciable difference in pressure. The laundry room, being attached to ac but with no return, should operate at positive pressure when the air is running, but the amount of air coming out of the vent is nearly imperceptible, even with the door open and the AC going full blast, probably due to the 30 foot snaking flex duct.

How can I ensure that the back room doesn't start sucking sawdust? I was thinking about putting in an in-wall vent fan with a filter to force the pressure differential without feeding sawdust into the room, but would that feed un-conditioned air back into the main house? Is there some sort of one-way vent or damper I could install to prevent that? Are there other solutions I'm not thinking about?

Thanks, HVAC goons.

Plastik fucked around with this message at 14:18 on May 14, 2020

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009


MOTRONIC FOR MODERATOR, MAKE AI GREAT AGAIN


Grimey Drawer

Nevets posted:

I've got an oil furnace that runs off 2x tanks in the basement, and it keeps getting air in the line (I assume, since draining the pump always fixes it). The furnace and tanks are in opposite ends of my L shaped basement so there's about 70ft of copper line hanging from the joists between them. My oil delivery/repair gal says air in the line is just something you have to deal with with dual tank setups.

Is there something else I should be looking at? I'm planning on getting the whole thing serviced soon, beside changing the fuel filters is there anything else I should make sure to have them to do?

Sounds like you have a single line system. I'm not familiar with how a dual line system would work on a dual tank setup, but dual line systems have a return and are self bleeding. Unless you have a very long run, any air, including "I completely ran out of oil" is handled by resetting the burner once. It will run long enough to bleed and start firing before it trips again. Worst case you're standing there for another 60 seconds until you can reset it a second time.

B-Nasty
May 25, 2005



Nevets posted:

I've got an oil furnace that runs off 2x tanks in the basement, and it keeps getting air in the line (I assume, since draining the pump always fixes it). The furnace and tanks are in opposite ends of my L shaped basement so there's about 70ft of copper line hanging from the joists between them. My oil delivery/repair gal says air in the line is just something you have to deal with with dual tank setups.

Is there something else I should be looking at? I'm planning on getting the whole thing serviced soon, beside changing the fuel filters is there anything else I should make sure to have them to do?

Any chance you can run the oil line along the floor? Overhead lines are somewhat notorious for issues with air lock/vacuum strength issues for the little pump on the burner. Do you have conventional tanks (drain on bottom) or something like a Roth where the oil line comes out the top?

If it's the standard tank, easiest and best would be to run the line on the ground so that gravity keeps it fed. If you have no choice but to go overhead, you can look into a 'Tigerloop', which are designed to help with this.

Nevets
Sep 11, 2002

Be they sad or be they well,
I'll make their lives a hell


Conventional tanks, and running the line along the floor is technically possible but pretty involved with the walls etc. already in the basement. Tigerloop looks like an excellent option and not too expensive. I should be able to just mount it on the wall behind the burner where the supply comes down.

EssOEss
Oct 23, 2006
128-bit approved

Bird in a Blender posted:

Is the fan just for the bathroom exhaust, or do you have general exhaust in your unit? A bathroom exhaust is usually 25-50 CFM, so I'm surprised you can even tell the difference honestly.

For bathroom exhaust, I doubt adding an inline fan really affects anything. If it really means that much to put one in and wire it up. Something like that could be more involved that you think.

General exhaust, yeah. There's a 0,7 kW fan on the roof, shared by 40 apartments. I have two exhaust pipes - one going to the central fan, the other used locally for my kitchen hood, terminating as an open pipe on the roof.

When I add more ventilation, which pipe should I use? On one hand, splicing into the kitchen exhaust pipe would mean my extra airflow does not gently caress with the general exhaust. On the other hand, might this just divert some of my outflow from going to general exhaust, instead of adding more?

I am looking at adding something like a Cata 125/320. The spec sheet says 30W and 365 m3/h, which comes to 215 CFM. Does that sound about right? 30W seems awful low compared to my dinky kitchen hood fan which has 120W on the label and is barely effective.

EssOEss fucked around with this message at 21:02 on May 14, 2020

MRC48B
Apr 2, 2012



Nevets posted:

Conventional tanks, and running the line along the floor is technically possible but pretty involved with the walls etc. already in the basement. Tigerloop looks like an excellent option and not too expensive. I should be able to just mount it on the wall behind the burner where the supply comes down.

In addition, if you have any leaks in the line, fix them. High viscosity fluids do weird things under flow.

Bird in a Blender
Nov 17, 2005

It's amazing what they can do with computers these days.


EssOEss posted:

General exhaust, yeah. There's a 0,7 kW fan on the roof, shared by 40 apartments. I have two exhaust pipes - one going to the central fan, the other used locally for my kitchen hood, terminating as an open pipe on the roof.

When I add more ventilation, which pipe should I use? On one hand, splicing into the kitchen exhaust pipe would mean my extra airflow does not gently caress with the general exhaust. On the other hand, might this just divert some of my outflow from going to general exhaust, instead of adding more?

