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DeimosRising
Oct 17, 2005

¡Hola SEA!

Rick posted:

I was a bit confused as to why Johnathan Motley was ranked so low, and I think one thing I have finally accepted is the red flag of age. He had a monster all around game and knocked Texas's bigs off the floor, including Jarret Allen. Is that because he's a 21 year old who has had three years to work on his body? Like he's bigger than most college guys, but he's not NBA big. All things I guess draft watchers have to consider while watching a guy who just was absolutely dominant.

Jarrett Allen…I just didn't see 'it' but I guess in a game where someone is in constant foul trouble is useless so I'll try and find another.

Watch him in a bad game and the red flags are much more obvious. He can't shoot or pass, so if he's not the biggest or most athletic guy on the court he's not going to have any offense. He has the length and speed to be a good defender, but his court awareness is poor on both ends so he's going to struggle learning NBA defenses.

I watched his highlights from the Texas game and nothing but the garbage clean up is going to translate. He's not getting calls on those wild drives to the rim (or being allowed to go right over and over when he can't dribble left) and he's not backing guys down in the NBA. WVU and Kansas State chumped him in consecutive games just by being too strong for him to push around, and those aren't exactly huge teams.

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Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Miles Bridges seemed to just be everywhere, he had a lot of non-box score influence on the game. I loved his slashes to the basket. He is small though. His jumper looked fine in the game I watched (Michigan St v Indiana) but apparently that is not always the case and I think he might have some problems in the NBA if that is the case. But I definitely see the talent and athleticism and maybe the modern NBA could find room for him.

Thomas Bryant has a wide body. I liked his defense and rebounding. He's quick and athletic. I really hated his offense. Ugly out of control drives, mostly bad post plays, and while he only took one jumper it was a bad one. He seemed to have tunnel vision and was not gonna pass once he got the ball on the offensive end no matter what. Maybe the right coaching could help with that though, because I think the size and D will be very tempting for lottery teams.



DeimosRising posted:

Watch him in a bad game and the red flags are much more obvious. He can't shoot or pass, so if he's not the biggest or most athletic guy on the court he's not going to have any offense. He has the length and speed to be a good defender, but his court awareness is poor on both ends so he's going to struggle learning NBA defenses.

I watched his highlights from the Texas game and nothing but the garbage clean up is going to translate. He's not getting calls on those wild drives to the rim (or being allowed to go right over and over when he can't dribble left) and he's not backing guys down in the NBA. WVU and Kansas State chumped him in consecutive games just by being too strong for him to push around, and those aren't exactly huge teams.

I'll try and make a second pass on him, but your assessment seems logical to me.

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

straight up brolic posted:

He's Lou Williams/Jamal Crawford with better athleticism. You don't want him in the top 5, but beyond that he's good value

I haven't seen a full game of him yet but from what I've seen, this is spot on. His game is so Lou Williams that it's uncanny because you know he did not, and no one ever, grew up on the court pretending to be the next Lou Williams.

Henchman of Santa
Aug 21, 2010


Rick posted:

Miles Bridges seemed to just be everywhere, he had a lot of non-box score influence on the game. I loved his slashes to the basket. He is small though. His jumper looked fine in the game I watched (Michigan St v Indiana) but apparently that is not always the case and I think he might have some problems in the NBA if that is the case. But I definitely see the talent and athleticism and maybe the modern NBA could find room for him.

Thomas Bryant has a wide body. I liked his defense and rebounding. He's quick and athletic. I really hated his offense. Ugly out of control drives, mostly bad post plays, and while he only took one jumper it was a bad one. He seemed to have tunnel vision and was not gonna pass once he got the ball on the offensive end no matter what. Maybe the right coaching could help with that though, because I think the size and D will be very tempting for lottery teams.


I'll try and make a second pass on him, but your assessment seems logical to me.

Bridges had 33 points, 7 boards and was like 5/7 from three last night.

paternity suitor
Aug 2, 2016



God drat Lakers are just screaming their way to the bottom. Please don't get a top 3 pick again, thanks in advance.

tanglewood1420
Oct 28, 2010

The importance of this mission cannot be overemphasized


I went on NBA tankathon and on my first sim draft the Kings and Knicks both jumped the Lakers so Philly got #2 and #4 overall.

If that happens in real life they are putting a statue of Hinke next to the Rocky one.

paternity suitor
Aug 2, 2016



tanglewood1420 posted:

I went on NBA tankathon and on my first sim draft the Kings and Knicks both jumped the Lakers so Philly got #2 and #4 overall.

