Search Amazon.com:
Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«246 »
  • Post
  • Reply
Megaman's Jockstrap
Jul 16, 2000

What a horrible thread to have a post.


I beat every single mission in Hitman 2 with a Silent Assassin rating on my original Xbox and it literally broke the game. The score counter was all hosed up and was a negative number.

Hitman owns but I'm going to wait until it's a complete game before purchasing it.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Dark_Swordmaster
Oct 31, 2011


Absolution's stealth was literally just stay out of sight and DON'T look like the guys you're trying to get past. It was awful.

Mierenneuker
Apr 28, 2010



Dark_Swordmaster posted:

I took the first level in Blood Money and slowly killed everyone on the map. It was a nice surprise when the newspaper at the end actually reflected no witnesses.

Also it's just fun to kill people, a lot of people, even people you're not supposed to. This series makes killing everyone fun.



Bless those tourists, sipping their wine, blissfully unaware (the grey crosses are staff).

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Get back. Move, get back! Don't you touch my stereo! THESE ARE MY RECORDS!!!

Dark_Swordmaster posted:

Absolution's stealth was literally just stay out of sight and DON'T look like the guys you're trying to get past. It was awful.

It was a bit more than that. The fact that you moved quite a bit faster and you could use cover and subdue people without needing an item changed things quite a bit.

Dark_Swordmaster
Oct 31, 2011


There was some mild nuance to it and to my fault I treated it like any other Hitman title and played on the highest no-help difficulty I could. Playing through it on 360 after it went free I set it to easy and literally killed everyone I possibly could and it was okay.

But I would still stand by the argument that Absolution's stealth was an unintuitive broken loving mess and the fact that it relied on Instinct so much was a large part of why.

CharlestonJew
Jul 7, 2011

Your next post will be "im gay"


Illegal Hen

the actual stealth part of Absolution was just fine

The disguise system was completely broken though. Why yes, literally every street food vendor in Chinatown knows each other and can instantly spot an imposter from a mile away.

Mierenneuker
Apr 28, 2010



On the hardest difficulty (not counting Purist) you get so little Instinct. I remember only using it in clutch situations to "blend in" and to lower suspicion, like having to pass right in front of a guard with a similar disguise.

I didn't mind the fact that Instinct pointed out things in the environment on the lower difficulties though. They are so many stories about the previous games where people were like "I didn't know you could do that!". Like how in A New Life from Blood Money you can grab some anesthetic darts from the vet office, use the air rifle in the tree house to take out the pool cleaner when he is near the shed, disguise as the pool cleaner, have the wife of the target invite you to her bedroom, remain in the bathroom until she falls asleep and acquire the necklace you need that way. I once told a friend about that one and it blew his mind. Things like that are awesome, but I'd hate for most players to never discover them.

Mierenneuker fucked around with this message at Feb 11, 2016 around 22:21

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


Mierenneuker posted:

On the hardest difficulty (not counting Purist) you get so little Instinct. I remember only using it in clutch situations to "blend in" and to lower suspicion, like having to pass right in front of a guard with a similar disguise.

I didn't mind the fact that Instinct pointed out things in the environment on the lower difficulties though. They are so many stories about the previous games where people were like "I didn't know you could do that!". Like how in A New Life from Blood Money you can grab some anesthetic darts from the vet office, use the air rifle in the tree house to take out the pool cleaner when he is near the shed, disguise as the pool cleaner, have the wife of the target invite you to her bedroom, remain in the bathroom until she falls asleep and acquire the necklace you need that way. I once told a friend about that one and it blew his mind. I assume he always stuck to the sedative syringe when he was feeling stealthy.
Or you can knock out the guard dog and sneak in through the side door.

mistermojo
Jul 3, 2004



CharlestonJew posted:

The disguise system was completely broken though. Why yes, literally every street food vendor in Chinatown knows each other and can instantly spot an imposter from a mile away.

I'm certain it was only implemented that way so they could have levels where you have to get from point A to point B past 30 guards without just killing one, disguising yourself and walking to the exit.

Dark_Swordmaster
Oct 31, 2011


Absolution's main problem was that the game/levels were designed in service to its loving badbadbadbad story and so they were mostly HORRIBLE A-to-B linear levels. Anyone who says they weren't doesn't understand that a loop ending in the same place five feet down is still a line.

Also then mere mention of its checkpoint system should be enough to show how garbage that game was.

BillBear
Mar 13, 2013

Ask me about running my country straight into the ground every time I play EU4 multiplayer.

