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Yeah, I mean if you're going far back to the real origins, maybe you should try making some ancient Israelite recipes.
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Jan 19, 2017 16:08
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coyo7e posted:But for real, how is one supposed to understand the cuisine of a group of people unless you go as far back to the real origins of that cuisine and why it came about, instead of just being satisfied with a co-opted version which has been filtered down through uncounted layers of indirection through time and tastes and availability of ingredients? You do the same thing with martial arts trainers - you try to find the best education which is as close to the source that you are looking for, as is possible. It's a fallacy to assume that there is some sort of pure cultural heritage for any group that's unchanged over centuries, especially in the Middle East. Every ethnic and religious group in the region has exchanged commerce, culture, genetics, and ideas pretty much nonstop since they encountered one another. The "real origins" of any cuisine are impossible to find. Full stop. Every technique, ingredient, and practice for every dish is influenced by other cultures. Trying to find the pure roots of a given culture through its food is a fool's errand at best and usually ends up eliding the history of this cultural interplay by downplaying or denying the impact of other groups.
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Jan 19, 2017 19:02
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Loomer posted:Yeah, I mean if you're going far back to the real origins, maybe you should try making some ancient Israelite recipes. or maybe try Paleo
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Jan 19, 2017 19:23
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Murgos posted:Your implication is that someones religion prevents them from having authentic recipes for a cuisine from the region where they live and their ancestors have lived for thousands of years. coyo7e posted:Any recommendations on cookbooks for middle-eastern or Mediterranean cooking? I picked up "Olives, Lemons, and Za'atar", and "My Cooking class: Middle Eastern Basics: 80 recipes step by step" and a couple others from the library and I love the way so many of these recipes involve a whole plethora of ingredients but often in very small quantities. coyo7e posted:Wow, his stuff does look great I'll be sure to check it out, thanks! If I were to go find a first-generation german-mexican, should he be my first go-to for salsa and huaraches recipes? And Murgos? Delete your account. quote:Food appropriation is a big deal in the Middle East, where the adoption of falafel and hummus as Israel's national snacks is a point of contention for Palestinians. Sabra, however, is a BDS target for other reasons: The USA's top hummus manufacturer is owned by Strauss Group, an Israeli company with strong ties to the IDF. The corporation has "adopted" the Golani Brigade, an "elite unit" of the Israeli Army with a reputation for bad behavior that ranges "from revolts against commanders to abuse of Palestinians," according to Haaretz. Golani troops were on the front line in Operation Cast Lead, the 2008-9 assault on Gaza which killed some 1,400 Palestinians. Strauss, apparently, provided the lunches, exclaiming on its website that it provides "food products" for missions and "personal care packages for each soldier." After U.S. BDS groups targeted Sabra in 2010, Strauss removed the wording from its Corporate Social Responsibility pages. But it has said nothing of withdrawing its support for IDF troops. coyo7e fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Jan 20, 2017 |
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Jan 20, 2017 00:38
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coyo7e posted:If I were to go find a first-generation german-mexican, should he be my first go-to for salsa and huaraches recipes? Yes, awesome. You are a special snowflake. "So yeah, if it doesn't involve Israelis, I'd be very interested." e: That Sabra has lovely political affiliations has pretty much nothing to do with anything. e2: Pureed Chickpeas with various ingredients go back something like 700 to maybe as much as 1400 yeas in the Levant and Egypt. That a Lebanese activist is upset about it doesn't actually make it a Lebanese dish. Murgos fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Jan 20, 2017 |
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Jan 20, 2017 02:02
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coyo7e posted:Yes, feast your eyes on the rampant religious-based biases of which I began my request You know that a large number of Israelis are actually from the middle east and have been for centuries, right? Like, Israel isn't just a bunch of white dudes from Europe rocking up one day and saying 'yo, we own this now' - it's also a whole bunch of brown dudes from across the middle east, including Israel's own land, rocking up and saying 'hi, we'd like to join' (and also a whole bunch of dudes from Ethiopia, and a whole bunch of non-Jewish dudes who've been living there forever). The reason hummus and falafel became a big thing in Israel is because, shocker, a whole bunch of Israeli dudes were cooking really good hummus and falafel in the Palestinian style because they were Palestinian Jews who lived in Palestine and so did their parents and their parents and their parents and their parents. You can have ethical objections to supporting Israel. I do myself. But when those objections start to get into a weird place of 'no Israeli is equally entitled to 'ownership of the cuisine' of a region despite a large number of Israelis having family roots that go back literal centuries in that region, it gets ugly. I mean, you've basically decided the Mizrahi don't have a title to their own cuisine anymore - and that there aren't proud Arab Israelis cooking drat good hummus up. Loomer fucked around with this message at 03:40 on Jan 20, 2017 |
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Jan 20, 2017 03:32
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Guys he hates Jews, get over it. No need to beat up on the poor guy. A little anti-Semitism now and then never hurt anyone.