If that happens in real life they are putting a statue of Hinke next to the Rocky one.

Don't stop, I'm almost there

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Henchman of Santa posted:

Bridges had 33 points, 7 boards and was like 5/7 from three last night.

I also missed his Arizona game which was just silly of me but he had good numbers there, too. I think as long as the league doesn't swing big again (it might, some teams have started to finally try rolling out big lineups against small lineups again instead of matching up with them) he'll be fine.

--

Robert Williams has some crazy jumping ability and giant arms. He seems to be offended by the existence of the basketball. This is great when he is swatting it out of the air or slamming it into the hoop. Not so good when trying to pass or dribble it or even really rebound it, where he seems loath to touch the object. Perhaps if someone can teach him to love the orange orb they would have a great player on their hands.

Carlosologist
Oct 13, 2013

Impossible's just another Tuesday in Central City


if I don't get too hammered before the game, I'm gonna try and scout Josh Hart when Villanova plays my school. what should I be on the lookout for as an amateur scout?

straight up brolic
Jan 31, 2007

After all, I was nice in ball,
Came to practice weed scented
Report card like the speed limit



Lonzo Ball's FT form is disgusting

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Carlosologist posted:

if I don't get too hammered before the game, I'm gonna try and scout Josh Hart when Villanova plays my school. what should I be on the lookout for as an amateur scout?

What I am interested in is his ability to play the point in the NBA.

Declan MacManus
Sep 1, 2011

It's this one thing

Carlosologist posted:

if I don't get too hammered before the game, I'm gonna try and scout Josh Hart when Villanova plays my school. what should I be on the lookout for as an amateur scout?

generally speaking, off the ball stuff will tell you more about a player in terms of bball IQ whereas on the ball stuff is good for assessing skill and talent level. watching fast breaks and off ball cuts will tell you a lot about how athletic someone is

With Hart in particular, watch how he handles inside pressure and how he creates with the ball in his hand, and also watch his shooting from long distance; these are the areas of concern for NBA scouts

aBagorn
Aug 26, 2004


Can people who watch more college bball than me talk to me about Jonathan Isaac? I'm hearing Brandon Ingram comparisons, is this true?

Dejan Bimble
Mar 24, 2008

Verhy old and rocky thoughts


Plaster Town Cop

straight up brolic posted:

Lonzo Ball's FT form is disgusting

It honestly looks like the little hand movement a ballet dancer does after a plié

straight up brolic
Jan 31, 2007

After all, I was nice in ball,
Came to practice weed scented
Report card like the speed limit



the look

https://twitter.com/RobDauster/stat...849203578839040

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

loving lmao

Redgrendel2001
Sep 1, 2006
you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.



This is amazing.

wandler20
Nov 13, 2002

I love my second round kicker


aBagorn posted:

Can people who watch more college bball than me talk to me about Jonathan Isaac? I'm hearing Brandon Ingram comparisons, is this true?

As someone who has watched every FSU game, he seems really good. But I'm no expert on the matter, just a casual fan. I'd also like more talk on him.

Paul Zuvella
Dec 7, 2011



This dude is already flopping at an NBA all-star level.

NickRoweFillea
Sep 27, 2012

poor bear


straight up brolic posted:

Lonzo Ball's FT form is disgusting

Jay Bilas just compared it to Furyk's swing lol

straight up brolic
Jan 31, 2007

After all, I was nice in ball,
Came to practice weed scented
Report card like the speed limit



NickRoweFillea posted:

Jay Bilas just compared it to Furyk's swing lol
that's great lmao

Metapod
Mar 18, 2012



NickRoweFillea posted:

Jay Bilas just compared it to Furyk's swing lol

lmfao

NickRoweFillea
Sep 27, 2012

poor bear


I followed Jim Furyk around during the FESJC a couple years ago and it was positively sensational to see a man who swings like he has vertigo and Parkinson's blast the ball straight and true

straight up brolic
Jan 31, 2007

After all, I was nice in ball,
Came to practice weed scented
Report card like the speed limit



Josh Jackson looks really good at everything but half court offense.

Ty1990
Apr 22, 2011



aBagorn posted:

Can people who watch more college bball than me talk to me about Jonathan Isaac? I'm hearing Brandon Ingram comparisons, is this true?

My casual observations:

His per 100 possession numbers are actually better than Ingram's. He's lengthy and has a huge ceiling defensively. Not quite as good a shooter as Ingram from 3 point range but has a better overall FG% and is a much better free throw shooter. His rebounding is pretty loving elite for his position too. Overall I think he's better defensively too, racks up a good amount of steals and blocks.

