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Data Graham
Dec 28, 2009





NarkyBark posted:

After the town exploded I kinda wanted them to go back to showing meat baby, this time all cooked, or perhaps still being grilled.

How come nobody ever asks Cassidy how he got that way? I'd be so curious. Maybe they can make a story arc about that.

In the comics this happens a good way down the road. And it's both sad and hilarious.

I feel like it's one of those things the show will handle quite a bit differently, but I imagine they'll keep the feel of it intact.

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muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005



With the way the town destruction was handled I could see them leaving it open to just about anyone returning, with the exception of Odin, since his story arc was over.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


I really loved the missing pet notices plastered ALL over town and even beyond the city limits. Tulip really went above and beyond to try and cure Cass!

Edit: Also I guess her drunken uncle/dad is dead now.

it dont matter
Aug 29, 2008



So the Saint of Killers is a bit different in this version, huh?

The comic revealed it was God who delayed his return to his family in order to create the 'Saint of Killers'. That gave him some serious motivation for what transpires in the final issue. Here he just seems to be a very angry dead soldier. Maybe they'll explain some more background later but without any of the stuff about hell freezing over, the magic guns or the devil being killed it's not got quite the same impact. At least they didn't waste that line on the methane explosion.

Sentinel Red
Nov 13, 2007
Style > Content.

Maybe, maybe not. The meat and potatoes of the Saint's background is revealed later to Jesse directly, could just be they're doing the bare bones of it for now with the rest of it later.

it dont matter
Aug 29, 2008



Sentinel Red posted:

Maybe, maybe not. The meat and potatoes of the Saint's background is revealed later to Jesse directly, could just be they're doing the bare bones of it for now with the rest of it later.

Yeah I figured we hadn't see the end of his back story, but from what we've seen so far he wasn't a bad enough dude hell froze over, he was just hanging about there.

Shageletic
Jul 25, 2007






Just caught my last ep of this season, and here's my two cents for what they're worth (one cent).

Still don't think the creators have a handle on this show yet. The characters (well, the main ones anyway, other than Cassidy, well, maybe, more on that later) are unsympathetic, which is fine, but not when you feel like the people behind the scenes want you to root for them.

There's a distinct feeling (at least to this non-comic reader) of Seth Rogen and the like having such a immense respect for the property that they rushed through the building steps normally seen on TV that typically fosters an audience identification with a character.

Like, for example, with Jesse, he's an outright murderer of an innocent security guard (maybe the flashbacks will void this happening, but that would suck, since alot of our understanding of what his character is through the lens of that act and its reprecussions), a person that sent a kid into hell, lover of violence, etc, etc, and yet, we're supposed to sympathize with his need for redemption? Which is hampered by the character's apparent abandonment of it (casually shooting Carlos in the trunk) and self-righteousness (Jesse: "I GOT SOME QUESTIONS!", yeah I got one, why don't you bother telling the father of the missing kid, you know, what actually happened to him).

Tulip's character is still very much a mess. A hard-charging, unsympathetic, bewildering mess, which again, would be okay, if the show didn't apparently want us to view her as being straightforward awesome.

And all the people in the town...what was the point of spending so much time giving them dimension....when you were going to just blow all them anyway? And AGAIN, this is fine, if the show didn't just treat as some sort of after-thought.

As far as Cassidy, he is the least unscathed by the moral schizophrenia behind the show, he's done bad things, knows he's done bad things, and the show treats what he's done as bad things (well, mostly, him biting the mayor, which was a clusterfuck of ???s on its own, and its inconsequential aftermath invalidates the mayor's significance to the larger story). Still, I'm left wondering why he's with these two psychos, and what made him so inseperable from them? Like, wasn't he on the way to something in the pilot?

So overall, here are my questions: What is the point of this show? What are they trying to say? These are things that need to be figured out by the second season, IMO.

OTOH, I couldn't stop watching every episode. It was the first show that I would catch up on each week in fact, the amazing cinematography, the flights of narrative fancy, the sheer committment to unbridled weirdness....made it so I couldn't.

So hoping they clean up their themes and characterization next season, which I will definitely be there for.

