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What was a bigger/badder thing for America?
Big Box Stores
Dotcom/Tech
This question and the answers for it are both complicated and stupid and I have a totally different take on the matter.
View Results
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glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


The media seems to have a fascination with the tech billionaires of Silicon Valley and the like. I think mostly because Baby Boomers are fascinated by anything that disturbs the narrow little world that they grew up in, and they seem to have a love/hate relationship with this "Net 2.0" that has both let them tweet about disrespectful athletes, but also has made them no longer masters of the world.

But I think that Big Box stores changed American life just as much as the dotcom era and later social media did, its just underreported because it seems "normal enough" to the Boomers and the media that panders to them. But lets compare the two:

Big Box Stores:

Bad:
Increased oil dependence by sprawling out communities
Also destroyed lots of habitat
(Generally bad for the environment in a lot of ways)
Ruined town character, and disrupted community relations
Drove down wages
Ugly and tacky

Good:
Gave access to cheap stuff to people who otherwise wouldn't have had it
Made it so that if you wanted to buy something simple like a keyboard you could just drive to Best Buy and get it, instead of having to go to the one weird crowded computer store run by neckbeards


Tech/DotCom

Bad:
Used a lot of resources by encouraging conspicuous consumption
Encouraged people to stare at screens all day
Disrupted communities
Full of smug fuckers who play foosball all day and made rents in San Francisco riduculous

Good:
Enabled people to interact with the wider world
Greatly eroded barriers around the world
Encouraged new forms of creativity and community
Made life generally more fun and versatile and convenient


I think on balance Tech gave more to the world. Big Box stores changed communities more than is generally accepted, I think it tore apart traditional social fabric much more than the internet did, but unlike the internet, it didn't replace it with anything.


Also, on a personal level, even though tech is full of smarmy fuckers who I kind of want to punch, lots of them try. Like Zuckerberg. He looks like an annoying, smug bastard. But I think he means well, or means something. I could actually have some type of conversation with him. Compare that with Alice Walton, who literally killed a woman while drunk and wasn't charged for it because Texas.

I think the choice is clear here.

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Burt Sexual
Jan 26, 2006

I AM SO SICK OF EVERY SINGLE WOMAN ON THIS PLANET AND THEIR UNFAIR ROLES EXCEPT FOR AIDA CUEVAS, MY RANCHERA PRINCESS. WOMEN ARE YUCKY (EXCEPT FOR AIDA)!


I don't know where your going op

glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


Darth123123 posted:

I don't know where your going op

Going down to Walmart to pick up 5 packages of Candy Corn Oreo for 10 dollars

Real hurthling!
Sep 11, 2001





9/11 changed everything

let it mellow
Jun 1, 2000



Dinosaur Gum

I'm thinking millennials are worse than Walmart or the tech booms or anything really

glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


jackyl posted:

I'm thinking millennials are worse than Walmart or the tech booms or anything really

SELFIE STICKS!

Burt Sexual
Jan 26, 2006

I AM SO SICK OF EVERY SINGLE WOMAN ON THIS PLANET AND THEIR UNFAIR ROLES EXCEPT FOR AIDA CUEVAS, MY RANCHERA PRINCESS. WOMEN ARE YUCKY (EXCEPT FOR AIDA)!


glowing-fish posted:

Going down to Walmart to pick up 5 packages of Candy Corn Oreo for 10 dollars

Wait, you're fat too?

Somebody fucked around with this message at Sep 19, 2016 around 02:47

spud
Aug 27, 2003

I like to make the sex

Someone do big pharma and big farming.

gimme the GOD DAMN candy
Jul 1, 2007

gimme those gat dang candies

i think that every human creation including humans themselves must be burned away from the face of the earth

glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


Serious Frolicking posted:

i think that every human creation including humans themselves must be burned away from the face of the earth

Are you sure you didn't mean to post this in the Evangelion thread?

a dog from hell
Oct 18, 2009

by zen death robot


What is the alternative? The country has always been sprawling. Many communities rely on big box stores to survive, suburbs don't matter because they're hosed, and cities have the option of banning corporations that they feel would do harm. You may as well blame it on suburban development because that is where Targets and Wal-Marts thrive and cause the most waste.

I agree that it's bad to lose diversity and put everyone underneath the thumbs of corporate giants but maybe we deserve it as Americans because we're ugly & tacky.

Fix the suburban problem imo. Nuke em preferably.

