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So North Carolina is a state a lot like other states in that it has elections. Elections are usually a pretty simple thing, you get more votes, you win. The only real exception to that rule is of course the electoral college, which Alexander Hamilton geniusly thought of to keep America from ever electing someone who has "[t]alents for low intrigue, and the little arts of popularity" and is excessively beholden to foreign interests and only focussed on being president for personal gain. Good loving job Hamilton, here have a rap musical. There's another exception, though. In some states, a state legislature can actually override an election if they feel it was 'contested' and therefore illegitimate. Obviously the writers of such laws wrote these clauses in the event that we find one of the candidates was plying entire factories of people with alcohol in exchange for a vote. But this year, in the state of North Carolina, Pat 'Crybaby' McCrory has decided he'd like to contest it another way. Election Night So, the people of North Carolina voted on election day for a governor and the democrat Roy Cooper appeared to be ahead of the incumbent Pat 'Queers Are in the Bathroom!' McCrory by the end of the night by about 5,000 votes. It was still too close to call however and absentee / provisional ballots could change the outcome. In the two weeks since the election, all of the additional counts have moved Roy Cooper closer to an obvious win. While the AP and other news agencies may not have called it yet, Cooper now has a 7,500 vote lead, which is likely insurmountable unless a recount shows some really crazy miscounts. Still, that's a close election in a race where 4.7 million votes were cast and unless Cooper wins by more than 10,000 when all the remaining votes are counted, a recount is likely. However, since the counting has been going on for two weeks already, a recount has a very low chance of changing the outcome. The Aftermath At this point, it's understandable McCrory doesn't concede. If it's close, a recount makes sense and let's have that be the final arbiter of who won. Cooper has, of course, claimed victory as is his wont, and normally an election loser will simply just say "Let's wait until all the votes are in." or something equally non-commital. Governor McCrory, however, has been a little more blatant about how much of a sore loser he is: https://twitter.com/PatMcCroryNC/status/796336542792949760 Well that's not bad. Respect the process. Cool. https://twitter.com/PatMcCroryNC/status/798673150611361792 Huh, that seems a little more unhinged... From the article on the governor's own website, this is their evidence of voter fraud: quote:The protest, filed by Bladen County Soil and Water Conservation District Supervisor McCrae Dowless and corroborated by a forensic handwriting expert, notes “shocking evidence resulting from a blatant scheme to try to impact the voting results of an entire county and perhaps even sway statewide and federal elections,” including the gubernatorial race. So someone running for County Soil and Water Conservation District Supervisor hired a handwriting analyst to say that a bunch of write-in votes had similar handwriting, and Governor McCrory has latched onto this as evidence of systemic voter fraud. Now, of course, handwriting experts are a dime a dozen and handwriting analysis is pretty much bullshit, but whatever. Let's keep going: https://twitter.com/Team_McCrory/status/799029788350566405 https://twitter.com/PatMcCroryNC/status/799376379854864384 This is the meat of the aftermath, Pat McCrory has filed official protests in about half the counties in the state (the blackest ones of course) basically claiming that since one handwriting analyst hired by someone who lost a soil and water conservation election claims there may be some fraud with write-ins, that it affects every county where there are absentee ballots and essentially every absentee ballot must be challenged. The Aftermath of the aftermath The protests were made at the county level and most of the complaints alleged there was a massive democrat-led project to doctor black voters' absentee ballots. There's no real evidence and most county boards (which are overwhelmingly republican) rejected his claims. So, McCrory appealed to the republican-controlled state board of elections and they, too, said "no fuk u": http://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/election/article116060918.html. They did agree to go over guidelines for the county level to make sure all contested ballots are dealt with the same way. The Denouement So that settles it. Pat McCrory has very likely lost and, knowing he will likely lose on a recount, has decided to poison the well of his successor, ginning up controversy amongst the republicans of North Carolina to suggest that Governor Cooper was behind an evil plan to switch black votes to vote for him instead of McCrory. That certainly sucks for Cooper but once he gets into office and governs well.... wait, that's not the end? The loving Crazy poo poo So, as referenced earlier, there is a law in the