Ultimate Mango posted:

Internal job changing is top of my mind.

I have a friend who is being approached for jobs in at least five departments where he works (he is a HiPo who is widely recognized and overdue for a promotion). Dude will do well by not saying much and getting competing offers.

I’m four months in at my company, have made it through a few rounds for an internal promotion, and just got a call from another VP basically offering me yet another different role. For the out of the blue opportunity, I did name a number, but did so knowing it would protect my current base and give me significantly more upside (otherwise they would have offered me a lateral with less base). For the other one, it would be a full level up with more everything. Even if I don’t get either of these, I still have a great job so my BATNA is solid.

Dumb Lowtax posted:

Xguard86 posted:

I've asked if I can cover anything further or revisit something before closing.

Not a Children posted:

On every renewal with proposed rent increase (typically 2.5-3%) at my current location I've asked my landlord if I could just keep the same rent by email. Every time they've relented, no fuss.

quote:

After reviewing the renewal offer, the proposed rent increase is higher than expected and more than we would prefer as continuous tenants. Is it possible there is any room for negotiation to lower the proposed rent increase, given our continued tenancy?

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

why would you do that, at minimum you should just say "I am interested in renewing my lease at the current rate"

PIZZA.BAT posted:

Well it's been over a year now on the hunt but it's finally come to an end. I was given an offer a few days ago for basically my dream job which came in well above what I would have accepted (BECAUSE I DIDN'T SAY A FUCKIN NUMBER THIS TIME). I countered anyways asking for an additional 7% on top just because why not? They came back a day later accepting my counter and I've just signed the paperwork. My new base salary is well above where my current base + bonus puts me and I get a fatter bonus than I currently get on top of it. To anyone who's still in the slog: it's a numbers game. You're going to face a lot of rejections or run into a lot of brick walls when you can't come to an agreement. Just shrug those off and keep looking. Your ideal position is out there somewhere and the only way you'll find it is if you keep grinding at it. Don't blink when their HR tries to harass you into accepting less than you know you're worth. It'll click eventually.

Thanatosian posted:

Just put in my notice. 60% salary increase, better time off, plus going from 3% matching on 6% contribution to retirement to 7% matching on 7% contribution, and when I told them I was leaving, even after I told them my new salary, my boss suggested they wanted to counter. Get loving paid. You're probably worth more than you think you are (I was hoping for a 35% increase while I was searching before I got my offers). Listen to the thread.

CornHolio posted:

Here's what the recruiter tells me

Absurd Alhazred posted:

Pandemic's not over yet so I'm not sure who in their right mind would be scheduling a face-to-face. Several states over, no less.

Not a Children posted:

Do you mean they retracted the offer when you tried to negotiate?

If that's the case, good riddance.

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

accounting is not consulting imo even though accounting firms put on airs these days

LochNessMonster posted:

Everything below senior is just making powerpoints with 20 other juniors

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

all consulting is bad

Parallelwoody posted:

make sure there's a clause in your offer that you'll be reimbursed x amount if they rescind it for reasons other than the basic contingencies like a drug test and BG check.

Good Parmesan posted:

For the job I've done 8 interviews, I told the head of HR that my number was $95,000 to their offer of $80,000.

HR spoke to the hiring manager and said that the number they crafted was what they thought was fair and equitable considering I had originally interviewed for another position and they were now considering me for the more senior position. He said originally they were thinking of offering me a smaller number.

They said the hiring manager was taken aback by my counter-offer and my delta. I said I was under the assumption that there was room for negotiation and I was qualified for the position and would merit the top of the range. HR said he will go back to the hiring manager.

Dwight Eisenhower posted:

re "Taken aback" chat: It's absolutely bullshit, it is manipulative bullshit, and you can reasonably expect to hear it when negotiating about employment. There's some domain of "good faith" negotiation where two parties are interested in economic activity and are trying to discover if there are terms that are in both parties' mutual self interest to agree upon. And this NEVER. loving. HAPPENS. Everywhere else is combination of that, deception, obfuscation and emotional manipulation.

The correct response was demonstrated, which is to shrug and stick to your guns. Grats goon!

Dongsturm posted:

I'm getting really annoyed by companies trying to lie about overtime and other conditions when I interview.

I ask "how much overtime is there?", and instead of a number I hear some dribble about how they are revolutionising the industry and how that's not possible 9-5 and yeah get hosed I'm not falling for that poo poo again.

what do they think is going to happen? I take the job and suddenly realise that I actually love unpaid overtime? in reality, I'm going to quit after two months when I realise the conditions aren't temporary. the company loses money, i lose time, everyone is unhappy.

maybe it's like spam mails where they are accidentally filtering for people naive or desperate enough to believe a ridiculous story, and wasting everyone else's time.

cunts

Omne posted:

Update: Managed to negotiate both more options and a higher salary. So now the increase in salary is greater than the salary at my first job, which feels pretty good.

