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Frosted Flake posted:I have a serious question about this stuff: Do some of these concepts create examples of themselves? Yeah probably. I mean, it's helpful to have labels and words sometimes to describe complex emotions we feel because it can help us navigate our inner selves (imagine trying to think to yourself about complex ideas with no language, or tribespeople who have no strong concept of numbers past like 10 maybe trying to do calculus), but yeah at some point it's just academics self perpetuating. e: just so someone doesn't jump down my throat on the tribespeople thing: http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2004/08/20/1181286.htm?site=science/tricks&topic=latest quote:There are only about 200 Piraha and they live in groups of 10 to 20. Their words for numbers appear limited to "one," "two" and "many," and the word for "one" sometimes means a small quantity.
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Aug 25, 2016 21:59
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Moridin920 posted:Occupy was a bunch of bourgie white people for the most part too, for that exact reason. I remember all the media hype and one person interviewed was a freshman from Miami U who talked about how he heard the news and drove straight up there. He was sharing a tent with a female Occupy person and talked about how upset his girlfriend was but he was here making a difference.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:00
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Frosted Flake posted:I have a serious question about this stuff: Do some of these concepts create examples of themselves? All this stuff + trigger warnings are just a byproduct of living in a prosperous country with a strong government. Would any of this matter if the government failed and there was no police to enforce the laws ? Or would we just degrade into a society where violence = power like the rest of the places in the world where this happened ?
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Aug 25, 2016 22:08
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pentyne posted:He was sharing a tent with a female Occupy person and talked about how upset his girlfriend was but he was here making a difference. lol
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Aug 25, 2016 22:08
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The letter was a dumb idea and was inviting controversy. I'm all for protecting academic freedom from knee-jerk students, but the tone and timing was not on point. Better to deal with situations as they arise and use them as moments to spell out to students why it's better for them to confront ideas that they deem uncomfortable in a college setting, rather than shut themselves away from the world. I mean, there have been academics discussing the downsides of trigger warnings with regards to academic freedom and open classrooms for a while now, so it's possible to go about it in a better manner. Now U of Chicago's stance on the Columbia NLRB ruling on grad student unions might be more worthy of real discussion, particularly for grad students attending the school. Zimmer is clearly not a fan. Interesting take on the matter: http://blog.lareviewofbooks.org/essays/union-libel-argument-collective-bargaining-higher-ed/ Edit: Also, re-reading the letter, I think confrontational may be a bit strong. Poorly timed is probably more accurate. Any response to this type of letter in 2016, especially online, is going to probably be bad. Kind of obvious. Now the tone about the grad student union thing is certainly less inviting. Fire Barrel fucked around with this message at 22:19 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 22:10
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Fire Barrel posted:The letter was a dumb idea and was inviting controversy. I'm all for protecting academic freedom from knee-jerk students, but the tone and timing was not on point. Better to deal with situations as they arise and use them as moments to spell out to students why it's better for them to confront ideas that they deem uncomfortable in a college setting, rather than shut themselves away from the world. Also, do it in a manner that is less confrontational. Yeah It kinda read like some administrator was pissed about something related haha.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:13
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Fire Barrel posted:The letter was a dumb idea and was inviting controversy. I'm all for protecting academic freedom from knee-jerk students, but the tone and timing was not on point. Better to deal with situations as they arise and use them as moments to spell out to students why it's better for them to confront ideas that they deem uncomfortable in a college setting, rather than shut themselves away from the world. Also, do it in a manner that is less confrontational. You sound triggered.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:15
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Frog Act posted:i'm a grad student so if i play my cards right i will literally never leave college I made this gamble once (the most dangerous game)
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Aug 25, 2016 22:16
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Aww.. was the note too harsh of tone for you... go play with crayons to feel better
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Aug 25, 2016 22:18
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We have a very litigious society in which the best way to avoid court around contentious issues of interpretation is to be as black-and-white as possible. So I can definitely understand why a school would be like "responsibility and care for your mental health and peace of mind rests on you, not the school, take it or leave it".
