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Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
i was intimidated by Decay's gimmick when i first unlocked it, but now that i've done a run in it i've noticed it's getting me more than four times the helium per hour that balance did, even without the challenge bonus.

it's nice to have a fast forward button to the new stuff at zone 60, but i'm now starting to acutely feel the effects of the agility cap and lack of build efficiency upgrades

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Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
Should I be going for golden helium or golden battle, early on? getting an extra zone cleared would be worth a lot more helium than the 1% bonus, but it's hard to tell if/when 3% attack and health would actually push me over the edge in that regard.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

serefin99 posted:

Anyone got any recommendations for idle games that AREN'T on Kongregate? The site runs like poo poo on my computer.

there's some idiotic adsense going on in the background which bogs everything down. kongregate started running a lot faster for me when i turned on ublock for it.

that being said if you really want to go straight to the source, Trimps is also hosted on github without any extra bells and whistles.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
shieldblock is quite good up to zone 50 or so. if you're really curious about when to stop using it, just take a look in your block stats every time you get a new gymystic and look for when shield starts being <5% of the total. once your prestige bonuses are high enough to reach that zone without farming maps, that's about when you're ready to move on

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

The Ninth Layer posted:

I liked Idle Mage Attack a lot, it's a fairly slow idler but the execution makes it interesting to watch and play out.

i like it more for my phone than realm grinder, which has to be left on for days on end to make good use of autocasting

i also genuinely appreciate that there's a ton of spells most of which are silly and essentially useless, because sometimes it's fun to have a bunch of stuff to choose from and play around with, even if they dont contribute to an optimal strategy

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

New Yorp New Yorp posted:

I've been playing Trimps for a while, and I'm just about to break the zone 180 barrier for the first time. I have about 50m helium.

What's my best course of action?
1) Keep running Nom for helium/hr (I get about 600-650k) until I can do #2 or #3 more easily
2) Push into Corruption for Masteries
3) Do a max-tox run and then spending my accrued 300ish bones. I have all the exotic imp-orts.
4) Do the Watch challenge that unlocks at 180?

Max tox, as my understanding goes, involves running the Toxicity challenge, but from every zone from 60 to challenge completion, letting Toxicity stack up to 1500 before finishing to get roughly double the helium, then tripling that when the challenge ends. This seems like it would take a few days -- I haven't done the math, but it would boost the portal value up to something around 6 million helium, and I'd be able to do it 3 (maybe 4) times for a pretty big boost.

you should be close to where toxicity is better he/hr than nom. certainly you're safe to do a full tox stacks run, although i wouldn't really recommend doing full stacks from zone sixty. you should have scientist 5 by now, and the scaling helium boost per zone means that early zones, even after broken planet, don't really matter that much. for my full tox run, i started into it in earnest around zone 100, and it was still a very large boost overall.

Watch doesn't have any benefits apart from helium, so if you can't handle the later zones quickly it won't be worth it. i ran tox for a fairly long amount of time and only switched to watch once i could clear it without any big farming interruptions.

the early masteries are almost completely irrelevant; you won't see any truly beneficial quality of life upgrades until the second tier, and that won't be accessible until you can reach zone 190-200 comfortably. if you want the novelty of getting one of the tier one masteries early, i would recommend doing the full tox run and burning all your bones first so you can enter corruption with all that extra helium and coordinated points.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

New Yorp New Yorp posted:

I just started using AutoTrimps a few days ago because I reached the point where I felt like I was making no progress on my own. Actually, on the subject, I see there are a number of presets for perk allocation, but no explanation of what the presets are, when they're appropriate, or what their goal is. Any advice on that front?
you can save specific perk arrangements with them. it's not really useful since there's only ever one optimal perk layout in most cases, but you might try it when you do a bunch of challenge squared runs that make specific perks useless.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
once you unlock the time machine you'll be able to get enough gold in a single run to trigger a special one-time boost to all adventure stats at the money pit. i dunno what the threshold is or if it's random whether or not it activates, but i think i got it around 7.5mil thrown in.

the boost is 10 power/toughness, 100 health, and 1 regen, which is more than enough to handle the forest if you have decent sewer equipment

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
is there something to be said for picking up a few attack/defense upgrades early in NGU to make the early phase of challenges faster? Once you can cap skills as they're unlocked it seems like there's no other way to speed up the pre augment and pre-time machine phases of a run.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Xyven posted:

Log without a number is the natural log like 99% of the time

that's abbreviated as ln(number) you dumb gently caress


e: sorry. heated math moment

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Lottery of Babylon posted:

For Trimps, how do you make further progress in Magma once you're Coordinated enough to buy all the Coordinations? I'm at Z400 and I can't imagine getting to Z500 just from pumping Power/Toughness II.

focus on getting experience for fluffy and pouring helium into looting 2. you can cumulatively increase the amount of helium you gain by at least 10% or so per run even when you aren't making much zone progress, as long as you keep increasing looting 2.

i haven't quite made it to the point of having to worry about this, but eventually you can do extended runs where you max out your magamamancer bonus each zone for the 4.5k% attack bonus to push a few more zones at the end.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
you have the stats to kill the first titan well before that point, but it takes more than an hour. unlock advanced training and put energy into power and toughness until you have around 40% bonus and you should be able to handily defeat the first titan as long as you fight it actively.

it’s worth doing this soon, since the GRB set is well ahead of HSB equipment and maxing a few of those items, even if theyre at level 0, will bring you to the point where you can idle the fight with no problem

