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votefinder
Jul 6, 2010

scoop scoop


Votecount for Day 5



Not Voting (6): CapitalistPig, CCKeane, kaschei, Kumbamontu, Murmur Twin, tpink

With 6 alive, it's 4 votes to lynch. The current deadline is May 02nd, 2016 at 10 p.m. EDT -- that's in about 2 days, 9 hours.

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kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



Any news tpink

tpink
Feb 18, 2013



Melman

Kumbamontu posted:

You have very few potential targets left and no one is above suspicion

Well played, Kumba.

I investigated Kumba and he came back scum. Good night.

##vote Kumbamontu

CapitalistPig
Nov 3, 2005

You turn the corner and see a greenskinned fuckmidget.
Roll for initiative.

tpink posted:

Well played, Kumba.

I investigated Kumba and he came back scum. Good night.

##vote Kumbamontu

I was already thinking he was scum from the way he voted toward the end of yesterday. With the whole deadline exchange and I got a strong feeling he was bussing with his vote.

##vote kumba

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



CapitalistPig posted:

I was already thinking he was scum from the way he voted toward the end of yesterday. With the whole deadline exchange and I got a strong feeling he was bussing with his vote.

##vote kumba

I was over 75% on you being gf from your sudden switch

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



Is there really no godfather? My calculator must be broken

tpink
Feb 18, 2013



Melman

kaschei posted:

Is there really no godfather? My calculator must be broken

You want to throw in a vote, given that we have confirmed scum?

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



Or is that just what you want us to think???

I'm willing to have everyone check in first at least

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



Kumba did ecco ever mention how exactly I was disrespectful in the scum doc

kumba
Nov 8, 2003

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!

enjoy the ride


Lipstick Apathy

CapitalistPig posted:

I was already thinking he was scum from the way he voted toward the end of yesterday. With the whole deadline exchange and I got a strong feeling he was bussing with his vote.

##vote kumba

You make less than 0 sense as I already explained

I am not scum. Your results are being hosed with. I am currently at a wedding and will be unable to post until tomorrow evening and I would appreciate not being hammered before then but do what you want

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I'm here and would vote but will also let people check in and say things. I do think it's possible that there are 4 scum , since right now we have:

SCUM: Mason, Bulletproof*, (probably another Mason?) vs.
TOWN: Cop, Backup Cop, Doctor, Mason

*(essentially a Goon unless there's some way for scum to get shot that I'm missing?)

I don't ever run games so my ideas on balance might be off but right now it feels to me like if there were 3 scum, town would win that game every time. Also I feel like four scum might explain their willingness to try the Infinitum gambit - I'd bet that Kumba was supposed to help sell it but they were foiled by Keane's dedication to town

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


The only other thing I can think of, which seems like a huge stretch, is that "Scum Bulletproof" is a joke role where the punchline is that there's no way for scum to get shot. And then the way to balance that would be to give town such a role, which could be "Town Backup Cop" in a game where there's no cop. In that scenario tpink is the last scum.

But there's really no need to worry about that unless Kumba flips town, and reading over his history (he dismisses my case on Ecco but jumps right about the case on Revolver), I really don't think he's going to.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Having thought it through I don't see any reason to delay it, there's no way anyone other than Kumba is the right lynch. ##vote Kumbamontu

CapitalistPig
Nov 3, 2005

You turn the corner and see a greenskinned fuckmidget.
Roll for initiative.

Kumbamontu posted:

You make less than 0 sense as I already explained

I am not scum. Your results are being hosed with. I am currently at a wedding and will be unable to post until tomorrow evening and I would appreciate not being hammered before then but do what you want

lol whatever.

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply



I wouldn't buy kumba as mafia. Kum a could be SK I guess, though.

CapitalistPig
Nov 3, 2005

You turn the corner and see a greenskinned fuckmidget.
Roll for initiative.

CCKeane posted:

I wouldn't buy kumba as mafia. Kum a could be SK I guess, though.

Why?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

I wouldn't buy kumba as mafia. Kum a could be SK I guess, though.

He would have to be the world's least successful SK given the lack of secondary kills on the night. What makes you think he's not scum?

Kumbamontu posted:

I just reread the whole game and didnt get much. I agree MMT's posts seem fake. Her initial vote on Ecco for instance reads as a big overreaction to what was a list of early D1 reads that didn't need any more substantiation. I'm also having trouble making sense of how, after all of the back and forth, MMT ends up with a "null-lean-scum" read on Ecco. Reads as overly hedged after that long confrontation.