My Lovely Horse
Aug 21, 2010




All that stuff about Jesse is, thought vastly different in the details, completely in line with how he's portrayed in the comics.

On the other hand, it wasn't particularly good writing then, either.

JazzFlight
Apr 29, 2006

Oooooooooooh!



Shageletic posted:

Just caught my last ep of this season, and here's my two cents for what they're worth (one cent).

Still don't think the creators have a handle on this show yet. The characters (well, the main ones anyway, other than Cassidy, well, maybe, more on that later) are unsympathetic, which is fine, but not when you feel like the people behind the scenes want you to root for them.

There's a distinct feeling (at least to this non-comic reader) of Seth Rogen and the like having such a immense respect for the property that they rushed through the building steps normally seen on TV that typically fosters an audience identification with a character.

Like, for example, with Jesse, he's an outright murderer of an innocent security guard (maybe the flashbacks will void this happening, but that would suck, since alot of our understanding of what his character is through the lens of that act and its reprecussions), a person that sent a kid into hell, lover of violence, etc, etc, and yet, we're supposed to sympathize with his need for redemption? Which is hampered by the character's apparent abandonment of it (casually shooting Carlos in the trunk) and self-righteousness (Jesse: "I GOT SOME QUESTIONS!", yeah I got one, why don't you bother telling the father of the missing kid, you know, what actually happened to him).

Tulip's character is still very much a mess. A hard-charging, unsympathetic, bewildering mess, which again, would be okay, if the show didn't apparently want us to view her as being straightforward awesome.

And all the people in the town...what was the point of spending so much time giving them dimension....when you were going to just blow all them anyway? And AGAIN, this is fine, if the show didn't just treat as some sort of after-thought.

As far as Cassidy, he is the least unscathed by the moral schizophrenia behind the show, he's done bad things, knows he's done bad things, and the show treats what he's done as bad things (well, mostly, him biting the mayor, which was a clusterfuck of ???s on its own, and its inconsequential aftermath invalidates the mayor's significance to the larger story). Still, I'm left wondering why he's with these two psychos, and what made him so inseperable from them? Like, wasn't he on the way to something in the pilot?

So overall, here are my questions: What is the point of this show? What are they trying to say? These are things that need to be figured out by the second season, IMO.

OTOH, I couldn't stop watching every episode. It was the first show that I would catch up on each week in fact, the amazing cinematography, the flights of narrative fancy, the sheer committment to unbridled weirdness....made it so I couldn't.

So hoping they clean up their themes and characterization next season, which I will definitely be there for.
You're completely on the money. I enjoyed the show overall, but there's definitely a part of me that's like, "I don't particularly like any of these characters besides Cassidy and the whole plot feels like prequel filler to the comic's actual storyline." There were a lot of sloppy character arcs with the townsfolk that I think they just hand-waved away by saying that the characters are messed up/sinful/crazy.

I'm hoping it comes into its own in season 2, but then again, even if it does, who knows if it'll get another lucky season order without improved viewership. Maybe it'd be better to just poo poo the bed in season 2 and get cancelled so it doesn't break my heart.

ruddiger
Jun 3, 2004



Show robbed us of the Saint tearing through Annville PD, but it gave us him shooting the nameless angel/terminator/waif from Game of Thrones in the back and saddled Tulip with every angry television woman cliche, so...


good?

Data Graham
Dec 28, 2009





The comics handle the entire story told in this season of the TV show in one flashback of about five pages. After that it's full-steam-ahead into a whole different story.

Rogen/Goldberg were right to say that the backstory deserved more coverage than the comics gave it; rereading it, yeah, it's pretty threadbare for that whole first bit, I guess because Ennis wanted to get right straight down to some good ol' Vertigo action. But while I think there was more story there than would have fit into (say) a single pilot episode, there wasn't enough for a whole season of TV.

So they stretched it, and they fleshed out a bunch of characters, and they shot their wad on a couple of characters that would otherwise only have shown up much later. But in committing to ending the season in the same place the comic starts (the three of them sitting in a diner and coming to terms with having just been at the center of a cataclysm that wiped a Texas town off the map), they also committed to throwing away all the character development they'd spent that whole first season on, for all the characters but the central ones who survive.