Dark_Swordmaster posted:


Here's something OP-worthy:

The Steam version of Contracts is FINALLY back (after licensing issues with one of my favorite bands, Clutch) but it has a gamebreaking bug in that IT HAS NO SAVE FOLDER! But this is fix-able. Navigate to your Contracts directory (Steam/Steamapps/common/Hitman Contracts/) and just create a new folder called "save". Done, now the game will properly save and you can stop restarting from step one like it's an NES title.


Added, thanks!
Also How not to play Hitman is god drat legendary. He's still making videos too, holy poo poo.

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Get back. Move, get back! Don't you touch my stereo! THESE ARE MY RECORDS!!!

Dark_Swordmaster posted:

There was some mild nuance to it and to my fault I treated it like any other Hitman title and played on the highest no-help difficulty I could. Playing through it on 360 after it went free I set it to easy and literally killed everyone I possibly could and it was okay.

But I would still stand by the argument that Absolution's stealth was an unintuitive broken loving mess and the fact that it relied on Instinct so much was a large part of why.

The stealth was fine. The disguise system had issues. But Absolution also improved the combat by a mile as well, because holy poo poo was it bad in the previous games.

Dark_Swordmaster
Oct 31, 2011


I get what you're saying but for Hitman I'd lump them together. You're right about the shooting however. Even though Freedom Fighters was great IOI still didn't have shooting down 100%. That said, the cheats for Codename 47 and Freedom Fighters were great. Free camera, time scale, and ioinailgun...

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

blackguy32 posted:

The stealth was fine. The disguise system had issues. But Absolution also improved the combat by a mile as well, because holy poo poo was it bad in the previous games.

this. its a decent game in of itself. hell i like it. but its bad hitman game. the controls are good though and i hope they keep them similar in the new one.

Swartz
Jul 28, 2005

I'm a friend of the family.


I'm hard for this new game. I'm seriously looking forward to it. Hitman is by far my favorite game series if you close your eyes and pretend Absolution never happened. I pity those who did not play Hitman 1 and 2 back when they were considered okay graphics-wise, as they were great fun at the time.

CharlestonJew
Jul 7, 2011

Your next post will be "im gay"


Illegal Hen

mistermojo posted:

I'm certain it was only implemented that way so they could have levels where you have to get from point A to point B past 30 guards without just killing one, disguising yourself and walking to the exit.

I get what you mean, it was just handled pretty poorly. The way this game handles disguises seems a lot better though. It really makes sense that some guys would be more "in the know" on who's supposed to be where so they can see through your disguise.

I'm cautiously optimistic about this, going to wait for a few impressions once it's out before I dive in.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

Swartz posted:

I'm hard for this new game. I'm seriously looking forward to it. Hitman is by far my favorite game series if you close your eyes and pretend Absolution never happened. I pity those who did not play Hitman 1 and 2 back when they were considered okay graphics-wise, as they were great fun at the time.

whats cool is it sounds like their will be multiple seasons. like this year(throughout) we are getting like 7 locations, then they will keep adding on over time. so like tf2 or something.

Mister Adequate
Oct 29, 2011

that's real fuckin' spooky


Dark_Swordmaster posted:

I get what you're saying but for Hitman I'd lump them together. You're right about the shooting however. Even though Freedom Fighters was great IOI still didn't have shooting down 100%. That said, the cheats for Codename 47 and Freedom Fighters were great. Free camera, time scale, and ioinailgun...

poo poo I always forget it was IOI who made Freedom Fighters. What a loving great game, wish that had got a sequel.

Swartz
Jul 28, 2005

I'm a friend of the family.


Dapper_Swindler posted:

whats cool is it sounds like their will be multiple seasons. like this year(throughout) we are getting like 7 locations, then they will keep adding on over time. so like tf2 or something.

Yeah, it will be done in multiple "expansions" or sorts, with perhaps a new level a month until the game is "finished". I actually like this approach. It gives the developers more time to tweak and refine the game based on player-input and more thorough bug-testing allowed due to the expanded periods of time creating the game.

I also like it because I'm poor. The basic deal is that I can pay $15 now and have the intro mission and first mission of the game, then whatever for each added on mission that comes out each month. It will obviously come out to more than $60 in the long run, but for someone like me who can't justify that kind of money on a video game, even if it is my favorite game series, it's actually rather appealing.

@Mister Adequate: I do believe IO is very interested in doing a sequel to Freedom Fighters but has not been able to since the game's publisher/distributor isn't being reasonable.

