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SedanChair posted:I was at a good training about developmental trauma today and the presenter referenced the "Circle of Security" (excuse the comic sans, we don't know how to be professional in this business): There's probably a joke about the black kid in a SedanChair graphic being sent out by white hands, but it's just not coming together. 
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Mar 24, 2016 05:10
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Popular Thug Drink posted:the most common cause of parental neglect ending in a child's death is drowning, btw GWBBQ fucked around with this message at 05:35 on Mar 24, 2016 |
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Mar 24, 2016 05:33
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It's easy as gently caress to drown. Even as an adult, and a strong swimmer, I would have serious reservations about swimming alone with no one watching. Of course, when adults do it it's not "supervision" so much as just not swimming alone. Likewise, if you have a few 11-year-olds who are strong swimmers and an adult is still somewhat nearby, I don't imagine you have to watch them like a hawk. I think, in general, people are confusing the need or utility of having adults nearby, or having people watching in a passive sense, with constantly having a guardian actually actively watching the kid. Maybe it's a function of our increasingly isolated suburban communities where it's normal to have areas, during the day, where no adult is likely to look at.
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Mar 24, 2016 05:50
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DeusExMachinima posted:I seriously can't imagine sending a 2 or 3 y.o. to a weekend camp, but by the time they're in primary school? Hell yeah I did sleepovers then.
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Mar 24, 2016 08:08
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I'm overly protective of my children only because I was given so much freedom as a child. I do my best to give them freedom but I try to keep them close enough that I can see them. Reason being: In 3rd grade, we lived in Cedar Square West in Minneapolis (most commonly known as the Crack Stacks). I was allowed to run completely free without even telling my parents where I was going. Sometimes we'd ride our bikes miles away. I got my rear end kicked many times, including a beat-down where the kid wouldn't stop kicking me in the face and chest. Some girls pulled him off me and I was able to run. I was chased at a full run by a man that clearly intended to murder me in broad daylight. He chased me for about a block, all the way to the apartment building. He was screaming "What time is it!?" repeatedly. I only didn't get caught because I'd stuck a rock in the back door of the apartment complex so I wouldn't have to use a key. When crossing under the I94 bridge, I met a man yelling to himself "Fuckin' Bitch, gonna fuckin' kill her" over and over. I just kept my head down and kept walking. These are only a few of my many, many, tales of 3rd-5th grade living in the projects. Now, I recognize that this experience made me a better person, however, I could have been killed or taken on many occasions. Every time I think back on those days, I remember another thing that seemed mundane at the time but, in retrospect was horrifying for a parent.
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Mar 24, 2016 09:32
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A Buttery Pastry posted:It builds character. GO DO SOMETHING YOU HATE For another point of anecdata I grew up in a sheltered college town suburb in a subdivision full of people just like my lily white family, I was outside the vast majority of the time from 5 to 10 years old with no supervision and only nebulous deadlines. Home before dark, unless it's winter in which case home at dinner. When I moved to a more urban dying steel town at age 11, my parents kept me and my younger sister closer to home. Parents' fears will be founded on their prevailing exposure and their "feel" like they are the only people who would care for their kids. More insular communities, socioeconomic divides and media fearmongering in the last 30 years probably pushed my folks into being more paranoid. The community interaction and engagement piece of this discussion I feel like would go a LONG way towards providing good solutions for play and socialization outside of the schoolroom setting. I don't know if it's just because I try to be aware generally, but I passively try to keep an eye out (in East Harlem) for random kids as I go about my day. Not in an active sense of like, supervising them, but I find myself occasionally double-taking or crossing streets deliberately if something seems "wrong".
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Mar 24, 2016 21:09
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mostlygray posted:These are only a few of my many, many, tales of 3rd-5th grade living in the projects.
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Mar 24, 2016 23:02
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Seems like with today's technology you should be able to give your kid even more autonomy, honestly. You can buy a cheap, practically disposable cell phone at Best Buy for what, twenty, fifteen dollars? Program your phone numbers in there, hand it to your kid, and you don't even have to go out to the front lawn to yell for them to come in for supper. That's not even getting into the possibilities of GPS. As long as you're not calling them every twenty minutes they can still have that freedom to wander while also still being able to call for help if some lunatic's stalking them or if Timmy fell down the loving well again.
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Mar 24, 2016 23:54
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The ghetto is perfectly safe unless you are in the drug trade or at risk for trafficking. Sure there is the occasional random stray bullet but it's not like you're safer from that in your house, unless you sleep in a lead bathtub.
