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bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

"The Quality of Mercy": daaamn, nice set of double-twists in this one. I was about 2/3 of the way through and thinking "Wow, it seems like the doctor lady and Franklin have come to a nice pat agreement; seems this one's wrapped up early". But then the murderer story tied back into it all of a sudden, and then just as I was kicking myself for not seeing that coming, there's another :tviv: when she suddenly goes all badass. That's quite a piece of writing.

Also an episode that you think is a one and done, but is important in the future.

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bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

I always felt like Boxleitner with a beard would have been perfect to play Ulysses S. Grant



He did play Longstreet in the horrible Gods and Generals.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

ConfusedUs posted:

There was this one weird-looking, bug-eyed, kinda toothy little guy who I always thought would have been better at being the cult leader than Byron. It was hard buying Byron's persecution conflict when the guy looked like loving Fabio.

Should have brought back Jeffrey Comb.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

Okay so kudos to them for lampshading this, I guess:



I mean, well, kinda. Funny that they're doing a whole "what's it like to be a human woman" subplot. But what I was getting at was, how does her hair work with her headpiece/skull thing? Does the hair go under it? Isn't that thing supposed to be a part of her head? Or is it something she puts on over the top of the hair, like a headband or a helmet? I mean obviously that's what it is in terms of costume/makeup, but in-universe it's really taking me out of the moment by making me ask whether that ridge thing is a part of her head or what.

Oh, and here's me during the last few moments of this episode:


:downs: Heh


:stare: Uh


:stonk: Oh god no


:suicide:

Yep that conversation ends up being a hint at something that happens later on.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Paradoxish posted:

Here's a confession, then: I love Babylon 5, but I don't think I've ever seen more than one or two episodes of the fifth season. The fourth season just feels so... final. It's hard for me to convince myself that it's worth watching anything after that.

Someone convince me I'm wrong.

A poo poo ton of Centauris

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?
Its better than Legends of the Rangers

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?
It helps turn Londo into even more of a tragic figure. You find out more how he got to his fTW a you saw when Sheridan became unstuck in time.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Party Plane Jones posted:

S1 doesn't actually have a lot of G'kar or Londo come to think of it. G'kar is only in 11 episodes and Londo in 14. Season 2 gives them vastly more time on screen.

G'Kar is also basically a mustache twirling villain in season 1.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

BTW "In the Beginning" was pretty good, particularly in seeing the actors all playing younger (and older) versions of themselves. Jurasik somehow made "young and bright-eyed" work, and Katsulas even more so (it seemed like he'd boned up on how he'd acted at the beginning of the show and was playing up being a higher-energy version of himself again). Even Ivanova I could buy as a teenager. Really neat stuff.

I feel like it was all kind of deflated at the end by the sudden injection of the Sinclair story, though. They had to put in a climactic scene for the battle in question, but they'd already covered the big dramatic reveals regarding that event in the show itself, so they couldn't just replay it all the same way, and centering it on Sinclair (who hadn't even been in the movie up till that point) felt like an out-of-body experience. A new viewer would have been totally lost as to who this guy was and, especially, why these seemingly huge pivotal moments surrounding him (e.g. "we have to ally with the humans, this guy is a huge deal, pull back") mostly take place off-screen. I don't know how they could have handled it better, though. They kind of wrote themselves into a corner there.


I really like the S4 titles sequence, though. Finally it's looking like a "real" show, plus the original theme music is back.

Sinclair was unable to film so they used only footage already shot. They claimed he could not get there, but it might have more to do with his mental illness.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

Yeah I get that.

I'm saying they probably couldn't have done much differently, dramatically, even if he'd been able to. They'd have had to write him a much bigger part, or leave him out entirely, to make that segment work better for me.

They might have made Sheridan have a lesser role and make Sinclair the focus character.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?
Same here

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

I did like how they ended it kind of with a Steven Universe style "Hey don't worry, this isn't really canon :v:"

You know besides the laying the seeds for a betrayal

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

"Objects in Motion": Okay, so it feels like they're kinda just running out the clock here?

I mean, I rather enjoy the idea of a space sci-fi serial show that doesn't end in a vast climactic sturm-und-drang cacophony of interstellar war, where instead you just get people gradually saying goodbye and bowing out of the story. But it's taking so long to get through the end of everyone's arcs (and Londo's is just going to... end there, is it? With the spider on his neck and everything?) that it feels like JMS was just kind of sick of all the meta drama of dragging this thing back and forth across the finish line and wanted it to go away.

One thing I still think I'm missing: right before Londo got the spider, what was the transmission he triggered? Why didn't the Drakh notice and take action? As far as I can tell it just alerted Sheridan that something mysterious was going on in the upper echelons of Centauri politics and they should draw unclear conclusions from it, and good thing those conclusions were "don't blow everything up". But I thought that transmission was supposed to be more of a chessmaster disarm move on Londo's part, something a bit more significant to the story? The wiki barely even mentions it. :confused:

You saw the end of his story when Sheridan got unstuck in time. This is just how it got there.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Data Graham posted:

So is it just me, or is Crusade like, really bad.

