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Quidnose posted:ALSO: No. This isn't true. I am a logical player. I am mentioning all the information available that affects things. If I'm wrong about AA and he flips town then FL is confirmed town and it is silly to leave him off the list. If I'm right, then it could go either way and he is no longer on the town list. He was on the town list because I would consider him town and not vote for him unless I am proved right on AA. Like, what you are saying in the post doesn't even make sense to me. I don't understand where you are coming from at all. We have to work with all the information available to us even if we don't currently agree with it so that we can appropriately address it.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:02
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If his alignment is based solely on another person's alignment, and that person is unflipped, you should not be making a hard alignment call on him, and I don't see why you do. I can understand why you would maybe think AN is potentially town since you agreed with her about something but you haven't mentioned her or interacted with her at all for a full game day and that's weird as hell. You are ignoring my points about not actually committing to Inf at all yesterday and responding around it. Please show me where you unequivocally said that Inf was scum yesterday, so much so that you felt you had to point out to us how suspicious of him you were.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:05
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Quidnose posted:Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhh. And you are wrong again.  I think everyone will correctly see that I caught AA in something that he couldn't explain and so he didn't respond to it, even though he posted afterwards. I'm feeling really good about him being scum at this point.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:06
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And I think everyone will see that you are ignoring my point about how you actually weren't on Inf yesterday and are trying to discredit me on literally everything else. Your posting is also hella shade throwing, and if I were not 100% confirmed town, you would probably be moving towards a vote. Certainly looks that way from how you are soft questioning my motives.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:07
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Quidnose posted:Except you didn't, because I have no idea what you agreed with there. You do a very good job on D1 of not really committing to Inf at all, then turn around on D2 and act like you were suspicious of him all day. IF that is true, you did not show your work. People can read your D1 post history and see that, easily. I mean, I can at least understand why you aren't crediting me on this, but can YOU put yourself in my shoes and see how I could mean exactly what I said I meant? Sitting in an airport, posting from my phone with limited words where I can. I clarified later to MMT when on an actual keyboard that I agreed with all of it. Like not much more I can speak to here. From my perspective, I really did completely agree with her opinion on Inf and I said as much.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:09
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Quidnose posted:If his alignment is based solely on another person's alignment, and that person is unflipped, you should not be making a hard alignment call on him, and I don't see why you do. Because you don't ignore a claimed cop until you have proof that you should? This doesn't seem like rocket science to me. Like seriously, even in games where people believe the cop sometimes they will flip the cop just to prove things out. You are being really illogical here. How is it weird for me to not have interacted with her when she doesn't actually post that much and I've been gone from the game for most of the day? Like, seriously, if I applied your logic to YOUR posting this game I could come up with all sorts of crazy theories. You are being wacky. I have not ignored a single point and I have responded to every single one of your posts in order so far. Please point out where I haven't. Now who is lying?
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Jun 28, 2016 09:13
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You agreed with who? AN?
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Jun 28, 2016 09:13
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King Burgundy posted:Now who is lying? BOOM SO IT BEGINS, THE SLOW MARCH TO A QUIDNOSE VOTE~
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Jun 28, 2016 09:14
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Quidnose posted:And I think everyone will see that you are ignoring my point about how you actually weren't on Inf yesterday and are trying to discredit me on literally everything else. Naw, when you post like this it makes me sure you are town. You are only this weirdly wrong about things as town. Even if you weren't confirmed I'd be confident you are town at this point. I don't think I'm questioning your motives? Can you point out where I did that?
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Jun 28, 2016 09:14
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Quidnose posted:You agreed with who? AN? With Viva.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:15
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Immediately above this post.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:15
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Quidnose posted:Immediately above this post. Maybe we have a different grasp of language on this. Or maybe I'm tired. But are you saying me saying you lied about something is questioning your motives?
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Jun 28, 2016 09:16
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Viva's post on Inf says literally nothing:VivaNova posted:Best votes: Infin, AR, AA, MG. OK, so Infin is the best vote, and presumably her #1 by looking at this. What does she think about him? quote:Infin misrepresented his role initially. Mhmm, mhmm, mhmm, scummy scummy. quote:However, I understand that as a boss he wants others bosses dead, and if he really is town aligned, he might believe that no rival bosses are as well. ...or maybe not? Towny towny? Off the hooky? quote:Currently he has it in his head that adahn is a scum boss, though I feel there's insufficient evidence to back this up on both counts. ...is this scummy or not? Adahn isn't on the best vote list, but...this...this isn't a commitment...there's no comment... quote:Most of the points in his case are plainly wrong or super reaching. Oh so he is scummy! quote:I would very much like to kill him for poor casing and arguably anti-town play. ...ok...that's not a great reason, but he's scummy for being anti-town, right? quote:For mechanics reasons, I'm not sure it's a great idea to kill a boss today though. I'm open to discussing this. Oh I see, you have no opinion. And you agreed with this and used it as your proof as to how you were 'on inf all day.'