Basically, I know he plays on a better team than Ingram did and I might be talking out of my rear end but I prefer him as a prospect when comparing the two. I think there's a pretty good chance that had he been in last years class he would've went #2.

aBagorn
Aug 26, 2004


Ty1990 posted:

My casual observations:

His per 100 possession numbers are actually better than Ingram's. He's lengthy and has a huge ceiling defensively. Not quite as good a shooter as Ingram from 3 point range but has a better overall FG% and is a much better free throw shooter. His rebounding is pretty loving elite for his position too. Overall I think he's better defensively too, racks up a good amount of steals and blocks.

Basically, I know he plays on a better team than Ingram did and I might be talking out of my rear end but I prefer him as a prospect when comparing the two. I think there's a pretty good chance that had he been in last years class he would've went #2.

Thanks. Yeah his length and defensive potential is what intrigues me as a Sixers fan. I'm imagining the Sixers being able to get him and Ntilikina and having all that length and defense (with Simmons and Embiid)

Dejan Bimble
Mar 24, 2008

Verhy old and rocky thoughts


Plaster Town Cop

Ty1990 posted:

My casual observations:

His per 100 possession numbers are actually better than Ingram's. He's lengthy and has a huge ceiling defensively. Not quite as good a shooter as Ingram from 3 point range but has a better overall FG% and is a much better free throw shooter. His rebounding is pretty loving elite for his position too. Overall I think he's better defensively too, racks up a good amount of steals and blocks.

Basically, I know he plays on a better team than Ingram did and I might be talking out of my rear end but I prefer him as a prospect when comparing the two. I think there's a pretty good chance that had he been in last years class he would've went #2.
He also has about twice the physical volume as Ingram, despite only being an inch taller and 30 pounds heavier. Ingram is like a post card on a juice cleanse. Isaac is just thin. He's a really skillled player for his size and moves well. I've only seen one FSU game and haven't watched much else of him. The biggest difference between he and Ingram is that Isaac will be able to play pf and not be blown around like the famous beautiful shopping bag from the academy award winning drama American Beauty

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Gosh darn it, I didn't get any of this weekend's games recorded.

Well luckily all the ESPN ones can be watched online still and Arizona vs Washington is on again Wednesday (which I was planning to watch later today anyway). Probably got a better Jonathan Issac game scheduled anyway than the one this weekend and get a second pass at Dennis Smith.

I need to see more of Issac to really have a conclusion, since the only game I saw him in was the game where FSU was just a total mess and I only had about half the game anyway.

Rick fucked around with this message at Jan 30, 2017 around 20:31

Ty1990
Apr 22, 2011



aBagorn posted:

Thanks. Yeah his length and defensive potential is what intrigues me as a Sixers fan. I'm imagining the Sixers being able to get him and Ntilikina and having all that length and defense (with Simmons and Embiid)

If I could have any combination of two players in this draft not including Fultz, Isaac and Ntilikina are the exact two I'd take (I'm a philly fan as well)

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

So I've seen more of these guys than anyone else but Markkanen, but I wanted to see this game before writing aabout them.

Josh Jackson looks like a classic NBA wing prospect. All the moves you just would expect a highly drafted basketball player to have, if it was like 2003. It may see, like I'm saying this to set up an insult but I'm not. He has a sort of timeless basketball skill that we just haven't seen a lot of the last five years from people that age in that body style. I thought he was kind of dumb in the first game I saw him in, but as I've seen him more I've decided he is just extremely confident in his abilities and thinks that he can do anything which sometimes causes him to take risks that ultimately make him look bad, and he otherwise makes a lot of intelligent plays and puts himself in great positions on the floor. I think if anything playing for a team that has a lot of weapons is causing his game to be under-exhibited, and I'm saying that about a guy who has had some big games. Obviously the shot is going to need work, and I'm not sure he will immediately be able to defend NBA caliber athletes. And maybe the NBA just doesn't need that style of wing player anymore. So for those reasons, I expect Fultz and maybe even Ball going ahead of him. But I dunno, he could definitely wind up being great.

Malik Monk is Lou Williams ver 2.0. 2.0 because he's more athletic than Williams is, which might be able to overcome some of the shortcomings that have relegated Williams to a very good backup basketball player. Of course, they might not, so I wouldn't pick in the top 5, as others have said here.

