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Zzulu
May 15, 2009

(▰˘v˘▰)
at dawn i turn into a man again

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Frosted Flake
Sep 13, 2011

Semper Shitpost Ubique

Trans-Disabled people present at Disability conferences here now so, I don't know what the gently caress.

e: these are the same people that famously banned yoga for the disabled. There is also a push to include transwomen in stuff around the March For Life (Abortion stuff) they went around checking signs before the counter-protest to make sure they weren't gendered. See, not all women have a uterus, or can actually get pregnant so its transphobic to focus on the reproductive rights of cis women during an abortion protest.

My thinking is that this attitude of "accept everything no matter what and never, ever question lived experience" means that everybody in these academic/activist circles is so terrified of being called a bigot nobody is willing to pump the brakes.

Frosted Flake fucked around with this message at 13:18 on May 14, 2016

Elusif
Jun 9, 2008

Trump can and will slam on the brakes. Trump for Commander of Bus Drivers 2016.

Zzulu
May 15, 2009

(▰˘v˘▰)
where we're going, we won't need brakes

Dreddout
Oct 1, 2015

You must stay drunk on writing so reality cannot destroy you.

Putty posted:

i think you misunderstand

I think you misunderstand!

Donkey
Apr 22, 2003


Moridin920 posted:

im too lit to read any of the rest but bro who the gently caress in high school actually gets naked in a locker room?

When I was in high school gym class, at least, people would be naked when changing into bathing suits or showering during the 3-4 week swimming unit. I don't know if that's still the case or if schools have installed any kind of modesty partitions or anything else that would prevent that issue since then though. If so, that might be a moot point. There are still a lot of naked people in non- school gyms, yoga center locker rooms, etc.

I guess another interesting question that might come from that is whether it's fine for a transgender man to wear a men's bathing suit if he still has female secondary sex characteristics (boobs). I know there have been legal challenges that have determined that it's ok for women to choose to be topless in any situation when men can be, so even if you think a transgender man is really a woman it shouldn't be a problem, but I still imagine most conservatives would pitch a fit if they ever heard about it happening.

8-Bit Scholar
Jan 23, 2016

by FactsAreUseless

Donkey posted:

The third issue I'm having trouble understanding is that the Justice Department has apparently mandated that insurance companies provide care for conditions which it's biologically impossible for a transgendered person to contract (e.g. a trans-woman contracting ovarian cancer even though she has never had ovaries). Though I'm sure the insurance companies won't have too much of a problem collecting money to cover a condition they'll never have to pay out for, this seems a little ridiculous.

I'm so loving glad the Justice Department is spending time and taxpayer dollars making ineffectual gestures of good wills to transgendered people instead of doing something useful, like making good on the administration's promise to put the war on drugs to bed or address prison overpopulation or, gently caress, anything else..

Are insurance companies just raking in extra cash from trans people then?

SurfaceDetail
Feb 17, 2016

by Cowcaster
those things sound hard and the last several years have been about securing Obama''s legacy

Donkey
Apr 22, 2003


I was wrong about the Justice Department insurance thing. That was actually the Health and Human Services dept. Justice is just doing the bathroom access stuff. The article I linked did give "vaginal reconstruction" as an example health procedure (in addition to ovarian cancer), and that could apply if the trans woman has had vaginal construction surgery in the first place, so maybe there is some merit to it. It still seems silly to cover the impossible-to-get stuff, but maybe men's/women's health insurance coverage is bundled together. I wonder if the trans person would have to pay extra to have both categories insured, though.

Agent Escalus
Oct 5, 2002

"I couldn't stop saying aloud how miscast Jim Carrey was!"

Frosted Flake posted:


My thinking is that this attitude of "accept everything no matter what and never, ever question lived experience" means that everybody in these academic/activist circles is so terrified of being called a bigot nobody is willing to pump the brakes.

Sounds about right. And you just know the paedophiles will be out demanding theirs next.

Age of consent laws? "OPPRESSIVE BIGOTRY!!!!"

GORILLA BASTARD
Jun 20, 2005

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
Guess she couldn't find a date dressed up this way either.

Brannock
Feb 9, 2006

by exmarx
Fallen Rib

Frosted Flake posted:

Trans-Disabled people present at Disability conferences here now so, I don't know what the gently caress.

As an actual physically disabled person it's infuriating seeing these idiots show up

Fire Barrel
Mar 28, 2010

Brannock posted:

As an actual physically disabled person it's infuriating seeing these idiots show up

Surely no one takes them seriously, right?