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Mar 25, 2016 01:51
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I live in a fairly dense urban neighborhood and my local streets and businesses are full of unsupervised kids all the time. One of the reasons I'm raising a kid here is so one day I can send her out the door with a bike and a few bucks and let her do her thing all day and let me finally watch some goddamn basketball. Hell, my wife and I already let our baby play with minimal supervision. It drives my mom and sister batshit during family get-togethers, because they are both massive helicopter parents. My sister basically controls her kid like a marionette.
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Mar 25, 2016 03:15
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I have to wonder how much this issue ties in with how competitive and public "best" parenting practices have become. I wonder if there is a sense of peer pressure going on, perhaps a fear of being seen as "not caring enough about your child's safety" or something like that. Do the parents in this thread ever feel peer pressure like that from the other parents you interact with? Any admonishment for letting your kids do things they wouldn't consider letting their own children do?
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Mar 25, 2016 03:48
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Solkanar512 posted:I have to wonder how much this issue ties in with how competitive and public "best" parenting practices have become. I wonder if there is a sense of peer pressure going on, perhaps a fear of being seen as "not caring enough about your child's safety" or something like that. And really I probably don't get as much of it as my wife, expectations being generally lower for dads and all.
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Mar 25, 2016 04:26
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I think mass media has made parents more aware of the dangers around them then they were in the 80's. Any time a (white) child is raped and murdered, it's national news for weeks. The internet gives us maps of convicted sex offenders (even as awful as that system is) surrounding our homes. The 80's had the nightly local news, which correlates with even more supervision than their parents gave. Don't talk to strangers was a big thing growing up. I don't know what I'm going to do. I'm an anxious wreck in the best of times, and the idea of my son out alone in the neighborhood at age 6 just fills me with thoughts of John Wayne Gacy or Russian sex slavers. What are the laws about kindergartners carrying tazers again? That was a joke...mostly.
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Mar 25, 2016 05:49
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Solkanar512 posted:Do the parents in this thread ever feel peer pressure like that from the other parents you interact with? Any admonishment for letting your kids do things they wouldn't consider letting their own children do? i try to surround myself with chill parents but Parent Shaming is totally a thing. when you have a kid it's a gigantic shift in your life - it's not like you're personally all that different, but suddenly every decision you make has the rider attached but what about my child? man i'd love to go out drinking today and watching football, but what about my child? my furniture is pretty ratty, i guess i could afford to get a new couch and table but what about my child? it introduces a large amount of low level anxiety into your life and if you can't handle it then one popular way to vent is by criticizing how other people raise their kids like you're the expert and parenthood isn't a massively common life goal. people strut around like they're the Worlds Best Parent, mostly because it's easier to front and tear down other parents than face and deal with the existential horror of parenthood in a mature way i even feel it myself from time to time - the other day during a playdate my friends were letting their toddler just smear his dinner into the carpet and i'm all in my head ugh its good to let a baby make a mess but gee whiz take it down a notch, stop that baby but that's me personally being lazy and i hate to clean up messes so i prevent my kid from making messes which are tough to clean up. tear up paper all day long that's fine but if you start rubbing pasta sauce into the rug we have a problem, because daddy hates scrubbing pasta sauce out of the rug. that's just me though, maybe they have a rug shampooer i dont know. i kept my mouth shut parenting has a lot of bonuses, though - my daughter has discovered recently how to cover her face and initiate a game of peekaboo, and if i ask her for a kiss she head boops me like a cat. i'm just trying to keep in mind that there is a greater benefit from being supportive and free ranging and letting her discover the joy of life on her own terms, versus being scared and protective and warning her of all the consequences of her actions boner confessor fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Mar 25, 2016 |
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Mar 25, 2016 05:55
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Spending a lot of time growing up in Singapore, my weekdays were pretty much filled with school, sleep and training. But on the weekends, even at age 11-12, my parents were happy to let me bike with my friend all the way down the east coast, or take a cab into town to play at the arcades at Suntec. That particular country is very safe though.
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Mar 25, 2016 13:54
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If your child is going to be assaulted, it's almost def. by someone you trusted and let into their lives. Just teach them to stay away from the road and they'll be fine.
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Mar 25, 2016 15:25
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the person who designed this may have early stage mental illness
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Mar 25, 2016 15:26
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who is to blame, is the trigger warning liberal millennial young parents who are afraid of literally everything? or is it the very real threat of pedophiles lurking behind every tree and bush and window, watching your kids play and enjoying it in quite the wrong way
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Mar 25, 2016 16:04
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Solkanar512 posted:I have to wonder how much this issue ties in with how competitive and public "best" parenting practices have become. I wonder if there is a sense of peer pressure going on, perhaps a fear of being seen as "not caring enough about your child's safety" or something like that. Yes. My friends all have books to recommend me, my parents and siblings are quite free with their unwanted advice, etc, etc. it affects my wife, because she cares what other people think. I give zero fucks about what people think of me or about anything else for that matter, and I definitely don't give a poo poo about how other people raise their kids, as long as they aren't bothering me about my parenting. Last week, my wife, daughter, and I were at an indoor playground. My daughter plopped herself onto a large beanbag chair, and moments later another kid did a flying elbow drop onto the beabag from a fairly high nearby structure. He missed my daughter, and neither I nor my wife reacted. A different parent, not even the Macho Man kid's parent, scooped my daughter up and fiercely remonstrated the elbow dropping kid. At that point I walked over and asked her to "relax."
