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dougdrums
Feb 25, 2005

MORTAL KOMB---
Uh, never mind. You're basically tonguing a nuke's butthole right now.


Don Lapre posted:

AIO units often have an ethylene glycol mixture because they use aluminum radiators and copper coldplates which will corrode each other. Saves them money.

That makes sense, I don't think I'd pay that much for an AIO cooler with compatible metals anyways.

I understand the dislike of them too. Unless you've already spent a bunch of money (like > $1500 maybe), water cooling isn't necessary for a desktop computer. AIO units kind of defeat the purpose of installing a water cooling system as a fun engineering challenge / hobby. The ones I bought were old stock, I think I paid ~$60 for them. I saw that the new models go for $100 which is ridiculous afaik.

Deuce posted:

Distilled water is the go-to choice for custom cooling because it is readily available at the grocery store for a dollar per gallon. However, it should not be considered to be "non-conductive." Straight out of the bottle, its conductivity will be very low, but it will pick up ions from the metal in your loop over time, and become conductive.

"Non-conductive" labeled fluids will be much more expensive, and run into the same issue. Over time, they become conductive.

Basically, just go with distilled water and a biocide.

Yeah, the system in reference drew power on the order of megawatts, and had accompanying units that would deionize the water, monitor the conductivity, and break for no apparent reason, terrifying all of us. I figured distilled water was cheap enough to put in those things, but I forgot that it would just get ionized without any way to fix it.

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Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


dougdrums posted:

The ones I bought were old stock, I think I paid ~$60 for them. I saw that the new models go for $100 which is ridiculous afaik.


Depends on the size. 120mm can routinely be $50-$60

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16835181030

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


Don Lapre posted:

Depends on the size. 120mm can routinely be $50-$60

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...N82E16835181030

I've seen toy cars with a thicker radiator than that.


Just because a thing can be acquired cheaply doesn't mean it should be. That's basically 60$ for something hardly better than a stock cooler. Total surface area on that is likely half of a hyper 212 at best, not to mention the garbage fan on it and non adjustable pump.

Gibbo fucked around with this message at Aug 15, 2016 around 18:27

Prescription Combs
Apr 20, 2005
   6

Gibbo posted:

I've seen toy cars with a thicker radiator than that.


Just because a thing can be acquired cheap doesn't mean it should be. That's basically 60$ for something hardly better than a stock cooler. Total surface area on that is likely half of a hyper 212 at best, not to mention the garbage fan on it and non adjustable pump.

I ran an overclocked 2500k with one of these many years ago and it kept things cooler than a 212 at max load.

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


Prescription Combs posted:

I ran an overclocked 2500k with one of these many years ago and it kept things cooler than a 212 at max load.

Is the radiator thicker than that picture makes it look? The one there makes it look like a slim rad. And I double checked and I was thinking of the cryorig h7 when I was making the size comparison. I get those two mixed up.




Nonetheless, I wouldn't put a pump that only cost 60$ in any system I built so there's no way in hell I'd put in a pump that represented a fraction of that cost as part of a whole unit

Prescription Combs
Apr 20, 2005
   6

Gibbo posted:

Is the radiator thicker than that picture makes it look? The one there makes it look like a slim rad. And I double checked and I was thinking of the cryorig h7 when I was making the size comparison. I get those two mixed up.




Nonetheless, I wouldn't put a pump that only cost 60$ in any system I built so there's no way in hell I'd put in a pump that represented a fraction of that cost as part of a whole unit

Looks about like that in person. it's 27mm deep.

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


Gibbo posted:

Is the radiator thicker than that picture makes it look? The one there makes it look like a slim rad. And I double checked and I was thinking of the cryorig h7 when I was making the size comparison. I get those two mixed up.




Nonetheless, I wouldn't put a pump that only cost 60$ in any system I built so there's no way in hell I'd put in a pump that represented a fraction of that cost as part of a whole unit

Yea, my d5 costs as much as many 240mm rads.


Prescription Combs posted:

Looks about like that in person. it's 27mm deep.

And thats the enclosure. Not the actual radiator part.

dougdrums
Feb 25, 2005

MORTAL KOMB---
Uh, never mind. You're basically tonguing a nuke's butthole right now.


Prescription Combs posted:

I ran an overclocked 2500k with one of these many years ago and it kept things cooler than a 212 at max load.

Yeah one of mine is on an overclocked piledriver. I have no idea how hot it gets but I've kept it fully loaded with xop nonsense for days without it going over 70C. Not so sure I could do that with a stock cooler. Either way the machine was designed to be beat on for cheap, which it does well.

It is one of these: http://www.coolermaster.com/cooling...er/seidon-120v/

They claim the radiator is 27mm deep.

dougdrums fucked around with this message at Aug 15, 2016 around 22:53

rage-saq
Mar 21, 2001

Thats so ninja...