Extra Large Marge
Jan 21, 2004

third place is still pretty damn good


Fun Shoe

Big Box stores are pretty bad, but they're not as bad as those Keurig machines that make the terrible little cups of coffee.

Julius CSAR
Oct 3, 2007

Trust Me


Arian_Samurai posted:

Big Box stores are pretty bad, but they're not as bad as those Keurig machines that make the terrible little cups of coffee.

paging 3O

Business Octopus
Jun 27, 2005

Me IRL

glowing-fish posted:

SELFIE STICKS!

Nothing is dumber and more baby boomers.txt than the moral panic over selfie sticks/selfies in general.

Chinatown
Sep 11, 2001

*Suck My Balls*

who loving gives a poo poo

glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


Chinatown posted:

who loving gives a poo poo

Quite a few people do, and people who don't, should.

donkey salami
Jun 28, 2008

DUNK A DILL PICKLE REALDO

Grimey Drawer

But where else can I buy big boxes?

Dreddout
Oct 1, 2015

You must stay drunk on writing so reality cannot destroy you.


Real hurthling! posted:

9/11 changed everything

Yeah, but that was for the better

Chinatown
Sep 11, 2001

*Suck My Balls*

glowing-fish posted:

Quite a few people do, and people who don't, should.

seek help

CaptainSarcastic
Jul 6, 2013

HAIL SATAN


jackyl posted:

I'm thinking millennials are worse than Walmart or the tech booms or anything really

Amen.

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

Everything I post is dumb and wrong


actually what you have a problem with is de-industrialization, not Walmart OP. time was an average chap could get a job making things rather than just jobs selling things

gary oldmans diary
Sep 26, 2005


Hell Gem

the pros and cons of french bread pizza vs big box stores:

glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


gary oldmans diary posted:

the pros and cons of french bread pizza vs big box stores:

I used to get this really good French Bread pizza, fresh bread, fresh cheese and sauces and just a little oregano on top, at my local independent grocery store in Montana. It cost me like under 2 dollars for a slice, which was a pretty good deal. There was some big box stores on the other end of town, but I liked my small, locally-owned market with its fresh deli food and bakery with extra good donuts.

If I could have just instagrammed one of these great french bread pizzas, I would have had a perfectly cromulant joinder of all three of our topics.

Vincent Van Goatse
Nov 8, 2006

Don't be so gloomy. After all it's not that awful. Like the fella says, in Italy for thirty years under the Borgias they had warfare, terror, murder, and bloodshed, but they produced Michelangelo, Leonardo da Vinci, and the Renaissance.



Canned Ferret

Chinatown posted:

who loving gives a poo poo

CJacobs
Apr 17, 2011

Tell 'em that God's gonna
cut 'em down.


The good done by both of those things far outweighs nearly all of their negatives op, the question you pose is a loaded one that implies either of them was bad for the US when really neither of them were

CaptainSarcastic
Jul 6, 2013

HAIL SATAN


CJacobs posted:

The good done by both of those things far outweighs nearly all of their negatives op, the question you pose is a loaded one that implies either of them was bad for the US when really neither of them were

Unlike millennials, who ruin everything.

Nut to Butt
Apr 13, 2009

Make your buddy smile!


recycle environmentalists

glowing-fish
Feb 18, 2013
Probation
Can't post for 23 days!


CJacobs posted:

The good done by both of those things far outweighs nearly all of their negatives op, the question you pose is a loaded one that implies either of them was bad for the US when really neither of them were

Source: Thomas Friedman's taxi driver whose nephew built an e-commerce business on a smartphone he bought at the local Wal-Mart.

get that OUT of my face
Feb 10, 2007

I'll get you, I'll burn you, I'll crush you, I'll flush you down, down
The toilet where you'll spiral a-round, round
Ahhhh, tick... mmm tick tick tick

amazon, google, and facebook might as well own the entire internet these days

H.P. Hovercraft
Jan 12, 2004

one thing a computer can do that most humans can't is be sealed up in a cardboard box and sit in a warehouse



Slippery Tilde

Rutibex posted:

actually what you have a problem with is de-industrialization, not Walmart OP. time was an average chap could get a job making things rather than just jobs selling things

american manufacturing is the largest in the world they just don't need humans to do most of the work anymore

Orkin Mang
Nov 1, 2007



try putting the last letter of a firt name and making it the first part of the second name lol give it a try!!

mom and dad fight a lot
Sep 21, 2006

twenty-six characters long


I stored my jizz into your mom's big box, and america is worse because it created the op lol

R-Type
Oct 10, 2005



Consume and sustain from renewables out of my rear end in a top hat OP. This world is a big gay gently caress and you're a puppet with titty strings.

