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Kind of repeating the video commentators on Sonic Mania, but that is absolutely, extremely my poo poo. Every 2d sonic game after S3&K has just felt wrong physically/mechanically. The friction on speeding up/slowing down was off, the jumping never felt quite right, the degree of speed gained from spin dashing, Sonic 1-3 had IMO basically ideal platforming controls for me where the movement was exactly slippery enough for the speeds you could get, and every game since then has missed the mark some way or another. If the physics actually are Genesis Sonic physics, then gently caress. This is the game I've been waiting 20 goddamn years for. Hilariously, I've told a few friends about the less than stellar sonic games over the past decade or so, and said that if Sega just made a proper HD Sonic 1-3 without loving with the physics or the core mechanics, they have people sucking dick to get their hands on it. Based on what I've heard, I feel very vindicated.
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Jul 30, 2016 08:47
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Robotnik Nudes posted:Sonic 3's controls are tight as hell. As a homeschooled kid with not many games I mastered it. I agree with everything (and outside of homeschooling, am in the same boat. Sonic 3 was my first game ever, and by god that's probably still my #1 game by play time), and while I use the term 'slippery' to refer to his screeching stops*, I do agree that the controls are perfectly tight as they should be. I mean, he takes time to slow down but it's a very reasonable amount of time considering how fast you can go, and the controls and physics of the game allows you to perform tricks to help you out. For example, jumping at the right time on a loop will give you a quick speed burst in S3 and I think in S2, or using well placed enemies or monitors to get extra height or jump distance. gently caress, I think I'm gonna go play S3&K again for some nostalgia. *compare to say, Classic Megaman. You've got perfect friction on the ground, but you never really move fast enough for stopping to take more time than 'instantly'. Classic Sonic is comparatively slippery, but it's that sweet spot where he doesn't stop on a dime nor slide excessively.
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Jul 30, 2016 15:52
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beep by grandpa posted:One of my fav things about S3&K is how it all just flows together from act to act. I really feel like I'm progressing and the entire thing feels like a big giant adventure, I always feel super pumped when the "story" kicks in about halfway through Lava Reef Zone. For me, I felt like S2 was a pretty alright game, but held back by Oil Ocean and Hill Top. Oil Ocean, for where it appeared, always seemed like just a weak-ish stage in general; impossible to die due to drowning or bottomless pit(well, ok, not impossible but you have to let it happen on purpose), but had a comparatively high amount of careful play required due to tons of hazards and fewer really fast area (as well as autoplaying sections), while Hill Top was a bunch of hurry up and wait areas. Chemical Plant always felt like a better done Oil Ocean zone, and Mystic Cave a better Hill Top. Also Oil Ocean had those seahorse looking fucks. 
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Jul 30, 2016 21:35
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beep by grandpa posted:Thanks for the "Monday Motivation" lol Gotta admit, for all the missteps Sega has had with gameplay/storywriting, they have an almost unreasonably good track record on the music. Not every song is amazing naturally, but I can't think of a sonic game I've played or heard that didn't have at least 2-3 songs that were fantastic. And hell, even the bad ones are rarely if ever annoying bad, just merely ok.
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Aug 15, 2016 15:29
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I feel powerful now too! Good vibes this week guys, let's try not to let too much "Chaos" get us down everyone 
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Paul.Power posted:I'm not a fan of Oil Ocean. I don't like orange, oil slopes are annoying to deal with, the pneumatic cannon thingies are slow, the badniks are surprisingly good at hitting me (like, Metropolis level good) and the music just rubs me up the wrong way for some reason, which is a shame because in most other respects Sonic 2 is my favourite game soundtrack period. Yeah, i think Oil Ocean is probably the weakest part of S2. I think also for all the reasons you mentioned it was something of a brick wall for me (seriously, gently caress those seahorse bots), and the boss itsself was kind of... eh. Also: beep by grandpa posted:Remake 3 & Knuckles with the Mania engine, tax man. This is 100% exactly what I want in a new Sonic game.
