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Max
Nov 30, 2002



Should I play in this game?

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Max
Nov 30, 2002



https://youtu.be/Cho039BrHpg

OK, I guess I won't play. Looks like fun!

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Oh poo poo, that's right, you can be a stump.

Yes, I will play.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Quidnose posted:

If dongsbot will be nice to me I will play.

Will you be nice to me, dongsbot???

e: also if AR will let me since i bailed on his Ramen game. I won't bail this time!

I am looking forward to playing with you!

My friend and I have been flooding Overwatch with lots of positivity, and I'm trying to bring that into my life in general. I promise I will very likely probably not engage in a giant multi page slapfight.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Why would you want to do that, Inf?

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Adahn1986 posted:

Looks like Drawrof is wrapping up (at least for me) so I'll be here to annoy dongsbot. And also play.

:no comment:

Should be fun!

Max
Nov 30, 2002



##vote Moat

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Moatillata posted:

Somebody read the scum doc lol

Yup.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Adahn1986 posted:

It's just cuz it rhymes dood

Nah, that's just a bonus.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Since town get stumped, I think it's not a problem to lynch day 1 and 2. You lose some voting power but gain confirmed town opinions early on that will stick around. Scum are probably not going to waste a night priming a stump, which means that unless the player was already primed before they were lunched, they will probably be around for the whole game. Then you just hope they have good reads and opinions.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



dongsbot 9000 posted:

u telling me I can't even lynch adahn

Also, hooray, second game in a row where no-lunch is brought up Day 1.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Adahn1986 posted:

That confirms town, sure, but it gives arsons one less person to prime.

It's entirely possible to lynch a townie that's been primed, wasting a LOT of the arsonists time, and that benefits town.

Also, when they do ignite, if the number is less than it should, we can see who argued for/against lynching the primed townie, as arsonists would rather lynch townies that haven't been primed.

All in all, I think no lynches for two days give town a pretty strong advantage.

I don't agree with this from a strategy standpoint and also from a meta standpoint. I've already explained why I think, strategically, I would rather have some confirmed town around early to listen to.

The other big issue with your plan is that we will have two whole game days of getting zero information about flips, since scum don't kill immediately.

I don't know what we are going to learn after a certain point, and discussion will become stagnant and toxic, most likely.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



dongsbot 9000 posted:

let me get a couple drinks tonight and ill get toxic asap

A toxic attitude leads to a toxic life. It sounds like you need to chill out, and possibly mediate under a tree?

##vote dongsbot

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Yay for actual d1 content. I think there's some merit to both arguments. On one hand we keep our numbers filled meaning that it extends the number of players scum would have to douse and ignite to win, on the other we get flip information and narrow the suspicion list.

I'll await others to weigh in on it.

This post seems a little too . . . hedgy.

Perhaps we'll have to . . . give you a trim.





Tree pun.

Max
Nov 30, 2002




I'm not going to keep this going because we clearly think differently on this subject. I think the game will get extremely stagnant and boring if we no lynch for two straight days, with the possibility of being back to square one, once we hit Day 3. I don't really want to play in a game like that, at all.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Max posted:

This post seems a little too . . . hedgy.

Perhaps we'll have to . . . give you a trim.





Tree pun.

On reflection, I realize these were more shrub puns than tree puns. I apologize, and hope you can all forgive me.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Adahn1986 posted:

Are you one of the arsonists? Because then I'd be totally okay with lynching you.

Why wood I ever say yes to this?

But I'm glad to see you coming around to the idea of lunching someone day 1.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I'm just trying to imagine what 2 full game days would look like if we all agreed not to lunch anyone. I think things will stagnate and things will be impressively uninteresting.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Murmur Twin posted:

mafia.txt

Seriously though don't talk about other games, and if it means anything at all I would personally enjoy the game more if we could keep things chill-ish?

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Also, MT, where do you fall on the "do we lynch or no-lynch day 1 and 2?" quesiton.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Murmur Twin posted:

I feel like we have to lynch D1 and D2, there's no other way to gain information.

If we no-lynch D1 and D2, isn't that essentially the same as starting the game with 2 people primed for arson?

Hooray! I had an opinion that someone agrees with!

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Murmur Twin posted:

Hah, I hadn't really read the game before answering that but apparently my answer seems to be the consensus. If anything I say we turbo someone to accelerate the process by which people are forced to make in-game decisions.

