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MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Maelstache posted:

Just Ivanova and Sheridan left of the B5 command staff, then? Oh, and Corwin. And those others that never spoke.

And LAUREL TAKASHIMA

And Morden

adhuin posted:

Or characters:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9WkQTzAcYk

An actor for a Rebel general couldn't make it to a pivotal episode, because he had been booked as a Rebel Admiral in a DS9 episode.

Another side point, the actor here (Bruce McGill) wasn't supposed to be cast - JMS wanted Everett McGill but could only remember the McGill part, and they booked the wrong one.

It works out well, though.

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MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


I've been working through B5 with an ex (although it's currently referred to as "Space James" because Sinclair looks like a mutual friend) and we're almost up to Intersections in Real Time. There's one I'm always interested in getting peoples opinions of

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Timby posted:

Let's not get carried away. Biggs did relatively well with his louder moments when he needed to be passionate and shouty and whatnot, but otherwise, he had all the subtlety of a brick to the head.

I think the comment was in the context of his disability

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


The first series is very much "Star Trek, but not every ending is so neat"

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Originally planned to be the finale, wasn't it?

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Maelstache posted:

Of course, TNG later did their own even more blatant Orwell homage, with Picard and the David Warner Cardassian. Which is also a great episode.



Well, 5 years earlier but who's counting!

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Maelstache posted:

Oh man, what a goof. In my defence, the huge time delay in TNG being run on British TV meant we were still getting "new" episodes several years after the show went off the air.

Yeah, I was well confused as a young'un in the nineties when I missed an episode of B5 and couldn't buy it on video the next day to catch up

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Kingtheninja posted:

Finishing up Believers right now (great episode), and I want to echo the sentiment for Sky full of Stars. That ending really got me stoked to find out more about the mysterious ending of the conflict. Do we get answers to that before Sinclair leaves the show? Or does it get answered anyway?

Don't worry, you'll learn about what and why

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


DrBouvenstein posted:

"In the Beginning" is the best of the B5 movies by a LONG shot

It falls too much into the "And Yoda was friends with Chewbacca!" trap, with all the main characters being not only influential in the Shadow War but also interacting significantly with the others.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Parts Kit posted:

"He's like a human god of anger"

Egyptian god of frustration

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


The first half isn't actually so bad if you can get over Byron being too good at being the annoying cult leader

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


12 then 15-22 I suppose if you're restricted for time

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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ConfusedUs posted:

There was this one weird-looking, bug-eyed, kinda toothy little guy who I always thought would have been better at being the cult leader than Byron. It was hard buying Byron's persecution conflict when the guy looked like loving Fabio.

The underground leader from A Race Through Dark Places?

Byron works well as a cult leader because he looks and acts like a cult leader.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Angry Lobster posted:

Honestly, the only thing I remember about the first half of season 5 is Tracy Scoggins and how hot she was before abusing botox.

If that's what you're here for just watch River of Souls

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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My accepted B5 watch order is:

Series 1
Series 2
Series 3
Series 4
Series 5

Maybe then In The Beginning

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


EX-GAIJIN AT LAST posted:

You won't get anything like S5 in any other show. If B5 had ended after the climax of S4 (like any other show would), it would've still been a great show, don't get me wrong, but S5 adds a rich texture to it that enhances the rest of the show, and gives a lot of closure to the characters. It doesn't just go "happily ever after." It gives you the sense that what they did had meaning, even though no victories are final, and there are more stories that go on afterward. So, Payndz, if you don't consider that "essential" then I don't know what to tell you.

That's an aspect that makes B5 so good - episodes like Believers work because they go past the standard ending and show that the aftermath isn't all that.

I personally find S5 less good largely because I don't like the new theme music but there we are

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Although I disagree to some extent, The Wire has a lot of that.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Data Graham posted:

I've only picked up some of the meta-drama via innuendo over the years. Do I have it right: they thought they were getting cancelled after S4, so they rushed to wrap up what would have been two more seasons in a single season, and then at the last minute it got renewed for an S5 after all, so S5 is mostly filler?

Sort of. Originally, according to JMS on usenet at the time, the plan was to finish with what became episode 18, Intersections in Real Time - 3 to go, not including Sleeping in Light (shot with S4, with Deconstruction shot with S5 which is why it doesn't have Claudia Christian but SiL does). Now quite a lot happens in those three episodes, but if anyone thinks that the content in those episodes was sufficient to stretch out into the plot of an entire (or half a season)... man, they don't know what filler means.

