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Do you think real life Marina Oswald watched this show?
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Apr 6, 2016 20:21
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Guy Mann posted:Apparently his son Joe Hill helped him rewrite the ending, but that was the Sadie stuff and not the actual time travel bits. Here's the original book ending.  clever idea of tying 9/11 into The Dark Tower plot, I'm so pleasantly surprised by this. The book ending to 11.23 was sappy and absolutely wonderful. Just like in the show, but better simply by virtue of having invested 800 pages with these two.Guy Mann posted:I thought the book ending was a nice capstone on the idea of casual time travel. You can sell the same few pounds of ground beef endlessly and you can save a life or two but you can't significantly change the past because doing so causes the very fabric of reality to unravel. What happened happened and you need to accept it and make the best of it instead of endlessly fixating on what could have been. quote:Every now and again a man or woman comes along whose life will affect not just those about him or her, or even all those who live in the Short-Time world, but those on many levels above and below the Short-Time world. These people are the Great Ones, and their lives always serve the Purpose. If they are taken too soon, everything changes. The scales cease to balance. Can you imagine, for instance, how different the world might be today if Hitler had drowned in the bathtub as a child? You may believe the world would be better for that, but I can tell you that the world would not exist at all if it had happened. Suppose Winston Churchill had died of food poisoning before he ever became Prime Minister? Suppose Augustus Caesar had been born dead, strangled on his own umbilical cord? Yet the person we want you to save is of far greater importance than any of these.
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Apr 6, 2016 21:27
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Lycus posted:In addition to Oswald owning the gun, Jake told the guy at the door that Oswald was gonna shoot the president and to get the police, and Sadie was with him. And he did angrily hand-delivered a letter to the FBI that practically screamed "I am a violent revolutionary and am going to kill the president" and Jake even (rightfully) called them out on ignoring it.
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Apr 6, 2016 21:38
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I went through and took note of the name of the record playing in each episode: 01. JUST LIKE A CANDLE 02. WAIT FOR THE BUNNY 03. Wool and Water 04. KING of HEARTS 05. POOL of TEARS 06. SHAKING 07. SHAKING 08. WHICH DREAMED IT Not sure if it means anything, but its kind of a neat detail they included.
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Apr 7, 2016 06:47
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I noticed in the credits that JJ Abrams actually composed the title theme.
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Apr 7, 2016 06:57
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Comrade Fakename posted:I noticed in the credits that JJ Abrams actually composed the title theme. Both the music and the visuals of the title sequence are great.
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Apr 7, 2016 10:25
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LinkesAuge posted:Lesson learned: Don't do anything to make people's life better, they will be better off without it. Vanderdeath posted:Yeah, the glossing over of the alternate future was frustrating. I wanted to know how poo poo went hinky with JFK alive but they barely scratched the surface. It cheapened the whole conceit of the show, in my opinion. emanresu tnuocca posted:major spoilers I guess the new time hole monitoring guy tells Jake that the rabbit hole doesn't truly fully reset the timelines and that the major changes to the timeline caused by his saving of JFK are somehow fundamentally destroying reality, when he gets back to the present it's not just a war torn world he encounters there's actual apocalyptic phenomena all over the place. In the book there's already a major earthquake that kills 7,000 people in california a couple of days after Jake saves JFK and reality basically starts going off the rails at that point so the new past Jake discovers when he returns is less of an alternative history and more of the world kinda falling apart rather rapidly. Vorgen posted:many worlds theory of time travel Fast Luck posted:The "time loop" thing for the yellow card man never ended up making sense. I mean, because that guy was caught in a time loop trying to save his kid, he just faded in and out of reality around Jake and hosed with Jake to teach him a lesson? And why does Sadie die "every time" according to him if Jake actually was able to save the janitor and save Kennedy, and Sadie doesn't even die period in the normal timeline? And how is it a "loop" if Jake can just go back to the present and quit trying at any time? Just didn't make sense. Basebf555 posted:I'm not sure how you could have taken him out completely, because he's the reason Jake decides he can't ever be with Sadie. You'd really have to re-write the ending completely to show Jake going through multiple cycles where he gradually figures it out on is own. tetrapyloctomy posted:The show's portrayal of "the obdurate past" didn't live up to its initial car-into-a-phone-booth, which was extremely sinister. Guy Mann posted:An easy way to do it is to have Sadie be all grapecritic posted:How did the secret service know that James Franco saved them? Did I miss something? Maybe there's some context in the book that makes this ending seem somehow satisfying, but based solely on its own merits it's garbage. This show was garbage. And that ending? Rather than finding out how this experience has affected our protagonist, we get to see that Sadie lived a life? Yeah, so? Who gives a poo poo? We knew she was a person who lived a life without Jake in the original timeline anyway, now it's just gone back to how it was before. Nothing loving happened. And like I said earlier, Jake learned nothing, and he hasn't changed in any noticeable way, he's just gone back to his old life as though none of it happened. What was the loving point?