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Jan 20, 2017 05:52
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Murgos posted:Yes, awesome. You are a special snowflake. "So yeah, if it doesn't involve Israelis, I'd be very interested."
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Jan 20, 2017 07:21
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coyo7e posted:what do you look for in south african cuisine? I'm just going to say this. If a South African cookbook doesn't include a good bunny chow curry, I am out.
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Jan 20, 2017 08:44
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Oh hey, new posts...*sees coyote reading from a Lebanese activists reconstruction of history from a single perspective* If you have a problem with Israel inherited recipes you are denying the single fact that everyone in that region is basically all brown people of the exact same descent going back easily 20 thousand years ago. The only people who do that are ISIS, ISIL and the PLO. The country is not perfect, plenty of corruption but any questions of authenticity based on mock controversy that isn't are at best mock controversy and at worst pure bullshit or a complete magical reconstruction of the entire regions history from imagination. Go into any country bordering Israel or even only go as far as northern or southern Israel and you'll find renamed dishes of the same loving cuisines or simply more halal branded places instead of kosher serving up the same poo poo. They will also serve their own specialities, not unlike places like Chicago where you can find 100 authentic regional cuisines in a 10 mile radius. You'll also find Lebanese folks cooking Lebanese dishes in Israel, but you would get murdered if people made kosher food in Lebanon because politics. TL;DR can we take the weird Palestinian argument which is explicit racism to another loving thread? I want to read about posts about books people use to cook with.
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Jan 26, 2017 11:33
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I dunno where you guys started getting israel butthurt at, but coyo7e is right to a certain extent - and I look for the same thing when checking out cookbooks. there's a difference between a type of cookbook that is "hey here's a British dude from Israel stylishly rocking some middle eastern recipes", and "hey here's an israeli who is devoted exclusively to the particular culinary history of his ethnic group" - and to the extent the existence of israel is a relatively new thing, I think that's a fair point to take into consideration. a contrast I'd draw to maybe move it away from the kneejerk politics - in Indian cookery, Madhur Jaffrey vs Julie Sahni. The former is well to do, not hard line about where a recipe came from - so long as it generically fits in with the cuisine. The latter is, well, less well off - more concerned with explaining the history of her recipes and what is typical for a region historically, or borrowed from neighboring regions or cultures. both acknowledge, for instance, that 'tiki masala' was a very strange western creation, but how they treat the subject is qualitatively different. And along those lines, I myself wouldn't really be interested in a cookbook written by an israeli that was just like 'here's how to make israeli hummus!!!', but would be interested in one written that went into the historical and regional variations on hummus recipes, how they've varied, possible influencers, etc. mindphlux fucked around with this message at 12:09 on Jan 26, 2017 |
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Jan 26, 2017 12:06
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Anybody got a recommendation for a Thai cookbook with a heavy (or total) emphasis on Isan?
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Feb 12, 2017 17:45
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Here, have an in depth Lebanese cookbook, by a Lebanese woman. https://www.amazon.com/Lebanese-Kitchen-Salma-Hage/dp/0714864803 I really like the Phaidon house for deep regional tomes. I have their Lebanese, Greek, Indian, and Thai (this one is white guy who traveled there) books. toplitzin fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Feb 12, 2017 |
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Feb 12, 2017 22:08
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