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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



redeyes posted:

Hot sex. Still, not 1000x greater endurance than NAND like the hype said way back when.

Might have been oversold but this is also the first iteration of this brand new memory type

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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Wasn't someone here adamant that there is no NAND shortage and it was just clickbait

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Bunch of hardware sites are posting Optane info
https://arstechnica.com/information...lso-use-as-ram/
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/in...800x,33938.html
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11208...d-xpoint-memory

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Mar 19, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



It's got interesting use cases in enterprise environments sure, but it won't help me load my FO4 load times so I don't see the point

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



priznat posted:

Non volatile storage that is (almost) as fast as DRAM is the holy grail, so cache won't be lost with a power failure without having to use supercaps or batteries to back it up to nand.

I wonder if the Xpoint is fast enough for raid controller memory and such.

There's definitely a niche for it!

Yeah it presents some interesting sounding (but unproven or theoretical) use cases and I die a little inside when people post "yeah but a 960 pro is bigger and look at this rate sequential read speed who cares"

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Intel released some info on the Optane cache product
https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...per-fast-cache/

quote:

The Optane Memory drives will be available to order on April 24th. A 16GB drive costs $44 while a 32GB drive costs $77.

$44 is well in the "ah gently caress why not" category of random purchases for my computer

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



ConanTheLibrarian posted:

Except it takes up an M2 slot that would be much better used for another SSD.


Does anyone have an example of a consumer application that would actually benefit from Optane's better latency but not better sequential R/W characteristics? After all, Samsung 960s are already fast enough that storage speed is no longer the bottleneck for most applications.

Apparently lots of new computers are still shipped with rotational drives and the apparent NAND shortage makes things worse.

And I've got two m.2 slots on my mATX board that also has 2 rotational drives in it, so for $44 why not.

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Anandtech has some more indepth numbers on Optane
http://www.anandtech.com/show/11209...ise-performance

And Tom
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews...4800x,5030.html

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 17:01 on Apr 20, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Review of the Optane system accelerator up
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews...emory,5032.html

http://www.anandtech.com/show/11210...by-lake-caching

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



GRINDCORE MEGGIDO posted:

In the comments for the optane articles, people are mentioning how Intel's original released specs have been totally missed. They're being shut down by comments like "Intel didn't specify gen 1"

Isn't Samsung getting in on a low QD / latency optimised SSD?

It's a first productized release of a brand new media that is still faster than the fastest NAND SSDs, that's pretty impressive. Even missing the marketing hype numbers the numbers still look really good. Capacity/cost is an issue, a big one, but the rest looks drat good

Ak Gara posted:

Intel Optane talk:
It's for people with newer kabylake CPU's and newer mobo's with M2 slots but running old HDD's and not SSD's as it doesn't help SSD's. ?

Why would it not? It's faster than current SSDs and you'll get a performance boost. It won't be as noticeable as with a HDD. The Tom's Hardware review paired it up with a crappier Intel 600p and it got a performance boost. Whether or not you would have just used the Optane cost to upgrade from a 600p to a 960 is a different story. A 512GB 960 was almost twice the cost of a 600 though last I checked. Not sure if you'd actually notice the performance difference in actual usage though

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Apr 27, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



GRINDCORE MEGGIDO posted:

I think the tech will be great. But this iteration of it, with the limited size, is absolutely useless for desktop users.

For the enthusiast crowd that already owns high capacity SSDs, sure. The NAND shortage probably creates a scenario where OEMs probably don't want to buy high capacity NAND drives and this lets them get away with putting Optane in front of a 2TB rotational drive and market it both on speed and capacity. I don't think the caching scenario is as limited in appeal as most enthusiasts believe

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 03:34 on Apr 27, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



SlayVus posted:

Linus did a small performance test with Optane and an SSD. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgTYSsaNU_A TL;DW, Optane is just as fast as an SSD when used as a Cache, but sometimes slower. Better to save money for an actual SSD.

There is a performance difference when accelerating SSDs but as he said it's mostly noticeable in synthetic benchmarks. Tom's synthetic benchmarks also showed an improvement

The real problem I have with it is limiting it to new chipsets and processors. Takes away from the value proposition. But I guess marketing gonna market

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 03:47 on Apr 27, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Besides the shortage, apparently more and more companies are converting over to slower TLC. So maybe used MLC drives are starting to command a premium.

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Jun 17, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Anyone pre-order a P4800X?
https://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-lis...8&condition=new

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



If you're not paying close to 2 grand for your storage you might as well just give up using computers completely

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Anime Schoolgirl posted:

isn't samsung's SLC V-NAND pcie x8 drive going to be cheaper than that as well as have better capacity/iops across the board

It'll have to have comparable latency and performance at low queue depth to be a true comparison.