Now time to actually sign this thing

LochNessMonster posted:

Deflect salary talk until the last session. Keep saying you first want to see if it’s a match and can only judge compensation based on the total package.

If they keep insisting ask them what the range is for the position. Remember that you don’t have to disclose your current salary. If they push for that info tell them you’re looking to get compensated for the role you are interviewing for, not the role you currently have.

Biodome posted:

Update on this:

I responded back with Eric the Mauve's message. Recruiter responded by saying that he'll have to run it by my hiring manager and his manager but he didn't think anything would change. I told him give it a shot.

They replied with this:

Same base
Same RSU
Same Bonus
+ Added a $10K signing bonus
+ Added $50K annual RSU refresher

That's a win for me! Always negotiate.

Thanks y'all.

Pillowpants posted:

It’s official: I did not get the job I was offered due to the bankruptcy on my credit check

Head Bee Guy posted:

So I'm in a unique employment situation. While collecting unemployment checks, I've been working part-time as a personal assistant to an Italian college professor for about 8 months--mostly looking after her NYC property while she's abroad, getting her mail, and dealing with a few sensitive situations. She's also a close personal friend of my partner (which is how I got the job), and they have an almost familial relationship. A few months ago, her son offered me some consulting work, which I haven't done before (I have a small background in media, but I only graduated college a few years ago). In the past couple months, I've done a lot of powerpoint work on freelance consulting projects he's taken on, and after proving my worth, he offered me a role as an "operations manager" for his consulting start-up. So far, I've set up a project tracking system, a payroll and invoicing system, and I'll be streamlingling workflow, outsourcing grunt work, and generally handing day-to-day matters. I'm the only other full-time employee, and he's said that a lot of the company's success relies on the work I'd do.

Additionally, he also offered an expanded property manager role at the house i've been looking after (the place needs a number of renovations, so I'll be coordinating with contractors, doing diy projects, airbnbing it, and getting it ready to sell in a couple years). My boss also expressed wanting me to live there, or at least be there frequently, to handle these various tasks. In addition to those two positions, he will also tap me for various projects on another start-up he has in the reinsurance field and for other freelance consulting projects he takes on. So this is like 3.5 jobs, and I've been working a lot of 8-10 hour days. Perhaps the best way to describe the whole package of work is being his "right hand man."

The initial offer he verbally showed me was a w2 salary of 52k a year for the property management role and 3k a month for the ops manager role. That seemed great to me, but I later realized I had miscalculated, because he wants to charge me rent to fill out the rent roll--which would be at a market rate of 3800 a month (even though the apartment is not market-ready). I thought he would pay me an additional 3800 a month, on top of the annual 52k & monthly 3k, to pay back in rent, but he later clarified that the salary is there to cover the rent. This would essentially wipe out the 52k salary, if not more (after tax, the salary is only 38k and the annual rent would be 45.6k), leaving me with a measly 3k a month before tax, which is about what I make on unemployment. I also already have an apartment in NYC and only pay 850 a month, so it's not like I'm hard up for housing or relocating from a different city; moving in would just make it a lot easier to put in sweat equity, be legally compliant with airbnb regulations, and catch contractors if they show up early or late.

So now I need to negotiate my way out of this poo poo offering and into the money. He knows my unemployment runs out next month and that I don't really have something else lined up. However, I don't think he has anyone else lined up for these jobs, and it would be a pain in the rear end to fill both. And because of my connection to his family, I don't think he wants to gently caress me, but he's a business man, so he obviously doesn't want to pay more than he has to. How can I best describe my value-add to get my price up? How can I best express that paying me well (something in the 60-80k range, although obviously I wont mention a "range") ensures my proactivity and dedication to these projects? Besides what's in the OP, any other tips on negotiating this?

Hadlock posted:

This whole rental thing seems like a (probably technically legal) pass through business tax write off/business loss tax churn scheme designed to greatly reduce their taxable income and effectively giving you a tiny cut of the proceeds

asur posted:

I think the advice of not accepting a counter offer is overstated in some aspects.

Head Bee Guy posted:

Hey thread, I posted here about a month ago seeking guidance on a convoluted offer I got to do operations at a boutique strategy consulting startup as well as managing a property.

Part of that initial offer was to pay me a salary that I would then pay back as rent to establish a rent roll on this property, but we’ve scrapped that as part of the initial employment offer. We are going to figure out that rent roll scheme somewhere down the line, but for now, we worked out a simple employment contract, and it’s a bit better than that initial deal. I’m kinda proud of myself for flipping the housing-as-compensation offer on its head—establishing that it’s not actually a valuable proposition to me—and I ended up getting a higher base rate out of it.

