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EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Omobono posted:

:getin:
We have such sights to show you. We're still missing the best characters too (every character is best character)(ok, maybe not the culprits)(every recurring character is best character)

E: list of best characters so far, in no particular order
Nick
Mia
The Judge
Larry
Payne
The games big strength is that the characters have a lot of character. Heck, I only dislike Larry because if he shows up I just know he's going to complicate things somehow (even then it's more of a 'DANGIT LARRY' moment.)

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EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
If it's in the Court Record, it's good enough for the kindly ol' Judge.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Aerdan posted:

I imagine it's more that he's so used to winning every case he's forgotten how to put effort into it.

Or rather, he's been putting the wrong sort of effort into it. See him telling the Bellboy to not submit certain things as testimony.
Instead of gathering evidence and basing his prosecution around that like Phoenix does.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Dragonwagon posted:

As evidenced by the two games with him as the protagonist.
That reminds me, I still need to play the second.

But Edgeworth is my favorite character in the series and it's certainly not for his performance here.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

But, on the other hand, we did get Redd White at his finest. :allears:

Somehow, he manages to sound Texan in his random english. This is both weird and somehow fitting for him :allears:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Nidoking posted:

Maybe she mentioned him not because she thought he would help, but so that whoever did (she probably knew it would be Phoenix) would learn something useful by talking to him.
He did have the files after all. Plus his refusal would be rather strange, laying the ground for further investigation.

Alternatively, Mia is only acting on really, really old information. A sort of 'if you're in any trouble and I can't help you for whatever reason, here's someone I trust.'

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
I don't see no ghost.

Look again.

When Mors posts the next update.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

legoman727 posted:

Meet the Security Lady. She's.. ho boy. We'll get into her only redeeming feature later on in the case, but for my money she's probably one of the worst characters in the entire series. The Steel Samurai is cool though.

IIRC she has some good scenes with her but those are in later games. At least I remember having a reaction to her after this... Bugger me if I can remember what that reaction was though.

This is a pretty neat case too.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
At the very least he's trying to be a sort of guardian to her considering she's his self-appointed assistant and sister to his late boss (plus he's the older of the two.)

Maya's personality makes a lot more sense if you know about japanese shrine culture. It basically boils down to the fact that she's finally able to experience something akin to a childhood now that she's away from temples and training to be a medium.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Shady Amish Terror posted:

Speaking of which, I think the game has already given us a pretty serious clue in the dialogue, but I don't know if I'm remembering correctly. I suppose hunting around some more will show whether that's right.

There's been a couple clues in the dialogue but the main one I remember is also one that they take a bit getting around to, which annoyed me to no end. It'll become a lot clearer when we see that photo evidence Gumshoe has.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Funky Valentine posted:

Edgeworth's life basically goes all downhill from here.

To chime in on this, Edgeworth's life basically goes downhill from when Phoenix beat him in the last case.

Oldbag is just the slick teflon on his downward slope.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Mzbundifund posted:

Kind of a plot hole that we have to hear about these people here, when Mr. Powers could have told us about them any time.

It was also pointed out in the actual case, both Pheonix and Edgeworth didn't think to mention/ask about the Director and even Oldbag found it unusual. They're Attorneys, not actors and there's a whole set of assumptions that can and will glossed over.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Agreed on the theories, it's helping bring back my memories of the cases so far.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Also the recipe and how it's handled is more of a marketing ploy than an actual thing of worth nowadays.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Omobono posted:

Except it's not the way things are done in Japanifornia.
Last case, anyone with half a brain could tell Redd White was the culprit two sentences in his testimony. And yet Edgeworth saved the rear end in a top hat before the Mia ex machina.

Once you drag a person into a trial, the Japanifornian prosecutor's duty is to grab, forge, cajole and fix a guilty verdict, come hell or high water. The mere factual innocence of the accused does not matter at that point.

The game isn't done with Edgeworth's arc yet but this is a continuation of the Redd White case for him. In Redd White, he was completely convinced that Pheonix was guilty, just the same as all the others he's prosecuted... And then Pheonix proved him wrong by having Redd White be guilty, who Edgeworth was protecting at the time... Completely at odds with his stated goal of 'convicting the guilty.'

Here, he's kept up pursuing the guilty but he's not single-mindedly ruthless about it. Now that the evidence has come out he's cottoned on that Vasquez is a bit too suspicious so he's helping out.

So yeah, while that's not the way things are done in Japanifornia, Edgeworth has started to figure out that the way things are done is kinda BS (a statement which is the subtle backbone of the entire series.)

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:

The best way is to use a wooden mallet, then burn the mallet, removing the crucial piece of evidence Phoenix needs in day 1 during the 2nd testimony.

Don't forget to dispose of the ashes by dumping them in the next ocean over, your expendable murder suit the same way, make sure you were careful and thorough not to leave anything behind and get ahold of the script so you can write out all of the narrative causality leading to you being convicted.

Oh yeah and make sure there are no witnesses or cameras of any sort.

... Sounds way easier not to commit it.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
There was that one fable with Rasputin though.

Uh, I don't think that's a particularly good case to base it off of though.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Huge coats are huge and make anyone's head look tiny.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Three shots from the pistol, two heard, one accounted for. That's enough of a foundation to fight back from, but Von Karma's not going to make it easy thanks to his abusing the 'Almighty Prosecutor' power that Japanifornia gives them. Don't you run roughshod over the judge you Draculawyer :argh:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
I was in AA3.5 for the crimes of arson, murder and jaywalking. That road had it coming I tell you! I had follow the chicken across it! It was in my way!