Solomonic
Jan 3, 2008

INCIPIT SANTA


Hitman is one of those series where I'll play anything with the name on it regardless of quality so I'm amped for the new one. I liked Absolution, although in kind of a different way from the rest of the series, and I hope they've taken note of what worked and what didn't so we can get a good unified experience with the new game. Combat was way smoother, for example, and being able to choke a dude was a nice quality of life improvement. I hope both of those things stick around even if we move towards more of an old-school Hitman.

My favorite levels are Dance With The Devil, Traditions of the Trade, and whatever that one was in Silent Assassin where you had to infiltrate an airport and kill a hacker in the basement. I need to replay Silent Assassin.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

Swartz posted:

Yeah, it will be done in multiple "expansions" or sorts, with perhaps a new level a month until the game is "finished". I actually like this approach. It gives the developers more time to tweak and refine the game based on player-input and more thorough bug-testing allowed due to the expanded periods of time creating the game.

I also like it because I'm poor. The basic deal is that I can pay $15 now and have the intro mission and first mission of the game, then whatever for each added on mission that comes out each month. It will obviously come out to more than $60 in the long run, but for someone like me who can't justify that kind of money on a video game, even if it is my favorite game series, it's actually rather appealing.

@Mister Adequate: I do believe IO is very interested in doing a sequel to Freedom Fighters but has not been able to since the game's publisher/distributor isn't being reasonable.

they could just make a new ip. just make the soviets invade in the 60s or 50s.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

question. I am i the only one who didnt even try to be stealthy/non-leathal in the orphanage level in absolution. I killed every single one of those nun killing tweakers with an ax and laughed and their screams.

Dark_Swordmaster
Oct 31, 2011


Dapper_Swindler posted:

question. I am i the only one who didnt even try to be stealthy/non-leathal in the orphanage level in absolution. I killed every single one of those nun killing tweakers with an ax and laughed and their screams.

They out-stealthed me...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_Yez7pe860

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

This avatar was paid for by the Silent Majority.

alright. so i played the beta or at least the first part. its pretty good. its definitely blood money 2.0. the controls are pretty much like absolution. the first intro training level kinda sucks, but its a good introduction to the game play mechanics. its a bit tanky but thats all the hitman games. no difficulty settings that i can see at least in the beta. the alarm system is pretty interesting. but ill get back to it tomarrow.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at Feb 12, 2016 around 05:10

Sleeveless
Dec 25, 2014

I'm not going to lie to you, there's nothing good about this at all.

Codename 47 came with my first real 3D-capable computer and being a teenager with infinite free time and no money or broadband for I pretty much played that game to pieces in spite of the jank. It really is incredible how far the series has come, between the incredibly slow sneak speed and the frustrating level design often you only had one way to actually beat a level and there were no mid-level saves so you were stuck playing through levels over and over and over. C47 didn't even have the ability to knock people out non-lethally so in order to complete some levels you had to go against the game's actual logic and murder an innocent dude for their clothes at the expense of your actual paycheck at the end of the level.

And both C47 and SA had the problem a lot of early stealth games had were they didn't trust the game to sell on stealth alone so they crammed in some lovely, frustrating open action levels like the jungle levels in C47 and Japan in SA. Considering that it could take upwards of 30 minutes to play through one of the jungle levels it was maddening to get to the end and then get mowed down by the shameless Tony Montana knockoff or get blown up in the drug lag or get mowed down running to the escape plane and have to start all over.

khwarezm posted:

What really got me about Absolution is the plot and the tone of the game in general, its just so dumb and in the most obnoxious in your face kind of way. I won't pretend that the series has ever been high art, but I think one of the reasons that I ended up liking Blood Money so much was that they had the intelligence to shove the main story into the background and instead focus on mostly unrelated missions that wildly varied in setting and character. You get a bit of a briefing as to why your killing a sheikh in Vegas or whatever and away you go, if you're observant you might notice little quirks like the fact that in till death do us part its clearly the bride who has organised the assassination of her own husband and father on her wedding day as well as the targets in the previous level. In Absolution on the other hand you've got a shitload of garish, ugly cutscenes filled with garish, ugly characters in a garish, ugly game that you can't ignore since it contextualizes all the stupid poo poo your doing. Instead of a day in the life of 47 on the job you've got this nonsense about him trying to rescue a teenage schoolgirl he's inexplicably grown attached to from the good ol' boys while you wander around the most boring parts of middle America. Also Kane and Lynch show up to rub salt on the wound.