##vote Moatillata - I eenie-meenie-miney-mo'ed the playerlist.

Moat is indeed a meanie-head.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Use the power of deduction.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Adahn1986 posted:

If Ferngully douses incorrectly N1 and N2, yes.

But D3 it puts us in an interesting situation. The arsonists won't want to lynch the people they've primed, even if Ferngully saved them.

Town also has 4 potentially useful lynches, because lynching either arsonist or either primed townie is "good" in that it slows scum.

The 'strategy' makes use of our power role. If we get lucky and she correctly douses a couple townies, the arsonists are boned.

If, however, we play the game with a 'lynch erryday' mentality, we cripple ferngully as we're likely to lynch her, out her, or get her randomly primed.

You guys do make good points though. It's just a question of whether we want to make use of our power role or not.

You seem to be approaching this as if the person that gets lunched will be a completely random decision. That's not the case. A big part of this game, and this setup in particular, is dissecting what people say. Dongs was rude before, but they had a point. No lunching day 1 and 2 gives scum two free primed targets, or even a free kill, before they ever have to worry about getting lunched.

It's sort of suspicious that you can't see that, but I don't know how new a player you are.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



##unvote

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Adahn1986 posted:

I see it more as people describing a chess game as if it's being played with checkers pieces, but I can see that the consensus is against the idea so I'll let it alone.

Oh come on. This setup was known, it's mostly going to be a game where we figure things out on our own. This is actually possible. Our firefighter may help us, or they may not. It's dangerous to forgo two days of gaining no information on the chance that they do help us. But if scum pick their targets completely randomly, there's only a 1/9 chance that the firefighter will cancel out their action. Even the math is bad in that sense. People's opinions about a flipped player are far more valuable than that, plus we get the opinions of stumped but confirmed town players, who again, will probably not be primed because that seems like a total waste of a night action.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I also just generally rebel when someone is publicly suggesting what the PR should do. It's on them to figure out the best path forward.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



But, like . . . that's how mafia is played. Scum gets town to mislynch, town tries to lynch scum. There are PR's that may or may not help.

And I hadn't even thought about what AA said, but it's a good point that lynching now narrows the pool of people that the firefighter would/should protect, increasing the odds of them screwing up scum.

This isn't a good argument that you're making, but I also don't really see scum making this bold of an argument right out of the gate.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TwJaELXadKo

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Wait, was that just a magnificent gambit?

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Murmur Twin posted:

Regardless of your intent, it comes off as condescending since you're clearly implying that you're considering the game in a more intelligent way than the rest of us.

But I disgress!

##vote Max

This is almost entirely gut but I feel like he's going out of his way to sound like a town player.

Care to point out where I was doing that?

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Murmur Twin posted:

No worries! If I ever point out something like that it's with the intent of being helpful, not judgmental


Like I said, it's mostly gut. I went back and reread you and didn't really see what I described (outside of that "hooray!" post). I guess the thing that's pinging me is that it feels like you're contributing a lot to the setup spec math discussion now because it's something you can be honest about even if scum.

[]

Mmm. I was honestly trying to wrestle that argument to the ground because I have no interest in participating in this game if people were seriously going to consider the no-lynch idea.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Disagree with Adahn that scum would advocate for a no-lunch. It's in their best interest to thin the herd as fast as possible.

Quidnose posted:

Scum post.

This I agree with.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I am really not a fan of using odds to describe what may or may not happen in a game of mafia, since it assumes that a random number generator is making decisions, and not people who are actually looking at posts and weighing their options.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I say that knowing that I invoked some numbers earlier.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



See my later posts. I don't think scum would have walked in to the game and made that argument right off the bat, I just REALLY didn't want people to even entertain that idea, because it sounds like a snoozefest.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



Max posted:

This isn't a good argument that you're making, but I also don't really see scum making this bold of an argument right out of the gate.

This one in particular, which I guess you both missed? I just couldn't understand why you were even entertaining that idea.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I was going to say that Moat voting for you is lovely and then saw your reply as I was typing this. On top of you, they'd vote Lil D even though they don't mention them at all in that post?

##vote Moat for reals.

Would also go AA, but it's only the start of the game and that would put them at -2.

Max
Nov 30, 2002



I just checked. Yeah, how did Lil D end up on that list as well? Moat hasn't mentioned them at all.

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Max
Nov 30, 2002



Mm, yes, I supposed Moat didn't vote for Inf.

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