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Feb 28, 2017 23:44
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VikingofRock posted:Okay but when the boss shoots the ground-level lasers and blue flames shoot up you gotta admit that was pretty tight. The first time, maybe, but it doesn't really make up for the rest of the fight.
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Mar 1, 2017 05:06
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LOCUST FART HELL posted:The Sonic 2 level I always forget is Aquatic Ruin because it's sandwiched between Chemical Plant and Casino Night, which have the benefit of much more memorable to the extent that my brain tells me there's nothing in between. The music is  though.
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Mar 1, 2017 12:11
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Yorkshire Tea posted:So with Sonic 2, there's a map of almost every stage in my head. I don't know the entire layout, but for every stage until Oil Ocean I know where the "high" path is and what you need to do to get there. The levels are simple enough that I also know most of the enemy placement on the high paths meaning I can storm through a lot of the game with sufficient, but not unreasonable practice. And honestly, that's what I enjoy. I think it's because when you're playing well, it's obvious that you are because you're going through the level quickly and being rewarded with high ring counts. That actually makes a lot of sense, although I have to make one disagreement with Marble Garden specifically. That level is large, but it's also somewhat special in that there isn't really a specific high and low path, just different paths that take you down different routes (separate from the sonic/knuckles specific routes), and which path is better is actually left up to the player. This is as opposed to the high path usually being the fastest or otherwise best one. I think this may have been a deliberate design choice. Basically, Oil Ocean feels like an experiment in ditching specific high/mid/low pathing, and it didn't really work out. I think that Marble Garden was a refinement of the idea, and did actually work. At the very least, Marble Garden has parts of it that are actually fast. I never felt like I could build up speed in Oil Ocean, and there's lots of slow sections in Marble Garden, but there's also segments where you can haul rear end. Hell, it's not even 'you can', with those slopes hauling rear end is mandatory. Actually, in retrospect, I think my biggest problem with Oil Ocean is the speed. Or rather, the total lack thereof. I dislike Oil Ocean because it feels like you just can't get going for any appreciable amount of time. Marble Garden, Carnival Night and even Sandopolis has moments where you can just go full tilt, but you find nothing like that in Oil Ocean. Dabir posted:The thing about Sonic 3 that complicates this is that the 'right' way to play is really a bit more slow and explorey, so you can find enough chances to get the Emeralds. Look at Angel Island, you can have four emeralds by the end of the Zone, but other than the one that's handed to you at the start of Act 2, they're all on the bottom routes. That's a bit unfair to S3 though. I'm pretty sure you can get every single emerald in the first act of S2. Edit: I remembered wrong. Still, you can get them all in the first 2 acts and have one to spare if you hosed one of them up. Rorac fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Mar 1, 2017 |
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Mar 1, 2017 14:44
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"Hrm, lots of posts, I wonder what info got dropped." *click* ...  Holy poo poo what.
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May 16, 2017 18:45
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S3&K is the superior game and I will hear nothing to the contrary.  Desperately hoping that Sonic Mania will finally dethrone it though. VVV Oh, I have. Never had a problem with it, just wait till he's moving horizontally to attack. Rorac fucked around with this message at 02:04 on May 23, 2017 |
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May 23, 2017 01:31
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Never really got the whole rote memorization problem of Sonic 2's special stages, I always liked them  I mean, pretty much ALL of those stages in all of the games required memorization. And yeah, the later ones were hard but I always felt like the reward was worth it. Sonic 1's special stages were always way harder for me since movement always felt terribly imprecise and wibbly-wobbly. At least on S2's special stages I felt like I was going where I wanted when I wanted.I mean hell, if we're talking difficulty being a problem, I still have problems with the final part of Labyrinth zone. I don't think anybody was able to consistently get through that from their first or even after their 10th attempt. Sonic games rewards skill mastery, and memorization is part of that. Rorac fucked around with this message at 22:51 on May 23, 2017 |
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May 23, 2017 22:47
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Ventana posted:Not sure what point you're making with Labyrinth zone difficulty. Sonic 1 is pretty wonky as is with difficulty since Marble zone is probably the 2nd hardest zone yet it's Zone 2. As for that section you said, I never really felt I had to memorize Labyrinth zone myself so idk. What What Sonic 1 game did YOU play? Marble was easier than anything that came after it. The only thing that might've been different were the dropping spike ceiling/platforms and I don't know of any that didn't show you their location before dropping on you. Or is the lava? I never found any of that zone particularly difficult. I guess we find different things difficult? The idea that Marble zone is harder than Labyrinth or Scrap Brain is kind of mind blowing to me, but ok I guess?
