|
I don't think it would bother a single Honda guy.
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2016 16:13
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 18, 2024 02:05 |
|
|
I'm not suggesting it would, it's just funny to roll up to a Honda meet in a BMW
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2016 16:16
|
|
|
Wrar posted:I don't think it would bother a single Honda guy. Maaaaybe an S2000 purist, but those guys don't go to general Honda meet ups.
|
|
#
?
Nov 24, 2016 21:50
|
|
|
Yeah, it'd be way more fun the other way around.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2016 06:59
|
|
|
Once I get engine mounts figured out and the thing mounted I'm doing a "Sacrificial Sunday" photo post and sharing it to all the BMW, E30 and M3 groups I'm in on Facebook. I expect a lot of backlash and people being pissed off. General automotive enthusiasts see it as a nice combo of a great engine and great chassis, BMW people....well they can be weird. Even S52/54 swapped E30 M3's are really looked down on by the E30 M3 people. poo poo any swapped car is referred to as a 'Caitlyn" within the M3 mailing list group. Needless to say it's going to be fun revealing this one. Yesterday hung the diff and tried the dry sump tank in a few spots. Nice thing about this one is if I don't feel like cutting and want to be lazy it fits in the battery location really nicely.  At this point I think its time to put the engine back on the stand and pull the subframe. Trying to figure out mounting with the engine hanging from a stand is proving to be a big pain in the rear end. I know how far back from the original engine mount holes the mount arms need to be, then the arms have to be level (for OEM mounting angle) and centered. Not sure if I'm going to try to chop and tack sometime together then bring that to a fabricator to make or if I'll have a fabricator friend come over. Garbage photo but with the dry sump pan this will fit nicely with the rear drain just behind the subframe and above the sway bar. I may relocate the sway bar to front if it ends up being too close for comfort. Engine is going to sit very low with roughly a 1/4" between the subframe and pan, solid engine mounts will ensure it doesn't hit. 
NitroSpazzz fucked around with this message at 14:45 on Nov 25, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2016 14:16
|
|
|
It amuses me the extent to which E30s are sort of the sacred cow. The S14 was cool because it was amazingly close to a race engine in a production car for the time, and the overall combination was good, but FFS it's just a car, and objectively one with all sorts of flaws.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2016 15:51
|
|
|
mekilljoydammit posted:It amuses me the extent to which E30s are sort of the sacred cow. The S14 was cool because it was amazingly close to a race engine in a production car for the time, and the overall combination was good, but FFS it's just a car, and objectively one with all sorts of flaws. In NitroSpazzz's case, it makes sense, as it's an already-modified, engineless car that he got at a really good price. But if you were to say "I want to build a modified E30", you'd always start with a basic model, as with any of the "interesting" ones, you're paying a premium for a load of stuff you're just going to throw away. Or in the M3's case, stuff which can potentially make life difficult for you (e.g. the non-standard windscreen). Also, with some cars, I do understand why people tend to get upset about people "ruining" them. There's a lot of stuff out there where it's like with AE86s now - a good, straight, original model is a complete pain in the arse to find, and it gets especially annoying when the modified ones all seem to be done atrociously, with little real variation in the ghastly mods they choose..
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2016 18:24
|
|
|
Sinestro posted:Yeah, it'd be way more fun the other way around. That might rustle some jimmies for sure. I'm a huge fan of this because I want the engine from my s2k in a whole bunch of other cars. I wish Honda had made a smallish RWD sedan with it in there because I'd probably own it by now.
|
|
#
?