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Ah yes, Von Karma. He knows there's weaknesses in his witness' testimony but rather than even attempt to play along with proper procedure he attempts to bulldoze through everything to get his verdict. Edgeworth might have been described as ruthless but he's nothing compared to Von Karma (as he warned.)

It's great :allears:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Elric posted:

It sure would be nice to have a witness who does not commit blatant perjury once.
It's often a side effect of the Prosecution coaching them. It's only perjury if the Defense witness does it :v:

Geizt posted:

Probably because she's literally the only witness we have, and it's obvious that she's slipping up and saying things that Von Karma doesn't want her saying.
There's a line about this actually. The witness thing, not the perjury.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Don't forget to add in Von Karma yelling at you to stop talking to the witness despite it being your job after every panel. That's part of the reason this case is so slow at least.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Hobgoblin2099 posted:

I replayed the original trilogy recently, and I was absolutely stumped on what to do when I got to Day 1 of the trial, because I wanted to bring up the number of gunshots and the other pictures, but no, we have to discredit Lotta as some kind of Gourdy hunter first.

One one hand it makes sense to discredit her in this way because Gourdy probably has something to do with this case, in addition to picking apart Von Karma's carefully constructed pile of lies.

On the other hand the main reason this is happening is for character development rather than actually solving the case and getting Edgeworth a not-guilty verdict.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Waffleman_ posted:

I have a feeling something's gonna smell in a bit.

Hopefully it will not just be Larry. Gotta get a Von Karma smoulder on so he can mess up properly.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

LordNagash posted:

Because as the game says, he may be easily intimidated and rather dim, but he always makes the right decision in the end.

He may also be getting sick of Von Karma pushing him around. He is the Judge after all, stop telling him what to do.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Especially when he makes a leap or two in his deductions and the player has to piece together how it happened to 'catch up with him.'

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
The prosecution REALLY hates losing.

Thus, she became a scapegoat.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
No one likes the scene leading up to this because of plot fiat, but that same plot fiat is what leads to this scene.

Should have watched what you said Von Karma!

Also poor Maya, still electrically charged from being tazed. She's a very good conductive medium it seems.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

HenryEx posted:

Remember, the proof needs to be in the Court Record for you to present it. :v:

This gets really annoying when I've figured out what happened and have a piece of evidence I think will prove it but the game is like 'woah slow down there son, your a crazy man.'
Which turns into showing a different bit of proof which leads to something being added to the court record, which I later show as proof... And then I'm allowed to present my first piece of evidence to solve the case :shepicide:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

C. Everett Koop posted:

Don't be ridiculous. von Karma is only a man, he can't cause an earthquake.

Now that loving :parrot: on the other hand, that's who we can't let off the hook.

Just check out that emote. Put enough :parrot: on something and eventually the earth had to move.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Ema Skye is great :allears:

Lana less so.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Tenebrais posted:

So I'm guessing it's that the pointy tip doesn't have any blood on it.

Kind of weird that neither the defendant nor the witness are cooperating with their lawyers.

That's actually kind of the point of this whole case, being something of a natural fallout once Von Karma got his comeuppance. It sort of shows the tight-knit relationship the Prosecution and Police had fraying at the edges.

Bonus: now Edgeworth gets to really shine since he's in a similar position to Phoenix for once.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Grizzwold posted:

Wait, does evidence law only apply to the prosecution or something? Or is that new and everyone just got fed up with Wright pulling that stunt in pretty much every case?

People have mentioned it being written after the fourth game but there's a bit of general continuity within this one: Edgeworth has been playing this pretty much by the book, which we can easily see as a consequence of his own trial (and Von Karma's headbang from grace.)

If anything, him bringing up evidence law here is just making that extra blatant so that the player knows that Edgeworth isn't prosecuting to win the case, he's doing it to convict the guilty.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Gant's quite the character for sure.

Tons of surprises from his appearance, his frequent semi-awkward pauses to his jolly demeanor and frequent use of nicknames for everyone.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Zerbin7 posted:

That was painful. Edgeworth got reamed there. Lots of subtle stuff going on, too. This game is just as good as I remember.

It doesn't help that, as Chief of Police, he can pull rank on Edgeworth rather than the other way around :v:

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

Zerbin7 posted:

I agree that this case is one of the better ones, and a real treat later on. That said, Meekins is kinda... blah.
Meekin's is the low point in this case.

And it's 90% because of that freaking bull horn.

The rest is him tripping over himself way, way too much to be endearing/tolerable.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
That would just make him use his bullhorn more.

We must do everything we can to stop that.

EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.
Boy are his arms... Not tired? Good lord Meekins calm the heck down.

Strange that Gant would deliver a security tape to Meekins. One that had been mistakenly erased.

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EponymousMrYar
Jan 4, 2015

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy.

resurgam40 posted:

I don't get the hate either, but then again, I'm just reading, and I don't hear the feedback noise everyone's talking about. That would be proper annoying I imagine.

This is the real non-hyperbolic reason everyone hates Meekins. Everything else would be fine in a quirky weird witness but that noise is winceworthy.

If you still don't get the hate and have heard this noise, imagine someone getting stuck on this case and pressing him for more info where the feedback noise happens. Again. And again. And again. Buh-weeeeeeeen. Buh-weeeeeeeen.

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