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Mar 25, 2016 16:21
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Popular Thug Drink posted:
It's times like that when I start hearing my Grandfather (and my own father) grouching in my head. Both of them were very strict, but loving. I just twitch a bit while waiting for their parents intervene. Though my nephews have come to realize "you I can punish." (Stern, guilt inducing lectures and time outs naturally.)
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Mar 25, 2016 18:21
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terrorist ambulance posted:Just teach them to stay away from the road and they'll be fine.
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Mar 25, 2016 20:40
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Yeah that's clearly what I meant good for you to notice
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Mar 25, 2016 21:52
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So your post was intentionally dumb? Got it.
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Mar 25, 2016 22:05
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Roaming free or not, your children will probably grow up to spend a lot of time getting stuffed in toilets just like their pedant sperg father, so I wouldn't spend as much time worrying about it as you apparently do
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Mar 25, 2016 22:09
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It's not pedantry to point out that "staying away from the road" is basically impossible unless the kids only venture into the woods through a path in your backyard or something. Lots of pedestrians are killed even in the crosswalk when they have the right of way, and kids are more vulnerable to this than adults because they're smaller and thus less visible. While being kidnapped by random strangers is extremely rare, being hit by a car is not. Just last year I got hit by a car twice while biking, one of those times with my son, with both times the driver being obviously at fault.
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Mar 25, 2016 22:33
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yes so teaching your kids to not play or spend a lot of time on / around the road and when they do be careful because they could be mowed down would be a good idea which is what I said unless you're pedantic and take an absurdly narrow interpretation of "stay away from roads" to mean literally "do not go on a road ever stay on this block" Cicero posted:
this is exactly what my first post said.
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Mar 25, 2016 23:15
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lol, so the sum total of your point was, "parents, tell your kids NOT to play in the middle of the road"? Thanks for the brilliant advice, chief, we could use some real brains like yours around here Not to mention that the statement is still stupid and wrong, kids won't necessarily be "just fine" if they don't play in the street, for the very reasons I just pointed out, numbnuts. quote:this is exactly what my first post said. Cicero fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Mar 25, 2016 |
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Mar 25, 2016 23:19
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are you in a delerium or something. see if your handler can sprinkle some cool water on your fevered angry broken-brained brow (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 26, 2016 00:31
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This thread is going places. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Mar 26, 2016 00:40
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Ok, let's move on from the hopelessly dense.Grand Theft Autobot posted:Yes. My friends all have books to recommend me, my parents and siblings are quite free with their unwanted advice, etc, etc. it affects my wife, because she cares what other people think. I give zero fucks about what people think of me or about anything else for that matter, and I definitely don't give a poo poo about how other people raise their kids, as long as they aren't bothering me about my parenting. quote:Last week, my wife, daughter, and I were at an indoor playground. My daughter plopped herself onto a large beanbag chair, and moments later another kid did a flying elbow drop onto the beabag from a fairly high nearby structure. He missed my daughter, and neither I nor my wife reacted. A different parent, not even the Macho Man kid's parent, scooped my daughter up and fiercely remonstrated the elbow dropping kid. At that point I walked over and asked her to "relax."
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Mar 26, 2016 00:48
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Cicero posted:Yeah, I have mixed feelings about how much I should guide or control my kid in public. Like, ideally I think I wouldn't intervene if he or some other kid was being a dick and throwing around sand or pushing, because kids can figure that out on their own as the natural consequences of "the other kids don't want to play with me" come around. But, if I am right there watching him, then not intervening looks like implicit approval, which is obviously not the message I want to send. Yeah a lot of parents struggle with this. Inconsistency of discipline (be it permissive or harsh) has got to be the #1 method for turning your kid into a jerk.
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Mar 26, 2016 01:08
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DeusExMachinima posted:TBH OP children should never be let out alone until college age because any independence before that may teach them not to be respectful non-counterrevolutionary wards of the state. This sentence is heinous. Rewrite it for the sake of us all.