I'm two episodes in and first of all the music makes me want to slit my throat, but also there's just weird as gently caress pacing and characterization issues, and I don't just mean Bill Lumbergh as captain (lol).

He is currently awesome on Veep and a poo poo ton of other stuff.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Parts Kit posted:

It's not just you.

Still better than Legend of the Rangers

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

hangedman1984 posted:

I imagine JMS was probably particularly salty that he was losing him to DS9.

We are lucky that he did not decided to walk it off. Maybe with a long walk. A long, dull, pointless, boring walk. Across America.
That he won’t finish.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

SlothfulCobra posted:

I get the sense though that Delenn was going through some pretty heavy weeabooing for humanity before the shadow war gave her something bigger to focus on, and it definitely didn't help that she seemed to be romantically pursuing Sinclair, and then when he got replaced she just went and jumped his replacement's bones. (and through it all Lennier does that weird Nice Guy thing. How are minbari-minbari romances supposed to work?) I don't think any of the romantic relationships of the show really worked for me.

There was still a lot of allusions to inter-species sex, but never any sort of "legitimate" relationships besides Delenn and Sheridan. In fact, there's not really that many alien romances in general. The Centauri are the only ones that they show having relationships (but man, how they do show it).

I am pretty sure they showed G'kar banging centauris and wanting to bang humans.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

ConfusedUs posted:

Thanks to whomever posted the link to go90.com with all episodes streaming.

I'm into the latter parts of Season 2. First time I've re-watched the series since, oh, the early 2000s.

I forgot all about the fate of the Markab in "Confessions and Lamentations." That's some heavy poo poo.

I'm also noticing a lot of world- and character-building that I missed, like Franklin's growing Stim addition and Garibaldi's alcoholism.

In fact, with Garibaldi, it looks like it was Londo that got him to drink his first drink, in the episode where Londo is all sad about how his new "friends" all seem to want something. He waits for Garibaldi at the bar and, when Garibaldi finally shows up, he drinks a colorful drink instead of his usual water.

It's possible the first drink came in an earlier episode--I only watched the highlights of Season 1--but I'm pretty sure that was it.

Garibaldi does not relapse until the later seasons. He is sober until then

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

pentyne posted:

Katsulas was pretty old but not ancient.

Dude loved to smoke.

Also RIP Vir/Flounder

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

Every time I see Sheridan with a beard I think it was a criminal waste that Boxleitner was never cast as General Ulysses S. Grant.

He did play Longstreet in gods and generals but that movie is trash

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Pick posted:

JMS never forgets.

Unless he decides to make a deal with the devil or go on a long boring pointless walk across america, and then quits halfway through

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

McSpanky posted:

Vir gets his in the end.

The betus?

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

thexerox123 posted:

Yeah, I just watched his episode yesterday, it was heartbreaking and great.

Bill Mumy's great, too. I was a big fan of Lost in Space at one point as a kid, so it's been fun seeing him as Lennier.

It's a good life

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

bartolimu posted:

If you assume the last scene of Sleeping in Light was always planned, it totally makes sense that the audience never seriously doubts Sheridan was the Good Guy. The whole five-season show was one big history/propaganda piece paid for by the Ranger Memorial Fund or something like that.

Of course that could also be seen as a final "well yeah my dialog was mediocre and the actors sometimes couldn't quite pull off what I needed them to, but it's totally okay because they were actually portraying the actors who were portraying the historical characters, CHECKMATE" kind of move to deflect criticism.

What are you talking about? Sheridan did not do all those things. He was power hungry.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Jedit posted:

explained that Dr Kyle was recalled to Earth and promoted and more than implied that he was killed in the sabotage of Earthforce One.

Nope he is mentioned as the guy who got Frankin his new job at the end of the series.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Milky Moor posted:

Vorlons have physical forms.

Yes as energy

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

turn left hillary!! noo posted:


I can't think of any other show that has a whole quarter of the last season as epilogue and denouement, but it is so good to have this.

Six feet under did!

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

TraderStav posted:

It would have been much better if they never showed him being taken but start showing flashbacks of it over the past fifteen episodes.

But if he was never shown missing G’kar would never have searched for him and taken to alpha Centauri

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Doctor Zero posted:

In the Beginning kind of re-writes a bunch of stuff. Personally, I take the details like that with a grain of salt and think of it like a meta Made For TV dramatization.

It is lando telling a story

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Jedit posted:

Lyta is the only character said to have gone beyond the Rim before the actor died.

Didn’t she just go to the vorlons home planet?

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Timby posted:

Byron is indeed terribly written, there are no two ways around that, but the character isn't helped by Robin Atkin Downes being like 21 when he was playing the part, and that being essentially his first major live-action role ever. He was completely out of his element and it shows, painfully, on the screen; when you're a really raw actor in a show full of mediocre actors, you're going to stick out like a sore thumb.

I still think they should have brought back Jeffrey combs

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bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?

Antifa Turkeesian posted:

Even Star Trek’s subtler pop culture thing where everyone listens to classical music and also things baby boomers find comfort in got annoying after a while. I hope the new star trek series don’t suddenly have characters with historical interest in the 1990s.

According to we hate movies bones was a big fan of nu metal and especially former president durst

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