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Aug 25, 2016 22:21
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Spunky Psycho Ho posted:Aww.. was the note too harsh of tone for you... go play with crayons to feel better In retrospect it came off like that, but honestly I think it's good that university's stick by their faculty and freedom of expression on campus, even if students whine about it. Striking books from syllabi or something to make students happy is loving pathetic. More a criticism of the timing of it. Luckily I don't remember undergrads being quite so thin-skinned when I was one. OMGVBFLOL posted:We have a very litigious society in which the best way to avoid court around contentious issues of interpretation is to be as black-and-white as possible. So I can definitely understand why a school would be like "responsibility and care for your mental health and peace of mind rests on you, not the school, take it or leave it". There's other paper work for students to sign while applying/confirming their application to the school. Though, I don't really remember my welcome letter, so maybe it had a bit more meat to it's content than I remember. Although I do agree. Academic institutions have enough to worry about without becoming the guardians of their students' mental health. And, like it or not, college students are technically adults. Gotta learn to take care of yourself, especially in the light of new/uncomfortable ideas, on your own. Fire Barrel fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 22:22
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gently caress yes
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Aug 25, 2016 22:23
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OMGVBFLOL posted:We have a very litigious society in which the best way to avoid court around contentious issues of interpretation is to be as black-and-white as possible. So I can definitely understand why a school would be like "responsibility and care for your mental health and peace of mind rests on you, not the school, take it or leave it". But kids entering college expect 4 years of sex, drugs and fun - make babby take self-responsibility and all of a sudden they've been violated
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Aug 25, 2016 22:25
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Spunky Psycho Ho posted:Aww.. was the note too harsh of tone for you... go play with crayons to feel better It sounded like a dumb crybaby overreacting to a trigger warning boogeyman. EDIT: Would this be an appropriate use of the word 'ironic'?
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Aug 25, 2016 22:29
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also, hell yea
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Aug 25, 2016 22:30
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Kaedric posted:It sounded like a dumb crybaby overreacting to a trigger warning boogeyman. no, keep trying though
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Aug 25, 2016 22:30
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je1 healthcare posted:Well that's a good way to get your school free advertising on a bunch of conservative clickbait sites Oh haha those zany Racist uncles
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Aug 25, 2016 22:32
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EugeneJ posted:But kids entering college expect 4 years of sex, drugs and fun - make babby take self-responsibility and all of a sudden they've been violated I suspect that isn't the case for anyone getting legitimately mad about the letter. Also, I've heard grad students from the U of Chicago say that that it's not a very fun school in general for undergrads. Also, one final thing about the letter proper, I think it is on point as describing safe spaces as a "retreat" from ideas they don't like. That's actually why the AAUP released their own statement against trigger warnings/safe spaces a few years back.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:32
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naem posted:I made this gamble once (the most dangerous game) how did it go for you? people are telling me to start thinknig about a PHD program and my professors are all confident i could probably find funding but like, the life of an academic these days sucks poo poo so hard
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Aug 25, 2016 22:38
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Their economics department triggers me
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Aug 25, 2016 22:38
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the real problem with college students today is that they can neither read nor write. this whole feelings thing is overblown, we should address the overwhelming illiteracy issue first and foremost. make people read books and poo poo
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Aug 25, 2016 22:39
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mdm posted:Their economics department triggers me same, unironically
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Aug 25, 2016 22:39
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Frog Act posted:the real problem with college students today is that they can neither read nor write. this whole feelings thing is overblown, we should address the overwhelming illiteracy issue first and foremost. make people read books and poo poo Didn't US schools stop teaching cursive a few years ago? Signatures are a thing of the past
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Aug 25, 2016 22:41
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this thread is too edgy for me
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Aug 25, 2016 22:42
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EugeneJ posted:Didn't US schools stop teaching cursive a few years ago? cursive doesn't matter, its being able to process and articulate ideas that matters, fuckin type it up or whatever its 2016
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Aug 25, 2016 22:43
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Gaunab posted:this thread is too edgy for me is it because of this? how does that dog make you feel?