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Mar 27, 2016 01:55
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The government and courts usually stay out of this sort of thing, but the British Columbia Supreme Court recently made a ruling that an 8 year old child was too young to stay at home by themselves regardless of how mature they were. This is a troubling potential precedent for people in commonwealth countries that would be ok with leaving their kid by themselves. I think one of the biggest issues here is that by embracing car oriented design, we've created shockingly dangerous spaces. I know that in Europe there are elementary schools and neighbourhoods where they have tried to reduce the interactions between children and cars by distancing those areas from roads and trying to connect them in other ways. From my understanding you'd park a distance away and walk the last bit. Even better the child could ride their bike along a protected bike lane the entire way and never experience any interactions with automobile traffic. I read in an article in Monocle (not on the internet) that in Japan apparently children walk and take the train to school from a super young age. It appears at a glance that they're walking by themselves, but in actuality they're closely watched by a host of train station managers, shop keepers and volunteers along the route to school. If a child isn't noticed people are quickly informed. Additionally children have little alarms on their bags that they can use if something bad happens. I really like the idea of young children being able to have the chance to be independent and walk to school but at the moment most NA towns are not able to do this. We need to dramatically redesign our towns to make them safer for young children. Femtosecond fucked around with this message at 04:02 on Mar 27, 2016 |
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Mar 27, 2016 03:58
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SedanChair posted:Yeah a lot of parents struggle with this. Inconsistency of discipline (be it permissive or harsh) has got to be the #1 method for turning your kid into a jerk. Because it's hard to the point of being physically exhausting, at least some days. I've had good luck with explaining the expectations before the situation and then do exactly what was discussed. We are going to do X, if you do Y then Z will happen so please don't do Y. But then they do something totally new that surprises you and you can never go back to that restaurant again.
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Mar 27, 2016 04:12
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Femtosecond posted:The government and courts usually stay out of this sort of thing, but the British Columbia Supreme Court recently made a ruling that an 8 year old child was too young to stay at home by themselves regardless of how mature they were. This is a troubling potential precedent for people in commonwealth countries that would be ok with leaving their kid by themselves. Congratulations, we will forever be coddled millenials with absolutely no intuitive risk assessment skills running around like headless chickens in a permanent panic.
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Mar 27, 2016 09:59
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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Femtosecond posted:The government and courts usually stay out of this sort of thing, but the British Columbia Supreme Court recently made a ruling that an 8 year old child was too young to stay at home by themselves regardless of how mature they were. This is a troubling potential precedent for people in commonwealth countries that would be ok with leaving their kid by themselves. There's two points in this post I'd like to address: 1) I don't think letting an 8-year-old stay home alone is the same thing as letting children play without direct supervision. When they are at home alone, there is no one even watching them incidentally, whereas if they're outside playing, other people will occasionally see them and probably notice if something goes seriously wrong. I would say that having two 8-year-olds staying home, unsupervised, would probably be much safer. I take issue with the court making such a definitive pronouncement, but I don't think it's the same thing as saying 8-year-olds shouldn't play unsupervised. 2) I don't think cars are the huge danger in and of themselves. I've lived in downtown areas now for a decade, and there's always a lot of cars. Numbers that just can't be put onto suburban streets, since a lot of these downtown streets have 3, 4 or even 5 lanes. However, there are also a lot of pedestrians. Pretty much every single intersection is controlled by a signal or at least a 4-way stop, by simple necessity. Things are extremely well lit at all hours. As a result, I feel fairly safe as a pedestrian. This is not the case in suburban areas. Crosswalks and intersections are frequently not controlled by a signal, visibility can be poorer due to developers' obsessions with pointless curves in the road, there aren't as many pedestrians around, and often the lighting is not at all good at night. Areas near schools are especially bad because, in the absence of signals, drivers will make very marginal and therefore dangerous choices to get through an intersection, lest they be stuck waiting for the never-ending trickle of people with right-of-way crossing the street. Combine this with inadequate drop-off locations for parents who drive their kids, and the resulting mess of U-turns and other bizarre nonsense they do as a result, and you end up with a safety nightmare you'd never, ever see in a denser, urban area with proper traffic control.
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Mar 27, 2016 16:56
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Femtosecond posted:I read in an article in Monocle (not on the internet) that in Japan apparently children walk and take the train to school from a super young age. It appears at a glance that they're walking by themselves, but in actuality they're closely watched by a host of train station managers, shop keepers and volunteers along the route to school. If a child isn't noticed people are quickly informed. Additionally children have little alarms on their bags that they can use if something bad happens. yeah there's even a show called like My First Errand where they send incapably young children on missions to buy poo poo from stores in the neighborhood and film the usually hilarious outcome https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e5k5XTZy0rA
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Mar 27, 2016 17:16
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