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Entropy238 posted:Giving resolve a % chance to empower is a great idea imo. Another option might be to give the user a random chance at getting the resource they used back after it's expended, though that's a bit less exciting. Depending on the probability, I still don't see people building for Resolve though, when you could take the now buffed Might which is multiplicative rather than additive. I am completely down with a random chance to (dis)empower on RES. Empowers are really good, and it's a cool thematic way to be drawing your overflowing willpower. It would need a good UI indicator to show when it's happened, so as to feel meaningful though. Like a thunderbolt sound or something.
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Feb 26, 2018 14:33
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Yeah, we plan on making Empower more visually dramatic in any case.
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Feb 26, 2018 14:50
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Would you really build for that though? The “random” nature of it seems like it might be off-putting. Why not just straight make it give an extra empower charge for every x points instead?
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Feb 26, 2018 14:50
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Avalerion posted:Would you really build for that though? The “random” nature of it seems like it might be off-putting. Why not just straight make it give an extra empower charge for every x points instead? Then people would never use it just in case.
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Feb 26, 2018 14:51
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That’s a potential problem with empowers in general, regardless if you get extra ones.
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Feb 26, 2018 14:55
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Avalerion posted:Would you really build for that though? The “random” nature of it seems like it might be off-putting. Why not just straight make it give an extra empower charge for every x points instead? If you could boost the chance to empower to around 15%/20% it would be pretty amazing imo.
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Feb 26, 2018 14:55
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My current math pegs it at 3% per point over/under 10, so at 20 you're looking at a 30% chance to Empower any given ability. Casters, in particular, tend to use more abilities over the course of fights (especially as levels stack up), so I think it could be especially appealing. The rational side of me doesn't like the idea of investing in Yahtzee attributes, but a lot of people enjoy the occasional super saiyan moments.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:02
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High luck Jinxed Fallout 2 runs, baby.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:03
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The Crotch posted:High luck Jinxed Fallout 2 runs, baby. Luck is my favourite stat in every game it's in. Give me those high variance strategies. rope kid posted:My current math pegs it at 3% per point over/under 10, so at 20 you're looking at a 30% chance to Empower any given ability. Casters, in particular, tend to use more abilities over the course of fights (especially as levels stack up), so I think it could be especially appealing. Yeah, a lot of people are saying that the randomness of it puts them off. But it feels oh so satisfying when you get a lucky break on a proc that saves you in a tough fight. What kind of effect are you thinking for a disempower? -10 power levels?
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Feb 26, 2018 15:07
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rope kid posted:My current math pegs it at 3% per point over/under 10, so at 20 you're looking at a 30% chance to Empower any given ability. Casters, in particular, tend to use more abilities over the course of fights (especially as levels stack up), so I think it could be especially appealing. Why not just grant an additional bonus/penalty on top of the normal empower effect? like +/- 3% damage/duration/AoE/whatever per point of Resolve over/under 10
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Feb 26, 2018 15:14
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rope kid posted:My current math pegs it at 3% per point over/under 10, so at 20 you're looking at a 30% chance to Empower any given ability. Casters, in particular, tend to use more abilities over the course of fights (especially as levels stack up), so I think it could be especially appealing.  Looking forward to my big paladin buff.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:15
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rope kid posted:My current math pegs it at 3% per point over/under 10, so at 20 you're looking at a 30% chance to Empower any given ability. Casters, in particular, tend to use more abilities over the course of fights (especially as levels stack up), so I think it could be especially appealing. That seems like it might be a bit overpowered but try it out and see what happens. I like % chance to hit effects.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:17
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That seems quite good with how crazy Empower can be. It feels like you could make a change like this and move combined damage back to Might and there wouldn't be an obvious dump stat. Even if RES wouldn't be particularly strong for a given class I still wouldn't want to randomly cast a disempowered spell that did basically nothing.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:20
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rope kid posted:My current math pegs it at 3% per point over/under 10, so at 20 you're looking at a 30% chance to Empower any given ability. Casters, in particular, tend to use more abilities over the course of fights (especially as levels stack up), so I think it could be especially appealing. I will endorse this if you ensure that the PC gives the full 'I am a Super Saiyan!' speech everytime it procs.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:24
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This also sounds like a great way to integrate Empower into the gameplay more. As-is it's great, but feels kind of unconnected to everything else.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:27
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Another concern is that at 30% - that free empowered fireball might actually be worth savescumming for.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:34
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Avalerion posted:Another concern is that at 30% - that free empowered fireball might actually be worth savescumming for. Agreed - please remove the 'save' system.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:37
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Dan Didio posted:I will endorse this if you ensure that the PC gives the full 'I am a Super Saiyan!' speech everytime it procs. My high-Res monk will finally be an anime.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:42
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Alternatively, Bleak Walkers can give the 'My heart is pure...' Vegeta speech.