When it came down to brass tacks and my boss asked how much I wanted to make in a year, I threw out 65k, which is about 15k more than my last job. After deliberating for a few days, he countered with a starting salary of 48k a year (plus health care and a 401k), but I’d be on a fast track to 65k in about six months after I hit a few key milestones, and I’d be on track to make ~88k after about a year and a half (but i’m not counting those chickens). He argued that I don’t have the skills and experience yet to be autonomous enough to justify 65k (he’s right, this if my first time working in both of these fields, and I haven’t worked much since graduating with a liberal arts degree a few years ago). So I agreed to it.

Now I know a promise of future raises isn’t worth much, but I basically don’t have a BATNA (unemployment would have run out this week, and I stoped studying Javascript a few months to focus on this work), and the milestones are pretty concrete and attainable. Also Ive gotten the sense over the past few weeks that he’s legitimately invested in training me up to those higher levels, so I don’t get the sense that I’m being used as cheap, disposable labor.

Anyway, thanks for helping me work through this and for providing strategic tips in the actual conversation. I certainly would have said a few things I shouldn’t have had I not read the thread.

Vegetable posted:

I just got a FAANG offer. The recruiter told me the offer over the phone and said "I'll send you some material, take a look at it!" No deadline was set.

What's the etiquette in this sort of situation? I'm hoping to drag it out a bit so my other offers have time to come in. Am thinking I'll reply them only end of next Monday with some clarification questions, ask to schedule time with a team member to ask more questions about job scope (which they offered), etc.

priznat posted:

Just put in my notice (3 wks in this case), and don’t feel great about it. My manager and team were good just the new opportunity is really interesting and pays way way (almost 3x) more. I am constantly on the panic edge of trying to go back on everything because the status quo was boring but comfortable. But I gotta see this through!

a dingus posted:

It's happening friends, I have 2 offers I am very excited. Its way more stressful thinking about the offer yourself. I feel like I would be able to answer this easily if it were someone else. So here it goes:

Company A: 140k T/C. 130k base + 9k bonus (7%) w/ 5k sign on. Bank based in NC. Cool team & manager. WLB seems good too.
Company B: 140k T/C 140k base w/ 3000 stock options... so probably worth nothing? 10 y/o "startup" based in Jersey City. The team seemed cool but I am really not interested in working for a startup.

Company X: $85 hr contract converting to ~150k in 5-6 months. I turned them down because the place sounded awful from glassdoor/indeed etc and I don't want a contract role, but I am including this as a data point.

I told Company B that I had an offer from Company A but not the specifics. It just so happens that they offered pretty much the same thing as their "best offer". Company A does not know about Company B (yet). How do I put them against each other when the offers are so similar? Obviously the higher base is nice but Company A has better 401k & benefits.

Company A is on levels.fyi for the same level role accepted in September for $161k. The "sign now" number in my head was $165k. Should I just give them my "sign now" number? Or do I share the details of the other offer? I would much rather work for Company A and would be pretty happy with 150k+. Or is even that too low? Too much to think about and second guessing myself.

This will be a 40% raise for me either way, so I am doing well! 3 YOE software engineer in a medium/high COL area and both roles are remote. I really killed both interviews & both teams really liked me.

DTaeKim posted:

Does anyone have information on negotiating in the health care industry?

I applied for an oncology pharmacist position and received an email asking for an interview the following day. I anticipated a screening interview and ended up on my back foot when they asked my experience, salary expectations, and potential starting date.

I KNOW I handicapped myself by providing a salary range, but I did NOT provide them my previous salary. The range I gave them included a minimum $15K pay increase from my previous position.

From a quick google search, it looks like I would be asking for absolute top line pay, around $140K to $150K. However, I really don't know what my position makes nationwide. Should I just start at $150K and see where the hospital system blinks?

air- posted:

Offer was rescinded in response to my counter offer

Lockback posted:

"What do you mean, he didn't take the job? A firm handshake and our family values should be enough for anybody. No one wants to do an honest days work anymore. Call him back, I am not taking no for an answer!" Poor recruiter. Mario-sized bullet dodged.

Dik Hz posted:

Also, they seem to indicate that one reason they're reluctant to pay $Market is because a higher-up is underpaid and they don't want to pay this role more than that higher-up.

Dik Hz posted:

CEO came back with +1 week instead of my proposed +2 weeks and I accepted.

To recap: After resisting the external recruiter trying to anchor me at market -25%, I negotiated for market, got countered at market -$15k, recountered at market -$8k + 2 weeks, accepted market -$8k + 1 week.

Bennies are really good, though and there is a clear career trajectory.

Overall, kinda miffed by the process but I'm happy to take the offer. The red flags y'all spotted are noted, though. I'm going to put this one in the win column.