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May 24, 2017 01:57
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It plays like genesis sonic games but it's a bit like CD in being kind of weird about it. You're constantly controlling two characters through basically a stretchy cord (it's a pair of power rings with an energy link, but it behaves like a rubber hose in terms of physics). You can do some creative things via that, but it can take a while to get used to the physics. IMO it feels a bit more like CD than anything else, and I didn't care for CD, but I wouldn't say it's a bad game. Just a bit odd. Go give it a try though, worst case scenario you don't like it.
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May 31, 2017 23:16
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Some friends of mine just bought me Sonic Mania as a late birthday gift. Guys I'm so excited, 20 years of waiting and hope has finally paid off.
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Jun 2, 2017 01:42
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beep by grandpa posted:Everyone yells at me for this but drat Sonic 3's will always be my fav Agreed, he just looks drat sharp in that game.
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Jun 2, 2017 21:17
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Discendo Vox posted:Thread poll: Sonic 1: http://www.soniczone0.com/games/sonic1/downloads/s1-specialstage-maze3map.png This one. gently caress this one in particular. I can't really explain why, but this just screws me up something fierce. Either I manage to complete it really quickly, or it turns into a painful slog as I try to figure out which way is back toward the emerald. (what? As far as I'm concerned special stages all count as individual acts. It takes me as long to complete some of them at least. )Sonic 2: Sky Chase zone. It's a big, interactive cutscene which breaks with the flow of the game horribly, and there's absolutely no way to get it over faster. I'd have just as soon made it non-interactive, like the end of Flying Fortress zone. Have sonic and tails jump into/onto the plane, take off, and then jump to flying fortress. It'd be more interesting, keep logical consistancy and waste less time. Sonic 3&K: Carnival Night zone 2 WAIT! IT'S NOT WHY YOU THINK! It's not the barrel (although I hated that loving thing), but so many things in that level seem designed to waste your time. The water section (not at the start, but after Knuckles) isn't actually a threat or anything, but it slows you down and for what? What does water add there? Would anything be different if there wasn't? loving no. It slows you down in one section and then it drains once you reach an easy to reach point. Why did they even bother? Also the section near the end with the repeated booster things. For what point or purpose did you need to add 20 of those? I have nearly timed out on that stage, and running through those boosters ate up some really precious seconds when the stage could've been shortened. They're all one-way things anyways, what does 2 dozen do that 1 or 2 won't? I haven't played any of the other games, so I can't say anything about their stages. Rorac fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Jul 2, 2017 |
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Jul 2, 2017 17:27
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Discendo Vox posted:Nuts, was planning that as a follow-up. If it makes you feel any better, I don't actually dislike any of the sonic 1 acts. It really all boils down to that one special stage. Also: Shinjobi posted:This. I don't get the hate for Marble Garden. I think it's a nice change of pace.  Never had any problems with Marble Garden. It's about as much acceptable verticality you can reasonably squeeze into a Sonic game, and the game does give you lots of chances to turn that height back into speed.
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Jul 2, 2017 18:59
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExUwpZLC2dc Motherfuckers beat Marble Garden act one in under 4 minutes WHILE getting every giant ring. I want to believe that this is a TAS run, but I also know from AGDQ and such that people are insane and if I was told that it was done normally, I would buy it. Still think that MG is too long and boring? Maybe we all just need to get good.