The Kingfish
Oct 21, 2015


Immortan posted:

I see this a lot whats the context

Its fishmech

Microwaves Mom
Nov 8, 2015

by zen death robot

E Equals MC Hammer posted:

Trump can and will slam on the brakes. Trump for Commander of Bus Drivers 2016.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Agent Escalus posted:

Y'know what's also becoming a thing among the progressive-to-a-fault? "Ableism." As in, it's wrong to call someone stupid or crazy. Like, "hate speech" wrong.

The pushback on this stuff better be amazing otherwise it won't have been worth having heard it in the first place.

see. as a physical disabled person, i hate that poo poo. you can't speak for me assholes. yeah i have issues, like most side walks being lovely for people with mobilty issues or fucksticks who steal handicap spots or the fact that many handicap entrances are lovely. but these progressive-to-a-fault clown fucks dont care about that. they care about some crazy bitch who is "transabled" or that someone said cripple in a movie. they dont want to solve real issues, that would be hard and cost daddies money.

this fetid oval office here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xujgH_C2q8 always enrages me.

Brannock posted:

As an actual physically disabled person it's infuriating seeing these idiots show up

amen friend. these people are honest to god scum. i dont care what "mental disibilty" they have, it doesnt stop them from being cunts. all these gently caress sticks want the perks of being a cripple but none of the downsides. gently caress em.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Donkey posted:

I need some help, you guys. I've always considered myself pretty progressive, but I'm having trouble understanding four specific parts of transgender acceptance.

First, even though I don't have any problem with letting transgendered people use the restrooms of their choice, I'm having trouble justifying support for allowing them to use locker rooms that don't match their genitalia configuration. It seems like we, as a society, still have a cross-gender nudity taboo, and I'm not sure how that squares with forcing schools to require that adolescents shower or change with other kids who have a different biological gender (I know that "biological gender" is sometimes considered hate speech now, and I apologize, but there's no real term in English anymore for that concept).

Second, I'm not sure if it's a good idea to advocate gender reassignment surgery, for this reason: if someone was suffering from body dysphoria instead of gender dysphoria, I don't think I would support allowing them to blind themselves or have a limb amputated so they would match their mental self-image.

The third issue I'm having trouble understanding is that the Justice Department has apparently mandated that insurance companies provide care for conditions which it's biologically impossible for a transgendered person to contract (e.g. a trans-woman contracting ovarian cancer even though she has never had ovaries). Though I'm sure the insurance companies won't have too much of a problem collecting money to cover a condition they'll never have to pay out for, this seems a little ridiculous.

My final concern is that I haven't been able to identify any case in which gender is a useful social construct at all. Biological sex seemed to have some utility (i.e. your doctor wouldn't mistakenly diagnose you with testicular cancer if you were born as a woman... though this may not be true anymore, as per item 3). However, at this point it doesn't really seem necessary for anyone to give any credence to anyone else assuming the societal trappings or roles of whichever gender they choose. In addition, the lack of a categorical taxonomy for gender renders all but the most trivial genders incomprehensible (see this article, "squiggly" http://www.npr.org/sections/alltechconsidered/2014/12/04/368441691/sapiosexual-seeks-same-a-new-lexicon-enters-online-dating-mainstream).

I know that writing this will identify me a bigot, as per Justice Department guidelines, but I've always tries to look at social issues logically and some of these things don't make sense to me. Is this just a symptom of becoming more conservative as I get older, as people claim happens to everyone? Do I have to vote for Donald Trump now? I've been pretty disconcerted to find out that the people who agree with this position write for Breitbart and The Daily Beast, since most of the things they write are usually wrong and evil. For some reason, I am sure that this GBS thread about noted celebrity Caitlyn Jenner can help me discover the answers to these questions.

I don't disagree with you. i know several transpeople who just went through it all and are happy. it seems to me like all the loud ones like jenner, wu, stephoknee and ton more just attention whores with other mental issues. Honestly i dont know how i honestly feel about anything anymore. so i am in the same boat as you. I assume alot of thise poo poo will settle out once the tumblr/twitter left grows up, but who knows.

spacetoaster
Feb 10, 2014

Agent Escalus posted:

Age of consent laws? "OPPRESSIVE BIGOTRY!!!!"

There are some gay rights groups, and activists, already working on this.

http://bigthink.com/dangerous-ideas/13-let-kids-have-sex

EGALE (Equality for Gays and Lesbians Everywhere) is trying to lower the age of consent specifically for anal sex.

