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Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Booblord Zagats posted:

I mean, are Star Wars human related to us? I know 40K humans and Dune humans are, but Star Wars isn't defined well enough for us to claim them, imo

E.T. is canon to both the Star Wars universe and the modern day human one so yes, also isn't there some poo poo in 40k that links that universe to Dune? I feel like there is/was

someone make a post about medieval siege mortars because those things are metal as gently caress

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Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Warhammer 40k was basically created by a bunch of goon neckbeards who watched Dune and read 2000AD, basically everything Rogue Trader and 2nd Edition is a mashup of that + their fantasy line. Then 3rd Edition it was that, but now unironically.

The models are fun as gently caress to paint and the fluff is still fun, but holy gently caress if you're at the game store every weekend playing competitive games. My best friend and I just build what we want and play like twice a year when he visits his parents.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


LITERALLY SHAKING posted:

If you like World War one history and haven't listened to Dan Carlin's Hardcore History series called Blueprint for Armageddon, you deserve a swift, light kick in the balls.


http://www.dancarlin.com/product/hardcore-history-50-blueprint-for-armageddon-i/

This is the one that got me into him.

Actually, now I know what I'm gonna put on in the background when I paint my lil army mens

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


every child should be forced to learn history from either Dan Carlin or that guy

holy poo poo that's funny

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kung Fu Fist gently caress posted:

i cant say for sure because i wasnt even an itch in dads nuts in 79, but it wouldnt surprise me

keep in mind were talking about the country that spawned mondo films and during the 70s and 80s were pumping out some of the best trash cinema ever known

they were also trying and convicting the people who were making those mondo films

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cannibal_Holocaust

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kung Fu Fist gently caress posted:

i dont think anything other than a temporarily revoked film license came from the cannibal holocaust stuff. the main controversy with that was the brutal violence, no one gave a poo poo about the nudity. they actually filed murder charges against the director until he wrangled up the actors to prove they were alive

porno holocaust is a better movie imho

the murder charges were dropped but they still got convicted on obscenity and animal cruelty charges (with a suspended sentence)

point is Catholics are nuts, ground zero for Catholics is batshit crazy..... you get both incredible artistic expression and amazing religious repression simultaneously

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


OMFG PTSD LOL PBUH posted:

I'll never respect you as a man from this post on, JFC.

it's cool, I'll continue to get poo poo house wrecked with my bud as we play with tiny army mans in his one or two full days away from his kids he gets a year

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


buncha dudes dancing, one staring longingly at a goat

yup, it's the Navy

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Booblord Zagats posted:

Pax Mongolica really never set in for the slavs, they pretty much went right from fighting the Mongols to pissing in each other's mouths.. Again.

It's even better that that. The Mongols just passed right on through, because lol if a slav had anything of value then

by the time the Mongols were that far west they were after riches much greater than other steppe people could provide

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kung Fu Fist gently caress posted:

yeah, i mean its not like the golden horde ruled most of modern day russia, belorussia and ukraine for almost 300 years. oh wait...

well, they never really fought the Mongols

steppe peoples fighting steppe peoples surely happened, but Mongols and the contemporary Russians were very similar at that point, so the Mongols just assimilated them

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Fair point, I probably should have clarified it more as west of the Urals

There's like a thousand miles between the Rus and where Subutai started out from, those are the people they swept right through

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kawasaki Nun posted:

And the founding of Moscow as a power center was established through the repelling of the Mongols a while later.



All of which is west of the Urals

can I go back and change that to east like I meant or do I look too dumb at this point

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kung Fu Fist gently caress posted:

you should probably chalk this one up as a loss and move on

That's a fair point, haha, I'm not too proud to admit I butchered what I meant to say.

Basically, from where Subutai embarked, the Mongol forces traveled over a thousand miles, picking up similar peoples along the way, until they got to and crossed the Urals, then faced the Rus. So when people hear that the Mongols conquered most of what is present day Russia, it actually wasn't as crazy as it sounds because most of the Asian part of Russia contained nomadic horse tribes.

Hopefully that makes a bit more sense? Either way, yeah, I'm a moron sometimes.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kawasaki Nun posted:

so uh, what was happening in the Americas for the centuries leading up to the introduction of horses around (I'm assuming) the 1400s? That's a long time to survive as a nomadic people, sans horses.

Also there are quite a few different nomadic peoples in Africa and Australia. Nomadic people's on other continents didn't form major empires like in Eurasia but they were hardly wiped out.

