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Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Horseshoe theory is basically one of the ways centrists jerk themselves off for never actually believing in anything so I wouldn't take it too seriously.

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Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

teen witch posted:

One of the few pros of being Facebook friends with tankies is tankie infighting is this hilarious overblown nerd slapfest.

The cons are the massive amounts of off the wall apologia. I'd kill to never see another TeleSUR article in my future.

I love tankie poo poo on twitter because they are SO GODDAMNED SERIOUS about stuff that they will never have any impact on. I guess in the absence of any ability to affect the world having the correctest takes becomes super important.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

A White Guy posted:

The reason they're not more culturally relevant is that their credibility came and went with the Soviet Union. It's hard to be a credible communist wingnut when you have such a glaring example of the failure of your ideology to point to.

They'll have their day again, someday, but with the current almost-relevance of a few alt-right shitheads, that might not come for a while.

And not only that but it's an ideology that the rest of the left absolutely loving despises.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Tankies insisting that democrats yelling about Putin are red-baiting have a bizarrely inflated sense of their ideology's national prominence and relevance.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

I used to hang out in IRC with the folks who took over /r/communism and made it what it is today. They used to be really funny! And over time, less and less so.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.


There's a bunch to laugh at here but I like most of all the idea that "antifa" is an organization.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

It is probably not real helpful for some of the more visible, accessible faces the hard left presents to the world be constant strings of gulag jokes.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

It's not tankies but it seems like the way to conclude an article excoriating anarchists for being unable to stop police officers from murdering black people with impunity (which the whole time reads like it's building up to calling for the killing of cops) is probably not with a call to cast spells on cops.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Baronjutter posted:

I don't think women should be allowed to vote, not because I hate women, but because the political system is corrupt and states are bad!!

This was not an altogether uncommon view among anarchists, most notably Emma Goldman, during the suffrage campaign- that it was a waste of time and an attempt to make women complicit in bourgeois democracy. Of course, that's an easier view to hold when you're pretty sure revolution is imminent.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Osama Dozen-Dongs posted:

It's because that's exactly what they did. The entire Soviet economy was based on stealing from the more productive Warsaw pact colonies allies, and the lion's share of the loot went to the nobles party members while the proles queued for bread.

One of the more obnoxious habits of Marxist-Leninists is the use of "imperialism" to mean "American, and only American, foreign policy".

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

The YPG prefers American occupation to being butchered and Twitter MLs are pissed.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

get that OUT of my face posted:

There's nothing you can say in a Twitter thread that can't be explained better and clearer in a Medium post.

Yeah, but according to Alexandra Erin, many, many more people read her stuff when she posts it as a Twitter thread than on medium.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Precisely what is going on with tankies on Twitter thinking ISIS works for the US? Is it because they're anti-Assad?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

I straight up see people say ISIS works for the CIA and ISIS are US contras, it's bizarre.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

I'm sorry, is the argument here that only Americans care about white supremacy or have whiteness as a concept?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Silver2195 posted:

I think it's more than only Americans treat "whiteness" as the most significant category in determining who's an "Other" and who isn't. Though even then, I think "whiteness" has a similar status in, e.g., Australia.

Europe is white supremacist as hell they just like to pretend otherwise.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

trapped mouse posted:

Leftists get into bickering, and some like to point out to tankies that the only people they admire are white (and asian) men, pretty much exclusively. Rather than give up their philosophy of "Unless you were a high ranking member in a communist dictatorship you are literally human garbage" they try to argue there was more genetic diversity between all the (exclusively) men that they admire.

Edit: It's pretty much a troll argument, but somehow "You're racist/sexist" leads to tankies getting defensive way more than saying "Maybe you shouldn't murder every other person that doesn't feel the way you do"

Be fair, they also like Rosa Luxembourg because doing so lets them claim that anybody who is a leftist but not an ML is objectively a Nazi collaborator.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

It's part of how MLs like to conflate "communism" and "Marxism-Leninism". Rosa Luxembourg is a useful hammer against people they vote as liberals, therefore she was good and her murder was one of the greatest crimes against communism and socdems are objectively Nazis.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

It's a really popular idea among tankies that fascism is just terminal liberalism, and while that's not entirely wrong (it's definitely important to understand the connections and how one can give rise to the other) the facile "therefore anything that is liberal is fascist, also per Mao anything that is not working tirelessly toward communism is liberal, therefore everybody who disagrees with me is fascist" is not useful for anything other than making tankies feel good.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Tankies generally prefer hating liberals over doing actual analysis and now see anything that looks like compromise with or participation in liberalism as far worse than doing nothing, especially since it's actually 1975, Mao is still alive, and he's going to lead the revolution any day now. Or perhaps it's the 1930's and the labor movement is at its strongest and Stalin will send support for the revolution which is totally happening within such a short timeframe that working to lessen the harm being done is surely wasted effort.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Anti-Germans continue to be the loving worst.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

A few nights ago I went down the rabbit-hole of reading about Hoxhaism. From what I gather, it's a pro-Stalin pro-Mao anti-Imperialist yet pro-Nationalist movement of some sort? And reminiscent of the "takfiris" in Islam in that they take it on themselves to define non-Hoxhaists as non-communist.