Etc, etc.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Frosted Flake posted:

Trans-Disabled people present at Disability conferences here now so, I don't know what the gently caress.

e: these are the same people that famously banned yoga for the disabled. There is also a push to include transwomen in stuff around the March For Life (Abortion stuff) they went around checking signs before the counter-protest to make sure they weren't gendered. See, not all women have a uterus, or can actually get pregnant so its transphobic to focus on the reproductive rights of cis women during an abortion protest.

My thinking is that this attitude of "accept everything no matter what and never, ever question lived experience" means that everybody in these academic/activist circles is so terrified of being called a bigot nobody is willing to pump the brakes.

because the social left doesnt really have many fights left, the once they do have(cop and african americans, all the lovely anti-abortion laws, the "religious freedom" laws) are a long and hard fight and these people dont like that. so the twitter/tumblr left would rather focus on ideological purity and going full retard thought police on each other. pick on easy targets instead of hard ones. be paternalistic hipster pricks who hate and "critique" everything. all that bullshit. eventualy that poo poo will blow up in their faces. the pendulum is already being pushed right ward sadly :(

Brannock
Feb 9, 2006

by exmarx
Fallen Rib

Dapper_Swindler posted:

this fetid oval office here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xujgH_C2q8 always enrages me.

2:18 right there is a perfect encapsulation of the decline of Western civilization

Fire Barrel posted:

Surely no one takes them seriously, right?

It really depends on individual temperament and how thoroughly they've been conditioned and browbeaten into being tolerant and accepting

Most people will just nod and smile and thank them for their support

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

spacetoaster posted:

There are some gay rights groups, and activists, already working on this.

http://bigthink.com/dangerous-ideas/13-let-kids-have-sex

EGALE (Equality for Gays and Lesbians Everywhere) is trying to lower the age of consent specifically for anal sex.

Etc, etc.

i mean. if its 2 teenagers loving around, fine. but this comes off as creepy as gently caress.

then again salon made these.

http://www.salon.com/2015/09/21/im_a_pedophile_but_not_a_monster/

http://www.salon.com/2015/09/30/im_a_pedophile_youre_the_monsters_my_week_inside_the_vile_right_wing_hate_machine/

I am one of those people who is fine with pedos or at least child molesters being "removed" from society. so i guess i am a bigot now.

Nooner
Mar 26, 2011

AN A+ OPSTER (:
but for real why is he supposed to pose naked on SI cover, who in the loving world wants to see that?

Fire Barrel
Mar 28, 2010

Dapper_Swindler posted:

because the social left doesnt really have many fights left, the once they do have(cop and african americans, all the lovely anti-abortion laws, the "religious freedom" laws) are a long and hard fight and these people dont like that. so the twitter/tumblr left would rather focus on ideological purity and going full retard thought police on each other. pick on easy targets instead of hard ones. be paternalistic hipster pricks who hate and "critique" everything. all that bullshit. eventualy that poo poo will blow up in their faces. the pendulum is already being pushed right ward sadly :(

If the pendulum needs to move right for a correction, then it may be better to happen now than down the road. The "full retard thought police" component of the left is really disconcerting though and I've friends working in political organizations that don't know how to deal with them. It's a disappointing situation though and I'm glad I don't have to deal with some of the poo poo happening on campuses that some of my former colleagues have to deal with regularly.

spacetoaster
Feb 10, 2014

Dapper_Swindler posted:

i mean. if its 2 teenagers loving around, fine. but this comes off as creepy as gently caress.

They say things that make you think that, but when you read the law proposals that language is missing.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

spacetoaster posted:

They say things that make you think that, but when you read the law proposals that language is missing.

of course it is. there seems to be two types. the sex negatives who think all depiction of sexual stuff is sexist or bad or penurious. or the sex postives who range from,"cool do whatever you like its your body" to weird fucks who want every kink and fetish to be a sexuality.



Fire Barrel posted:

If the pendulum needs to move right for a correction, then it may be better to happen now than down the road. The "full retard thought police" component of the left is really disconcerting though and I've friends working in political organizations that don't know how to deal with them. It's a disappointing situation though and I'm glad I don't have to deal with some of the poo poo happening on campuses that some of my former colleagues have to deal with regularly.

pretty much.this poo poo comes in cycles. the world doesnt need more Jonathan McIntosh's or donald trumps/ ted cruzs. it needs smart people who dont think every hill is worth dying on and dont get asshurt over loving marvel movies and video games/books and think everything should be sophicticated "art" or on the right side, want to RIP and TEAR all the people they hate.

Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 20:14 on May 14, 2016

skeevy achievements
Feb 25, 2008

by merry exmarx

Microwaves Mom posted:

I thought there was a no takebacks policy?

I'd take Bruce Jenner back in a heartbeat, that guy was a fuckin stud, olympic decathlete and have you seen his daughters? jesus

in summation bruce even in caitlyn form is way too much man for DND so he/she has my full support

This Jacket Is Me
Jan 29, 2009
I had no idea who the guy was until all this poo poo happened. Do people really follow running and jumping or whatever he was good at? The only way I'd care about track & field is if some hot chick is doing it, and... wait a minute...

Soylent Yellow
Nov 5, 2010

yospos

Dapper_Swindler posted:

this fetid oval office here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xujgH_C2q8 always enrages me.


Once she gets the surgery (she won't), I wonder how long it will take for her to get fed up with the joys of using a wheelchair once she can no longer get up to take a poo poo.

Cartouche
Jan 4, 2011

boom boom boom posted:

Transgender issues are in the news a lot lately, and it can be very confusing, and a lot of people have some pretty strong emotions about it. I think having a thread for talking about trans stuff is a good thing

It could be titled something along the lines of: I have a serious mental illness that people are pandering to rather than getting me therapy.

boom boom boom
Jun 28, 2012

by Shine

Cartouche posted:

It could be titled something along the lines of: I have a serious mental illness that people are pandering to rather than getting me therapy.

I thought that transitioning was the best treatment we have for transgender people now?

Cartouche
Jan 4, 2011

boom boom boom posted:

I thought that transitioning was the best treatment we have for transgender people now?

Whats this "we" poo poo?

Blue Train
Jun 17, 2012

boom boom boom posted:

I thought that transitioning was the best treatment we have for transgender people now?

lobotomies were the best treatment for crazy not too long ago too

Cartouche
Jan 4, 2011

We should probably let all the killers out who were found to be mentally ill. I mean, those people have rights you know.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

Soylent Yellow posted:

Once she gets the surgery (she won't), I wonder how long it will take for her to get fed up with the joys of using a wheelchair once she can no longer get up to take a poo poo.

probably like less then a year. then she will kill herself and people will say its because of bigots and poo poo.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

boom boom boom posted:

I thought that transitioning was the best treatment we have for transgender people now?

I always thought it was case to case deal. I mean judging by some documentries i have seen it looks like some doctors over digonose kids as transgender but IDK. I think you should wait til your actually cognozent of feelings/mind and not just rush into stuff when they are kids. then again every trans person i know knew they were trans when they were little, so who knows.

unpacked robinhood
Feb 18, 2013

by Fluffdaddy

Dapper_Swindler posted:

this fetid oval office here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xujgH_C2q8 always enrages me.

She's "literally shaking" at 2:05 too

boom boom boom
Jun 28, 2012

by Shine

Dapper_Swindler posted:

I always thought it was case to case deal. I mean judging by some documentries i have seen it looks like some doctors over digonose kids as transgender but IDK. I think you should wait til your actually cognozent of feelings/mind and not just rush into stuff when they are kids. then again every trans person i know knew they were trans when they were little, so who knows.

Trans kids is a whole other can of worms. I mean properly diagnosed adult transgender people. For them, I thought transitioning is the only successful treatment available.

Dapper_Swindler
Feb 14, 2012

Im glad my instant dislike in you has been validated again and again.

boom boom boom posted:

Trans kids is a whole other can of worms. I mean properly diagnosed adult transgender people. For them, I thought transitioning is the only successful treatment available.

I have no idea, then. again its probaly case to case.

Nooner
Mar 26, 2011

AN A+ OPSTER (:

boom boom boom posted:

Trans kids is a whole other can of worms. I mean properly diagnosed adult transgender people. For them, I thought transitioning is the only successful treatment available.

im pretty sure shotgun/handgun to the dome is also a successful treatment that quite a few choose too. good enough for our troops than good enough for our trannies, amiright?

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Facebook Aunt
Oct 4, 2008

wiggle wiggle




spacetoaster posted:

I don't think they removed his. Also, I don't think they even remove it. They just invert it.

They do this:

https://gfycat.com/LightShinyBufeo

Yeah, there's no coming back from that.

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