Oh hi watercooling thread! I just finished a watercooled build thats been scratching the back of my mind for a year or two now and I decided to make the plunge. I held off on custom loop watercooling for a while as the last time I was looking at the investment a few years back I didn't really think the parts quality was there, but these days the good gear is pretty loving good.
I used a Corsair H100i for a while and that held me over until madness took over and i went in deep with an all EK system. I bought the EK P240 kit off amazon and added a PE480 rad and some more fittings, and recently I just got my MSI Sea Hawk EK X 1070. I'm pretty happy how it came out, it was a stupid amount of money but doing a stupid overkill build for fun was a lot of the point.

To support some statements others have made ITT, the D5 pump even at 100% speed is almost completely silent. As in even if you get your ear right up next to it you might not think it is on and working. Also, a good custom loop setup can have its fans run at ~800rpm even when your CPU and GPU are at 100% utilization and that is pretty close to silent.

VulgarandStupid
Aug 5, 2003

YEAH

LICK MY ASS

BITCH


I ran an H50 on my 965 BE, years ago. Seemed to work just fine, I don't see what all the complaints are for. Air cooling has improved since then, but even more importantly, TDP has gone down.

New Zealand can eat me
Aug 29, 2008

I LIKE TO SMOKE DONGS. IF I HAVENT MENTIONED MY BLACK SATURN ASTRA MY ACCOUNT HAS BEEN STOLEN


Nice! Do you think we'll ever see self-contained/all-in-one units that are as pretty as this? The transparency is very cool (They might already exist I haven't really looked since I built)

I've been using an H80 on my 2600k since December 2011, when should I expect it to die? Have had zero issues and really couldn't be happier with it.

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


Once the five year warranty is up is replace it

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


Don Lapre posted:

Once the five year warranty is up is replace it

I'm pretty sure they only had a two year warranty back then so he's playing with fire already. That was one of the things that corsair improved and a lot of companies didn't. I'm not sure of that actually accompanied switching to a better integrated pump or not though.




Edit; don't just chuck it though. You can use it for joke builds, potentially cut out the rad and do things with it, and use the base slug and mounting hardware for silly mods. (or sell it off cheap to someone else that wants it for that.) (I'm potentially one of those people from time to time.)



I've been in the hospital for eight days today, and I'm going crazy. Been spending a good chunk of my time just browsing overclockers and wanting to get back to doing stupid poo poo with old hardware.

I may finally get around to building myself a radbox that I can stick out the window when the summer starts to wind down too.

Gibbo fucked around with this message at Aug 16, 2016 around 14:06

rage-saq
Mar 21, 2001

Thats so ninja...

I LIKE TO SMOKE WEE posted:

Nice! Do you think we'll ever see self-contained/all-in-one units that are as pretty as this? The transparency is very cool (They might already exist I haven't really looked since I built)

I've been using an H80 on my 2600k since December 2011, when should I expect it to die? Have had zero issues and really couldn't be happier with it.

Well, it depends on what you want to consider comparable. The EKWB Predator system is pretty close, its expandable with pre-made "blocks" of pre-filled/fitted components you can get from the EKWB web store and uses fairly good, but not the "best" components. You could also build your own expansion blocks by ordering and building the components yourself. However, at this point you are building a custom loop but you are retaining some of tradeoffs the predator system and the pricing is fairly close to one of their custom loop kits.
The Predator 240 system is fairly close in both price and features to an EKWB L240 kit. However, in my opinion, if you plan on building an expanded system you would be better served by getting a EKWB P-series kit instead of the L series as you are getting the better water block and a quiter pump with better mounting options.

Here is my opinion on a decision point for predator vs custom loop kit.

Chose the predator if you are going for a small setup in a case with not a lot of watercooling mounting options. The 240 is sufficient for a CPU alone at fairly low noise level but would get a bit noisy with a GPU in the loop, while the 360 should be able to handle a CPU and GPU at low-moderate noise level. Adding additional pumps/radiators seems a little silly vs going custom loop to begin with, but I suppose its certainly possible without having to replace anything.

Chose the EKWB kit if you have room in your case for a more expansive setup, want to expand more down the road / tweak the hell out of your system or if you want to get your noise level very, very low.

RiperSnifel
Jul 13, 2007

Pull the handle, let it go, now you know you're ready to roll.

I had a thermaltake aio for a while and it kinda sucked. Now I have a swiftech h240x with some noctua fans on it and it totally rules and is drat quiet.

NihilismNow
Aug 31, 2003


Does anyone still run bong style watercoolers? Those supposedly got really great performance but were a bit of a pain maintenance wise.

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


NihilismNow posted:

Does anyone still run bong style watercoolers? Those supposedly got really great performance but were a bit of a pain maintenance wise.

This?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsQKyAswAPI

NihilismNow
Aug 31, 2003



Yeah, though i doubt you need 2 towers. I once saw these benchmarked against a big automotive racing radiator and even a single tower does better.

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


NihilismNow posted:

Does anyone still run bong style watercoolers? Those supposedly got really great performance but were a bit of a pain maintenance wise.

