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I've just got to post in here that Soul Calibur VI is going to rule! Even though it has it's own thread. Also King of Fighters 99 (Evolution on Dreamcast) is my favorite fighting game. These are my thoughts.
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Oct 13, 2018 07:11
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| # ? Apr 24, 2024 14:58 |
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FEXL's on sale for the weekend: https://twitter.com/FightingExLayer/status/1050617837155282944
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Oct 13, 2018 08:30
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Chev posted:Basically mindgames are absent, because there's no mind to fight against, only shadows. 
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Oct 13, 2018 09:58
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So, uh, is every move in T7 inherently stance based? Aside from the obvious thing that running completely changes the buttons, It took me a full day to figure out that "df2" aka "3B" is completely different when executed as "B while holding 3" vs "tap 3+B at the same frame from neutral", because they're different moves when executed from a standing vs a crouching state. And the notation even has an explicit "while standing" qualifier but nobody ever seems to bother using it consistently. Also there's the weird overload of "down", where holding it is ducking, but tapping it is a sidestep. Does the game give you a few frames of crouch state before transitioning into the sidestep state once it receives the KEY_UP event? And then switch into the side-walking state once it receives another press afterwards? 8 has a similar behavior, but tapping 9 is always a hop, except tapping 7 is neither a jump or a sidestep, and jumping backwards needs a hold. This isn't me complaining, more wondering if long time players actually think that stuff is intuitive? Because none of the "beginner" or "essentials" tutorials even bothered to mention any of it, and that poo poo's genuinely more arcane than 95% of the stuff i've seen people mock Dota for, or the myriad of systems ASW piles on in their games. And that's not even going into the high/low crush vs moving hitboxes distinction or "special mids". RoadCrewWorker fucked around with this message at 10:16 on Oct 13, 2018 |
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Oct 13, 2018 10:02
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RoadCrewWorker posted:So, uh, is every move in T7 inherently stance based? Aside from the obvious thing that running completely changes the buttons, It took me a full day to figure out that "df2" aka "3B" is completely different when executed as "B while holding 3" vs "tap 3+B at the same frame from neutral", because they're different moves when executed from a standing vs a crouching state. And the notation even has an explicit "while standing" qualifier but nobody ever seems to bother using it consistently. Also there's the weird overload of "down", where holding it is ducking, but tapping it is a sidestep. Does the game give you a few frames of crouch state before transitioning into the sidestep state once it receives the KEY_UP event? And then switch into the side-walking state once it receives another press afterwards? 8 has a similar behavior, but tapping 9 is always a hop, except tapping 7 is neither a jump or a sidestep, and jumping backwards needs a hold. Standing, full crouch and while standing (aka while rising in other 3d fighters) are all different states with different movesets, as is running, crouch dash and various character specific stances.
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Oct 13, 2018 10:25
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https://twitter.com/MarnORZ/status/1051031761319284737
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Oct 13, 2018 11:32
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RoadCrewWorker posted:So, uh, is every move in T7 inherently stance based? Aside from the obvious thing that running completely changes the buttons, It took me a full day to figure out that "df2" aka "3B" is completely different when executed as "B while holding 3" vs "tap 3+B at the same frame from neutral", because they're different moves when executed from a standing vs a crouching state. And the notation even has an explicit "while standing" qualifier but nobody ever seems to bother using it consistently. Also there's the weird overload of "down", where holding it is ducking, but tapping it is a sidestep. Does the game give you a few frames of crouch state before transitioning into the sidestep state once it receives the KEY_UP event? And then switch into the side-walking state once it receives another press afterwards? 8 has a similar behavior, but tapping 9 is always a hop, except tapping 7 is neither a jump or a sidestep, and jumping backwards needs a hold. When looking at a movelist or combo notation for Tekken the inputs are tap direction + button (black arrow means hold). Holding d, df, or db will put you in a full crouch like any other fighting game. Tapping down or up makes you sidestep. Double tapping and holding down or up makes you sidewalk. There are no crouching frames for side steps. While standing (or while rising) means the transition from crouched to standing. So to execute say, a WS4, you're going to hit 4 during the animation from crouching to standing up. Basically crouch, release, 4. It takes some practice. Some people like to use quarter circle movements from crouching, or something like D,DB,netural+4 to get it out more consistently. I would say stop thinking in keypad notation since you have a whole other plane of movement to think about now. The advice when just starting out that helped me immensely is work on the very basics first (movement and punishes). Learning a combo or two helps, but you can win entire sets without ever throwing out a full combo. Also you'll lose a lot, especially if you're not used to 3D fighters. Please feel free to ask questions in the discord. There's players of all levels there and we're always willing to answer stuff. Also; https://drunkardshade.com/2017/05/27/tekken-7-top-15-moves-for-all-characters/ Some of the frame data might be out of date, but it's still a good general guideline on what's the best moves for characters. You're not gonna use most of the moves in those long rear end movelists in game. Romes128 fucked around with this message at 11:54 on Oct 13, 2018 |
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Oct 13, 2018 11:49
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I have high hopes
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Oct 13, 2018 12:17
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If we can't get CvS3, let's at least have Terry and Mai as guest characters. Honorary Street Fighters.