Nov 25, 2016 23:04
|
|
|
InitialDave posted:Also, with some cars, I do understand why people tend to get upset about people "ruining" them. There's a lot of stuff out there where it's like with AE86s now - a good, straight, original model is a complete pain in the arse to find, and it gets especially annoying when the modified ones all seem to be done atrociously, with little real variation in the ghastly mods they choose.. People don't tend to have a good perspective on how the "lifecycle" (for lack of a better word) for enthusiast cars works. I remember back in high-school, 10-12 years ago, some of the guys I knew crashed & wrote-off a good dozen or so AE70 and AE85's between them, back when you could still get them for $500-$1500. And now they're the same guys you meet at car shows who are all about "keeping it straight and clean" because the values have gone up by a factor of 10+, the irony being that they're the ones who caused the scarcity but don't realise it. When it comes to M3, the stock ones are going to stay stock due to collector value, and the modified ones are going to stay modified due to track-car demand. There might be a 0.1% that will jump between the two categories, but I don't think a single person on the BMW forums who will whine about this car will say "I have a complete inventory of NOS parts in my shed just waiting for a M3 shell to turn back into stock, and your ruining that opportunity for me OP!", because those people know there are way better & easier examples to clean and fix back up to stock than this car that is well into track territory. Anyway, ramble aside, awesome thread and I genuinely look forward to the final weight-in and track-times for the car once it's finished.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2016 01:06
|
|
|
Jomo posted:People don't tend to have a good perspective on how the "lifecycle" (for lack of a better word) for enthusiast cars works. I remember back in high-school, 10-12 years ago, some of the guys I knew crashed & wrote-off a good dozen or so AE70 and AE85's between them, back when you could still get them for $500-$1500. And now they're the same guys you meet at car shows who are all about "keeping it straight and clean" because the values have gone up by a factor of 10+, the irony being that they're the ones who caused the scarcity but don't realise it. But yes, I love this thread, even if it does remind me I'm really letting my E30 go to seed in a bad way.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2016 02:34
|
|
|
Some of those points are making me muse on the giant pile of 1st gen RX-7s I have sitting around in various states of completeness actually... all were intended as parts or shell donors for race cars so there's no fully original cars out there though, but I'm not going to (likely) go through that many shells now.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2016 02:54
|
|
|
mekilljoydammit posted:Some of those points are making me muse on the giant pile of 1st gen RX-7s I have sitting around in various states of completeness actually... all were intended as parts or shell donors for race cars so there's no fully original cars out there though, but I'm not going to (likely) go through that many shells now. Bang as many as you can together into functional cars.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2016 02:56
|
|
|
InitialDave posted:But yes, I love this thread, even if it does remind me I'm really letting my E30 go to seed in a bad way. That's a wagon right? When did it last move?
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2016 17:10
|
|
|
cakesmith handyman posted:That's a wagon right? When did it last move? On the road? 2004.
|
|
#
?
Nov 26, 2016 19:52
|
|
|
mekilljoydammit posted:Some of those points are making me muse on the giant pile of 1st gen RX-7s I have sitting around in various states of completeness actually... all were intended as parts or shell donors for race cars so there's no fully original cars out there though, but I'm not going to (likely) go through that many shells now. Ditto, sort of, including the pile of RX-7s (5 first gens, 2 of which are GSL-SEs, and 2 FCs.) I only have one functioning engine, maybe 2, though, and one is in the only driving FC. I bought one first-gen, and then the drat things started following me home. I suppose I could go full-on blasphemer and toss a random V8 in one, just for fun. If I had a 4BT hanging around, I would surely do that, just because of the cries of anguish. The 6BT in my dad's old Dodge won't fit without a LOT of surgery. Comedy option: GSXR engine? What I really need to do is sell the running FC and the nicer GSL-SE, and then put the money into making my '79 SA22C (my first RX-7) move again. Alternately - the engine from the S5 FC into the '79 and scrap the FC (with rear seat! $250 right there!) edit: forgot to mention: I love this swap. I understand that some folks want to keep certain cars "pure", but a) this is a race car, b) it's different, and c) there are a fair number of nice M3 examples already.
|
|
#
?
Dec 2, 2016 19:38
|
|
|
Darchangel posted:Comedy option: GSXR engine? Ruining car and value talk I remember test driving a couple E30 M3's towards the end of high school or early college with my Dad. We didn't know a lot about them but had heard they were fun and he'd always like how they looked. We didn't realize you needed to rev the poo poo out of it get any power so we were very disappointed after test driving a couple and he ended up buying a E36 M3 because they have torque. One of the cars we drove was an immaculate 40-41k mile sterling silver car in Chicago that was listed at a dealership for 10k. That car sold about a year and a half ago for 70k with 51k miles on it. E30 M3's were dirt cheap for a while and many were bought and destroyed. The lucky ones got turned into track cars and are still being raced. Some were simply cool looking daily drivers while many were wrapped around trees and other inanimate objects. Same thing with the S50/52 swapped cars, that was seen as a huge upgrade years ago and people were selling good S14/transmission/ecu for a couple thousand, now a S14 goes for 10k. I had one I held onto for a few years and sold to help fund the E28 purchase. Looking back I should have held onto it but oh well poo poo happens and I still made ~5k by having it sit in the corner of the garage for 4 years. Rambling aside haven't made poo poo for progress, was out of town all week and am recovering from travel and catching up on usual work crap today. I'll be rearranging the garage today/tomorrow for winter storage. Once that's done I plan on pulling out the subframe and steering rack so I can start working on mounts. I'd like to keep the stock mount arms on the F20 but it may end up being easier making custom arms. We'll see what my fabrication capable friends think.
|
|
#
?