I don't think anyone ever really ran bong as a long term solution. Maybe a long time ago and some weirdo that really liked having their room above 90% humidity?


Every now and then though someone will still do it as a giggle. It doesn't have to be that expensive.

Wouldn't be that bad if you had a bunch of tropical pets I guess.

PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

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Wouldn't you just be running water in your loop, then? And have to deal with the problems associated with running only pure water.

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


PerrineClostermann posted:

Wouldn't you just be running water in your loop, then? And have to deal with the problems associated with running only pure water.

Which is another reason is not a good long term solution. Your options are evaporate chemicals into the air you breathe, or deal with growth.

Welmu
Oct 9, 2007
Metri. Piiri. Sekunti.

Radiators: it possible to use bottom fillport as an inlet and two ports at the top as outlets (that lead into a reservoir)?

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


Welmu posted:

Radiators: it possible to use bottom fillport as an inlet and two ports at the top as outlets (that lead into a reservoir)?



Thats designed to be a drain port. If you want a radiator like that you get a crossflow.

http://mnpctech.com/pc-computer-alp...flow-radiators/

rage-saq
Mar 21, 2001

Thats so ninja...

Yes, you don't want to split your watercooling loop into multiple paths.

PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

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I've seen some loops sharing a reservoir between a cpu and gpu loop.

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


PerrineClostermann posted:

I've seen some loops sharing a reservoir between a cpu and gpu loop.

But its a single continuous loop. It doesn't break off into multiple paths.

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


Don Lapre posted:

But its a single continuous loop. It doesn't break off into multiple paths.

If you have a large enough reso with enough outlets(or just a big tub of water) , you can run two parallel loops off of it. Since the pumps are providing suction, it's not like one won't get water.

It needs to be pretty large and have vortex prevention and a number of other things though.



Not at all what welmu is asking though

PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

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The order of your parts in a loop doesn't really matter much, right? Other than having your res feed your pump.

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


PerrineClostermann posted:

The order of your parts in a loop doesn't really matter much, right? Other than having your res feed your pump.

Correct

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


It does makes a technical difference but to such a small degree that no, it really doesn't matter.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014




Tortured By Flan

It does matter that you don't use the fill/drain port in the middle of the intended flow path of a radiator -- lest you set up a situation where water isn't actually being forced through radiator fins.

Deuce
Jun 18, 2004
Mile High Club

Potato Salad posted:

It does matter that you don't use the fill/drain port in the middle of the intended flow path of a radiator -- lest you set up a situation where water isn't actually being forced through radiator fins.

My understanding of fluid dynamics is that water will flow at equal pressure through all available paths. So, assuming both ports were open, water would go through both. And since the normal path is in one, out the other, we can assume this hits all the radiator fins.

If you closed off one, yes, you'd probably stagnate water in half of your radiator.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014




Tortured By Flan

Deuce posted:

My understanding of fluid dynamics is that water will flow at equal pressure through all available paths. So, assuming both ports were open, water would go through both. And since the normal path is in one, out the other, we can assume this hits all the radiator fins.

If you closed off one, yes, you'd probably stagnate water in half of your radiator.

If you are absolutely sure you don't have a cooler that takes advantage of crossflow to increase efficiency or want to ignore that feature altogether, knock yourself out.

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


That's not order of components. That's using the correct inputs and reading instructions.

I'm Still in the goddamn hospital and part of my daily activities is browsing various tech forums and reading the panicked posts of people who either overclocked or water-cooled for the first time without doing enough reading first.

PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

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Those are always face palm inducing.

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


The first time I wanted to overclock anything I had to go buy a "special" (2b is only special when you're 13 and live in a town of 6000 people) pencil and draw a goddamn line on my goddamn processor. I made drat sure I wasn't going to gently caress up because we did not have the money to replace that poo poo.


BACK IN MY DAY.

PerrineClostermann
Dec 15, 2012

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"Back in my day" you had to pay a thousand dollars to get an unlocked multiplier.

FSB OCing, for when you need the entire machine to run faster.

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


Yea I changed the jumper so my pentium 60 ran at 66mhz

Gibbo
Sep 13, 2008

"yes James. Remove that from my presence. It... Offends me" *sips overpriced wine*


Yeah I realize I'm not actually that old but I'm almost thirty so I thought I'd try it out.

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Welmu
Oct 9, 2007
Metri. Piiri. Sekunti.

Deuce posted:

My understanding of fluid dynamics is that water will flow at equal pressure through all available paths. So, assuming both ports were open, water would go through both. And since the normal path is in one, out the other, we can assume this hits all the radiator fins.

This. Water is pumped in via the bottom fillport and through two outlets straight into an 800ml reservoir. Crossflow isn't an option as they don't make ridiculously oversized ones:



Do I need a 560 xXx Monsta? No. Wall-mounted in a custom case, will it quietly keep my rig cool? Yes.

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