state of North Carolina that goes like this: quote:A contested election for any elective office established by Article III of the Constitution shall be determined by joint ballot of both houses of the General Assembly under Article VI, Section 5 of the Constitution in accordance with the provisions of this section. So by simple majority vote, the house and senate of North Carolina can say "The election is contested." (Now's a good time to read up again on gerrymandering in North Carolina, suffice to say that even though republicans tend to get around 50% of the vote in state house elections, they control 62% of the chamber). What happens next is, as far as I can tell, unprecedented in North Carolina history, but the president pro tempore of the Senate and the Speaker of the House then get together and each appoint a special commission comprised of 3 members of 1 party and 2 members of the other. These two commissions then recommend to their respective chambers whether the election was fair or not. Basically, the commission can simply decide "No, the votes in this county don't count so gently caress you and we recommend the house of representatives / Senate vote to make Pat McCrory the winner of the election." Reporters have been saying that inside sources close to the governor say this is the plan. The fomenting of "voter fraud!!!!" allegations is not so much to make Cooper seem illegitimate, but as to give some cronies on the House of Representatives an out: a way to recommend that the house and senate vote to override the voters and keep Pat as governor. The loving Crazier poo poo So, why would they do something so blatantly undemocratic? Well, obviously they don't want to give up power, but there was one other reason. This election right here: https://ballotpedia.org/North_Carolina_Supreme_Court_elections,_2016 It's a judicial election between Bob Edmunds and Michael Morgan. Bob Edmunds, the incumbent, was absolutely loving demolished by Michael Morgan despite spending nearly a quarter of a million dollars to Morgan's 20k or so. If you know anything about judicial elections, you know that means Edmunds was insanely unpopular. This means that the state supreme court is now 4-3 in favour of more democratic judges. So the house could just override that one too, right? Not likely, Edmunds got destroyed. If voter fraud gave Morgan the win, it was voter fraud on the level of ancient Mayan spirits inhabiting the bodies of over 300,000 North Carolinians and having them vote for Morgan. And if that happened, who would want to override Mayan spirits? They'll gently caress you up. However, the ultimate plan in keeping McCrory in office is to pack the court. According to the Charlotte Observer, republicans already have a plan: http://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article114048698.html quote:The North Carolina Constitution states that the Supreme Court shall consist of a chief justice and six associate justices, but the General Assembly may increase the number of associate justices to eight. If two seats were added, the governor would appoint the justices who fill the seats until the next election. To remain in the seats, those justices then would have to stand for election, and that would not be until 2018. Of course, Republicans deny this, but if they're willing to go far enough to override the election by claiming fraud, packing the court would be the next blatantly obvious step. We talk a lot about how the US is turning into a Banana Republic, but this would turn North Carolina into the fuckin Donkey Kong Banana Hoard.  If you want to stay up to date on this, http://www.newsobserver.com - The Charlotte News & Observer has been covering this fairly well, probably the best source. edit: http://www.ncpolicywatch.com/ - Awesome site https://twitter.com/PatMcCroryNC - Governor McCrory's twitter https://twitter.com/RoyCooperNC - Challenger Roy Cooper's twitter pathetic little tramp has issued a correction as of 21:09 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 21, 2016 20:03
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| # ? Apr 19, 2024 01:11 |
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obligatory gently caress the NC GOP
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Nov 21, 2016 20:05
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I'm not owned
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Nov 21, 2016 20:11
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one thing i found interesting is that mike morgan got an endorsement from NC fraternal order of police and a justice advocate group edmunds got mccrory and most county (((sheriffs)))
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Nov 21, 2016 20:20
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Thanks for the thread. It's very nice to have a good resource to keep track of this situation.
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Nov 21, 2016 20:24
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i had asked in the trump thread when we were talking about pat's attempts to pack the court, has anyone actually tried to do that since FDR?