Dec 2, 2016 20:15
|
|
|
I've kept a collection of all E30 M3's selling prices on ebay, craigslist, facebook, forums and anywhere else I see them pop up. There's a few in the group that do and it helps when someones car gets totaled and they didn't have agreed value insurance or when someone is trying to figure out how to price things. These three popped up in the past 24 hours on one of the facebook groups I watch. Just to give an idea of how bad prices have gotten, these cars all had multiple offers in the first couple hours and have been sold for asking price or higher.  And some parts, if I remember right the calipers were $600 and the 46mm TB's were $1600. Those prices are considered pretty good.  Cars given a fall wash and quick detail then packed away for the winter. E21 still needs a bath but I didn't feel like hand washing in ~40F weather. Garage is pretty tight with the engine on the lift. Ignore the dumb snapchat stuff, I forgot to take a regular picture. 
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2016 15:52
|
|
|
Thread/Project hasn't been abandoned life has just been crazy lately with end of the year work/life stuff. A couple little things to keep this out of the archives. New crank pulley drive has showed up. Mounting this one just requires cutting off the big washer that comes on the factory crank bolt. Think I have all hardware for mounting the pump as well. I'll need to order a pump pulley and drive belt, talking with Aviaid today about that.  Air pump circuit eliminator, one less check engine warning to deal with since I'll be using the stock ECU for now. Helpful since I didn't get any of the air pump crap and don't want it anyway.  Then there's this. This is one of three connectors on the engine wiring harness that plug directly into the ECU. No markings on it and luckily most of the damage is to the end without any connections. It needs to be repaired or more likely replaced. Lots of pictures because my camera didn't feel like focusing.         I have all the hardware to put the shifter back together ordered and it should be getting here right after the holidays. I'll put that together then do yet another 'final test fit' of things before making engine mounts. Have about a week off for the holidays and hope to make a lot of progress during that time.
|
|
#
?
Dec 19, 2016 11:06
|
|
|
Sucks the plug is busted but they're easy to depin and find replacements for.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2016 00:16
|
|
|
I swear I have seen that connector somewhere. I think it is a Tyco or sumitomo product.
|
|
#
?
Dec 26, 2016 16:41
|
|
|
Got a little work done this morning. Things taking longer than they should and running into unexpected issues as usual. First up pull the transmission back off and toss it on the stand, then flip it and remove the tape protecting the oil pan. Nasty residue from the combined oil and adhesive but some purple power cleaned it up. Pulled pan, cleaned it and the mating surfaces then applied Honda-bond and torqued it down. Hoping I didn't seal this up prematurely but I probably did. Not putting the plugs/drains in the pan until the engine is mounted.     Next up the pump mounting plate and a dry fit of the pump. A miscommunication between the kit and pump manufacturer means the mounting holes don't line up. Not worth tearing apart the pump to put it back together with the mounting in the right spot. I'll drill and tap this maybe this weekend, think I have the right size tap around here somewhere.     Then toss on the crank pulley mount which requires cutting the 'washer' of the factory crank bolt. Dremel, hammer, chisel and some swearing got that off. Then find out the mount inside diameter is too small for the bolt...drill and file eventually got it fitting.     Loose test fit of the crank pulley  Ordered all the parts (everything on the drat diagram) to put the shifter assembly together, stuff should arrive early next week. Put that together then stick the transmission back on the engine and do yet another 'final fitting' of everything before engine mounts begin. On the mounts I'm not sure if I want to stick with the OEM Honda mount arms and make adapters for the subframe or bolt in M20 mounts and DIY the engine mount arms. DIY arms might let me get things a bit lower which would be nice. I talked with Condor Speed Shop about mounts and they won't give me the heights of all their mounts and it's surprisingly hard to get accurate OEM measurements. Condor said they'll help me find something that works if the M20 or M42 ones I have don't. M42 offset is very close but they're too tall, while the M20 is the right height but a straight through bolt design.
|
|
#
?
