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For some reason I'm still thinking about ways D2's story could have been improved to match the great level design: - Make only Emily playable - Delilah traps Corvo in the Void after taking his mark, this gets rid of the "why doesn't Delilah just smash the statue" plot hole - if the player rescues Hypatia, she stays on the ship for the rest of the game and helps make it feel less empty. Depending on low chaos or high chaos she either recovers but still has to reckon with having been the Crown Killer OR it becomes clear that Grim Alex is still there and is trying to retake control. Maybe you even have the option to kill Hypatia right before the last mission to prevent any risk of a resurgence. - when a game has a voiced protagonist, use it. When Delilah pulls Emily into the Void, have them actually interact, argue, etc. instead of Emily just dumbly taking in Delilah's story - If high chaos and/or Jindosh and Ashworth are both dead then the Duke should really be in hiding with a bunch of guards, not having a party. As for DOTO... it's hard to know where to begin. I enjoyed it but it has problems on a more fundamental story level.
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Nov 28, 2017 03:36
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FourLeaf posted:- if the player rescues Hypatia, she stays on the ship for the rest of the game and helps make it feel less empty. Depending on low chaos or high chaos she either recovers but still has to reckon with having been the Crown Killer OR it becomes clear that Grim Alex is still there and is trying to retake control. Maybe you even have the option to kill Hypatia right before the last mission to prevent any risk of a resurgence.
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Nov 28, 2017 04:12
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How is not smashing the Corvo statue a plot hole? I do tend to agree with you, though, on the other points. Felt like Hypatia and Stilton were gonna be boat buddies for the long term and then, nope. Especially considering the metaphorical importance of Stilton’s photo to Death of the Outsider.
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Nov 28, 2017 04:26
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FourLeaf posted:For some reason I'm still thinking about ways D2's story could have been improved to match the great level design: I agree with all of this, but with nabbing Jindosh too for extra company.
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Nov 28, 2017 07:42
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Bogart posted:How is not smashing the Corvo statue a plot hole? If you kill Breanna Ashworth and then talk to Delilah's statue she says something like "Maybe I'll take a hammer to your father/daughter and dump the pieces into the ocean." But even if you've gone high chaos and she knows you're coming for her, she just keeps the statue next to her throne unharmed.. why? I know the real reason (allow the player to choose to rescue Corvo/Emily), but it was never justified in-universe.
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Nov 28, 2017 15:44
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She's overconfident and thinks her victory is assured and likes having one of her enemies petrified in the throne room. Why is that even remotely weird?
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Nov 28, 2017 15:54
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Mymla posted:She's overconfident and thinks her victory is assured and likes having one of her enemies petrified in the throne room. Why is that even remotely weird? Villains that never react to you loving with their plans because they're so sure they're going win are boring unless the game is all about hubris. And while there are elements of that, its much more about violence and vengeance, so having a vindictive-as-gently caress villain just...do nothing with one of the most important people to you is weird.
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Nov 28, 2017 16:11
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Mymla posted:She's overconfident and thinks her victory is assured and likes having one of her enemies petrified in the throne room. Why is that even remotely weird? It's one thing to freeze your enemy when you think your coup has succeeded without a hitch, but when all your allies are dead including your girlfriend, their angry assassin is coming to kill you next, spite and sadism are your primary emotions and you don't even use your petrified enemy as a hostage? That's not being overconfident, that's being an (out-of-character) idiot. FourLeaf fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 16:14
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But when you try to fight her, you literally cannot kill her. She's immortal. She has no reason to think you've found a way to kill her.
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Nov 28, 2017 17:33
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FourLeaf posted:If you kill Breanna Ashworth and then talk to Delilah's statue she says something like "Maybe I'll take a hammer to your father/daughter and dump the pieces into the ocean." But even if you've gone high chaos and she knows you're coming for her, she just keeps the statue next to her throne unharmed.. why? I know the real reason (allow the player to choose to rescue Corvo/Emily), but it was never justified in-universe.