Most of the people's in South America weren't nomadic, some of the largest cities on Earth at that time were located there. The nomadic indigenous people in the Americas were basically constrained to the plains of North America. A lot of the native tribes were a combination, as they'd set up small villages in the winter and summer, and would follow game in the spring and fall as they migrated.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Kawasaki Nun posted:

Such a green institution, hopefully we see someone take up the reigns

On a smaller scale, this is a great fact about my home state I always thought was crazy.

If you've been to rural NY, you've probably noticed the forests. Huge, old growth trees everywhere, it's really cool and there's vast areas of it in NY. Must be just like it was back in the Revolution, if you close your eyes.

Actually, no, if you closed your eyes and opened them in the Revolution, NY was almost entirely clean cut farmland. All of the NY "old growth" forest existed after the rise of ind=

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Zeris posted:

New York is rather large and wasn't quite well populated enough for this to be true in revolutionary times according to my gut. Do you have a source?

Yeah, Revolution was probably too early, but by the mid to late 1800's NYS had stopped logging and farming primarily, so our forests tend to be a bit older than others in the Northeast

quote:

New York regarded wilderness as a treasure and a resource in the 19th century, long before most other states. Much of the woodland of the Northeast was destroyed by heavy logging during that time, but many of New York's hardwood trees were spared because they were useless as lumber, on inaccessible peaks and hillsides or far from streams used to float lumber to towns.

In 1895, the state created Adirondack Park, six million acres to be protected forever as wilderness and watershed. It now has more than half a million acres of virgin forest, as much as all the rest of the Northeast, said Barbara McMartin, a mathematician who has written 23 Adirondack guidebooks. Michael Kudish, a forestry professor at Paul Smith's College in Brighton, N.Y., in the Adirondacks, said that over the past 30 years, he had mapped 97 square miles of virgin forest in the Catskills.

Link

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Would you say that the US helped the overall war effort in WWII more, but that American boots on the ground had more of an effect in WWI?

I always thought that, and the Western Front in WWI was a much more important and a close run thing than it was in WWII anyway. In terms of total influence WWII has it hands down, though.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


when Stalin says that they couldn't have won without American help, I tend to believe him

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Genocide Tendency posted:

This pretty much ends the discussion on how much the US Euro Theater intervention was critical to the downfall of the NAZIs.

WWII is like that post about the Civil War

when you learn about it as a kid, you learn American Industry Won The War, when you actually learn a bit about it you realize holy poo poo the Soviets did a thing!, but when you actually learn about WWII, you learn American Industry Won The War

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


the whole speaking German thing shouldn't be taken literally, either

we never won a land war against China but I bet more kids are learning English there than Mandarin here

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Yeah, that's a fair point, but I was more talking about how American dominance after WWII and English domination prior necessitated other nations learning our language in the first place.

Germany didn't need to invade the US to get us all speaking German, they just needed to climb to the top of the global ladder.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Lazy Reservist posted:

Germany's greatest mistake during WWII was to attack Russia. By 1940, they had reclaimed more territory than the German Empire originally laid claim to. Had they halted, and engaged in some form of diplomacy, they might have been able to broker some sort of peace arrangement. Acknowledge a free France west of Alsace, give the Poles territory east of Silesia, and allow other occupied nations status as semi-autonomous states. But instead, Hitler decided that the best course of action was to roll into Russia, not realizing how bad of an idea that was. Germany not only repeated Napoleon's folly, but they left themselves vulnerable on three fronts. Within three years, the allies were able to surround the Axis from the south and west while Germany focused on their Western front. By the time of the Normandy Invasion, Germany had already spent too much of its manpower and materiel trying to conquer, then defend against, the Soviets. Fortress Europe, while still heavily defended, was nowhere near as strong as it could have been.

Theorycrafting this stuff is always fun, but with the Nazis you really only have one play. If Germany had played its hand better their leadership would have been different, and if their leadership were different, they never would have been dealt that hand.

Hitler's natural enemy was Bolshevism and he was gonna fight them no matter what.

e- the pro move would have been leaving Poland alone and signing the Brits and French up to fight Stalin

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


in any case, with Churchill, Hitler and Stalin all in power at the same time, something astronomically stupid was bound to happen

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Bernard McFacknutah posted:

Churchill was a symptom of Hitler, he would never have become prime minister if Hitler hadn't started knocking the piss out of Poland. Everyone thought he was a reckless maniac, which he was and proved as much whilst serving as 1st Lord of the Admiralty. Right up until the day of his appointment as PM it looked like a much more Conservative statesman in the form of Lord Halifax would have taken the job.