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Feb 26, 2018 15:45
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Avalerion posted:Another concern is that at 30% - that free empowered fireball might actually be worth savescumming for. 30% does seem a bit much. Somewhere between 15% and 20% at 18 RES seems about right. So 2% per point?
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Feb 26, 2018 15:46
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CottonWolf posted:I am completely down with a random chance to (dis)empower on RES. Empowers are really good, and it's a cool thematic way to be drawing your overflowing willpower. It would need a good UI indicator to show when it's happened, so as to feel meaningful though. Like a thunderbolt sound or something. So wait, is this like "any given attack you make could be randomly weakened" or is it like "your empower could go away or you could get an extra one to use when you like" a bit of randomness to when you have / gain / lose empower uses could be good (I still want a return to Might though) Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Feb 26, 2018 |
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Feb 26, 2018 16:16
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:So wait, is this like "any given attack you make could be randomly weakened" or is it like "your empower could go away or you could get an extra one to use when you like" This sounds terrible. Empowered is already limited to one per fight and only a few uses per rest. To add randomness on top of that (when there's already inherent randomness to the attack rolls) would just make it incredibly unappealing, to be honest.
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Feb 26, 2018 16:18
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Fair Bear Maiden posted:This sounds terrible. Empowered is already limited to one per fight and only a few uses per rest. To add randomness on top of that (when there's already inherent randomness to the attack rolls) would just make it incredibly unappealing, to be honest. Eh, it'd be build dependent. If you were a caster that used a lot of powers, you could stack Resolve for lots of extra casts and get extra empowers every fight. If you weren't planning on using Empower, you could just dump Resolve and you'd lose your Empower every so often but no biggie because you weren't gonna use it anyway. On the other hand if it were "your attack was just DEPOWERED" that would blow gravy. EDIT: and a lot of people would just leave Resolve at 10 Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 16:42 on Feb 26, 2018 |
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Feb 26, 2018 16:21
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So basically the idea is to turn Resolve into a 'super crit' stat, independent of critical hits you can already get. Interesting. Though I do worry a bit that it would make fights a bit too swingy.
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Feb 26, 2018 16:40
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Yea the difference being that with crits - it doesn’t really matter if your ranger crits on his first or third attack, you can just think of it as a baseline dps increase for the most part.Hieronymous Alloy posted:On the other hand if it were "your attack was just DEPOWERED" that would blow gravy. EDIT: and a lot of people would just leave Resolve at 10 10 or high enough where rerolling for them becomes worthwile. Avalerion fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Feb 26, 2018 |
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Feb 26, 2018 16:45
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Avalerion posted:Yea the difference being that with crits - it doesn’t really matter if your ranger crits on his first or third attack, you can just think of it as a baseline dps increase for the most part. Yup. Overall yeah what I'd prefer is something like "every attack you make / every 1 second elapsed combat time (so it doesn't preference fast-attack builds), percentage chance to either gain or lose an Empower point". That way there'd be build variability and also buffs and debuffs to resolve would matter. A brave high resolve character would be throwing out empowers all over and a cowardly one wouldn't, but you'd still have control and choice over when the empowers got used. It would make high empower wizards basically able to ignore the per encounter cast limits though.
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Feb 26, 2018 16:56
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:It would make high empower wizards basically able to ignore the per encounter cast limits though. That sounds terrible.
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Feb 26, 2018 16:59
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Dan Didio posted:That sounds terrible. You could fix that by eliminating the ability to use empower to replenish your full cast list, or changing it to "get one more cast" or something. edit: I do hope they're fixing the interrupt system too, nobody but wizards has a way to boost concentration
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Feb 26, 2018 17:01
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Maybe resolve could give a percent chance, on entering combat, to regenerate a previously used empower point? That way you wouldn't get swingy results where one combat all your spells are mega strong, and you also couldn't go over the base empower limit. But you'd be able to empower and recharge more consistently then other characters. When it triggers your character throws a fist up and shouts "let's do this!!"