Blood Money's story was a political thriller about cloning laws, I greatly prefer Absolution's goofy cartoon characters and sci-fi weirdness to yet another dry drab CGI cutscene of the reporter and the former head of the FBI chatting in between completely disconnected levels.

mistermojo
Jul 3, 2004



Absolutions story and bizarre not quite human looking people were the best thing about it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AkCc2BpUQWQ

Sea Sponge Run
Jan 14, 2010

I'll go to the ends of the Earth for my dream


Lipstick Apathy

Interestingly the tutorial level was my favorite part of Absolution

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

Sleeveless posted:


Blood Money's story was a political thriller about cloning laws, I greatly prefer Absolution's goofy cartoon characters and sci-fi weirdness to yet another dry drab CGI cutscene of the reporter and the former head of the FBI chatting in between completely disconnected levels.

Blood Money (and contracts) had a story that was background fluff you can immediately kick away to get to the meat, it existed purely to string along varied setpiece missions, as it should be. Absolution has the kind of story that dumb people will defend by calling it camp, although, unlike good camp, it takes itself bafflingly seriously, and it also hijacks the direction of the game so that you spend most of it killing rednecks in boring as gently caress small town America. It seriously baffles me how little fun it felt despite trying so hard, none of the characters were enjoyable or charismatic, it had this real ugliness in the character design and tone, and don't get me started on the way women get portrayed in it.

The one thing I kind of liked was the way that 47 clearly didn't fit in at all with the ~W a c k Y~ nonsense going on around him and just went through the whole thing with an expression that said 'what the gently caress am I even doing here?' Its like he's stoically going through the crap the script requires of him so he can get it over with and be in a good hitman game again.

khwarezm fucked around with this message at Feb 12, 2016 around 06:40

PaletteSwappedNinja
Jun 3, 2008

One Nation, Under God.

I liked the part where the guy framed Hitman for murder.

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

khwarezm posted:

it had this real ugliness in the character design and tone, and don't get me started on the way women get portrayed in it.

To be fair, IOI has always had some real bad issues with these things. Blood Money's maybe the closest they ever came to being decent about that and it still had some extremely, uh, questionable parts, and that was before they regressed completely in K&L2, where you are at one point forced to listen to a lady being raped during a loading screen (seriously) so the male leads would have more motivational framing to shoot more people.

Trailers for this Hitman aren't looking super promising on that front, either. Though this one seems to be presented so dryly that you can hopefully just skip/ignore IOI's tendency towards gross framing devices/bizarrely terrible plots and just focus on the mechanics of assassinatin'.

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

Moartoast posted:

To be fair, IOI has always had some real bad issues with these things. Blood Money's maybe the closest they ever came to being decent about that and it still had some extremely, uh, questionable parts, and that was before they regressed completely in K&L2, where you are at one point forced to listen to a lady being raped during a loading screen (seriously) so the male leads would have more motivational framing to shoot more people.

Trailers for this Hitman aren't looking super promising on that front, either. Though this one seems to be presented so dryly that you can hopefully just skip/ignore IOI's tendency towards gross framing devices/bizarrely terrible plots and just focus on the mechanics of assassinatin'.

True, it seemed in BM that there was only one model they had for most women below fifty, and that model had the most ridiculous tits. Absolution just felt like they were going backwards on that front at a point when most games were finally getting the idea that maybe this sort of carry on was really dumb.

I will say that the trailers are really selling me on the new game though, I think the trailer that involved 47 jogging interspersed with clips of various assassinations is one of my favorite game trailers I've seen in years, it just perfectly gets the kind of tone I want in a hitman game, that combination of glamour and danger that really makes it feel like your trying to rub out some seriously powerful people in the most elegant way possible.

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Get back. Move, get back! Don't you touch my stereo! THESE ARE MY RECORDS!!!

khwarezm posted:

Blood Money (and contracts) had a story that was background fluff you can immediately kick away to get to the meat, it existed purely to string along varied setpiece missions, as it should be. Absolution has the kind of story that dumb people will defend by calling it camp, although, unlike good camp, it takes itself bafflingly seriously, and it also hijacks the direction of the game so that you spend most of it killing rednecks in boring as gently caress small town America. It seriously baffles me how little fun it felt despite trying so hard, none of the characters were enjoyable or charismatic, it had this real ugliness in the character design and tone, and don't get me started on the way women get portrayed in it.

The one thing I kind of liked was the way that 47 clearly didn't fit in at all with the ~W a c k Y~ nonsense going on around him and just went through the whole thing with an expression that said 'what the gently caress am I even doing here?' Its like he's stoically going through the crap the script requires of him so he can get it over with and be in a good hitman game again.

Why don't you go sort some mail then, macho pig?

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

I need to use the bathroom.

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

khwarezm posted:

True, it seemed in BM that there was only one model they had for most women below fifty, and that model had the most ridiculous tits. Absolution just felt like they were going backwards on that front at a point when most games were finally getting the idea that maybe this sort of carry on was really dumb.