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Nov 21, 2016 20:26
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I can't think of any state where it's happened. The funny thing is most state constitutions outline very specifically things like "The court shall consist of X amount of justices" while the Supreme Court of the United States doesn't actually have anything giving it an official number ( in 1789, they passed a law saying it should consist of 6 justices and that didn't really hold up).
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Nov 21, 2016 20:31
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pathetic little tramp posted:I can't think of any state where it's happened. i wish we had like nielsen ratings for conservatives across the nation so many things i'm like "huh, wonder how they react to that and how long they care" ps thanks for the thread!
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Nov 21, 2016 20:34
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Yeah, woo, my lovely state is back in the news, once again, due to known empty suit familiar of Art Pope: Mayor McCheese, Pat McCrory. Thanks for sending your finest, Ohio.
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Nov 21, 2016 20:39
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have the guy who won just walk into the governors office and shoot him for tresspassing imo nc has castle doctrine right?
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Nov 21, 2016 20:43
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NC is hosed. I am pretty confident the General Assembly will override the result of the governor's race and install Pat as permanent god emperor, while installing two more Supreme Court justices, to keep their racket going for another 8 years at least. Reasons for: -They can. The state constitution is fundamentally broken, and it gives the General Assembly complete power to do all of this. -If they want the 2 extra justices, they need to install Pat as Governor, because there's a chance Cooper could kick out their nominees and put in 2 democrats if he gets in. -There is absolutely nothing Democrats can do about it. The NC GOP literally have the power to go full dictator, and there would be no repercussions ever. Democrats would hold a few drum circles, a few protests, and then go back to being miserable and doing nothing as every public institution in the state is fully dismantled and sold to the highest bidder. -Any fear of some kind of Federal repercussion is gone since the GOP will control literally everything Federal next year. Reasons against: -Uh, I don't know, I guess it would be the nice thing to do to let the person who won the most votes win? Tough call right? I'm sure the GOP are just scratching their heads on this difficult decision.
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Nov 21, 2016 20:54
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FL > NC has turned out to be the most lateral of all the moves I have made in my life
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Nov 21, 2016 20:56
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Speaking of our dipshit founding fathers, how's this laboratory of democracy holding up? Maybe we can race Kentucky to the bottom and see who gets there first.
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Nov 21, 2016 20:58
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Should also mention, NC's GOP has been ruthless at every turn since 2008. -NC is the most gerrymandered state in the country. In 2012 democrats won a majority of votes for the Congressional delegation, but took only 4 of the 13 seats. -NC's general assembly is the same way. Republicans enjoy permanent supermajorities in both houses which are impossible to get rid of, even in a national democratic tide. -NC is the only state I'm aware of where the General Assembly draws districts for itself AND the governor cannot veto them. -The GOP previously tried to prevent the state Supreme Court election from happening through unconstitutional means. They're well aware that control of the court would give democrats a chance of breaking out of their electoral prison. When Edmund's term was nearing its end, they tried to set up a retention election, which would've been "voters can choose to keep Edmunds on another term, or get rid of him, in which case McCrory would appoint a successor". This was blocked at the federal level. Should give you some idea of the lengths they're willing to go. -When democrats won big in Raleigh and Greensboro in 2012 (there were no Republicans left in elected office in Wake County after all the teabaggers on the schoolboard were voted out), the General Assembly intervened and drew new gerrymandered districts for those municipal elections. Bodyholes has issued a correction as of 21:09 on Nov 21, 2016 |
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Nov 21, 2016 21:06
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It sucks to feel so powerless. NC is one of the most purple states in the country, and it's so frustrating to see the shift drag on so long and the increasing gap between popular opinion and state government policy.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:13
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Mental-Rectangle posted:Should also mention, NC's GOP has been ruthless at every turn since 2008. well poo poo this is hyperdepressing
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Nov 21, 2016 21:27