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Oct 13, 2018 12:39
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Arzachel posted:Standing, full crouch and while standing (aka while rising in other 3d fighters) are all different states with different movesets, as is running, crouch dash and various character specific stances. Romes128 posted:The advice when just starting out that helped me immensely is work on the very basics first (movement and punishes). Learning a combo or two helps, but you can win entire sets without ever throwing out a full combo. Also you'll lose a lot, especially if you're not used to 3D fighters For what it's worth the input timings and buffer lengths seem much more forgiving compared to the games i've played so far - if you're in the right stance that is - although some of the cancel timings are frustratingly obscure.
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Oct 13, 2018 13:22
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My Lei Wulong is a disaster but I guess I have to grind it out since I paid money for this loving guy. It feels like everything he does has 7,000 frames of start up, and because at the lower ranks guys are CONSTANTLY hitting buttons I get the sense that it's oddly harder than when the other player respects you. Because I get somewhere when I just block and punish but that's missing the entire point of Lei, I might as well go back to Law if I'm going to do that. I'm solid as Law but he's so boring so I'm constantly on a quest to find someone else and it's invariably a disaster. Ugh man.
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Oct 13, 2018 16:40
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Every character has to block and punish, every player has to learn how to deal with bad players that just hit buttons forever. It has nothing to do with what character you pick, but sticking with one or two means that when you get to a point where you're fighting smarter people you'll have already internalized your punishes and you can focus more on using your character's unique stuff to get ahead.
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Oct 13, 2018 18:13
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RoadCrewWorker posted:So, uh, is every move in T7 inherently stance based? Aside from the obvious thing that running completely changes the buttons, It took me a full day to figure out that "df2" aka "3B" is completely different when executed as "B while holding 3" vs "tap 3+B at the same frame from neutral", because they're different moves when executed from a standing vs a crouching state. And the notation even has an explicit "while standing" qualifier but nobody ever seems to bother using it consistently. Also there's the weird overload of "down", where holding it is ducking, but tapping it is a sidestep. Does the game give you a few frames of crouch state before transitioning into the sidestep state once it receives the KEY_UP event? And then switch into the side-walking state once it receives another press afterwards? 8 has a similar behavior, but tapping 9 is always a hop, except tapping 7 is neither a jump or a sidestep, and jumping backwards needs a hold. 1) In Tekken, "while standing" actually means "while rising from a crouch", not "while you are standing around". It's like this because the WR abbreviation is used for "while running", so WS is while standing. 2) So all characters have three basic stances: standing, crouching, and while standing (i.e. rising from a crouch). It's important to learn the WS moves for your character, because one of them will be a quick hitting mid, and another will be a launcher, and you need to know those as punishes, but also so that you don't do the wrong one at the wrong time. 3) You basically have the down inputs correct. Inputting down, neutral quickly will get you a sidestep, but just holding down will get you a crouch. If you hold straight down (2), the game doesn't consider you crouching for 6 (I think) frames, so you won't get the crouch state before your sidestep. However if you hit down/back (1), you will be able to block low instantly. You just don't gain the actual crouch state instantly.
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Oct 13, 2018 18:23
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im seeing everyone from Max to that dipshit smash bros leaker claiming it's a real thing coming next year. it's horseshit
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Oct 13, 2018 18:44
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DLC Inc posted:im seeing everyone from Max to that dipshit smash bros leaker claiming it's a real thing coming next year. it's horseshit I hope it's real and they make everyone pay for it again
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Oct 13, 2018 18:54
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Lynx Winters posted:Every character has to block and punish, every player has to learn how to deal with bad players that just hit buttons forever. It has nothing to do with what character you pick, but sticking with one or two means that when you get to a point where you're fighting smarter people you'll have already internalized your punishes and you can focus more on using your character's unique stuff to get ahead. I'm aware. All I'm saying is Lei isn't a poking/counter-hit/rushdown character and it's a tough transition from Law who is 100% that.
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Oct 13, 2018 19:08
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Considering it's been almost 12 hours since this...
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Oct 13, 2018 19:18
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RoadCrewWorker posted:So, uh, is every move in T7 inherently stance based? Aside from the obvious thing that running completely changes the buttons, It took me a full day to figure out that "df2" aka "3B" is completely different when executed as "B while holding 3" vs "tap 3+B at the same frame from neutral", because they're different moves when executed from a standing vs a crouching state. And the notation even has an explicit "while standing" qualifier but nobody ever seems to bother using it consistently. Also there's the weird overload of "down", where holding it is ducking, but tapping it is a sidestep. Does the game give you a few frames of crouch state before transitioning into the sidestep state once it receives the KEY_UP event? And then switch into the side-walking state once it receives another press afterwards? 8 has a similar behavior, but tapping 9 is always a hop, except tapping 7 is neither a jump or a sidestep, and jumping backwards needs a hold. who's d/f2 are you talking about here? generally they can be performed standing with just a 3 input. it sounds like you're talking about a FC (full crouch) d/f2 which is usually listed as such
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Oct 13, 2018 19:22
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the only game i can think of that sucked hard at first and did the rebuild/rebrand thing successfully was FFXIV.