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Jun 28, 2016 09:18
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King Burgundy posted:Maybe we have a different grasp of language on this. Or maybe I'm tired. But are you saying me saying you lied about something is questioning your motives? Why would I be purposefully lying as town, KB, what motive could I possibly have for actively and purposefully misrepresenting you. Come on man.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:19
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King Burgundy posted:I agreed with Viva 100% on that. I thought there was no reason to dive into the boss drama and off one of them yesterday since I figured the night would clear things up some, and it did. This is, indeed, something you did. quote:If I had to vote one of them, I was on the record that Inf would be the right choice, but I didn't think we should. This is, indeed, something that did not happen. Show me where you are on the record that Inf was the right choice.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:21
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Quidnose posted:Viva's post on Inf says literally nothing: Ok wow. Well, if that is your opinion then there is nothing I can do to address your problem. We have a fundamental disagreement on what message Viva's post imparted. But also: Quidnose posted:And you agreed with this and used it as your proof as to how you were 'on inf all day.' King Burgundy posted:I agreed with Viva 100% on that. I thought there was no reason to dive into the boss drama and off one of them yesterday since I figured the night would clear things up some, and it did. If I had to vote one of them, I was on the record that Inf would be the right choice, but I didn't think we should.  One of these things is not like the other. In what world do you get from my post above to I was on inf all day. Like what the literal gently caress man. I give up. You are being belligerent and unreasonable and aren't even properly parsing proper English at this point.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:24
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Quidnose posted:Why would I be purposefully lying as town, KB, what motive could I possibly have for actively and purposefully misrepresenting you. Come on man. It was a jab at how the things you were saying were actually untrue, unlike what you were accusing me of. I didn't impart motive.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:26
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Ok, you didn't say you were on him all day. You said that your opinion about him being scummy was a fact that could be proven by showing the record. Show the record.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:26
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Quidnose posted:This is, indeed, something you did. I was on the record by saying I agreed with Viva on Inf. But as I said, you just did a whole big post where you say that supposedly Viva said nothing. So we are going to get nowhere with this. Because you don't think words mean things. I do.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:27
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Quidnose posted:Ok, you didn't say you were on him all day. You said that your opinion about him being scummy was a fact that could be proven by showing the record. I did. You don't agree that it is one. We will get no further on this. Other people will hopefully see the truth if we haven't scared them away with this silly nonsense.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:28
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King Burgundy posted:It was a jab at how the things you were saying were actually untrue, unlike what you were accusing me of. I didn't impart motive. You're still sniping at me and soft accusing me of misrepresenting you with your "one of these things is not like the other" comment. You're not working to prove me wrong with your posting, you are working to disprove my motives and assassinate my character. I understand you have been busy and have bene traveling and I feel like your response this entire time would be a lot more "I just haven't had time to post anything concrete but I have been following, I can't show my work because it's all in my head." You've said that...once? The rest of the time you've been working really hard to show that I am: -not reading correctly -not reading between the lines correctly -purposefully misrepresenting you -making no sense and not reading English I mean honestly, KB, does that look like an innocent person who has been too busy to post but has a lot of thoughts on the game? Or if you were me, would it look like scum who got caught and is trying whatever they can to get out of it?
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Jun 28, 2016 09:29
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King Burgundy posted:I was on the record by saying I agreed with Viva on Inf. So you don't see Viva as hedging back and forth there? What is the ultimate conclusion she made, because it ends with "I don't really want to go after bosses, actually" which basically is the same as saying "This is maybe scummy maybe not but not worth pursing." That's a nulltell.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:30
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Quidnose posted:You're still sniping at me and soft accusing me of misrepresenting you with your "one of these things is not like the other" comment. You're not working to prove me wrong with your posting, you are working to disprove my motives and assassinate my character. Nope seriously. I like you. I think you are a cool dude and most of the time I like playing mafia with you. Nothing I have said has been said with ill intent or with a desire to shade you or impart ill motive. I'm literally just saying that for whatever reason, you haven't been paying a lot of attention to the thread and now that you are you aren't reading carefully or in context. I mean, its really late where you are too, so it is possibly that. But I don't know your normal cycle, so no way to tell. You just admitted to putting words in my mouth that weren't there. If I had done the same to you, apply the same glasses to yourself and decided what you would think. I think I'm being a pretty stand up guy, honestly. 