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Rurutia posted:It sucks to feel so powerless. NC is one of the most purple states in the country, and it's so frustrating to see the shift drag on so long and the increasing gap between popular opinion and state government policy. If democrats could stop being such a loving disaster at winning elections nationally we wouldn't be having this problem. The main issue is that the democratic contingent in NC relies heavily on youth turnout--moreso than any other state. Young voters are flaky and unreliable. NC's young voters are the flakiest and least reliable voters on the planet. It was because of this that I knew as soon as Clinton was the dem nominee, NC was gonna be in trouble this year. Republicans in NC are old and turn out like goddamn machines. If you look at every election, midterm or presidential, since 2008 when they were caught a bit off-guard... they've been extremely consistent at generating a certain number of votes... and besting their previous year by 60,000 or so every time. Every new Republican this state gets gets turned into a consistent voter immediately. While the millennials that voted for Obama still live here and many are in their 30s (and Clinton did much better among 30-44 year olds than Obama because of it), they're just not turning out.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:30
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Mental-Rectangle posted:Should also mention, NC's GOP has been ruthless at every turn since 2008. *me reading this* nice.. nice nice nice nice
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Nov 21, 2016 21:30
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North Carolina is going into some weird apartheid/Jim Crow level voter disenfranchisement. I like how we're bringing back white supremacist coups, a storied part of southern state history.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilmington_insurrection_of_1898
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Nov 21, 2016 21:31
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Phone posted:Speaking of our dipshit founding fathers, how's this laboratory of democracy holding up? As a Kentuckian, tough luck getting to the bottom first. We have a basically untouchable dictator for governor and the Trump landslide here (That Clinton coal comment killed things), gave republicans insanely unchecked power. Kentucky used to be one of the hidden gems of education, but we're going to get Brownbacked in record time now.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:39
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Atrocious Joe posted:North Carolina is going into some weird apartheid/Jim Crow level voter disenfranchisement. You don't even need to go back that far. I wrote my college thesis on how North Carolina had literal Klansmen in county offices as late as the late 1960s. All we can do now is volunteer for county parties, mobilize, and get out the loving vote in 2018 and 2020.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:40
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Coheed and Camembert posted:All we can do now is volunteer for county parties, mobilize, and get out the loving vote in 2018 and 2020.
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Nov 21, 2016 21:42
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*guy after reading entire thread about how voting is rigged* Guess we just need to vote more
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Nov 21, 2016 21:43
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pretty sure the ga overturning the vote and the court packing schemes were floated by some civitas toady and not anyone serious i know the ga leadership has said they're not interested in convening a session to install mayor mccheese, but of course they can't be trusted what's more likely to happen is after cooper's certified as the winner, the ga will call an emergency session to strip the governor's office of every unilateral power it has- stuff like appointing the state elections board, the unc board, and most importantly the state bureau of investigations. which incidentally was moved from the ag's office after mccrory became governor because he and a few ga members were tied up in a federal corruption investigation revolving around video poker lobbyists that took down the lt governor of florida
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Nov 21, 2016 21:46
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I'm glad that the rule of law means nothing now that the insane psychopath party has a legislative majority at every level of government This is a clusterfuck
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Nov 21, 2016 21:51
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The Muppets On PCP posted:pretty sure the ga overturning the vote and the court packing schemes were floated by some civitas toady and not anyone serious That could also be the case. They've stripped power multiple times at this point in other areas. In 2010 Wake County's schoolboard got overrun by tea party racist assholes who voted to cancel the busing system--which integrated all the schools in the district by economic tiers. That system was highly successful for a decade and was duplicated by many other cities, but it meant the republicans in state government in Raleigh had to send their kids to school with... y'know... those people. There was such an uproar over this that democrats won a majority back on the board in 2011. So the General Assembly transferred power from the schoolboard to the Wake County Board of Commissioners where they still had a majority, and then gerrymandered the everliving poo poo out of the schoolboard districts. The following year, democrats won every single seat on the BOC, and won a supermajority on the schoolboard even with the retarded districts. So the General Assembly gerrymandered the BOC districts after that. And this sort of pattern continues. Whenever democrats gain power anywhere, the General Assembly immediately stamps it out.