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Nov 28, 2017 17:47
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Mymla posted:But when you try to fight her, you literally cannot kill her. She's immortal. She has no reason to think you've found a way to kill her. Outwitting a villain who is hilariously overconfident is so common and so boring that its nice when stories do something new. I like that Dishonored lets you get incredibly grandiose and proclaim your intentions over the loudspeaker regularly if you want to, because Dishonored generally lets you become the villain. Its just that there really isn't any response to that. Basic Chunnel posted:The threat to smash the statue is empty because Delilah is a venal character who's haunted by her destitute origins. If she outright kills Corvo / Emily then there's no one left in the world to spite with her triumph. e: I do think its funny that the game will let you take the throne without unfreezing the statue, but I feel like disabling an automatic statue-killing failsafe before you go after her should be an alternative objective, especially if you have to (maybe) chose between killing her and unfreezing the statue? I'm not sure. Maybe if they play up the risk that she might escape the painting unless she's killed (again)? Hell, set it so that if depending on what you do, she's somehow tied a fragment of her soul to the statue, then have her rant about how she's got some failsafe effect to agonizingly destroy the soul of whoever is trapped in the statue if something happens to her. I don't know. Make your final choice to sacrifice the statue in return for ensuring that a threat to your throne is 100% gone and getting your vengeance, while the other option plays out the same. Or, you could return Delilah's soul to the statue (maybe alongside the original occupant, maybe trapping the original in the Heart), then reveal yourself to her/stab her. She then comes back to life, taunts you, and destroys the statue, inadvertently perma-killing herself in the process. THAT would be outsmarting her and playing into her hubris in a way that fits a lot more, because anticipating a counterplay is so much more fun than just showing up and doing something she probably should at least have partially expected. I don't know, something more involved. Its weird that they have two souls trapped in statues during the game and there's nothing involved with that parallel. e: vvvv poo poo, I'd forgotten about that scene. That really makes things weird as hell, but time travel kind of always does. Ravenfood fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 18:16
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I think that part of what sets the game up for failure is the implication that Delilah knows who it is that is spying on her from beyond time. If she knows *who* and *when* you are, and as cunning as Delilah apparently is, why are you succeeding at any of this.
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Nov 28, 2017 18:27
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When did Jindosh fake the Heart? I thought that was Outsider original work.
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Nov 28, 2017 18:39
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E3 display: http://dishonored.wikia.com/wiki/File:E3_display,_the_heart.png
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Nov 28, 2017 18:43
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I just realized something. Canonically, does the rest of the world not know that the masked man running around was Corvo?
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Nov 29, 2017 03:55
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Nope. They refer to him as "the masked criminal" in Dishonored 1, and there'd be no reason to ever make it public. I'm sure plenty figured it out; some named NPCs recognise it's Corvo in D2 while he's masked. Delilah's circle certainly knew. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Nov 29, 2017 |
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Nov 29, 2017 04:15
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are "breakable doors" not really breakable unless you get the strength upgrade
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Dec 1, 2017 04:44
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Relin posted:are "breakable doors" not really breakable unless you get the strength upgrade
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Dec 1, 2017 05:17
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Shooting breakable doors with the pistol will destroy them.
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Dec 1, 2017 23:05
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Just had something a bit odd happen. Was playing through on a no powers run and was at the last fight. I had dropped most of the replicas then sniped the true delilah in her secret perch and she teleported... to the greenhouse outside the tower. The one you find a few witches in initially. I lobbed some grenades off the battlements and she teleported back up to the top floor and i could kill her but it was such a bizzare place for her to go.
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Feb 11, 2018 23:44
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What, down to where the witches were singing and mixing paint? Yeah, that's bizarre.
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Feb 12, 2018 04:56
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GotLag posted:What, down to where the witches were singing and mixing paint? Yeah, that's bizarre. Yeah. It was really odd. I had knocked everyone ot down there already as well so couldnt go down the quick way. Was glad she teleported up when she heard the grenade
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Feb 12, 2018 14:31
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On the subject of strange occurrences, I found this clip in my Shadowplay folder: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8THM2Z2GxTg
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Feb 12, 2018 15:35
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Duke Luca Abele https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dY8BSHVWGxk&t=65s
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Feb 14, 2018 18:47
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I loved the first Dishonoured, but when I got this just after release I gave up halfway through the first level. I gave it a second chance a month or so ago, and holy poo poo I'm glad I did - there's some annoying stuff but overall this is one of my favourite games ever. There's so much to explore, so many amazing locations, and the two levels with 'gimmicks' are nuts. I love how the levels feel organic and flow with possible routes emerging naturally, unlike some other stealthy games where the levels feel like they were built backwards from two or three routes. This is also the first game since the original Deus Ex I'm playing through a second time, doing Easy, but no powers, no runes, no kills, no spots, all ui/awareness/alert markers etc turned off. It's fun but is doing me in. One question about the The Good Doctor/Addemire level - I noticed theres a bunch of bulging steam pipes around the level that sort of explode if you whack them with your sword - does something happen if you get them all? I've tried and nothing happened, but perhaps I missed some...