Between posts like this and a cop investigation on him I find it to be kind of open-and-close.

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply




I guess mostly because being masons with two mafia would be pretty out there. I'd buy a mafia, town, 3p group though.

For what its worth, KK died after I speculated that he was cop.

That said, if it wasn't for the investigation, I wouldn't be looking at kumba at all so.

tpink
Feb 18, 2013



Melman

CCKeane posted:

I wouldn't buy kumba as mafia. Kum a could be SK I guess, though.

I'm just reporting the investigation results.

CapitalistPig
Nov 3, 2005

You turn the corner and see a greenskinned fuckmidget.
Roll for initiative.

CCkeane, if there is another scum besides kumba. It is probably you.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

I guess mostly because being masons with two mafia would be pretty out there. I'd buy a mafia, town, 3p group though.

For what its worth, KK died after I speculated that he was cop.

That said, if it wasn't for the investigation, I wouldn't be looking at kumba at all so.

So who do you think is scum?

tpink
Feb 18, 2013



Melman

CapitalistPig posted:

CCkeane, if there is another scum besides kumba. It is probably you.

Yeah my entire assumption behind thinking CCKeane was town was the mason thing. But with this defense of kumba now I dunno.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


If we lynch Kumba and he flips town, I'd be shocked. It would either mean that tpink is lying, or that scum has a framer. If scum had a framer, it would have to be either me or Keane unless we're thinking there's a Framer/Godfather combo role.

If we lynch Kumba and he flips scum but the game doesn't end, I would guess that there's 4 scum and Keane is the godfather.

If we lynch Kumba and he flips scum and there were only three scum, :

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



##vote kumbamontu

votefinder
Jul 6, 2010

scoop scoop


Good riddance, Kumbamontu!

Max
Nov 30, 2002





Kumba, How To Succeed in Business Without Really Trying, Scum Mason has been CANCELED on Day 5.

All of the scum have been eliminated, TOWN WINS

Setup:

13 players

3 Mafia
1x Scum Traitor. Bulletproof. Knows who the other two scum are, cannot communicate with them.

2x Scum Masons. Bulletproof. Each has a Night Kill. DO NOT know who the other scum are.

(In the event that one of the masons die, the remaining two scum will be linked up.)

10 Town
1x Cop
1x Back-up Cop
1x Doctor
1x Unconfirmed Mason
6x Vanilla

So, scum had a hard go of it. The main mechanic of the scum team being split up didnít really come into play past day 1. You can look at the mason doc, but Infinitum actually had a kind of good idea in the way he claimed, he just chose the complete wrong time to do so. I believe his idea was to word his claim in a way to let the other scum know that he was definitely scum, as he figured there had to be at least one more in the masonry. Kumba would have caught on to it. If they had done this during the night phase, they could have coordinated at that point and just killed Keane (unless he got doc protected that night.) So really, that was always a gamble.

Kumba, you will notice, did not really bring any of this up to Ecco when they got together. Especially the bit about not knowing who the other scum were. I think they could have eventually constructed an argument to lunch Keane, had they put that together, given the wording of Infinitumís claim. But really, there wasnít much to do after they lost the second NK except hope they kill the cop. They were doing fairly well until the mass claim, honestly. Hitting only uninvestigated Vanilla players didnít help.

This was literally carbon copied from a setup Token Female ran 8 years ago, which had a similar situation happen where one of the scum masons died on D1, however scum won out in the end by nailing the cop. I suppose weíll never see how that plays out the way it was intended. You can see it here: http://forums.somethingawful.com/sh...hreadid=3025691

Iím sure Tokes has more to say, so Iíll leave my piece at that. Thanks for playing!



Here is a link to the various docs:

Scum Doc
Mason Doc
Setup / Night Action Doc
Flavor Doc

Max fucked around with this message at Apr 30, 2016 around 23:08

CapitalistPig
Nov 3, 2005

You turn the corner and see a greenskinned fuckmidget.
Roll for initiative.

Thanks! This was fun.