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Nov 21, 2016 22:00
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You're a naive idiot if you think that the NC GOP aren't a bunch of weasel faced motherfuckers who would sell their own mothers into chattel slavery if Art Pope rubbed two nickels together. Some examples: 1. Back in the 00s, Wilson went to TWC and Charter and whoever else and told them "we're growing at an insane rate, we need fatter pipes. Please please please put some new copper in the ground" and the telcos turned up their noses and said "No." So the government put it on a ballot to raise money for a bond to roll their own fiber, it passed, and people in Wilson could get 100Mbit/s symmetrical service whereas people in Raleigh or Charlotte were stuck with 20/5 service via TWC. Time Warner whined to the legislators that it's unfair that Wilson went out and rolled their own fiber because it's anti-competitive. Now there's a law on the books saying that if a municipality wants to be an ISP, they have to be revenue neutral day 1. How many podunk towns in NC are sitting on 100 million dollars in their coffers? Zero? Funny that. 2. Duke Energy spilled a poo poo load of coal ash into the Dan River. Mayor McCheese pleaded and begged to not be too hasty to either clean up the environmental disaster or levy fines against his former employer. We have to be patient, we have to wait, we can't be mean to poor ol' little power company Duke Energy. Oh, but it's totes cool for Duke to pass on the cost of the clean up to it's customers. Yeah, why wouldn't you? 3. I think it was Alec Bald Snatch in the NC LAN thread that described the speed of which HB2 was signed as being sufficient "to light the paper on fire". When the NC GOP wants to get regressive dumb bullshit passed because everyone keeping an eye on them had the audacity to blink for a microsecond, they get poo poo done and then "joke" about sending the bill to a "liberal" city. All of the rumors are true.
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Nov 21, 2016 22:05
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Mental-Rectangle posted:That could also be the case. They've stripped power multiple times at this point in other areas. oh it was longer than a decade the original busing plan dates back to the countywide merger in the late 70s, but it was indexed to free/reduced lunch rates in the 90s, when they started the reassignment program the bigger story behind the wake segregation debacle was every one of the tea party affiliated members were transplants from the northeast, as are the bulk of the ncgop leadership Phone posted:1. Back in the 00s, Wilson went to TWC and Charter and whoever else and told them "we're growing at an insane rate, we need fatter pipes. Please please please put some new copper in the ground" and the telcos turned up their noses and said "No." So the government put it on a ballot to raise money for a bond to roll their own fiber, it passed, and people in Wilson could get 100Mbit/s symmetrical service whereas people in Raleigh or Charlotte were stuck with 20/5 service via TWC. Time Warner whined to the legislators that it's unfair that Wilson went out and rolled their own fiber because it's anti-competitive. Now there's a law on the books saying that if a municipality wants to be an ISP, they have to be revenue neutral day 1. How many podunk towns in NC are sitting on 100 million dollars in their coffers? Zero? Funny that. it wasn't so much wilson building greenlight as it was the towns nearby wanted to buy service from them where centurylink (which was called embarq at the time) and twc already had monopoly power and were refusing to upgrade services beyond basically low end dsl level that freaked them out The Muppets On PCP has issued a correction as of 22:32 on Nov 21, 2016 |
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Nov 21, 2016 22:17
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The Muppets On PCP posted:the bigger story behind the wake segregation debacle was every one of the tea party affiliated members were transplants from the northeast, as are the bulk of the ncgop leadership including mccrory lol just wanna point that out for readers at home who are unaware most people from NE i've met are cool, but drat guys stop sending the lovely ones please
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Nov 21, 2016 22:33
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Karl Sharks posted:including mccrory lol just wanna point that out for readers at home who are unaware yeah it's a quick tell that the author doesn't know poo poo about poo poo whenever there's an article in national media about our shenanigans when they have a line about northeastern transplants shifting the state blue when it's like those assholes are the reason there's a viable republican party here at all
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Nov 21, 2016 22:52
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The Muppets On PCP posted:yeah it's a quick tell that the author doesn't know poo poo about poo poo whenever there's an article in national media about our shenanigans when they have a line about northeastern transplants shifting the state blue when it's like those assholes are the reason there's a viable republican party here at all yeah cause it couldn't be both