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Jul 3, 2017 15:19
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Ah well, unless I'm doing something specific (like playing tails or otherwise just exploring), I tend to run through levels as quickly as reasonably possible (IE: without glitches), mostly because above all else, playing skillfully is intrinsically rewarding to me. There's another youtube channel, The Geek Critique, who talked about this in relation to Sonic 2, but applies to all Sonic games really. And it doesn't even mean using every single trick to shave 5 frames off your best time, just running through skillfully but otherwise legitimately makes even larger zones like Marble Garden feel reasonable to me. Or at the very least, Marble Garden feels *fun*, which is probably more important. Basically, and I kind of mentioned this in a previous post, I don't mind things that take time if they do or give you something to do while that time is being taken. The blue tops? Often requires some degree of careful movement. The stone face things? You have to fight and beat them to move on. They're not hard really, but at this point, is ANY of the game really hard for any of us? I remember it was a bit challenging for me when I first got the game and I was 5 years old, for what it's worth. (Jesus gently caress I've been playing sonic 3 for 23 years). Hell, I don't mind the golem boss of Sandopolis Act 1, because that is a goddamn puzzle boss, or at least one that requires you to stop and think for a moment rather than just blindly bashing it. Granted it's a slight time-waster now, but I appreciate it for what it was made to be, even if I've moved past it.
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Jul 3, 2017 17:17
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Discendo Vox posted:SEGA's gonna give the rights to Penders. If there was ever a reason to make a Killdozer mk2, this is it.
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Jul 20, 2017 13:13
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Discendo Vox posted:A lot of Robotnik's true leftist motivations make sense if you've seen Rossum’s Universal Robots- or if you just know the true origins of his name. I followed that, and when I looked up "Other uses of the name Robotnik" link, I eventually found my way here. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robotnik_Automation It almost wouldn't be so worrying if like half the research project names didn't also sound like badnik names.
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Jul 21, 2017 17:26
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ColdPie posted:Someone's been digging into a detailed analysis of level changes during the Sonic 2 beta versions and Who the gently caress thought that was ok? Like no, the S3 barrel of doom gets all the hate, and it deserve it, but that's right there is a total dick move.
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Jul 31, 2017 19:47
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The White Dragon posted:that's because it's a dick move, but unless you're using a game genie, it's one-and-done. you fall for it the one time, you die, and that's it. the only problem it poses from then on is for speedrunners who miss the grab on the drawbridge switch, or if you have a brain fart. As a kid, before I had the level layouts memorized I fell for it a lot. It's just intrinsically bad level design though. I mean I don't mind that there's a trap there, that it is a trap is perfectly fine. But what does wasting the player's time with spikes accomplish that a bottomless pit doesn't? It's the difference between "Wow, that's a hell of a trap." and "Wow, that trap is hell." SeANMcBAY posted:The way he pronounces it angers me. It's pronounced Hydrocity. Rorac fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Aug 1, 2017 |
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Jul 31, 2017 23:51
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Favorite sound in any sonic game has got to be the 'charging' sound effect. This one, at 24 seconds in. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WsjhXkyMHUk&t=23s
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Aug 2, 2017 19:08
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I don't think Sonic's 4 music was inherently bad, but most of them required a bit more polish. The melodies were pretty alright, but the only way I can put it is that the sounds needed to be a bit 'cleaner'. That said, I will fight anybody that says Lost Labyrinth's Act 2 music is bad. That song is the single best part of Sonic 4 Ep.1
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Aug 7, 2017 22:32
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Heran Bago posted:Sonic Mania Contest / ROM hack release I tapped out at Casino Night zone while playing it unrecorded.
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Aug 9, 2017 23:29
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Evil Eagle posted:I can't get past whatever the hell this is supposed to be How did you get through it? I've tried everything, something always knocks be back into the bowl (or I get stuck in slot machine hell) Edit: Only 5 more days! Rorac fucked around with this message at 05:11 on Aug 10, 2017 |
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Aug 10, 2017 05:01
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In order to get my sonic fix, I decided to play through all of sonic CD, which is something I have never actually done before. I did play a little of it a long time ago, didn't care too much for it, and hadn't touched it again until now. Sadly my opinions didn't really change.  S2, S3&K are still the better games. In fact I like S1 more.