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Oct 13, 2018 19:25
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Nostalgia4Butts posted:the only game i can think of that sucked hard at first and did the rebuild/rebrand thing successfully was FFXIV. if this counts, super sf2 tanked the franchise and they mostly fixed it with st. gg#reload red tanked hard and they quickly released gg#reload blue to fix it. mvc3 got umvc3 update like 8 months after release too
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Oct 13, 2018 19:49
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I don't think MvC3 Vanilla was a flop, though. Ultimate was just Capcom realizing they hosed up and forgot to put Phoenix Wright in, so they had to fix it.
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Oct 13, 2018 19:51
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There was also the story about how the earthquake totally disrupted the planned support cycle and they put all their existing work into the Ultimate bundle and had to move on. But I've never known where that came from so I'm just furthering the cycle of half spoken truths
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Oct 13, 2018 19:57
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wow Marn was talking out of his rear end who'd have thought
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Oct 13, 2018 19:59
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What message has his leg left for us
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Oct 13, 2018 20:07
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Poniard posted:What message has his leg left for us To take showers frequently.
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Oct 13, 2018 20:10
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Nostalgia4Butts posted:the only game i can think of that sucked hard at first and did the rebuild/rebrand thing successfully was FFXIV. Diablo 3 had a catastrophic launch but stuck around to be a mostly well-liked game it looks like?
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Oct 13, 2018 20:13
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mycot posted:Diablo 3 had a catastrophic launch but stuck around to be a mostly well-liked game it looks like? they removed the cash auction house and rebalanced inferno
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Oct 13, 2018 20:16
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In Training posted:There was also the story about how the earthquake totally disrupted the planned support cycle and they put all their existing work into the Ultimate bundle and had to move on. But I've never known where that came from so I'm just furthering the cycle of half spoken truths thats what literally happened with ffxiv they took it down for a year or so after the quake and totally changed the game to be not poo poo, did a wow cataclysm event to explain it all and worked hardcore on it since
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Oct 13, 2018 21:18
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In Training posted:There was also the story about how the earthquake totally disrupted the planned support cycle and they put all their existing work into the Ultimate bundle and had to move on. But I've never known where that came from so I'm just furthering the cycle of half spoken truths It's much more likely considering what was going on at the time that Capcom had to put Ultimate out in that timeframe because the end of 2011 is likely when Capcom lost the Marvel licence- Disney was aggressively not renewing even sales licences for any Marvel properties at the time, which is why existing games like MvC2 PS3/X360 started vanishing, in order to start developing Marvel-themed titles in-house. That said, even if Capcom explained that, which they probably legally couldn't, that still wouldn't mollify a playbase who's $60 purchase was obsoleted in ten months, even if UMvC3 was priced to move. It probably should have been pushed as an update like the later versions of SF4 were (and this might be the reason why SF4 Arcade Edition and Ultra were downloadable updates) but hindsight and time constraints and the earthquake and possibly even licencing agreements all might have gotten tangled in.
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Oct 13, 2018 22:17
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Nostalgia4Butts posted:the only game i can think of that sucked hard at first and did the rebuild/rebrand thing successfully was FFXIV. Rainbow Six Siege made an enormous turn-around from it's launch, The Division did pretty well too, For Honor managed to undo a lot of it's ills, Ubisoft games somewhat in general have been getting in on that.
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Oct 13, 2018 22:21
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teh_Broseph posted:
Oh god no. I’d rather just set up a series of mirrors around the house to see the computer monitor from the living room.
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Oct 13, 2018 22:42
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Lynx Winters posted:Every character has to block and punish, every player has to learn how to deal with bad players that just hit buttons forever. Law buttons are usually fast enough to out scrub the scrubs Yardbomb posted:Rainbow Six Siege made an enormous turn-around from it's launch, The Division did pretty well too, For Honor managed to undo a lot of it's ills, Ubisoft games somewhat in general have been getting in on that. Ubisoft games sell more than 200k copies unlike mahvel
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Oct 13, 2018 23:02
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Real hurthling! posted:Law buttons are usually fast enough to out scrub the scrubs But the thing I miss most is not having t-rex arms on my jabs 
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Oct 13, 2018 23:12
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wow, marn banned from evo for that tweet. incredible.
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Oct 13, 2018 23:23
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Yardbomb posted:Rainbow Six Siege made an enormous turn-around from it's launch, The Division did pretty well too, For Honor managed to undo a lot of it's ills, Ubisoft games somewhat in general have been getting in on that. I think the most miraculous turn-around was CS:GO, people loving hated it at launch.
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Oct 13, 2018 23:26
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anime was right posted:wow, marn banned from evo for that tweet. incredible. Please dont be joking, this would be cool.
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Oct 13, 2018 23:28
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In Training posted:Please dont be joking, this would be cool. seriously this would be the feel good story we need after infiltration
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Oct 14, 2018 00:48
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im joking
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Oct 14, 2018 01:19
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you’re banned from evo for that
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Oct 14, 2018 01:22
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| # ? Apr 24, 2024 14:58 |
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Son of a bitch
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Oct 14, 2018 01:29
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