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Aug 25, 2016 22:43
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Fire Barrel posted:The letter was a dumb idea and was inviting controversy. I'm all for protecting academic freedom from knee-jerk students, but the tone and timing was not on point. Better to deal with situations as they arise and use them as moments to spell out to students why it's better for them to confront ideas that they deem uncomfortable in a college setting, rather than shut themselves away from the world.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:44
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Pretty sure this message from U Chicago is simply a dogwhistle for the fact that they are in a poo poo neighborhood
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Aug 25, 2016 22:45
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Frog Act posted:same, unironically Third. Was a rough four years walking by it everyday.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:48
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the invisible hand groped ym donger
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Aug 25, 2016 22:50
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Frog Act posted:how did it go for you? people are telling me to start thinknig about a PHD program and my professors are all confident i could probably find funding but like, the life of an academic these days sucks poo poo so hard Depending on the field/program/school, funding can be hit or miss. History, a field really experiencing some woes in this regard, is a good example of this. Early Modern England, for example, is a hard sell and fewer schools are going to seriously fund those types of programs/grad students. Modern US or Modern China? They generally have better funding. Then again, some grad programs also prevent you from working outside jobs, making low stipends even harder, especially for humanities students. If you're really committed to the field you can push through. Otherwise, you can sometimes find professional degree programs that allow you to use your education thus far while learning technical skills and the like. Frog Act posted:the real problem with college students today is that they can neither read nor write. this whole feelings thing is overblown, we should address the overwhelming illiteracy issue first and foremost. make people read books and poo poo As for this point, low quality writing was sadly common when I was a TA, I saw a lot of this poo poo. Especially when I had a prof that gave more short answer questions. Lot of shallow, choppy writing and a lot of students always wanted to turn test problems into simple yes/no questions. Even happened during discussion sections when they were trying to talk through primary sources. To do anything about that problem, though, you'd have to start with K-12 education imo.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:50
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GORILLA BASTARD posted:University of Chicago Tells Incoming Students: Don't Expect Safe Spaces or Trigger Warnings Goddamn, thank you Chicago.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:53
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lol if u get triggered by anything
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Aug 25, 2016 22:54
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Y'know I know that there really are snotty little shits that misappropriate legitimate psychology terms who need to be put in their place, but I also cringe when I read news stories like this because they're made for dorks who are far too eager to gang up on privileged leftist kids than is healthy. Frosted Flake posted:Chiming in about Counselling Psychology to ask if the program attracts broken people or creates them? Raging egomaniacs who think they can bring kindness and cleverness to influence the world in a social direction they agree with, ironically unaware that most of the time kindness means deliberately choosing the less clever short-term solution.
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Aug 25, 2016 22:55
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Fire Barrel posted:Depending on the field/program/school, funding can be hit or miss. History, a field really experiencing some woes in this regard, is a good example of this. Early Modern England, for example, is a hard sell and fewer schools are going to seriously fund those types of programs/grad students. Modern US or Modern China? They generally have better funding. Then again, some grad programs also prevent you from working outside jobs, making low stipends even harder, especially for humanities students. If you're really committed to the field you can push through. yeah i'm doing my thesis on late-20th century intellectual history and philosophy so i doubt i'll be able to secure funding to write baout that kind of arcane nonsense, which is a shame, because i love history more than anything. just seems like a history PHD right now would be a bad idea. also, yeah, stipends suck, i'm not allowed to work another job and i make ~10k a year as a TA. grad students in other departments make almost twice that, the fuckers re: writing i'm with you, it needs to start super early, because people are genuinely unable to string together a coherent sentence, much less grapple w/serious complicated ideas. i had a student last semester mix up the Ayatollah, Richard Nixon, and Fidel Castro into one aggregate dictator who somehow ruled from Mexico
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Aug 25, 2016 22:55
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misogynist
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Aug 25, 2016 22:55
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Fire Barrel posted:The letter was a dumb idea and was inviting controversy. I'm all for protecting academic freedom from knee-jerk students, but the tone and timing was not on point. Better to deal with situations as they arise and use them as moments to spell out to students why it's better for them to confront ideas that they deem uncomfortable in a college setting, rather than shut themselves away from the world. Honestly I would be OK if the letter said "If you want a safe space, get hosed. If you want trigger warnings, here's your last one: 3.. 2.. 1.. go gently caress yourself. Good luck in the coming school year." Both of these things need to loving die. It's like we've put up with so many years of right-motivated censors, the last thing we need is left-motivated ones, because censorship in general sucks. If people can't confront and overcome their differences, nothing is ever going to truly improve. It's a self-defeating bunch of bullshit to make anyone who disagrees with them the villain. Blazing Ownager fucked around with this message at 22:59 on Aug 25, 2016 |
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Aug 25, 2016 22:56
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Blazing Ownager posted:Honestly I would be OK if the letter said "If you want a safe space, get hosed. If you want trigger warnings, here's your last one: 3.. 2.. 1.. go gently caress yourself. Good luck in the coming school year." wow....you owned them!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Aug 25, 2016 22:58
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after how many trigger warnings do u actually shoot? u can only mind trigger safety when operating a gun so much. i mean its designed to be fired
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Aug 25, 2016 22:58
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to be fair maybe being in Chi-raq is a sufficient trigger warning enough
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Aug 25, 2016 23:03
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