It's an odd situation to be in, and kind of a tricky table they've set for themselves. I think they could very well pull it off. But it's sort of inevitable, from the decisions they've made, that the texture of the aftermath of this season will be something very unusual and choppy.

The Action Man
Oct 26, 2004

This is a good movie.

Data Graham posted:

The comics handle the entire story told in this season of the TV show in one flashback of about five pages. After that it's full-steam-ahead into a whole different story.

Rogen/Goldberg were right to say that the backstory deserved more coverage than the comics gave it; rereading it, yeah, it's pretty threadbare for that whole first bit, I guess because Ennis wanted to get right straight down to some good ol' Vertigo action. But while I think there was more story there than would have fit into (say) a single pilot episode, there wasn't enough for a whole season of TV.

So they stretched it, and they fleshed out a bunch of characters, and they shot their wad on a couple of characters that would otherwise only have shown up much later. But in committing to ending the season in the same place the comic starts (the three of them sitting in a diner and coming to terms with having just been at the center of a cataclysm that wiped a Texas town off the map), they also committed to throwing away all the character development they'd spent that whole first season on, for all the characters but the central ones who survive.

It's an odd situation to be in, and kind of a tricky table they've set for themselves. I think they could very well pull it off. But it's sort of inevitable, from the decisions they've made, that the texture of the aftermath of this season will be something very unusual and choppy.

We didn't get to see Jesse and Tulip react to their hometown blowing up yet, and the state of Texas will at least want to talk to the only survivors of Anneville, especially since all three of them have criminal records.

I'm hoping the fallout from Anneville's destruction at least plays a role in Season 2, so all that time we spent in the town in season 1 feels less like a waste.

NarkyBark
Dec 7, 2003

one funky chicken

This last episode in particular made it quite clear what sort of tone they're gunning for. A whole bunch of despicable characters in a whole bunch of ridiculous situations. The whole Not-God sequence shows that you just can't take any of it seriously at all, just go along for the ride.

cjg
Sep 5, 2003



The Action Man posted:

We didn't get to see Jesse and Tulip react to their hometown blowing up yet, and the state of Texas will at least want to talk to the only survivors of Anneville, especially since all three of them have criminal records.

I'm hoping the fallout from Anneville's destruction at least plays a role in Season 2, so all that time we spent in the town in season 1 feels less like a waste.

How would the state know that they survived?

The Action Man
Oct 26, 2004

This is a good movie.

cjg posted:

How would the state know that they survived?

I honestly hadn't thought of it, but it's possible Sheriff Root put out an APB on Custer, Tulip, and Cassidy after church.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

"I find my life is a lot easier the lower I keep my expectations."
-Bill Watterson


cjg posted:

How would the state know that they survived?

I was about to post, odds are they'd just be presumed dead. Might catch up to them later on if they try to use a credit card or something, but they could just go off the grid.

The Action Man posted:

I honestly hadn't thought of it, but it's possible Sheriff Root put out an APB on Custer, Tulip, and Cassidy after church.

Assuming he lived, yeah. Although it wasn't really their fault! hah.

The Action Man
Oct 26, 2004

This is a good movie.

Zaphod42 posted:

I was about to post, odds are they'd just be presumed dead. Might catch up to them later on if they try to use a credit card or something, but they could just go off the grid.


Assuming he lived, yeah. Although it wasn't really their fault! hah.

Wouldn't there be an APB out for Custer since he escaped from police custody after being arrested days before the town was destroyed?

ruddiger
Jun 3, 2004



The Action Man posted:

I honestly hadn't thought of it, but it's possible Sheriff Root put out an APB on Custer, Tulip, and Cassidy after church.

He seemed prety disillusioned with any type of "law" after the call to heaven.

Also, lol at the confirmation of heaven and angels, yet the town still flipped the gently caress out. All or nothing, Preacher!

bring back old gbs
Feb 28, 2007

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN


The Action Man posted:

Wouldn't there be an APB out for Custer since he escaped from police custody after being arrested days before the town was destroyed?