Town was OP though.

kumba
Nov 8, 2003

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!

enjoy the ride


Lipstick Apathy

I think a framer or a roleblock on the scum team would work, but as it is the setup explicitly requires the cop to be dead by n3 at the absolute latest to have a chance since he can clear so many people

I had fun anyway though! Sorry for being scum Keane, your songs of love for me are still meaningful

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Good game all! It seems like scum had a pretty high hill to climb once D2 came around. Apologies to anyone if I came off as overaggressive

EccoRaven posted:

she's really ot but I can't write why because my hands are hurting.

please at least use my flip to figure out the game when I'm gone

Feel better and good luck with the bar!

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Haha at no point did naive cop even pop into my head as possibilities, oops.

CCKeane
Jan 28, 2008

my shit posts don't die, they multiply



Yeah, scum had a hard time of it.

You were a good mason buddy Kumba, sorry it didn't work out.

Juchero
Feb 15, 2008


Wedge Regret

That was a fun game guys, was watching on the sidelines and hoping you'd nail the scum.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Kumbamontu posted:

I think a framer or a roleblock on the scum team would work, but as it is the setup explicitly requires the cop to be dead by n3 at the absolute latest to have a chance since he can clear so many people

I had fun anyway though! Sorry for being scum Keane, your songs of love for me are still meaningful

Ecco suggested also moving the lost kill onto the traitor, which I think is a good way to handle the setup and keep the rest of the roles the same. I still wish we could have seen two night kills at the same time.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Oh, last funny story:

Tokes and I had a long conversation about how Ecco really couldn't play in this game, as they would break it due to their participation in the last version of this setup (assuming they remember a mini from 8 years ago.) Essentially, Ecco got the one role that would''t break anything. We knew that the moment they signed up, since we had randomized the roles to the musicals before opening the thread.

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



I can't tell if ecco was serious at all about me

In any case good luck with your rebar

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



wrt the setup it is very swingy based on when the double NK dies. Even if it's balanced overall the early days are more important than the later ones, which is the opposite of what I'd want in a mafia game.

kaschei
Oct 25, 2005



Kumbamontu posted:

I think a framer or a roleblock on the scum team would work, but as it is the setup explicitly requires the cop to be dead by n3 at the absolute latest to have a chance since he can clear so many people

I had fun anyway though! Sorry for being scum Keane, your songs of love for me are still meaningful
well that or you need to have been killing the cop's targets, but usually the cop targets suspicious people while mafia target people they don't think look suspicious.

The Ninth Layer
Jun 19, 2007



Yeah this setup seems really dependent on whether the scum can take out the two cops early or not. Definitely a setup where whoever gets ahead in the first few days will probably stay ahead from momentum.

Scum would have been better off with a godfather over one of the BPs imo.

Infinitum
Jul 30, 2004

!!President of the Rarity Fanclub!!


College Slice

Max posted:

So, scum had a hard go of it. The main mechanic of the scum team being split up didnít really come into play past day 1. You can look at the mason doc, but Infinitum actually had a kind of good idea in the way he claimed, he just chose the complete wrong time to do so. I believe his idea was to word his claim in a way to let the other scum know that he was definitely scum, as he figured there had to be at least one more in the masonry. Kumba would have caught on to it. If they had done this during the night phase, they could have coordinated at that point and just killed Keane (unless he got doc protected that night.) So really, that was always a gamble.

I loving knew there had to be another scum in that doc.



My bad for posting my role pm as well, I think I was out that day and just couldn't be arsed rephrasing it at the time.
As you said I picked the wrong time to run that play, but I'll know better for next time.

I'd have gotten away with it, if it weren't for you pesty modkills

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Token Female
Apr 2, 2007

If I hear the music...


The Ninth Layer posted:

Yeah this setup seems really dependent on whether the scum can take out the two cops early or not. Definitely a setup where whoever gets ahead in the first few days will probably stay ahead from momentum.

Scum would have been better off with a godfather over one of the BPs imo.

I think that's a very good point, since the cop and back up cop are there to find the two mason scum, since I think most would assume that the second mason scum would be town after the first one flips. The second cop is probably not needed.

It might be interesting to turn the roleblocker into a godfather to add more possibilities that the scum can kill each other as well. Though that continues to make the game very swingy for the town.

Max posted:

Ecco suggested also moving the lost kill onto the traitor, which I think is a good way to handle the setup and keep the rest of the roles the same. I still wish we could have seen two night kills at the same time.

I think this could have worked.

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