I will say that the trailers are really selling me on the new game though, I think the trailer that involved 47 jogging interspersed with clips of various assassinations is one of my favorite game trailers I've seen in years, it just perfectly gets the kind of tone I want in a hitman game, that combination of glamour and danger that really makes it feel like your trying to rub out some seriously powerful people in the most elegant way possible.

The rhythmic breathing leading into the ~sick beats~ was so drat hype. The only thing I'm questioning is the appearance of skeezy men doing vaguely exploitative things to women (that are leered at just as much by the camera as they are the skeezy dudes), because man does this series lean way too hard on that for framing the killing of peeps.

The trailer was great otherwise, though. If IOI doing vaguely unfortunate stuff ruined these games for me, I wouldn't be so into Contracts or BM. Here's hoping they remembered how to do good game design again.

Also bring back newspapers goddammit I want to read about how many people equate stealing dead people's clothes to being a chameleon.

blackguy32
Oct 1, 2005

Get back. Move, get back! Don't you touch my stereo! THESE ARE MY RECORDS!!!

Moartoast posted:

I need to use the bathroom.

Certainly sir, let me just get the key.


Traditions of the trade was kind of crappy in Contracts. But man that is one dark game. It and Hitman 2 are the only games I can think of where you actually kill non-bad people.

Accordion Man
Nov 7, 2012


blackguy32 posted:

Traditions of the trade was kind of crappy in Contracts. But man that is one dark game. It and Hitman 2 are the only games I can think of where you actually kill non-bad people.
Contracts has a great dismal atmosphere that feeds into the game's framing device, i.e. its usually always raining or snowing.

Plan Z
May 6, 2012



Megaman's Jockstrap posted:

I beat every single mission in Hitman 2 with a Silent Assassin rating on my original Xbox and it literally broke the game. The score counter was all hosed up and was a negative number.

Hitman owns but I'm going to wait until it's a complete game before purchasing it.

I never got all of them because I'm guessing that stupid ninja in the infiltration mission kept getting hit by a truck.

Discendo Vox
Mar 21, 2013

This user's endless pedantry is kept grey.

Key words: nutrition, philosophy, regulatory science, law, shallow realpolitik, fake cheese, game design fanfiction.

Contracts is my favorite game in the series. The overarching plot conceit effectively prevented IOI from writing an actual script, which was good because they keep demonstrating they can't be trusted to do so. Voicework for the game was fantastic, and in contrast with BM, levels did not feel like a series of increasingly obvious setpiece deathtraps that you walk up to and hit "use" on. Prelim reviews of the fashion show make me nervious- RPS reports that the scripted kill "opportunity" system continues absolution's approach of triggering scripted events when you're nearby to witness them and act, making it less of a working environment to navigate and more of a carnival ride with periodic "Press F to kill in this totally sick way, dude, don't forget to tell your friends" moments.

Things to do away with:
Instinct
Getting beaten in cutscenes
Money

Things to bring back:
Unlockable weapons that can be brought between missions
Contracts mode
Enemies that seem remotely competent (Hunter Hunted was the best)

Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at Feb 12, 2016 around 09:35

Booty Pageant
Apr 20, 2012


its a real shame they neglected mei ling she was a pretty good character imo

e:
i will never forget a name like parchezzi

Booty Pageant fucked around with this message at Feb 12, 2016 around 09:48

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Moartoast
Jan 16, 2011

Another unfunny, threadshitting knob-end.

Discendo Vox posted:

RPS reports that the scripted kill "opportunity" system continues absolution's approach of triggering scripted events when you're nearby to witness them and act, making it less of a working environment to navigate and more of a carnival ride with periodic "Press F to kill in this totally sick way, dude, don't forget to tell your friends" moments.

Boy, that's worrying. One of my favorite parts of the old games was how natural the scripting worked. Each little "world" rarely revolved around the player, which is something that most games just don't do, and it really lent this sense of actually infiltrating a living place. Having NPCs stand around waiting to take their marks and spout exposition when the player is nearby (along with flashing USE THIS FOR SOME SWEET ASSASSINATION ACTION setpieces) is basically antithetical to the whole design of classic Hitman. There were hints of these things in BM, but they weren't a huge deal at the time and the levels were still largely naturalistic and freeform enough to facilitate The Good poo poo.

I kinda figured IOI had come to their senses when one of the previews for this new one explicitly said "we have this many NPCs active and doing their own thing all across the map at a time", but y'know, marketing is just marketing I guess.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«246 »