APBs are for people you have to look for. Sheriff knew exactly where to find Preacher.

Not enough love for the wife yelling "THAT SUMBITCH PRAYCHAH!!" That line was so over the top methed out redneck.

bring back old gbs fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Aug 3, 2016

scuba school sucks
Aug 30, 2012

The brilliance of my posting illuminates the forums like a jar of shining gold when all around is dark

Yeah, that was a really good job of using the viewer's prejudice against them so that we were as surprised as Tulip when Jesse walked out of the shower.

Preacher: Like Lady and The Tramp, but in our butts.

The Action Man
Oct 26, 2004

This is a good movie.

GRANNYS PEACH TEA posted:

Preacher: Like Lady and The Tramp, but in our butts.

Now I need to rewatch that scene.

Filthy Hans
Jun 27, 2008





ruddiger posted:

He seemed prety disillusioned with any type of "law" after the call to heaven.

Also, lol at the confirmation of heaven and angels, yet the town still flipped the gently caress out. All or nothing, Preacher!

Jesse exposed heaven as a fraudulent power and was just as disgusted as the rest of them. He walked out of that church and knew he wasn't ever coming back, Quincannon or whoever was welcome to it. It was no longer a house of god.

It was ironic that the church organist was the only one who didn't flip out, she held it together for her kids and probably felt absolved of the guilt from killing the mayor since there's no god to judge her any more. The rest of the town's wrap-up was really, really dark however. I'm glad the kid who took a selfie while his mom was mercy-killing his sister died, though. I hope the sheriff lived just because W. Earl Brown did such a good job this year.

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

"I find my life is a lot easier the lower I keep my expectations."
-Bill Watterson


After all the Sheriff's been through, he should retire and get a job as a bartender

Grognan
Jan 23, 2007

by Nyc_Tattoo


Eugene and his Dad are probably hanging out in hell together.

Tenzarin
Jul 24, 2007

https://tinyurl.com/unbrokentable
Goons make for terrible detectives. It's okay they'll totally apologize right? Hahaha no of course not.

Taco Defender

The preview for this week's episode looks intense!

Tenzarin fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Aug 3, 2016

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001



Fun Shoe

Tenzarin posted:

The preview for this week's episode looks intense!



Hah- I had forgotten about that movie. Never would have remembered that. Did he do an American accent in that as well? My favourite fake southern accent was Vampire Bill from Tru Blood, It was hilarious.

D-Pad
Jun 28, 2006


I haven't read the comics but I assumed Jesse's character was all over the place because he is equal parts bad and good. That's why he can hold Genesis when the others exploded, they were one or the other.

NUMBER 1 FULCI FAN
Jun 1, 2003

If we vanished tomorrow, no organism on this planet would miss us.
Nothing in nature needs us.





Buglord

Man, I really wish Jesse had kept his long hair through the whole season. It looked great in the flashback.

MiddleOne
Feb 17, 2011



Tenzarin posted:

The preview for this week's episode looks intense!



What in gods name is that from?

Zaphod42
Sep 13, 2012

"I find my life is a lot easier the lower I keep my expectations."
-Bill Watterson


COOL CORN posted:

Man, I really wish Jesse had kept his long hair through the whole season. It looked great in the flashback.

Agreed, I was surprised by how good the mullet looked in the flashback and was kinda sad they didn't commit to it for the show. You'd think that they'd have to change it in theory, but then actually seeing it, it fit pretty well.

JazzFlight
Apr 29, 2006

Oooooooooooh!



MiddleOne posted:

What in gods name is that from?
Abraham Lincoln: Vampire Hunter
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abrah..._Vampire_Hunter

Not a bad little movie, actually. I enjoyed it a lot more than Pride & Prejudice & Zombies, for instance.

verdigris murder
Jul 10, 2011

by FactsAreUseless


For what Abraham Lincoln hunting vampires could have been, the movie is more than 'not bad'.

The horse chase, docks etc, it's chock full of really good set pieces.