That's true, but I was more saying that even if Hitler sued for peace or any other theorycrafting that happens, those 3 guys together would eventually result in a world war. That part of the situation was set in stone at Versailles. After that, only Hitler could have taken Germany down that path, only Hitler's Germany would pick a fight with Russia, and a Churchill-type would always be put in charge of the UK to counter those things.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


didn't he get all pissy at the liberation of Paris after the US and UK halted to let him go first, and then the people just welcomed the Americans and Brits as liberators anyway?

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


the amount of railroad equipment we sent them was loving ludicrous

e- from wiki so whatever

quote:

The United States gave to the Soviet Union from October 1, 1941 to May 31, 1945 the following: 427,284 trucks, 13,303 combat vehicles, 35,170 motorcycles, 2,328 ordnance service vehicles, 2,670,371 tons of petroleum products (gasoline and oil), 4,478,116 tons of foodstuffs (canned meats, sugar, flour, salt, etc.), 1,900 steam locomotives, 66 Diesel locomotives, 9,920 flat cars, 1,000 dump cars, 120 tank cars, and 35 heavy machinery cars. One item typical of many was a tire plant that was lifted bodily from the Ford Company's River Rouge Plant and transferred to the USSR. The 1947 money value of the supplies and services amounted to about eleven billion dollars.

Seizure Meat fucked around with this message at 04:49 on May 2, 2016

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


You always hear about how many Soviet tanks were built, well, prolly about 1,900 steam locomotives worth, lol

e- also the inflation gets wonky because I don't think it was sold at cost and people weren't making the same kind of money + benefits like today. It might be a 10:1 ratio on paper but you'd never get that amount of poo poo built and shipped for 100 billion today

Seizure Meat fucked around with this message at 12:25 on May 2, 2016

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


shame on an IGA posted:

Taking inflation out of the equation, it's still five Manhattan Projects holy gently caress

...and that's just what we gave the Soviets

e- and then tack on the Marshall Plan

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Soylent Pudding posted:

Where could I find out more about this nuclear incident?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerboise_Bleue

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algiers_putsch_of_1961

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Syrian Lannister posted:

:negative:

I apologize. For some reason I thought this was going to or about a discussion regarding the Falkland Island War.

it's ok, just think of the Vulcan raid and that clusterfuck

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


57mm is bitch stuff, toss a PaK-40 on that mofo

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Bernard McFacknutah posted:

People think that the Vulcan raids were meant to crater the runway at Mount Pleasant. That wasn't the intended purpose, that was just the side effect. The intention was to remind the Argies that we had no difficulty flying strategic bombers in to the south Atlantic and Argentina if we wanted.

The people doing the planning understood all too well that for a fraction of the resources used for the Vulcan missions they could have been running Sea Harrier ground attack missions around the clock but letting the Junta know that we could bomb the Mainland and sink their ships outside the exclusion zone added an extra strategic concern for Galtieri.

It gets explained in great length in a book by Commander 'Sharky' George who ran the airwing on one of the two aircraft carriers, it's called Sea Harrier over the Falklands and is a loving great book. Sink the Belgrano is another great book and explains that while the Conqueror had just sunk the Belgrano another Sub was shadowing the Argentine Aircraft carrier (which had a broken steam catapult that they couldn't launch any aircraft) and was waiting for the order to fire. Thatcher was about to give the order but was then disuaded by her cabinet because they were worried that if they killed another 1500 Argentine sailors that it would be impossible to get Argentina to negotiate a surrender.

The funny thing about sinking the carrier was that the only ships capable of detecting and destroying the British sub were the two Type-45 Destroyers escorting the Argentine carrier which we had recently sold them. All their other escorts were WW2 vintage with useless sonar that had a shorter detection range than the British Torpedoes, so the intention was to sink the Carrier, then sink the escorts effectively killing every sailor in the task force.

Anyone who has anything bad to say about the Mosquito needs to take a long hard look at themselves. It also only happened *in spite* of British Procurement. The war office had rejected it but De Haviland were so sure it would work they went ahead and built it anyway. Over a long range it could carry almost the same bombload as a B17 100ish MPH faster and only weighing 1/3rd of the weight.

No, I know what the message was to the Argentinians, but the mission itself to convey that message was a pretty convoluted and hosed up affair. It was more a joke than anything.

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Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Godholio posted:

Military history is hardly popular in the American academy, so from that perspective, of course "overall" they don't care. WWI also didn't really mean much to American society or policy compared to the conflicts before and after. You're coming off the Spanish-American War, where we gained territory, but then you go fight "over there" and bring home horrendously injured men without gaining anything tangible. It was not a high water mark by any means. The isolationists were effectively proven right, and the AEF was primarily effective as a reserve force used to bolster weakened units and lines and raise morale.

To be fair, one thing it certainly did was ensure American forces would never be placed under control of another nation's leadership on a major scale ever again.

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