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Feb 18, 2018 17:20
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Nah, I think they're just places you can use for distractions / environment attacks. I kind of feel the same way, I was surprised I was really annoyed by some things, despite it being such a good game.
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Feb 18, 2018 19:26
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Just replayed the Dust District mission, and so I guess if you ship Paolo and Byrne to the Shindaerey mining company, they end up as Eyeless blood tanks or whatever. Those crates are bound for Shindaerey Mining Company, and Shindaerey North Quarry is the last level of DoTO. At least Rothwild can be shipped to "just" the coldest reaches of snow communist land.
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May 13, 2018 17:46
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I feel like an idiot for not making that connection
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May 13, 2018 20:52
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I thought you were going somewhere else entirely with "if you ship Paolo and Byrne". 
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May 15, 2018 03:58
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That's a great mission. Knocking them all out, including the dogs is a fun challenge.
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May 15, 2018 04:02
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Finally got onto Dishonoured 2 and finishing it makes me feel sad the same way finishing Prey made me feel sad (and Mankind Divided, although being two-thirds of a game didn't help), that this genre feels like it's dying. I mean the writing hasn't moved on with the best in the industry but the level design, holy poo poo. The regular levels are so good and the two mansions are amazing. I think at least some of it is self-inflicted though. Save-scumming cuts off these games at their knees and undermines core gameplay mechanics, storytelling, and the best emergent gameplay. They should take a cue from indie stealth games, dark souls, and hell System Shock 2 and give people a little more largesse with the stealth and in return you don't get to choose when you save. Looking forward to going through Death of the Outsider, even though I can't say Billie Lurk was the most exciting secondary character I've ever had in a game. Emily is by far the most charismatic of the cast, I kinda wish I had the option to play as her again.
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May 18, 2018 04:54
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I feel like once you've got the ghost / clean hands achievement if you're into that, it's really worth playing through again not caring so much about perfection. My favorite way to play is basically 'batman mode" -- not going for perfect Ghost, but trying not to kill anyone who doesn't really deserve it. This game gives you so many better options for non-lethal combat than the first game did.
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May 18, 2018 04:58
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Yeah that's literally what I'm about to do  It's more than just making yourself not reload though, games that assume you will get caught or die and can't reload take into consideration those things in their mechanics and systems and it totally changes stuff like resource management, what kind of risks you take, how much leeway they give you in stealth etc. It's funny you mention Batman because the recent Arkham games also come to mind as games that benefit from no manual saves.On the upside Blink and Far Reach still make Dishonoured better than most in turning what can feel like a gently caress up into exciting gameplay. Hiding in vents waiting for the Nightmare to disappear while you're weak in Prey is a step down. e: After finishing Dishonored 2 I went back and (finally) played The Knife of Dunwall and The Brigmore Witches for the first time and uh I wish I'd known it was basically the prologue to Dishonored 2. I though Delilah and Billie both had these unsatisfying vague backstories but it turns out they just left it all in the DLC and didn't put it in the game where they're main characters. I love good DLC, but not fleshing out characters for people who didn't buy it is pretty poor form (reminds me of Dragon Age: Inquistion a bit). On the upside Billie the Whaler was cool so that has me a bit more excited for DotO. hampig fucked around with this message at 14:27 on May 21, 2018 |
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May 18, 2018 06:01
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Playing this game again, doing a no powers run as Emily. A few things I've found: Got through the Clockwork Mansion with only the initial required lever pull ("must have been a false alarm") and was annoyed to find this still causes Jindosh to leave his desk and walk around in front of it Lift shafts are entirely climbable without using powers. Use the door release on the inside of the front face of the shaft (you can reach it from the outside of the shaft cage, standing to one side and looking towards the back face of the front of the shaft) and stand up to jump-climb the alternating boxes on the back of the shaft. Getting out at a specific floor without the elevator car present is tricky but doable. And I can't believe I never discovered until now, but howling bolts kill the gently caress out of bloodflies. Better yet, it's a travelling area effect around the bolt, which means you can clear an entire corridor of bloodflies with one bolt. It doesn't destroy the nests but that's easy enough to do with the sword before more bloodflies emerge.
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Jul 9, 2018 21:30
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