That's not to say it won't be a better option for most users and as fast or faster in other areas

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 05:13 on Aug 23, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



I thought game load times were not something you could greatly improve since everything has to be decompressed anyway

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



I haven't reinstalled Windows on a mobo upgrade since at least Windows 7 was around. That includes going from an AMD board to an Intel one

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Beaten in a couple of other threads, but Intel will apparently be launching 240GB and 480GB consumer version Optane SSDs at the end of October.
http://www.guru3d.com/news-story/in...of-october.html

I expect everyone running a mission critical home server to run out and get one. Wonder what it will do for my Plex server

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Look at this guy who doesn't have hundreds of people using his Plex server

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



With best in class latency and sustained workload performance maybe people can upgrade their sarcasm detectors

But yeah a ton of these benefits probably won't help with most consumer users

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Oct 1, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Optane 900p reviews have dropped
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews...point,5292.html
https://www.anandtech.com/show/1195...ssd-900p-review

quote:

To coincide with the launch, Intel will show off the drive for the first time at CitizenCon, a community gathering of Roberts Space Industries' Star Citizen players. As part of the partnership, the Optane SSD 900P will ship with a download code for an exclusive in-game Sabre Raven ship that has unique in-game capabilities. As you might have guessed, the Sabre Raven's specialty has to do with it's over the top speed.

WhyteRyce fucked around with this message at 15:20 on Oct 27, 2017

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



peepsalot posted:

So it has ~40% more IOPS than A 960 EVO NVMe, ~5% more sequential write, and ~22% *less* sequential read speed. Seems like you could get two EVOs for the price and outperform it.

If all you are care about is sequential I/O at high queue depths then sure

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Star War Sex Parrot posted:

Which is a workload that doesn't really make sense for Optane anyway. I get the impression that Intel's kinda broken most of the tech media's benchmarks, and the writers just haven't figured it out yet.

One reviewer complained it made benchmarking drives not fun because Optane performance doesn't crater under the same workload/patterns like NAND.

Will probably take some time before consumers just automatically look at peak bandwidth numbers only and get confused at price discrepancy.

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



The new epeen will be how many nines you rate your QoS with

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Potato Salad posted:

I have a 900p.

I will not be buying more. There is no benefit over a DC P4500 (or higher series, per your estimated drive writes per day) except on artificially crafted benchmarks with no queue depth. It's not better for my oracle dbs, not better for my vdi environment, not better for even a client hpc environment.

Simply by the nature of being a storage drop in replacement, optane will always be crippled. Imo, we have effectively licked classical local block storage by placing it on the pcie bus and on the infinitely-scalable nvme protocol (and making it securely available by direct network fabric access).

It's the 2H 2018 DIMM 3DXpoint that's going to change your world.

Not everyone benefits from it, especially from a cost/performance standpoint. But there are very real benefits to some of the major enterprise/cloud/whatever players so I wouldn't say it's useless just because it's a drop in storage replacement.

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Potato Salad posted:

I mean, my hpc is pretty special snowflake rdma and IB poo poo, and I can test just about any kind of workload scientifically imaginable on there

I'm sure cloudflare might have use for optane over just more ram, I guess? Maybe very specific cdn service? I would have told you a week ago that optane has very niche but strong use cases, but since testing it against second gen intel nvme or just looking at what more ram for slightly more cost can do over optane, I'm not seeing it.

Your piddly little cute workloads are nothing compared to actual real performance crushing use cases
https://www.reddit.com/r/hardware/c...arked_on_linux/

quote:

I have one and just seeing 20 chrome tabs open in nearly an instant is glorious.

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



The industry has moved to using the same connector for different protocols/buses/whatever

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Let's talk about USB-C

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Klyith posted:

Not really, the "bottleneck" of SATA isn't going to get any smaller. Not until we have another generation or two of SSDs come out that are so fast the sata bus actually becomes a real hinderance instead of the small penalty it is now.


Here's an approximate visual description of your situation:
HDD |------------------------------------------------------------> Sata SSD
HDD |---------------------------------------------------------------> NVMe SSD

Just get a regular sata SSD, if you're putting this into an old pc it's not a good use of money to pay the nvme premium. Save the $100 or whatever for the next time you need a whole new computer.

We are already there. Optane latency is already hindered by Windows interrupt handling, much less an ancient protocol designed around spinny drives. It's just that most client user won't notice the difference

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



The Star Citizen bundle is kind of cool because you can sell the ship for good money to subsidize your very expensive but fast SSD

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



The AIC Optanes don't marry you to any ecosystem except for the Star Citizen ones

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



GRINDCORE MEGGIDO posted:

That at 256GB with PCIE x 4 would own really hard.

But that already exists....for a lot of money

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



GRINDCORE MEGGIDO posted:

Ah sorry, in M2. I wouldn't even mind 128GB if it was PCIEx4 M2.

Problem solved!!!

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Wonder how 4 800ps compare to a single 900p in that

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Apple being thirsty for second suppliers isn't exactly unknown news to people right?

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



40GB of DDR

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Anime Schoolgirl posted:

Remember when UFS was surely going to be a thing then it just ended up being the internal replacement for eMMC

What else were you expecting UFS to be?

WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



Anime Schoolgirl posted:

They had mockups of a microsd-like card!!!

That was for the Card Extension standard which is not the same as the base UFS standard. Being the replacement for embedded storage devices was an early goal

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WhyteRyce
Dec 30, 2001



You aren't buying Optane if you need bulk capacity.

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