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Agent355 posted:

I have just about 1000 attack/defense without advanced training. Tooltip on GRB is 1600 stats to kill em so that seems a bit out of range with the 40% bonus, unless the tooltip is inaccurate.

im pretty sure that’s enough? my recollection of that period is i could kill bosses through active play before i reached the recommended stat level, but idling took way, way, more than that. it’s worth a few tries to see how close you get, at least

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
i have an NGU request: when calculating exp from automatic titan kills, subtract one and leave the titans ready for combat so i can kill them for loot. i hardly ever get to kill GRB anymore, since i only check in a few times a day

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Kyrosiris posted:

Not offline. I believe they are asking "hey, subtract one from the number of kills when offline but make them spawned and ready to go when I log in".

aye, this is what i’m going for. it only takes 30 minutes or so to properly set up a new long run, so i’m not usually there for the first titan spawns, and then whenever i log on later to check in on things the timer on GRB is back up to 48 minutes again and it’s pointless to wait for it

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
you’re at a slow part. the secondary perks will eventually be your primary source of scaling, since their formula is less expensive than other helium options, but it’ll take some time to get them up and rolling. your priority now should be reaching 230 as soon as possible, since it provides a helium boost each run that will significantly help with moving into trimps’ endgame

edit: to beat your first spire faster, try the following
1: buy genetecists until you have a ten minute respawn time for the higher health
2: idle in maps overnight and use the extra money to buy equipment levels when youre out of prestiges
3: clear bionic wasteland maps until the next bionic wasteland is above level 200, and use that to farm prestiges for equipment you don’t technically have access to
4: respec out of helium gain and into carpentry/health/power (first spire clear has some special bonuses, so it’s worth doing this at least once but not more than that)

Venuz Patrol fucked around with this message at 18:29 on May 14, 2018

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Agent355 posted:

I hit 230 while afk so I didn't see what actually unlocked and I can't find any sort of permanent bonus on the wiki, what were you referring to?

I'll try the spire strat tonight and see how do.

every time you reach zone 230, you get a free two zones of helium under the helium formula for the new boss (which is something like 5x what it was previously). It should be a pretty decent portion of your total helium when you're just hitting it for the first time.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

baram. posted:

i want standalone ngu so i can get the heck away from kongregate. excited to get to beards once i can. . .

oh, same. i realize it severely complicates the IAP situation, but please take pity on my cpu and at least offer the option

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Numberwang posted:

NGU

Can someone explain the math behind the Beard permanent "ticks"?

I thought it was sqrt(level) * (1/3) * hours played

so it should be +1 at level 9, +2 at level 36, +3 at level 81, +4 at level 144

but I just checked and you get +1 at level 4, and +2 at level 20...

if it’s anything like exp calculations, it’ll round up to the next whole value, and then calculate growth from that value, meaning actual scaling ends up being considerably faster than the formula. at least, that’s the only guess i’ve got as to why 2% exp bonuses are so impactful

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
hyperspeed is the biggest speed boost, while blacksmithery significantly reduces the amount of micromanaging you have to do each run. headstart should be third regardless of which you pick first

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

Samuringa posted:

Trimps: I got 100 Bones so I was thinking of getting a couple of Exotic Imp-orts, I'm considering Venimp and Whipimp, would any of the others be a better choice?



first priority should be jestimp and chronoimp. the descriptions are a bit misleading, because the 45/5 second bonuses are multiplied by your looting modifiers from perks and other bonuses, which becomes drastically enormous as your helium count increases. Even early on (in zones 60-150, which I assume is around where you're at if you're only just getting your first imps), you should be getting several minutes of resource generation from the 45 second imp, and eventually that'll scale up to hours and days of resources from a single one. the imps that provide incremental upgrades are fine to get next, but they won't have the same immediate high impact.

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
the only change im really certain would make the game easier to balance is changing the respawn stat to respawn rate, such that +100% respawn rate = 50% respawn timer, +300% respawn rate = 25% respawn timer, and so on. that would let you start adding accessories with respawn stat allotments again without totally blowing up PP acquisition, and people will finally be able to ditch their staplers

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

New Yorp New Yorp posted:

Is there a calculator for NGU to tell you the relative value of putting XP into cap vs power? I don't want to build my own spreadsheet if someone else did the heavy lifting for me.

increasing your power by 10% has the same value as increasing your cap by 10%, so try to get your cap and power to the point where increasing either total by 10% would cost the same amount of exp. this generally means buying about 3.5 units of cap for each power upgrade you buy, in whatever magnitude you can currently afford

technically it's a little more complicated than this, since power and cap have a synergistic effect that probably makes it slightly more profitable to aim closer to equilibrium, but i'm pretty sure the approximation above is close enough that you don't need to worry about the exact math

Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011
the first no augs run is worth doing asap, but the rest are pretty low reward apart from the ap, so you might consider waiting until your NGUs are to the point where they only take 3-10 minutes to complete

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Venuz Patrol
Mar 27, 2011

HonorableTB posted:

Is there a new hotness to play that isn't NGU? I've been burned out on that for about a year and it's all this thread seems to talk about now, so anything new would be great! I tried Pepper and wasn't a big fan of that myself.

I prefer games that have a definite end point like Paperclips and Space Plan, if that helps.

perfect time to get back into trimps!!! woo!!!!

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