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Feb 26, 2018 17:03
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Entropy238 posted:Giving resolve a % chance to empower is a great idea imo. Another option might be to give the user a random chance at getting the resource they used back after it's expended, though that's a bit less exciting. Depending on the probability, I still don't see people building for Resolve though, when you could take the now buffed Might which is multiplicative rather than additive. My problem with Might in Poe1 is it's the very definition of a required stat for literally every class except Rogues. Rogues can get away with lower might because of the way sneak attacks work. Resolve on the other hand is a dump stat for every class unless you're specifically gearing your character to be a high deflection tank. Hell you can kinda say the same thing for Int/Dex too. Most classes in Poe1 want to shoot for a 16/16/16 might/dex/int spread at the least (obv can do more if you're into min maxing and dumping stats). Some classes can screw around with that and dump int a bit and go for something else instead. Like a Ranger can go 16/16/16 might/dex/per and not suffer for it. A Monk can neglect Dex a little more than every other class because of Swift Strikes and fists having such high attack speed anyways. But for the most part there's three stats to focus on in Poe1 and unless you're doing a more specialized build there's not much reason to deviate.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:04
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Do enemies empower skills in the beta currently? Will they get random empowers/depowers if resolve changes?
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Feb 26, 2018 17:07
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I always considered might kind of a trap stat in poe1 honestly, 3% per point just didnt seem as valuable as pretty much every other option.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:11
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Clever Spambot posted:I always considered might kind of a trap stat in poe1 honestly, 3% per point just didnt seem as valuable as pretty much every other option. Might in PoE1 is very useful, more so than the other stats, under certain specific circumstances: – When a character has both damage/healing elements (Fighter recovery, Chanter Ancient Memory/Dragon Thrashed, Paladin Sacred Immolation etc ..) – When a character does damage through DoTs or with very high base damage abilities (e.g. high damage wizard spells) – On Monk Fists, because might is one of the very few modifiers that increase their damage – Where a character is using abilities with lots and lots of raw damage, because might is the only modifier that adds to these (e.g. Cipher disintegrate). Other than when something like the above is applicable I generally just balance my points in Might/Dex, though if you've got a front-line character it's always a great idea to get Veterans recovery and that benefits more from might. Ginette Reno posted:My problem with Might in Poe1 is it's the very definition of a required stat for literally every class except Rogues. Rogues can get away with lower might because of the way sneak attacks work. Resolve on the other hand is a dump stat for every class unless you're specifically gearing your character to be a high deflection tank. Not necessarily – only if you want to build the class for direct damage. CC Wizards with their might points put in to Dex/Per/Int are very good, for example. I'd accept though that generally speaking it's useful for everyone (except maybe a summoning chanter?).
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Feb 26, 2018 17:19
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All the stats in PoE 1 are fine except Resolve which is bad. The problem is that breaking out Might into Str/Resolve makes hybrids too weak.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:22
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En Garde Motherfuckers posted:Do enemies empower skills in the beta currently? Will they get random empowers/depowers if resolve changes? An important note: the Resolve-based random Empowers/Depowers would specifically only occur after a character has been in combat for more than a certain amount of time (e.g. 10 seconds). This is specifically to discourage save-scumming for a random alpha strike double Empower from stealth and similar tactics.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:24
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You can't empower auto-attacks right? So a passive build wouldn't get anything out of Resolve?En Garde Motherfuckers posted:Do enemies empower skills in the beta currently? Will they get random empowers/depowers if resolve changes? Looking forward to a TPK due to a randomly empowered dragon's breath.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:25
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Con felt even more useless than res to me.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:25
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Avalerion posted:Con felt even more useless than res to me. less useful in dialogues yeah. It got buffed to 5% from 3% at some point though so became not quite as dumpable.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:28
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OK – I don't really know about enemies empowering. That seems like it could lead to some really ridiculous stuff.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:33
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MIght based Wizard/Fighters in POE1 were really good and I hope they're somehow still good in POE2, well, peace.
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Feb 26, 2018 17:37
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