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Aug 11, 2017 05:23
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I haven't made up my mind on Press Garden zone. I don't think it's bad, it's interesting, but I don't think it's the best zone. I dunno how to beat it in less than 1 and a half minutes though, I'm going to have to explore the poo poo out of it. I can say that they made Stardust Speedway actually fun and interesting for me, since I HATED that zone on CD but enjoyed it here. Edit: I got a sub 1-minute time on Chemical Plant zone act 1! 
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Aug 31, 2017 23:54
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Finally got all golds on the Blue Sphere stages. Christ, they had to put in the S&K one where it's just giant squares with a layer of bumpers and rings in it, didn't they? I never got a perfect on that because 6 year old me failed it once and I decided to never try to go for a perfect on it until now. It wasn't actually that hard.  6 year old me was really bad at Sonic.
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Sep 2, 2017 12:03
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:Chemical Plant Act 2 boss; I was waiting for this to happen. Holy... Like, I played a shitload of Mean Bean Machine, I don't think I'm bad at Puyo Puyo, but gently caress me that guy's on a whole different level. I went "What the gently caress are you doing" the whole way until he started the chain going.
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Sep 3, 2017 14:05
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Harminoff posted:Denevo has already been disabled for this game.Thanks for the two week wait for nothing Sega! Sega removed it, or what? I'm seeing it's cracked, is that what you mean?
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Sep 6, 2017 03:59
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Heaven Spacey posted:I just finished the game today, haven't gotten the true final boss yet but my favorite tracks have been Studiopolis 2, Mirage Saloon 1, and Titanic Monarch 1. As great as his Stardust Speedway arrangements are, Tee Lopes' original stuff is way better than his covers imo. I agree with all of those songs being really good, but LRZ 2's song is the best in the game. That loving guitar, man. Nearly brought me to tears. Just about every song in this is great, but that one is beautiful.
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Sep 6, 2017 05:10
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I finished the game with about 30 lives, no game overs. There were some difficult sections, but most of my deaths were figuring out the bosses rather than the levels themselves. The games don't really do much to tell you how to fight some of the more 'clever' bosses like metal sonic. Then again, I was the kind of kid that struggled with the first part of the Death Egg boss (the one with the gravity and the bumpers) until it clicked. Overall though, I feel like the game is a little bit tougher than the genesis games, but also fair tough rather than bullshit tough. Whatever bullshit toughness comes up is due to the engine rather than the level design.
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Sep 10, 2017 02:56
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I did feel like the Blue Sphere stage was a bit faster, but I never felt like it was uncontrollable unless I spent like 3-4 minutes in the stage.
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Sep 10, 2017 09:27
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That one was... pretty easy though? The hard one for me was the one where you have to spring, collect 3, spring, collect 3, spring collect 3... I mean for fucks sake can I get an error margin higher than "lol gently caress you"?
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Sep 10, 2017 10:22
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Shadow Hog posted:If you're having trouble, practice in the Glowing Orbs bonus stage in S3&K; it's the same gimmick, verbatim. Likewise, if you don't want to rocket off at max speed, time the jump so you're closer to the 'edge' of the sphere when you launch. Justin_Brett posted:If these UFO stages are gonna fail you for one mistake could they at least be easy to find? There's like 60-odd of them scattered about. Although I'll grant you, most of them are pretty well hidden.
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Sep 11, 2017 06:02
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Spiderdrake posted:Mania 2 will be awesome, regardless of whether it has remixes that barely resemble the original levels or is all new! I hope that there is at least an Aquatic Ruin remixed zone at some point. That's one of my favorite Sonic 2 stages, but it hasn't gotten ANY love.
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Sep 20, 2017 03:33
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Sonic Team should have a rule where they have to build a stage using Sonic Mania's engine before making it in Forces/whatever 3d game comes after, because holy poo poo that stage looks like a loving snoozefest.
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Sep 27, 2017 14:19
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Spiderdrake posted:Hey on that note, for ceiling running in S3K, did you need to reverse directions or is that new to retro engine? I don't remember that getting me so much in earlier games. You have to hold the opposite of the direction you want to go in. For example, there's a section in Mushroom Hill zone where you can run on the ceiling after going through a half-loop. Run left into the half loop, and keep holding left. You'll be running right while upside down.
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Sep 29, 2017 14:36
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