De'Aaron Fox is so loving fast. Fast players usually end up having some impact at the NBA level, so while he may not have the complete guard package that Ball or Fultz have, this guy probably has a future. There isn't much to his halfcourt game, if teams are packing the paint or his defender is cutting off the drive he doesn't do much. Not much to say about his jumper, doesn't really seem to want to take them unless he has to. His passing is good. Defensively, he gets lots of steals through his speed, and he's fast enough (at least against college athletes) to recover when gambles and misses, but I'm not so sure about his on the ball defense and he's really thin so when he bodies people they usually just brush him off and then get easy basket attacks.

I wrote "Dwight Howard the Second" in my notes about another player as an insult, but Bam Adebayo I mean it as a compliment, as there are shades of what we saw from young Dwight in Orlando. Powerful around the basket, and athletic as heck, with a nose for the ball. He can't help himself and tries to contest every shot which causes him to be defensively exploitable, and I just don't see much as far as offensive moves. Also I'm not sure if he's really 6'10". And obviously while it looks like he has the start of an awesome NBA body, that's no guarantee he'll actually fill out in the pros.

Rick fucked around with this message at Jan 30, 2017 around 22:34

DeimosRising
Oct 17, 2005

¡Hola SEA!

Dwight's not really 6'10" either (nor was Hakeem) and everyone bites on every shot when they're young. I haven't watched him but that's not a disqualifier.

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

DeimosRising posted:

Dwight's not really 6'10" either (nor was Hakeem) and everyone bites on every shot when they're young. I haven't watched him but that's not a disqualifier.

Yeah definitely not a disqualifier. He's my first center so far on the board for me.

Declan MacManus
Sep 1, 2011

It's this one thing

Fox is at least as fast as Wall, if not faster. He's going to get bullied around the rim and can't even kind of maybe sorta shoot a little bit but he's got a lot of promising physical tools and has good ballhandling and passing skills

I like him in the late lottery

Adebayo reminds me of Patric Young

Ty1990
Apr 22, 2011



What are Lonzo Ball's weaknesses outside of his insane shooting form?

Everything about him seems good to great outside of the shooting form and his FT%, but those things alone make me really hesitant to like him.

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

It's nitpicky but the weakness of Ball besides what you mentioned is that he's not like, a super athlete.

straight up brolic
Jan 31, 2007

After all, I was nice in ball,
Came to practice weed scented
Report card like the speed limit



Ty1990 posted:

What are Lonzo Ball's weaknesses outside of his insane shooting form?

Everything about him seems good to great outside of the shooting form and his FT%, but those things alone make me really hesitant to like him.
he's struggled, at times, against comparable or better athletes. really bad in the USC game.

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
And now the whole nation - pulpit and all - will take up the war-cry, and shout itself hoarse, and mob any honest man who ventures to open his mouth; and presently such mouths will cease to open.

Dennis Smith can be pretty fun to watch. I have some concerns about how he reacts to double teams or determined perimeter defense, and he shoots the high school heave still from three, but he gets to the basket like crazy and makes smart passes and his team around him better.

I have another NC State game on my watch list and maybe Yurtseven will be good in that one but at this point but right now I just don't really see anything NBA about his game.

Jayson Tatum looks really good. I'm not always sure about his decision making but he has a way of bailing himself out of mistakes via talent. His jumper looks fine, although it doesn't go in. I kind of wonder if he was on another team that spent more time highlighting him if he'd look even better.

Harry Giles is a good basketball player locked into a broken body.

I really wanted to write Luke Kennard off, because I mean, look at him, but he is really surprising. He has deceptive athleticism, like he looks like he's not going to get to the basket but next thing you know he's there. I feel like this is some team's future bench hustle guy.

I think Marques Bolden gets drafted somewhere because of his height and length, and he does seem to be able to score on pure physical ability, but he looked pretty slow at times and he has a "I'm concentrating" look on his face when trying to rebound which is comical and makes it look really unnatural, so I fully expect him to get boxed out in the NBA if he doesn't get fully developed.

chunkles
Aug 14, 2005



I'd like to propose that an NBA team should use a second round pick on football player Kobe Buffalomeat, MLB style, in the hopes that he'll eventually embrace his destiny and play basketball.

SamuraiFoochs
Jan 16, 2007



Grimey Drawer

John Collins is probably going to be a first round pick and I simultaneously love it and hate it.

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Jota
May 6, 2003

uga-booga uga-booga

Pretty crazy that it's likely that #1 pick two years in a row will be a college player from a team that missed the tournament. I watched UCLA-Washington tonight just to see Ball and Fultz. Now I haven't watched Washington a ton, but that team around Fultz is an absolute tire fire. Should lead to some interesting takes about him not being a winner but he's so nice.

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