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Jun 28, 2016 09:32
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AND AGAINKing Burgundy posted:Because you don't think words mean things. I do. Character assassination that looks REALLY FAMILIAR: King Burgundy posted:Is there something you aren't understanding about "unfinished"? King Burgundy posted:This is all stuff that is in the thread, which you would have noticed if you had been engaged earlier. King Burgundy posted:Like if anyone is lying here it is you. You are saying I haven't mentioned AN before today, but you actually quote the post where I agree with her. Like, what? King Burgundy posted:Like, what you are saying in the post doesn't even make sense to me. I don't understand where you are coming from at all. King Burgundy posted:You are being really illogical here. King Burgundy posted:You are being belligerent and unreasonable and aren't even properly parsing proper English at this point. What is the point of all of this other than to attempt to discredit me? This is not town.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:34
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Quidnose posted:So you don't see Viva as hedging back and forth there? What is the ultimate conclusion she made, because it ends with "I don't really want to go after bosses, actually" which basically is the same as saying "This is maybe scummy maybe not but not worth pursing." That's a nulltell. That isn't how I read that at all. I read that as "Inf is super scummy. But I'm not sure now is the time to go after bosses." I mean, that is an oversimplification obviously, but that was the gist I took from it and what I was agreeing to at that point. It's a problem people have in mafia where they think sometimes it has to be all or nothing. It really doesn't. There were logical reasons not to pursue inf yesterday so even though some of us thought he might be scummy we avoided the issue. It is VERY easy to sit on a high horse after the fact with hindsight, but I still think we made the right call not to go after Inf yesterday.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:36
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King Burgundy posted:You just admitted to putting words in my mouth that weren't there. If I had done the same to you, apply the same glasses to yourself and decided what you would think. I think I'm being a pretty stand up guy, honestly. I think you would be voting me if you were possibly able to, but you can't because of the claim and corroboration. Your posting looks like a slow move towards an OMGUS. You are 100% right that I haven't looked beyond you at all. I think I caught you in a fuckup and a lie and I'm gonna put it out there and engage with you on it so other people can see. I have, for sure, been wrong about poo poo like this. I will take some time to look at the rest of the game in the morning, especially after people come in and comment. But your responses are not making me feel you are more town.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:36
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King Burgundy posted:It is VERY easy to sit on a high horse after the fact with hindsight, but I still think we made the right call not to go after Inf yesterday. It's also very easy, as scum, to point back to a confusingly worded and non-committal post that you agreed with in the vaguest of senses and say "this is proof I was on Inf way early even though I didn't vote for him." You have to understand that.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:38
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Like I know you are busy and travelling but all you would have had to do in that post is say "I agree with VivaNova, Inf is quite possibly scum but pursuing him might be the wrong course of action." Then we would have no problem. You're acting like what you were "agreeing" with is cut and dry there for me to read and it 100% isn't. Your insistence that I am wrong ALONG WITH an insistence that PERHAPS I AM LYING ABOUT THIS...it's just scummy as gently caress, dude.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:39
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Quidnose posted:AND AGAIN The point is to shock you into re-examining your opinions in the nicest way possible because you REALLY aren't reading imho. I mean, I am an elitist prick at times, so maybe I wasn't being as nice as I thought I was and had thrown in some condescension but its almost 3am here and I have to get up in 4 hours for another long boring day of meetings.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:39
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Then let us sleep upon it because it's almost 2AM here and I have to drive my girlfriend to work in 4 hours~
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Jun 28, 2016 09:41
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Quidnose posted:It's also very easy, as scum, to point back to a confusingly worded and non-committal post that you agreed with in the vaguest of senses and say "this is proof I was on Inf way early even though I didn't vote for him." Sure, this is fair in general for low word count posts. But I'd like you to tell me what other interpretation you think I could be agreeing with in her post to back this up. Like I think we've had this argument before in another game. If you really think I could have used that post to back up another opinion, explain that other opinion and how I could have used the post to back it up, because I just don't see it.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:42
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Quidnose posted:Like I know you are busy and travelling but all you would have had to do in that post is say "I agree with VivaNova, Inf is quite possibly scum but pursuing him might be the wrong course of action." Then we would have no problem. hahah, sure, but that is a TON more words to write on my phone. I mean, yeah, in hindsight, if I'm ever in a game with you again, I just won't post from my phone. Its not worth the effort. And then I would just say that I was thinking he was scummy but never posted and wouldn't have voted him. You admitted to putting words in my mouth. Quit saying I'm accusing you of lying when you actually did say I did something that I didn't. Meaning lying is a fair interpretation and especially fair to throw back at you when you are wrongly accusing me of the same thing.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:44
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Quidnose posted:Then let us sleep upon it because it's almost 2AM here and I have to drive my girlfriend to work in 4 hours~ Sounds good.
