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Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



Yes. Also ancient Lola F3000 (remember that?) chassis until like 2009. It used to be Italian F3000.

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Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



When Kimiya Sato absolutely dominates a season there is a problem.

Dudley
Feb 24, 2003

Tasty



gret posted:

I remember AutoGP was pretty weak back when I first heard about it (probably when Pippa Mann contested the Sonoma rounds way back when). Can't imagine the field has become much stronger.

e: LOL in the 2016 season only 9 drivers started a race in the series and only 2 drivers competed in all of the rounds.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_...en_Championship

Yep, that guy won the last race of the season.

2nd in that race? A guy who owns a supermaket in a Minardi PS04B.

gret
Dec 12, 2005

goggle-eyed freak



Human Grand Prix posted:

When Kimiya Sato absolutely dominates a season there is a problem.

Managed by world renowned shitposter Taki Inoue...

Cygni
Nov 12, 2005

raring to post



TV Sched, basically the same as this year I think

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



I keep pondering who the "1 or 2 engine manufacturers" are going to be per that one article I found from autoweek.

Ford
Nissan
Audi/Porsche/Volkswagen
Toyota
Dodge/Fiat
Mazda

Gotta be out of that pool. I'd love for it to be Ford and Toyota to be honest, though beggars cannot be choosers. (Ford because I think they BELONG in the sport, and Toyota because they seem to keen to throw money at advertising races.).

I imagine it has to be Ford with Ganassi, and -x- with SSM perhaps? I don't know whom else would have the abilities to anchor an OEM. (I think Andretti/Honda will be married for a long time. Same with Chevy/Penske.)

FuzzySkinner fucked around with this message at Jan 12, 2017 around 09:27

Peanut President
Nov 5, 2008



That article just says that Indycar is freezing aerokit development in hopes that it could possibly attract new engine manufacturers who are too lazy/cheap to do aerokits.

Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



Ford is not coming to Indycar. There has been absolutely no indication that they are. Fiat is F1 focused, Chyrsler has been bankrupt for 30+ years. Mazda is happy to support the ladder (I'm glad they do) and do not have the budget for an top series program and have said so on repeated occasions. US VW execs are going to prison; VW itself has withdrawn from several Motorsport programs. Nissan already has a DPi program and I doubt they will commit resources to Indycar.


That basically leaves Toyota, who has said very little about Indycar in general.

Human Grand Prix fucked around with this message at Jan 12, 2017 around 10:18

drgitlin
Jul 25, 2003


Peanut President posted:

That article just says that Indycar is freezing aerokit development in hopes that it could possibly attract new engine manufacturers who are too lazy/cheap to do aerokits.

I think it was Marshall Pruett who said this, but most OEMs don't want aerokits. It's not like IMSA DPis where you can kinda make a family resemblance, and it means a whole bundle of new costs and competencies that you might not already have in house.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





Peanut President posted:

That article just says that Indycar is freezing aerokit development in hopes that it could possibly attract new engine manufacturers who are too lazy/cheap to do aerokits.

There was an awful lot of "we hope" in that article. It's not like lack of an engine is the only reason there's not 28 full season rides.

Also I'm certain that any OEM that was considering developing an aero kit said "gently caress, nope" as soon as they saw the gap between the Chevy and HPD kits. The nature of this series is such that if you miss the aero by even a small amount, you will be an also-ran. Coming in as an outsider with unproven engines and aero probably looked like a recipe to save Honda from being last out of two.

IOwnCalculus fucked around with this message at Jan 12, 2017 around 14:06

Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



IOwnCalculus posted:

There was an awful lot of "we hope" in that article. It's not like lack of an engine is the only reason there's not 28 full season rides.

Also I'm certain that any OEM that was considering developing an aero kit said "gently caress, nope" as soon as they saw the gap between the Chevy and HPD kits. The nature of this series is such that if you miss the aero by even a small amount, you will be an also-ran. Coming in as an outsider with unproven engines and aero probably looked like a recipe to save Honda from being last out of two.

That would have been prevented if more in-season development was allowed. I'm kinda bummed they are going away.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





Maybe, maybe not. Chevy would've been a moving target, and starting out that far ahead is going to be an advantage no matter what you allow during the season. It also would've increased costs for manufacturers and teams that can barely afford this as-is.