Dec 30, 2016 21:22
|
|
|
A little update to keep this out of the archives while things are slow. Big box of lights, wiring and fuse box showed up the other day. I'll be using this largely for connectors, switches and maybe the fuse box but I needed a set of tail lights as well. Fabricator stopped by last night to look at things. After throwing a couple ideas around we have something simple and durable figured out using the aftermarket M42 engine mounts and some 1/4" steel plate. He took the Honda engine mount arms and the m42 mounts to make the steel plates then should be coming back this weekend if he has time to take measurements. Trying to figure out what style gauge cluster I want to use for this thing. Down to two options, simple cluster copying the one they ran in the DTM cars or something more modern like a racepak all-in-one solution. A third option would be using a S2000 cluster.   Also signed up for a shakedown track day in August so now I have an official deadline as if the various E30 and M3 meets I've signed up for aren't enough. NitroSpazzz fucked around with this message at 12:42 on Jan 12, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 12:36
|
|
|
S2000 with led conversion http://www.s2ki.com/forums/sponsor-s2000-exterior-s2000-interior-deals-184/qube-engineering-led-dash-products-now-available-688460/
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 14:02
|
|
|
Given it's an E30 I actually kind of like the oldschool gauge setup, though I'd be tempted to have sarcastic pseudo-German words instead of actual German words. Also, having done my research, I'd personally much prefer an AIM dash to the Racepak setup. Racepak does this thing where they make you buy dongles for every additional thing you want to plug in, and that annoys me.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 15:14
|
|
|
mekilljoydammit posted:Given it's an E30 I actually kind of like the oldschool gauge setup, though I'd be tempted to have sarcastic pseudo-German words instead of actual German words. This for sure.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 15:53
|
|
|
Big red light; "Motorblowen"? Ideally with umlauts on the o, but I don't know how to type that offhand.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 16:09
|
|
|
MOTORENEKSPLOMDIERTÖLKAPUT HINTERRADANTRIEBGEWECHSLFEUER UMWELTSPLAKKETTENTEMPERATUR BLEIFREIDRUCK
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 16:17
|
|
|
mekilljoydammit posted:Given it's an E30 I actually kind of like the oldschool gauge setup, though I'd be tempted to have sarcastic pseudo-German words instead of actual German words. bolind posted:MOTORENEKSPLOMDIERTÖLKAPUT  I'm leaning towards the old school setup maybe even with the true to DTM orange/red background. It'll cost more but some of the STACK gauges have built in switches to turn on fans/pumps/etc and all have warning lights. Their big tachs even have a lap timer, speedo or other display which would be pretty slick to keep everything clean and minimal.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 16:28
|
|
|
NitroSpazzz posted:Yeah racepak seems kind of bottom of the list as I do more reading. AIM or STACK seem to make a better unit and less of the nickel and dime you for every sensor bullshit.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 17:20
|
|
|
Jymmybob posted:S2000 with led conversion http://www.s2ki.com/forums/sponsor-s2000-exterior-s2000-interior-deals-184/qube-engineering-led-dash-products-now-available-688460/ I like those. If my gauges ever go out I'll have to remember them.
|
|
#
?
Jan 12, 2017 17:23
|
|
|
Do you plan on running an aftermarket ECU? I know you can get AIM and Racepak to display data straight from the ecu if you're running hondata. Not sure if it works with the s2000 version of kpro though, most of my experience was with the s300. I think AEM's stuff is compatible too but I'm not positive for this application. If it does work it's really nice because most of what you'll want is there with no additional sensors. Oil temp and pressure would be all that's really missing. Aftermarket stuff like a wide band will pass through too. You can also set conditional alarms so if RPM/throttle is greater than X and oil pressure/air fuel/ etc is less than Y it will start flashing.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2017 04:11
|
|
|
honda whisperer posted:Do you plan on running an aftermarket ECU? I know you can get AIM and Racepak to display data straight from the ecu if you're running hondata. Not sure if it works with the s2000 version of kpro though, most of my experience was with the s300. I think AEM's stuff is compatible too but I'm not positive for this application. If it does work it's really nice because most of what you'll want is there with no additional sensors. Oil temp and pressure would be all that's really missing. Aftermarket stuff like a wide band will pass through too. You can also set conditional alarms so if RPM/throttle is greater than X and oil pressure/air fuel/ etc is less than Y it will start flashing. Using stock ECU at least for the time being. The integrated data for the display is one of the big features drawing me towards the modern digital dashes. A guy in Germany mounted his a bit forward and it looks pretty nice but his whole build is perfect.  Full build for those who want some  material - http://imgur.com/a/4NojQHas to be one of the cleanest nicest dedicated track car builds I've seen. Making 300hp if I remember right and he said weight should be right around 2200lb. I love everything about how this things is put together, even the switches though not period correct look great. Best part is this car runs around the Nürburgring several times a month.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2017 14:09
|
|
|
I say go with whichever variation of gauges you feel is easiest to read. My feeling would be a combination of clear analogue ones for the really important stuff, and everything else through a multi-function display of some kind.