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Nov 21, 2016 22:52
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Karl Sharks posted:yeah cause it couldn't be both i mean there are some who are part of the emerging voter bloc shifting the state dems from the rural populist party based in the eastern part of the state it had been for decades toward an urban coalition centered around the triangle, triad, and charlotte, but that also includes a lot of people moving from the rural areas to cities as well, especially from the minority-heavy counties in the northeast but at the same time the power of dems statewide has diminished significantly alongside the increase in outside migration
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Nov 21, 2016 23:11
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The Muppets On PCP posted:i mean there are some who are part of the emerging voter bloc shifting the state dems from the rural populist party based in the eastern part of the state it had been for decades toward an urban coalition centered around the triangle, triad, and charlotte, but that also includes a lot of people moving from the rural areas to cities as well, especially from the minority-heavy counties in the northeast but you'll have to do a hell of a lot more than give a couple posts to convince me that's a causation not correlation (not that my opinion matters, just sayin)
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Nov 21, 2016 23:14
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There is a weird dynamic going on: The republicans in positions of government are all carpetbaggers but most of the people voting for them are natives in rural parts of the state. The democrats in positions of government are all natives, but most of the people voting for them are newcomers in the major cities.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:21
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Karl Sharks posted:but you'll have to do a hell of a lot more than give a couple posts to convince me that's a causation not correlation (not that my opinion matters, just sayin) well can't really do more than that since the ballot is secret. you just have to go on what data's available but you're right it is both things. my complaint was this notion espoused in some places that this was a beet red republican place like much of the rest of the south (and even that's not really true) and now the enlightened outsiders are here to save the place from savagery e: in other news look toward a 5-4 decision anchored by new supreme court justice roy moore http://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/politics-columns-blogs/under-the-dome/article116265693.html quote:N.C. House Speaker Tim Moore said Monday that the legislature could revisit voter ID requirements and other election laws in the wake of complaints filed with help from Gov. Pat McCrory’s campaign. The Muppets On PCP has issued a correction as of 23:36 on Nov 21, 2016 |
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Nov 21, 2016 23:32
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The Muppets On PCP posted:well can't really do more than that since the ballot is secret. you just have to go on what data's available oh okay i get that, yeah they're not the saviors, they're just something we can use to tip the scale
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Nov 21, 2016 23:35
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i swear to god we're gonna wind up having voter id every other election
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Nov 21, 2016 23:38
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The Muppets On PCP posted:well can't really do more than that since the ballot is secret. you just have to go on what data's available Yeah NC has always had a more significant progressive minority than the rest of the south. There was a string of actually pretty good governors from the 1932 to 1976. Also the first black mayor in a major city in the south, Clarence Lightner, in 1973. The state shifted hard right in the 80s and 90s though and has been slowly shifting back. Compared to the national average: 2000 - R +13 2004 - R +10 2008 - R +7.5 2012 - R +6 2016 - R +5 Still improving but painfully slowly. Democrats could gain a ton of ground if they have a really juicy year nationally. If the last 4 years living here has taught me anything it's that no matter how terrible things get, young voters still don't turn out worth a drat, no matter how much it affects their lives. We're just slowly and painfully waiting for Raleigh and Charlotte to get enough people to outweigh the tremendous amount of white trash in this state. Bodyholes has issued a correction as of 00:17 on Nov 22, 2016 |
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Nov 22, 2016 00:11
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The Muppets On PCP posted:
I don't think they've actually said this. Moore said it's too early to comment.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:22
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| # ? Apr 19, 2024 01:11 |
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gently caress NC GOP.
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Nov 22, 2016 00:53
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