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Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


B5's lost more cast than the original Star Trek.

I'm going to rewatch. Everything. Including the pilot, tonight. I have prepared with whiskey.

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Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I forgot how male they had Delenn's makeup for the pilot.

E: Londo is the best from the first words out of his mouth.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The first season is not anywhere near as bad as I always remember it being. The main characters are all good, the writing isn't really any different. The CGI is a lot worse than later, some of the minor actors are rough even by B5's standards.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


TKO is one of the episodes I see people complain about a lot. The boxing storyline isn't anything special whatever, but the Ivanova one is good. And the little watch your back at the end is great.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Nah. I'm watching it straight through and it's all enjoyable. Even the bad ones are fun in their badness.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


JMS explained it, in the actual Navy to keep your flight pay you have to fly a certain number of hours a month, regardless of your rank or position. Same applies in Earthforce, they mention it later in the series.

Also you want to use your actors and stuff but there is a real world justification too.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


On Londo's accent, the best part is they specifically told him not to do that and he'd say okay, then when the cameras rolled Jurasik went with that crazy rear end vampire accent thing and they couldn't make him stop it so they just went with it. Then you see a few of the other old family types have a similar one. I liked that the Centauri had a range of accents, the Minbari did sort of too.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The Minbari are the only major race with a single religion though. The Narn have multiple and the Centauri have a complicated pantheon that has a big range of interpretations.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Almost every time something comes up in B5 and you think "this seems important I wonder if it'll come up later" the answer is yes.

Also a lot of the times when something happens and you don't even notice it four seasons later it'll come back and your mind is blown. For all B5's flaws I've never seen another show that connects together so well. I don't think there are any episodes that don't connect with the overall plot in some fashion. Some more than others but all of them do at least a bit.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Data Graham posted:

Hahaha holy poo poo are you kidding me



Now that's grounding it in reality

Zima being the only product to survive into the 2200s is my favorite joke of the entire show.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The point was Londo didn't want any Earth observers because they would see Londo's new friends, and Londo doesn't want anyone knowing about his new friends. So in order to keep the secret Londo backs down and lets the Narns leave.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I don't think Delenn was androgynous, I thought she was straight up supposed to be male the first season but the makeup/voice changing didn't work at all and rather than intentionally have a lovely thing they just switched to female.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


B5's bloodlust cannot be slaked.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The Vorlons are really sinister if you are paying attention and not distracted by Real Kosh being cool. They did a good job with that and that there was nothing you could do with them. Vorlons killed somebody and you're pissed off. Vorlons don't give a gently caress and what are you going to do about it? That's what I thought.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The Vorlons do work with the Minbari a little but yeah, I don't think they really care. Kosh went native and did genuinely care about the younger races, so it colors our perception.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I'd say use tags, there's at least a couple people reading who are watching it for the first time.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Yeah I don't think saying there's more to the Vorlons than meets the eye is much of a spoiler. In general I don't think B5 is as reliant on surprise, there are a lot of points where they flat out tell you how things will turn out and the story is about the process of it, but there are some really good surprises. Especially with the Vorlons.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Londo did nothing wrong.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Timby posted:

Well, poo poo, now I have to know.

Me too!

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Both episodes are good but David Warner and Patrick Stewart in a room together is just magical.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Party Plane Jones posted:

I've owned the various season box sets for at least half a decade and I still haven't seen Season 5.

This is bad and you are bad. Watch season 5 it's good.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Milky Moor posted:

The stuff I think is more odd about it is the alien race who shows up, attacks B5 and boards it with lots of soldiers, but are never mentioned again and, I don't think, even given a name.

They occasionally threw in episodes like that though. Most of the time the show's dealing with relatively known space but once in a while JMS liked a little unknowable aliens from the deep stuff. Like the berserker.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


They didn't do any writing as far as I know, JMS just thought it'd be a good idea to hire a duo to play the duo. I really liked that their humor wasn't funny since humor is so culturally linked, jokes from the future probably wouldn't work for us.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I don't remember the name of the episode but the one with Morden going around asking everyone what they want might be a good S2 choice.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Milky Moor posted:

That's S1.

Oh really? Well, I still might go with that instead of a S2 one then. That sets up a ton of mysteries and should intrigue a new viewer.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I was in Japan and they still have Zima there, so I tried one.

It was as disappointing as I expected. This is my Babylon 5 story I hope you enjoyed it.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The only legal way would be to buy DVDs. I guess you could try futzing with VPNs too but I've heard they detect that now and block it. Maybe that's just Netflix?

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Was it ever explicit in the novels or anything what happened to Babylons 1-3 or are we supposed to assume the Shadows blew all of them up like they were going to do to Babylon 4?

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


God drat how has B5 lost more of its cast than loving original Star Trek

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I dunno, I always thought B5 seemed realistic. It's mostly cramped, feels very military. There's plenty of automation. I also would guess there are other command areas, C&C is likely coordinating and issuing orders to other departments.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?



the 90s exploded in here

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Marcus gets the best one liner in the series. "Who knew they were French."

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Robert Atkin Downes voices the TF2 Medic.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I think it's just that JMS can make a good thing... if he has 10+ years to work on it. B5 was the story he was carrying around in his head for ages. When he has to come up with something new fast it doesn't go as well, like the first half of season 5.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Data Graham posted:

Pivoting after O'Hare had to leave worked out pretty well.

But that's part of it. He knew the realities of making a TV show and had a planned out and way around for every character in case the actor left.

The plan was revised quite a bit as the show went, but all those years of planning showed.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


The whole Valen plot is one of the best things in the series. I'm glad they only touched time travel the one time and it was executed perfectly.

Though I've seen War Without End multiple times and am still not 100% on how all the various dude in blue suit sightings connect up.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Got to love when a network does poo poo like moving a show to different time slots every couple of weeks and show episodes in random order and then cancel it because welp nobody's watching it for some reason who knew!

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


There's some B5 podcast where they talk about episodes and it's the worst thing ever, don't bother if you come across it.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


I don't remember the name of it. There were three or four main people, one woman and a couple dudes. The episodes are like two hours long and they just s l o o o w l y recap the episode, repeating things over and over. It's a slog and not remotely interesting. It's not the one Bubbacub linked.

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Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


It might be Jumpgate. I don't know. I had no idea there were multiple ones.

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