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2017 14:36
|
|
|
I have an AIM, it's ok. GUI is just like the racepak, black and white lcd, I personally prefer analog gauges with warning lights for when temps get too high. I'm a bit torn in having live telemetry staring you right in the face. So many things to focus on, I don't think the lap timer really does you any favors staring you right in the face at 10/10ths. Really depends on what you are accustomed to as a race pace, if this car is much slower than you are used to, then you can easily multitask and focus on a lap/split times mid lap. If this is the fastest car on track you've ever driven, lap time will only be a distraction. Those led s2000 gauges do look mighty pretty.
|
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2017 20:34
|
|
|
crazzy posted:I'm a bit torn in having live telemetry staring you right in the face. So many things to focus on, I don't think the lap timer really does you any favors staring you right in the face at 10/10ths. Really depends on what you are accustomed to as a race pace, if this car is much slower than you are used to, then you can easily multitask and focus on a lap/split times mid lap. If this is the fastest car on track you've ever driven, lap time will only be a distraction. At this point I'm 90% sure I'm going with analog, I like the look way better after sitting in a few cars over the past few days. Dad and I picked up a Aim solo lap timer years ago, I forgot I'll have that for lap times. I'll stick that somewhere visible (probably NOT in the cluster) like we did in the Chump/WRL car. I PM'd sharkytm about his VDO gauges, he has a really nice big 10k tack I might use. That's all I want, huge tach then a couple temp gauges (oil/water), oil pressure and maybe a fuel gauge. Don't need anything else. Keeping things minimal on the switch panel as well but that's a discussion for another day. NitroSpazzz fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Jan 17, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jan 15, 2017 13:05
|
|
|
Valid point of view. Personally, as an engineer, I want stupidly large amounts of DAQ channels (seriously, I'm at something like 50 channels for my planned setup) and a display smart enough to tell me to either stop the car now, or back off. From doing everything but driving for my dad and seeing how many blown engines resulted from missing poo poo on analog gauges, I won't ever do anything on my money that doesn't have the ability to have big red lights.
|
|
#
?
Jan 16, 2017 00:14
|
|
|
With individual gauges you definitely want something that has warnings you can set. Personally I prefer a display that will flash at you over a half-dozen individual gauges. I think the last I checked the racepak was the cheapest way to get logging, gps, and a g-sensor all together but I need to go through them all again. AEM has a new display but it was a little more expensive than I was hoping.
|
|
#
?
Jan 16, 2017 00:48
|
|
|
After talking with people way more experienced and smarter than me I've had a change of heart on the instrumentation. I'll probably be installing one of the AiM or Race-Tech dash units, if I win the lottery Motec . Programmable warning lights, telemetry, data recording and compatibility with future plans make it the obvious choice. It'll cost more upfront that's a common theme on this car. AiM seems to be very popular among the E30 guys and there's a few shops familiar with setup and everything within a few hours. Bonus, friend can get me 20% off Have an oil thermostat coming so I can start figuring out my rats nest of plumbing. I'm trying to find a set of scales locally to borrow or rent to help me figure out placement for things. Have spent the last couple weeks helping prep a house for renting then will be helping my brother move into that house this weekend, there hasn't been poo poo for time/energy to get anything done on cars. Need to find the drat vacuum leak on the 320i then get the timing dialed in then I'm moving it to the side or outside so I can put some time on the race car. NitroSpazzz fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Jan 17, 2017 |
|
#
?
Jan 17, 2017 18:26
|
|
|
Since you guys are on the topic, anyone have a notion of which units are compatible with hondata?
|
|
#
?
Jan 17, 2017 18:38
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 18, 2024 02:05 |
|
|
Basically all of them, I think. Heck, most of them are compatible with more or less everything down to and including Megasquirt. I like the Aim dashes and they're pretty professional. Nothing to fault with that choice (he says, of someone else's purchase)
|
|
#
?
Jan 17, 2017 19:40
|
|