Minto Took
Dec 4, 2002



Fun Shoe

Nissan is up there. Remember that Jimmy Vasser and Kevin Kalkhoven visited them not too long ago. Nissan Cosworth could be a thing.

KVSH is done, so who knows about that.

FCA is also rumored to come back to NASCAR, so I wouldn't rule out Alfa.

KingShibby
Jan 30, 2004

Wherever you go, whatever you do, I will be right here waiting for you...



Yams Fan



Initial concept designs for the 2018 updates to the DW12

wicka
Jun 28, 2007

Single cylinder posting

Minto Took posted:

Nissan is up there. Remember that Jimmy Vasser and Kevin Kalkhoven visited them not too long ago. Nissan Cosworth could be a thing.

KVSH is done, so who knows about that.

FCA is also rumored to come back to NASCAR, so I wouldn't rule out Alfa.

I would be surprised to see Alfa in IndyCar since they are supposedly trying to grow that brand here.

Spaced God
Feb 8, 2014


Dang that looks promising.

Part of me wants for there to be a new chassis (or several) after six dang years because there's only so much you can do with that tub, but I know that Dallara probably doesn't wanna make a new one and don't fix what ain't broke etc.

That part of me is also the part that wants 500 quali laps in the 240s and 1000 bhp engines and Canopies so I shouldn't listen to that part tbh

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





The biggest reason I'm not all "rargh must get new tub NOW" is that cockpit protection is pretty much the only thing the DW12 can't easily get. The bare tub itself is still safe, still fast, and the aero around it is extremely reconfigurable.

I am down with that concept art, goddamn.

Cygni
Nov 12, 2005

raring to post



no airbox

interesting lack of aeroscreen on any of them, wonder if thats no longer a 2018 thing

harperdc
Jul 24, 2007





Cygni posted:

no airbox

interesting lack of aeroscreen on any of them, wonder if thats no longer a 2018 thing

Could just be the case of a different design team working on that vs the aero kit.

Love the concept. Had me at "no air box".

Proud Christian Mom
Dec 20, 2006
I CANNOT HANDLE BEING CALLED OUT ON MY DUMBASS OPINIONS ABOUT ANTI-VIRUS AND SECURITY. I REALLY LIKE TO THINK THAT I KNOW THINGS HERE

INSTEAD I AM GOING TO WHINE ABOUT IT IN OTHER THREADS SO MY OPINION CAN FEEL VALIDATED IN AN ECHO CHAMBER I LIKE



airboxes are the loving devil

iospace
Apr 20, 2020




Grimey Drawer

I like them

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



Minto Took posted:

Nissan is up there. Remember that Jimmy Vasser and Kevin Kalkhoven visited them not too long ago. Nissan Cosworth could be a thing.

KVSH is done, so who knows about that.

FCA is also rumored to come back to NASCAR, so I wouldn't rule out Alfa.

I think the key would be tying whomever would be the third mfg to Ganassi IMO, which I still feel Chip could sell them on instant success in that regard. Which I still feel is Ford. ("My team's main competitor is Roger Penske, who's Team Chevy's flagship in our sport. I've won 11 titles in our sport. I have 4 Indy 500 wins. You guys will have the best driver in the series helping you succeed, and oh yeah, I've won you Le Mans, IMSA titles, and various other big sports car events").

I realize that sounds odd but remember...it was indeed Roger Penske that lured Chevy back to the sport. You need a figure like that to lure someone else "Big" like that back in.

That could be wishful thinking, but I still don't feel it's outside of the realm of possibility.

FCA seems to be a wildcard to me.

Nissan sounds likely. I'm debating about Toyota though...usually before they make the jump they've started to already "invest" in various programs TRD hasn't really done so on the American side of things where they'd have technology applicable to IndyCar. (Remember...they were involved in IMSA and The Atlantic Series pre-CART/IRL).

freeranger
Jan 7, 2006



Do you ever think we will see IndyCar return to the Champ Car days of doing international races? Or will this just lead to bankrupting the series quicker?

I obviously miss having a race here in Australia, but I also miss the days of them racing at the Twin Ring etc.

Also is F1/Bernie the reason Champ Car stopped racing at the F1 circuit in Canada? And the same reason IndyCar has not picked it up again?