Tenzarin
Jul 24, 2007

https://tinyurl.com/unbrokentable
Goons make for terrible detectives. It's okay they'll totally apologize right? Hahaha no of course not.

Taco Defender

JazzFlight posted:

Not a bad little movie, actually. I enjoyed it a lot more than Pride & Prejudice & Zombies, for instance.

Forget apples and oranges, were aiming lower!

Jose
Jul 24, 2007



cassidy is completely correct about the big lebowski imo

DogsInSpace!
Sep 11, 2001



Fun Shoe

Jose posted:

cassidy is completely correct about the big lebowski imo

No way Jose. The Dude abides so I will not tell you to shut up your stupid face but instead... please reconsider your incorrect opinion my good sir.

Mortanis
Dec 28, 2005

It's your father's lightsaber. This is the weapon of a Jedi Knight.

College Slice

D-Pad posted:

I haven't read the comics but I assumed Jesse's character was all over the place because he is equal parts bad and good. That's why he can hold Genesis when the others exploded, they were one or the other.

Nah, in the comics Jesse is more or less 100% justified and right at all times. There's only a small period where he uses The Voice for personal gain but that fades into the background as they resume the quest for God again. Overall, everything Jesse puts out to do is shown as being a righteous thing by the end - he's an rear end in a top hat, but a justified and correct one.

Really Jesse is kind of static and doesn't change much. His best arc is pretty early in the series.

Collateral
Feb 17, 2010


Mortanis posted:

Nah, in the comics Jesse is more or less 100% justified and right at all times. There's only a small period where he uses The Voice for personal gain but that fades into the background as they resume the quest for God again. Overall, everything Jesse puts out to do is shown as being a righteous thing by the end - he's an rear end in a top hat, but a justified and correct one.

Really Jesse is kind of static and doesn't change much. His best arc is pretty early in the series.

He kept leaving Tulip with those notes.

JazzFlight
Apr 29, 2006

Oooooooooooh!



Mortanis posted:

Nah, in the comics Jesse is more or less 100% justified and right at all times. There's only a small period where he uses The Voice for personal gain but that fades into the background as they resume the quest for God again. Overall, everything Jesse puts out to do is shown as being a righteous thing by the end - he's an rear end in a top hat, but a justified and correct one.

Really Jesse is kind of static and doesn't change much. His best arc is pretty early in the series.
Yeah, comics Jesse is kind of like Jack Bauer on 24. He does whatever he wants and it's probably the "right" choice in his universe.

Collateral
Feb 17, 2010


JazzFlight posted:

Yeah, comics Jesse is kind of like Jack Bauer on 24. He does whatever he wants and it's probably the "right" choice in his universe.

His treatment and general condescension of Tulip, wasn't right in anyway. Not just in a SJW way. There were several times he got hosed over because he left her behind, making matters worse for all of them. He also left her thinking he was dead in the company of Cassidy for what? 6 Months. All down to him seeing them kissing at a cafe. The cowboy fetish is a big flaw in his character. He lets his cyclops friend get no justice, he just walks away from the situation. I'll spoiler it as it may make up some plots in the show.

I don't think he is right about everything, there are just few unintended consequences. The big one, the 6 month one, he chose himself. I doubt that will be in the show as the major antagonist was Odin, but you never know.

Jesse Custer is a chauvinist, just like the cowboys he idolises.

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Mortanis
Dec 28, 2005

It's your father's lightsaber. This is the weapon of a Jedi Knight.

College Slice

Collateral posted:

He kept leaving Tulip with those notes.

Sure, but while it's a lovely thing and done repeatedly, in the end Ennis kind of exonerates him because nothing bad ever lingers around Jesse. Hell he rides up to her on a literal horse and they ride off into the sunset even after all the poo poo he puts her through and basically says "baby I'm a cowboy this is the way I am" and that's good enough for Tulip.

There's no lasting consequences for Jesse Custer, even if his actions toward her left her loving a vampire for half a year and falling down a pretty dark drug-fueled pit. Maybe "100% right" is too strong, but in the end he doesn't have to learn anything and all his choices either work out or don't leave him with any consequences.

He's teflon.

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