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Apr 7, 2016 17:00
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when a man she's never met before starts creeping on her and apparently knows everything about her and have Jake realize on his own that he can't ever have a true relationship with her again because the balance of power is so skewed.
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Tiggum posted:Yeah, that seemed to be the message. Seems like a pretty terrible message, but there it is. The book handles the post-assassination attempt better because Jake had already had multiple contacts with the Secret Service leading up to it. They were watching Oswald as well as Jake, but they were largely incompetent and easily-bluffed by Jake whenever they confronted him. Post-assassination attempt the Secret Service just wanted him to go away and were willing to get him quietly out of town to meet his "contacts from your home country for extraction that are waiting for you" (they thought he was a Soviet spy, of all things) if he wouldn't expose their incompetence in interviews. Also he really hammers on the story that he and Sadie were the reason JFK was alive, and how they need to show more respect for Sadie sacrificing herself to stop Oswald. The audiobook narrator does a really good job telling the story that I don't know would necessarily read the same way if you just read the book. In the book, when Jake dances with Old-Sadie, there are hints in her conversation with him that she feels like she knows him from somewhere and the memories may be coming in even though they technically happened to a different Sadie. The book ends mid-dance, so we never really find out what happens to them. Never mind that it would be a terrible thing to actually have happen to someone, because they might go insane, but that's Stephen King for you. Seems like the end of every book has to have some element of something that has some kind of existential horror to it.
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Apr 7, 2016 19:54
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W-what? So your interpretation of the ending of the book was existential dread as Sadie begins to be flooded with memories that happened to a different timeline version of herself? And that after the dance, she went through her life haunted by this interaction? Okay, I guess. You're entitled to your opinion. For me it seemed pretty cut-and-dry. He was willing to change everything just to be with Sadie, and only after accepting that the consequences for the entire world would be far too dire he allows things to play out naturally and return to the original timeline. He can't help himself wondering how her life turned out, so he tracks her down to her award acceptance ceremony, and then can't help himself approaching her and asking for a dance. During the dance, he lets slip how much he knows about her, and she's shocked and taken aback since she's never met him. He mysteriously ends it with, "I knew you in a different life, honey" and internally wonders if she ever found someone to love, someone to "get rid of that broom", someone who made her happy. It's beautiful and somber and quite fitting for the end of the book, and it kind of pulls the rug out from under you when you understand that the time travel and assassination and all that jazz was a cover so King could trick you into reading this simple yet powerful love story between two teachers. 11/22/63 is a love story masquerading as a time travel thriller and I love it for that. The show appears to have been made, at first glance, by people who actually read the book. But maybe they were also doing laundry or had the TV on in the background because they appear to have missed the point of the entire thing. They paid attention at the beginning and at the end, but they appear to have thought the middle would be better served not exploring the consequences and opportunities in resetting the timeline, or in exploring the Yellow Card Man and his implications for this world, but to invent a new character who fucks Oswald's wife.
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Apr 7, 2016 21:10
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Wade Wilson posted:Never mind that it would be a terrible thing to actually have happen to someone, because they might go insane, but that's Stephen King for you. Seems like the end of every book has to have some element of something that has some kind of existential horror to it. I mean, that's literally what happens to the card men in the book, but I never got an impression Sadie had anything more than some deja vu. Not full-blown conflicting memories or anything.
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Apr 7, 2016 21:43
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Wade Wilson posted:Also he really hammers on the story that he and Sadie were the reason JFK was alive, and how they need to show more respect for Sadie sacrificing herself to stop Oswald. The audiobook narrator does a really good job telling the story that I don't know would necessarily read the same way if you just read the book. Can't be said enough, the audiobook is very good. Kind of disappointed in the last few episodes and Jake's reveal that's he's from the future. In the book, Sadie ultimately came to the conclusion herself instead (albeit with prodding) which was pretty epic. The actor who portrayed Oswald was really good.
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Apr 8, 2016 00:52
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I liked the part where Jake fucks with the FBI guy with Future Knowledge.
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Apr 8, 2016 04:30
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Double posting to ask if the book brings up what happens if someone goes through the Rabbit Hole after while someone else is in there.
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Apr 10, 2016 02:20
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Jonas Albrecht posted:Double posting to ask if the book brings up what happens if someone goes through the Rabbit Hole after while someone else is in there. Nope. Such paradoxes are not addressed. Just like when he asks what would happen if he went back and killed his own grandfather. "Well why the gently caress would you want to do that?!" That is the end of it.
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Apr 10, 2016 03:19
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wide stance posted:The actor who portrayed Oswald was really good. Yeah, I really liked him too. Reminded me of Cassie Affleck acting the poo poo out of Robert Ford in the Jesse James movie with Brad Pitt.
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Apr 10, 2016 20:11
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TraderStav posted:Nope. Such paradoxes are not addressed. Just like when he asks what would happen if he went back and killed his own grandfather. "Well why the gently caress would you want to do that?!"
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Apr 17, 2016 05:52
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