To be fair that's a feature of virtually every version of Marxism-Leninism. The only real communists are Marxists, the only real Marxists are Leninists, the only real Marxist-Leninists are [my tendency], the only real Marxist-Leninist-[founder of my tendency]ists are [members of my cadre]...

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

Is Bakunin popular with tankies, or is he too decadent/reactionary/counter-revolutionary/etc for them?

I'm just fond of his line: When the people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called "the People's Stick".

Are you kidding? Bakunin defied Marx, they hate him.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

TinTower posted:

Some of the batshit left here in the UK think that that Skirpal was poisoned by MI6 or even Mossad.

Because Mossad want to poison a Russian defector for… reasons?

Reasons which I'm sure are completely unrelated to antisemitism in every way.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Mr. Sunshine posted:

If you honestly believe in a rigid class hierarchy with clearly defined classes and also that all social and political conflict arise from conflicts between those classes, I guess you're gonna end up with a pretty black-and-white view of the world where possessing class signifiers (owning an expensive horse or employing wage labourers, for example) is the same as belonging to the class in question, sharing the class' goals etc.

It also helps explain how someone can claim with a straight face that a place like the Soviet Union or North Korea is a classless society - because the ruling elite no longer fits your preconceived idea of what a class is.

A lot of dumb tankie poo poo comes down to abandoning actual analysis in favor of shortcuts like this (redefining "imperialism" to "The USA" produces a lot of this nonsense) without really realizing you've done it.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Tacky-rear end Rococco posted:

lol at posters who are so salty that nobody cares about their immortal science that they've had to sally forth to its defense.

In the immortal science of Marxism-Leninism, we study the mistakes of past socialist leaders and learn from them. And as soon as a socialist leader makes a mistake, we can get started!

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

gradenko_2000 posted:

People tend to misconstrue the idea of being anti-interventionist with also having to justify the proposed target as not actually being that bad.

Which ironically is a viewpoint you can only get to by accepting interventionist logic.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

https://twitter.com/4kshatra/status...9364125698?s=19

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

T-Paine was an LF superstar if memory serves.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

They other things he writes in, per this Twitter thread, are Infowars and the Ron Paul Institute.

https://twitter.com/4kshatra/status...7647296513?s=19

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

https://twitter.com/PeopleRepellent...358132182208514

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Didn't Khameini participate in killing a bunch of Iranian communists after the revolution?

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

I've mentioned before that it seems like the resurgent demsoc left of recent years and the traditional 'far-left', aka tankies, are basically entirely different movements with very little overlap. The authoritarian-libertarian axis was added to the traditional spectrum to try to reconcile this divide, along with other political language rapidly changing between groups. A lot of the latter seem like basically the 'gently caress you dad' edgelords of the day gravitating to a political alignment opposed to everything that the dominant culture stands for but has its own role models and heroes to look up to, and stuck in the Cold War mindset. Nowadays nobody takes tankies seriously, not even the feds, so to get a reaction you need to go full Nazi. (which has its perks in that the cops and other ham-fisted authoritarians will actually support you)

The authoritarian-libertarian axis has been there since there's been a concept of socialism. I mean, hell, "property is theft" goes back to Proudhon and the First International was in large part the formalization of the rift between authoritarian and libertarian socialism.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

I'm still really confused by the use of "radical feminism" to mean things other than "patriarchy is so deeply built into society that every aspect of society must be torn down and rebuilt", in opposition to liberal reformist feminism.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Deceitful Penguin posted:

Words are hard for some people lol
I know enough, but while they're obviously well represented in these discussions (duh) they're still a tiny minority overall and so you're far more likely to encounter these arguments from others.
Yes yes, whereas the legaliziation model has been a resounding success in not only in increasing trafficking and further entrenching surprise sex culture and the patriarchy but has benefitted the pimps and johns far more than it has the prostituted.

The fact that Germany and the Netherlands are already moving away from their systems is surely just a coincidence and that the Nordics are still the greatest place for women to live in is truly just a strange coincidence unrelated to that

FYI the use of "prostituted"' in this context is a huge red flag

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

TapTheForwardAssist posted:

Since tankies are into the whole revolutionary vanguardist thing, are US tankies generally against gun control in the US?

Yes, absolutely. Since revolution is right around the corner, any attempt or desire to relieve the working class of their guns can only result in preventing the revolution.

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

https://twitter.com/D0GGEAUX/status/1023339436346470400

Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

He's talking about sex like it's a black and white binary and clearly thinks that's important and something that the state should be involved in and that's at the very least a hostility to a modern, educated understanding of sex and gender and to people whose lived experiences of sex and gender don't match with his views, and I'm p comfortable calling that transphobia

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Pope Guilty
Nov 6, 2006

The human animal is a beautiful and terrible creature, capable of limitless compassion and unfathomable cruelty.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Isn't this basically the spanish civil war?

That's more "murdered anarchists and died".

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