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Jun 28, 2016 09:45
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what the hell are you two on to provoke such a stupid slapfight
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Jun 28, 2016 10:04
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Just caught up. AA, I will admit to not understanding your target choice; with a choice of all the lurkers in the game, why pick me to investigate? I'm no expert but looking at filters it seems like a weird choice.
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Jun 28, 2016 12:25
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Ok, skimmed most of the last posts because I saw people were voting. So, you guys think that AA is a mafioso who got a chance to participate in the shine lottery, and instead of choosing a useful role to scum, he picked one of the most useful roles for town? Also, none of the town players picked cop as a shine role, since he's not been counterclaimed. That's idiotic. It means AA is an idiot, and every town player who was in the lottery is an idiot. Is it possible? Sure? But we also don't even know if mafiosos could participate in the lottery.
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Jun 28, 2016 13:34
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Anomalous Amalgam posted:Also you seem to latch onto that first part of my response and nothing else in the post. In regards to this post, it followed my drunk night and suspicion was building up on me. Given that I was a shine cop with 1 shine, I expressed honestly the stance I still stand by. Fine with dying because in contrast, we can look at who pushed it, their reasoning and decide if they're scum or not. The odds of me copping scum n1 were about the same odds of jake reckless vigging one. So why is it a big deal to make that statement? I think KB os just trying to imagine he's caught me in something, because it's truly not being caught in anything. Heat built up on me, I made a defensive statement that expressed my alignment and hinted I was fine going, but had a useful role. In regards to copping Flying Leatherman, I play by my own book which isn't the best. I thought FL was a scum trying to coast by making just enough posts to avoid lurking rules and the bandwagony me too notions you made pinged me, in hindsight shoukd have copped tq, kb or anarc.
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Jun 28, 2016 13:36
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I started looking at Li Dawny after reading MMT's post, and something jumped out at me while I was reading.Li Dawny posted:[...]we do have 9 hours, so is voting absolutely necessary right now? It's still so early that most people haven't checked in. Li Dawny posted:Okay, we need to all figure out who we are/are not willing to vote today because I'm having genuine concern over if we're going to get a lynch in today. This happened in the space of slightly over two hours and one page. It feels manufactured, being over that short of a timeframe. I don't see anything in the intervening posts that would make it that much more important to get votes consolidated and get a train rolling. ##vote Li Dawny
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Jun 28, 2016 13:37
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 Votecount for Day 2   Anomalous Amalgam (3): Truth Quark, Li Dawny (2): Murmur Twin, Flying Leatherman Truth Quark (2): Adahn1986, Anomalous Amalgam, Moatillata (1): CapitalistPig King Burgundy (1): Quidnose AnonymousNarcotics (0): Anomalous Amalgam, Not Voting (11): Absurd Revolver, AnonymousNarcotics, curiousCat, flerp, Hal Incandenza, JimsonTheBetrayer, Li Dawny, Moatillata, TMMadman, tpink, VivaNova  With 20 alive, it's 11 votes to lynch. The current deadline is June 28th, 2016 at 10 p.m. EDT -- that's in about 12 hours, 56 minutes.  Bringing Shine into Chicago was one of the trickiest operations the Outfit had ever pulled off, especially with the cops dogging their heels thanks to all the stories that had come out of New York City. It called for more bribes - and the occasional 'accident' here and there - than the Outfit had ever had to handle before. Despite all that, Capone didn't seem to mind the effort. He claimed it would all be worth it in the end, but refused to elaborate when asked.
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Jun 28, 2016 14:03
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Thanks, Quid, for pointing out that KB also hedged on lynching a boss. Infinitum's play D1 was exceedingly scummy, and both TQ and KB advocated against lynching him for 'mechanics reasons' that don't make a whole lot of sense. Dongs is dead, as is Infinitum, and I think it's likely that the remaining boss is third party. Thanks to dongs, we have a list. I'll use this as an opportunity to make a suggestion. Choose your night kills wisely, boss. If, in addition to the mafia kill we see some scummy players disappear each night, well, maybe we'll continue to keep you on the back burner. We don't know your win condition, but it could be compatible with ours. Happy hunting!
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Jun 28, 2016 14:46
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