I'm sure these are questions that have been asked before but I'm currently curious on it.

KingShibby
Jan 30, 2004

Wherever you go, whatever you do, I will be right here waiting for you...



Yams Fan

Minto Took posted:

FCA is also rumored to come back to NASCAR, so I wouldn't rule out Alfa.

Yeah I heard they're producing a diesel powered car for NASCAR joking

freeranger posted:

Do you ever think we will see IndyCar return to the Champ Car days of doing international races? Or will this just lead to bankrupting the series quicker?

I obviously miss having a race here in Australia, but I also miss the days of them racing at the Twin Ring etc.

There's always talk about adding more international races, but IndyCar will only do it if all parties involved will make money which requires sponsorship. I'd love to attend a race at Surfer's or Twin Ring, but those processes take a long time.

harperdc
Jul 24, 2007





IndyCar's leadership wants to get to an international round or two and have that be January/February before the US season kicks off, and sounds like they want it to happen for 2018. "Wants to" turning into "will" turning into "a successful event" is a different matter entirely though. If IndyCar returned to Japan, I would imagine it would only race the Motegi road course, which is sad (the oval was damaged in the 2011 earthquake and to my knowledge hasn't been repaired sufficiently for racing, but it hardly has cracks and massive issues at the moment).

and yeah Fuzzy I hear you but Penske has deeper, longer-rooted ties to Chevy than Ganassi has with Ford. The Chevy-Ilmors in the '80s were essentially a Penske project, too, and that's just IndyCar. Ganassi going all Ford would be great, I would love to see them back, but no clue if it will.

who knows with Nissan USA racing programs, too. they're slacking on GT3 programs compared with other Nissan markets IMO, the tie-up with ESM in IMSA isn't a full factory effort, and I'm not 100 percent sure what they'd get out of Indy at the moment.

Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



I finished 1997. The season was fantastic, probably the best of CART/Indycar I've ever seen. There was general parity among the engines (aside from Toyota. I think part of their problem was the drivers and teams they employed. Papis was the only one who looked good consistently). Having 4 Chassis was cool too, although the Reynard/Firestone combo was obviously the one to beat. Also the Penskes kept getting worse as the season wore on; the Lolas floundered all year until the last round. Swift did great for a first year effort.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Airboxes are only cool if they are a huge snorkel scoop.

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Kanye West - Touch the Sky


Human Grand Prix posted:

I finished 1997. The season was fantastic, probably the best of CART/Indycar I've ever seen. There was general parity among the engines (aside from Toyota. I think part of their problem was the drivers and teams they employed. Papis was the only one who looked good consistently). Having 4 Chassis was cool too, although the Reynard/Firestone combo was obviously the one to beat. Also the Penskes kept getting worse as the season wore on; the Lolas floundered all year until the last round. Swift did great for a first year effort.

1997 and 1998 are the clear peak imo. 1998 is less close for the championship but has some of my favorite races of all time.

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Kanye West - Touch the Sky


Human Grand Prix posted:

I finished 1997. The season was fantastic, probably the best of CART/Indycar I've ever seen. There was general parity among the engines (aside from Toyota. I think part of their problem was the drivers and teams they employed. Papis was the only one who looked good consistently). Having 4 Chassis was cool too, although the Reynard/Firestone combo was obviously the one to beat. Also the Penskes kept getting worse as the season wore on; the Lolas floundered all year until the last round. Swift did great for a first year effort.

1997 and 1998 are the clear peak imo. 1998 is less close for the championship but has some of my favorite races of all time.

Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



Alain Post posted:

1997 and 1998 are the clear peak imo. 1998 is less close for the championship but has some of my favorite races of all time.

Zanardi was on a another level. The Ganassi cars also had excellent reliability. I think Honda still had a power advantage but Ilmor and Ford were close.

Human Grand Prix fucked around with this message at Jan 13, 2017 around 19:17

Feels Villeneuve
Oct 7, 2007

Kanye West - Touch the Sky


The best part of 1998 is when Zanardi has such a huge lead in the championship that he gets bored and starts wrecking people for fun

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



I thinking getting a 2nd race in Canada (in the west. Ideally Vancouver, but that ain't happening, so someplace in Alberta) would be ideal. I'd really like to see IndyCar try to have a program to encourage Canadian and Mexican involvement in the sport. I think Mexico would embrace the series quite a bit if you could find a couple of guys.