Looking at S5 now, rather than watching it at the time, the main change is that of focus - it goes from an obvious Good vs Evil story with Lots of Spaceships to a story that's a lot more difficult, a lot more human. When I was looking at a list of episodes earlier (with regard to "cutting the chaff") I just looked through and thought "yeah this is important, yeah so's this, can't cut this..." to essentially all of them.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Timby posted:

This is what I mean when I say that a lot of Straczynski's Usenet postings, especially from when the show was in active production, need to be taken with a grain of salt, because the guy was certainly not above drinking his own Kool-Aid from time to time (off the top of my head, claiming the similarities to Lord of the Rings were entirely coincidental, or that there was no way they drew inspiration from The Prisoner or Homicide: Life on the Street when doing Intersections in Real Time). But, in fairness, what creator doesn't stretch the truth from time to time?

He's right that if you're aiming to write a "realistic" interrogation there's only so many ways you can go.

The contemporary comparison was with https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closet_Land , largely, for what it's worth.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Sheridan is supposed to come across as a brash All American type as far as I'm aware

Angry Lobster posted:

The real reason was unknown until Michael O'Hare died in 2012. You see, many B5 actors have explained for years how difficult it was working with him on set, especially Jerry Doyle, who said O'Hare was quite an rear end in a top hat. The truth is O'Hare was diagnosed with a mental illnes that made him suffer from delusions and paranoia, so he struggled a lot to do his job. He started treatment but it would take time. He only confided in JMS, and was willing to stop filming until O'Hare recovered but eventually they decided it would be best if he left at the end of season 1 and O'Hare made JMS swear to keep this secret until he passed away.

You can understand why he got a bit bad given Sinclair's plot in S1

MrL_JaKiri fucked around with this message at Sep 21, 2016 around 11:09

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


The scene 33 minutes or so in. Garibaldi takes information from the Rangers to Sheridan and Ivanova, which lets them put pressure on the Centauri to release the civilians.

[edit in response to your edit]

There was further information exchanged offscreen

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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There's more dialogue, and the ranger is still there at the end of the scene. The next scene with Garibaldi is him telling Sheridan and Ivanova things. The implication is that he was told this information off screen, which is a sensible decision production wise because we don't need expository dialogue for stuff we actually watched happen

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Data Graham posted:

Was the bluff based on Londo thinking Sheridan knows about the Shadows, and that ... means he can send observers? Is "observers" supposed to be read as "We are in league with the Shadows too, and they're the observers"?

I don't think it's supposed to be read as anything other than "We know that you had outside help and will send people in to find proof"

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Forensics, I think the idea is.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Delenn was supposed to be androgynous originally

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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mojo1701a posted:

Ah, Babylon 5 thread, how I've missed you!

I don't stray into TVIV much these days, so it took me a while to realize someone made a new one.

I finally did a rewatch of the series last winter, and holy poo poo, did I actually notice some of the plot lines and hints start coming together.

Confession time: I kind of gave up a few episodes into season 5. My computer's dvd player was having issues, and I didn't feel like walking downstairs with my newly-purchased box set to watch it on the blu-ray player.

You have chosen... poorly

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Wait wrong franchise

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

Ask me about my calm and reasonable opinions on cycling!

I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Believers is great

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Data Graham posted:

"Passing Through Gethsemane": boy you guys weren't kidding about this dude being conflicted. Not just about religion, but I'm pretty sure that comes across as a pro-death-penalty stance to boot.

I disagree that it's pro-death penalty, it's about forgiveness. Although Garibaldi is explicitly pro-death penalty, but he's a right wing loon (as Jerry Doyle was)

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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And Michael York as well!

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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I am in no way a zealot about cycling!

Cycling helmets are ABSOLUTE HARAM!


Data Graham posted:

For the Night Watch, think Stasi/"rat out your neighbors" a la eastern bloc. It becomes very clear.

Or just the Gestapo

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Data Graham posted:

Well—it has to do with certain easter eggs that might actually get someone in trouble if I elaborated here. I'll PM anyone interested.

Yes please

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Oh wow it's uh not exactly what you'd expect, thanks DG

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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mllaneza posted:

Count me in !

I haven't been this excited since I got a Jeff Conway autograph on his card from the B5 CCG.

Which one? Zack, Mister or Chief

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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It's definitely better than Chain of Command; you don't "win" interrogations by being a badass prisoner like Picard does.

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Tsaedje posted:

It could only have been better if they'd managed to get Patrick McGoohan in to be one of the interrogators (I believe this was a plan they had)

That was Knight Two (first offered to Koenig, who was ill) in And the Sky Full of Stars

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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A lot of the trouble with the telepath colony is that they're a cult and act like a cult, and cults are very distressing and confusing to be outside of

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Deakul posted:

Nah, it's Byron.

Robin Atkin Downes was the perfect casting, which also means he was the worst

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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That was more of an individual comment on Londo

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MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

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Deakul posted:

God drat it not here too.

B5 has a lot of politics in it, it's not exactly surprising.

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