Thirsty Girl
Dec 5, 2015



why are homeless women called bag ladies and not box ladies

Sale At Albertsons!
Jul 29, 2014

ORIGINAL CHARACTER DO NOT STEAL

im gaye posted:

why are homeless women called bag ladies and not box ladies

Ya cant make a bindle out of a box

Bloody Hedgehog
Dec 12, 2003

Gotta' nuke something.


glowing-fish posted:

Ruined town character, and disrupted community relations

This is one of those complaints always brought up about big-box stores, but I'd argue that the VAST majority of towns where big-box stores opened never had any character to begin with.

Roylicious
Feb 21, 2012


It's true that they practiced predatory business tactics to drive small business out of the market though. That's pretty obvious.

And I'm not just talking about having cheaper prices, I'm talking about operating at a loss and selling items below cost just to drive out competition (exactly what Amazon has done to many small businesses operated by Americans online).

Being an entrepreneur in the USA has become incredibly difficult, from the standpoint of the average citizen wanting to start a business (not a venture capitalist with tons of cash to throw around). Many people have just given up and started selling through Amazon or eBay which take a hefty 15% off the top which eats into profit margins quite a bit. Would be nice if a presidential candidate addressed this instead of just saying they'll create more jobs (which to me is just doublespeak for 'business friendly' policies).

Roylicious fucked around with this message at Sep 19, 2016 around 16:33

satanic splash-back
Jan 28, 2009



Roylicious posted:

It's true that they practiced predatory business tactics to drive small business out of the market though. That's pretty obvious.

And I'm not just talking about having cheaper prices, I'm talking about operating at a loss and selling items below cost just to drive out competition (exactly what Amazon has done to many small businesses operated by Americans online).

Are you suggesting America is a capitalist society??

Roylicious
Feb 21, 2012


satanic splash-back posted:

Are you suggesting America is a capitalist society??

Well you say that like this stuff is all kosher but in reality the USA is not a totally free market society and there are rules and laws in place to prevent the natural monopolization of markets.

It's just that recently big interests have managed to skirt those rules because they have powerful lobby interests; and it doesn't help that our politicians literally don't know what the internet is or how it functions.

Everyone knows WalMart was dumping at the very least but no small business had the funding to fight their legal teams over it. Amazon is doing the same thing now.

This is from 2001:

quote:

The complaint accused Wal-Mart of selling butter, milk, laundry detergent, and other staple goods below cost at stores in Beloit, Oshkosh, Racine, Tomah, and West Bend. A bottle of laundry detergent that cost Wal-Mart $6.51, for example, was sold for less than $5 at several stores. The company’s intention, according to the complaint, was to force competitors out of business, gain a monopoly in local markets, and ultimately recoup its losses through higher prices. State officials filed the complaint after Wal-Mart failed to take corrective action following several warning letters sent as early as 1993.

Although most, if not all, states have received numerous complaints from small business owners about Wal-Mart’s anti-competitive practices, Wisconsin is the first state to investigate predatory pricing at the company’s outlets and file a formal complaint.

e: and 2000

quote:

In Oklahoma, Crest Foods, a three-store supermarket chain, filed a predatory pricing suit against Wal-Mart. The suit contends that Wal-Mart sold goods below cost at its store in Edmond in order to force Crest Foods out of business. Wal-Mart employees—including on one occasion former chief executive David Glass himself—regularly visited the Crest store to monitor prices. According to the suit, Wal-Mart then targeted price cuts to undermine Crest Foods, often dipping well below its own costs to beat out its rival. Such tactics are illegal under two state laws, the Unfair Sales Act and the Antitrust Reform Act. The suit is expected to go to trial in about one year.

Lotta good came from that haha.

Roylicious fucked around with this message at Sep 19, 2016 around 16:42

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Nooner
Mar 26, 2007

AN A+ POSTER (:

tech is cool because people get like billions of dollars for things that are totally pointless walmart is bad because they try to make me show to receipt to the loving geriatric standing at the door and that is illegal i never signed any social contract consenting to search of my personal property gently caress OFF GRANDPA

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