It feels like Australia and Japan are the only two markets you could continue to go back to with a decent amount of ROI. I feel if you're going to go outside of North America? that's your best bet.

My dumb fantasy is an XFS/VICS double header at Rockingham and Eurospeedway as an excuse to introduce those markets to American style oval racing. But that's asking a lot.

harperdc posted:

IndyCar's leadership wants to get to an international round or two and have that be January/February before the US season kicks off, and sounds like they want it to happen for 2018. "Wants to" turning into "will" turning into "a successful event" is a different matter entirely though. If IndyCar returned to Japan, I would imagine it would only race the Motegi road course, which is sad (the oval was damaged in the 2011 earthquake and to my knowledge hasn't been repaired sufficiently for racing, but it hardly has cracks and massive issues at the moment).

and yeah Fuzzy I hear you but Penske has deeper, longer-rooted ties to Chevy than Ganassi has with Ford. The Chevy-Ilmors in the '80s were essentially a Penske project, too, and that's just IndyCar. Ganassi going all Ford would be great, I would love to see them back, but no clue if it will.

who knows with Nissan USA racing programs, too. they're slacking on GT3 programs compared with other Nissan markets IMO, the tie-up with ESM in IMSA isn't a full factory effort, and I'm not 100 percent sure what they'd get out of Indy at the moment.

I can kinda see Ford getting something out of IndyCar/"The 500" in theory. considering the whole Chevy rivarly thing, and the domestic history behind the brand.

I still feel Toyota would do well in investing a prototype in IMSA and running an IndyCar program. It feels like NASCAR's base has rejected Toyota quite a bit, and the 'burb dwellers they were trying to reach haven't really been around the sport since 2008 or so. I really feel that while Indy's and IMSA's audience is smaller? They would be more in line with the type of people more like to buy a Toyota.

(This being said? This is NOT a statement saying they should pull out of Cup. I love the fact that they troll idiots who get pissed at the site of them winning. Just feel it would be cool to see them in IMSA/Indy again).

Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



freeranger posted:

Do you ever think we will see IndyCar return to the Champ Car days of doing international races? Or will this just lead to bankrupting the series quicker?

I obviously miss having a race here in Australia, but I also miss the days of them racing at the Twin Ring etc.

Also is F1/Bernie the reason Champ Car stopped racing at the F1 circuit in Canada? And the same reason IndyCar has not picked it up again?

I'm sure these are questions that have been asked before but I'm currently curious on it.


1. Not currently. I don't think the teams want to do it.


2. I'm sure he's had a hand in it. CART/Indycar isn't F1 (and it never has needed to be) but I imagine he doesn't like anything that flies too close to his series.

Roller Coast Guard
Aug 27, 2006

With this magnificent aircraft,
and my magnificent facial hair,
the British Empire will never fall!




International races would be welcome but I don't see Indycar crossing oceans again in any serious way for a while. Canada, Mexico? Sure. Brazil, Argentina? Yeah, great. Those are friendly timezones for the US audience so it doesn't harm the viewing figures or the sponsors' core market. Spending a massive pile of money flying everyone off to Motegi or Lausitzring and then wondering why nobody gives a gently caress about it is dumb though.

wicka
Jun 28, 2007

Single cylinder posting

Seems like there are plenty of tracks in the US.

Peanut President
Nov 5, 2008



wicka posted:

Seems like there are plenty of tracks in the US.

Americans don't watch indycar, duh.

FuzzySkinner
May 23, 2012



wicka posted:

Seems like there are plenty of tracks in the US.


Milwaukee
Portland
Cleveland
Laguna Seca
Fontana
Michigan
Homestead
Kentucky
Chicagoland
Circuit of the America's

I think would be far better to focus on atm.

Seizure Meat
Jul 23, 2008

by Smythe


Milwaukee is dead fam

financially racist
Aug 13, 2008

Yes...Ha ha ha...YES!



FuzzySkinner posted:

Circuit of the America's

gently caress no

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Human Grand Prix
Jan 24, 2013



It's a good track leave it alone.

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