I am looking at adding something like a Cata 125/320. The spec sheet says 30W and 365 m3/h, which comes to 215 CFM. Does that sound about right? 30W seems awful low compared to my dinky kitchen hood fan which has 120W on the label and is barely effective.

That is too much exhaust in my opinion. That would be like running your kitchen exhaust fan all of the time. At least in the US, apartments get 30-50 CFM (50-85 m3/h) of general exhaust and that is out of the bathroom fan. So you're looking at 5 times that much. I was thinking you would just put in a regular bathroom exhaust fan to act as a booster. If you really need that much exhaust, you could probably just turn your kitchen exhaust fan on all day instead of adding a whole new fan. If you did add that fan, it would likely be way too much CFM for your bath duct to handle. It would probably be fine for your kitchen exhaust duct, but you would have issues trying to run both that fan, and your kitchen fan at the same time.

Keep in mind that your energy costs are going to go up if you do this. In addition to running the fan, you're also going to have to condition your space more as you'll be throwing conditioned air out the roof and sucking in more outside air.

heyou
Dec 30, 2004
Mr. Green....Gesundheit.

It's getting hot again and I'm thinking about improving our A/C system. House was built in 1922, forced air HVAC was added at some point in the past. Heat works fine, the whole house is evenly warm, but upstairs is too warm in the summer. The furnace and A/C unit outside were replaced when the house was renovated before we moved in, 5-6 years ago. As soon as we moved in, I sealed every leaking duct I could find in the basement, and added some manual dampers to force more air upstairs, which helped, and added ceiling fans. The upstairs ducts do not feel like they are moving the same amount of air as downstairs, and upstairs stays pretty warm, so I've been thinking about two possible modifications I could make without total replacement.

There is no return duct upstairs at all, and the front of the house on the 1st floor has a return at the bottom of the stairs. I guess the intention is to pull air down the stairs, but hardly any air is felt to be moving into this duct. Each upstairs bedroom has a duct (3), as well as the upstairs bath. First thought would be to change the bathroom supply duct to a return. The supply duct for the bathroom is directly next to a return duct in the basement, so I think it would be pretty simple to disconnect it from the supply and hook it to the return.

Second thought would be a duct fan on the supply ducts to the bedrooms, attached to a duct thermostat to only operate when cooling. Ideally I would reduct the entire house, but that is something that we'd need to save up for. These two thoughts seem pretty cheap, and are both reversible if it makes it worse,. Good idea, bad idea? Any suggestion on other things to check?

DrBouvenstein
Feb 28, 2007

I think I'm a doctor, but that doesn't make me a doctor. This fancy avatar does.


Is there a general rule about haw far the condenser for a heat pump unit can be from the indoor vent/evaporator (I hope I have those terms right, but you know what I mean)?

My home is basically an ideal candidate for a heat pump. Small footprint, the living room and kitchen are semi-open, and it's a single story ranch, so I can even open the doors to the bedrooms to help them get warm in winter/cool in summer. And my heat is currently all electric baseboard, so it's about as expensive an option that there is for my area (~1000 sq ft home, and my electric bill in winter is almost $300. Going from my last home, heated with natural gas and more square footage, it was only ~$130 a month for gas, and $50 a month for electric.)

Rough layout, not to scale (and there's a large open window/breakfast bar thing between the living room and kitchen, it's not a 100% solid wall, and it's not as long as I made it there:


My garage is right alongside the left, maybe only 3' of space between that wall of the house and the garage wall. No room to put the condenser there. The back wall has a porch that starts about halfway across the kitchen and goes all the way across bedroom 2. I also don't think putting the evaporator in the kitchen is a good spot, cause it would never reach bedroom 1 and 3, it needs to go in the living room.

But as far as wall space to put it goes, the only spot really is along the left wall close to the garage. The front/bottom wall in the pic has a large bay window I didn't draw between the left wall and door, and as said, this is horribly not to scale and the wall is not as long as it looks there.

But there's no room right behind where the evaporator would go, can the lines go back along the wall of the kitchen to the back of the house? That's maybe 18-20'.

It could also in theory go around the corner to the front of the house (like 6', at most?), but I'd prefer not to have a giant condenser right in the front of my house, lookin' all ugly. Especially since I have very tentative plans to put a front porch on my house in a few years.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009


MOTRONIC FOR MODERATOR, MAKE AI GREAT AGAIN


Grimey Drawer

18-20 feet isn't even approaching the realm of problematic.

Remember, there are plenty of condensers sitting on the ground for 3rd story apartments.

Sterling_Archer
May 10, 2012

"What do you mean we're not in compliance?"

Hey thread -

What the heck is this:







I believe this is the switch that controls power to the furnace. I can see the power come down from the floor joist above into the lightswitch box and then back out again to the furnace whip....but what is this weird chime thing coming out of that box that has two wires running.....somewhere...? I've purchased a 2-gang and a new gfci outlet and new switch to replace these things with (and add an outlet because why isn't there one?!) but I want to figure out what this extra square box that says chime on it is doing.

Guy Axlerod
Dec 29, 2008


It's a doorbell transformer, probably powering your thermostat, but it could also be powering your doorbell?

H110Hawk
Dec 28, 2006


DrBouvenstein posted:

Is there a general rule about haw far the condenser for a heat pump unit can be from the indoor vent/evaporator (I hope I have those terms right, but you know what I mean)?

Are you thinking whole home ducted forced air? Or mini split?

For the latter the units often come precharged for a decent length of lineset, and can (should?) be adjusted for your actual length. There are units I skimmed that can have 164' of lineset. You will want something in those bedrooms to actually force the air to exchange with the rest of the house. Linesets fit inside 2x4 cavities if that's what you're worried about.

https://www.fujitsu-general.com/us/...brochure-02.pdf (Page 21, 25)

Sterling_Archer
May 10, 2012

"What do you mean we're not in compliance?"

Guy Axlerod posted:

It's a doorbell transformer, probably powering your thermostat, but it could also be powering your doorbell?

Ok so presumably I would want to keep this, how do I do that safely? Pigtails off to it?

DrBouvenstein
Feb 28, 2007

I think I'm a doctor, but that doesn't make me a doctor. This fancy avatar does.


H110Hawk posted:

Are you thinking whole home ducted forced air? Or mini split?

For the latter the units often come precharged for a decent length of lineset, and can (should?) be adjusted for your actual length. There are units I skimmed that can have 164' of lineset. You will want something in those bedrooms to actually force the air to exchange with the rest of the house. Linesets fit inside 2x4 cavities if that's what you're worried about.

https://www.fujitsu-general.com/us/...brochure-02.pdf (Page 21, 25)

Was thinking mini-split, so is there a way to put some kind of return (or duct?) in the bedrooms with that?

I know that there wouldn't be a lot of cooling or warming in those rooms with a minisplit in the living room, but I do stress it's a small house and I would put a fan or two around to get some flow, and I only really use the one bedroom anyway.

TacoHavoc
Dec 31, 2007
It's taco-y and havoc-y...at the same time!

Sterling_Archer posted:

Hey thread -

What the heck is this:

I believe this is the switch that controls power to the furnace. I can see the power come down from the floor joist above into the lightswitch box and then back out again to the furnace whip....but what is this weird chime thing coming out of that box that has two wires running.....somewhere...? I've purchased a 2-gang and a new gfci outlet and new switch to replace these things with (and add an outlet because why isn't there one?!) but I want to figure out what this extra square box that says chime on it is doing.

Based on your description that's your boiler shutoff (ideally would have a red plate) and a repurposed doorbell transformer being used for your thermostat. Flip the switch to off and see if your furnace controls go dark and your doorbell still works to confirm.

Why are you trying to add an outlet there? Leave the circuit that feeds your boiler alone. And if for some reason you do this, don't put your furnace power behind a gfci.

Sterling_Archer
May 10, 2012

"What do you mean we're not in compliance?"

TacoHavoc posted:

Based on your description that's your boiler shutoff (ideally would have a red plate) and a repurposed doorbell transformer being used for your thermostat. Flip the switch to off and see if your furnace controls go dark and your doorbell still works to confirm.

Why are you trying to add an outlet there? Leave the circuit that feeds your boiler alone. And if for some reason you do this, don't put your furnace power behind a gfci.

I'm trying to add an outlet for a condensate pump. Why not GFCI? There is a water heater next to it and a condensate drain next to it so I figured it'd be safer to have than not.

SourKraut
Nov 20, 2005

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Sterling_Archer posted:

I'm trying to add an outlet for a condensate pump. Why not GFCI? There is a water heater next to it and a condensate drain next to it so I figured it'd be safer to have than not.

I'm probably wrong, but I think the in-rush current on the furnace will blow the GFCI every time it turns on.

TacoHavoc
Dec 31, 2007
It's taco-y and havoc-y...at the same time!

SourKraut posted:

I'm probably wrong, but I think the in-rush current on the furnace will blow the GFCI every time it turns on.

More that if it false trips, you end up without an operating furnace. In regions with freeing temps, this will inevitably happen when you're not home and you could end up in a freezeup situation.

SourKraut
Nov 20, 2005

POST QUALITY UNDER CONSTRUCTION

TacoHavoc posted:

More that if it false trips, you end up without an operating furnace. In regions with freeing temps, this will inevitably happen when you're not home and you could end up in a freezeup situation.
Ah, that makes sense!

Sterling_Archer
May 10, 2012

"What do you mean we're not in compliance?"

TacoHavoc posted:

More that if it false trips, you end up without an operating furnace. In regions with freeing temps, this will inevitably happen when you're not home and you could end up in a freezeup situation.

Ok so a regular outlet would be ok then? I want to add a condensate pump so we don't have to empty a bucket but there isn't an outlet in the area.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009


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Grimey Drawer

Sterling_Archer posted:

Ok so a regular outlet would be ok then? I want to add a condensate pump so we don't have to empty a bucket but there isn't an outlet in the area.

Yes. Equipment outlets are not required to be GFCI (I believe that is still the case anyway).

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Sterling_Archer
May 10, 2012

"What do you mean we're not in compliance?"

Perfect - thanks all.

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