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Considering how much people love to go on about the rival Raticate death as a theme has at least been on people's minds from the 1st gen.
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Feb 18, 2017 00:58
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BioEnchanted posted:
My favorite thing about that is how Dark is the weakness for ghosts. Like, the trick to beating a ghost is that they're complete suckers for Queensberry rules, and if you start going for eye gouges and the like, ghosts won't know what the gently caress.
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Feb 18, 2017 00:59
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Not uranium specific question but I can't find the Games pokemon thread: I loved generations 1 through 3 and then restarted at 6 but had to put it down after the first gym because it just didn't feel the same, what are the chances of me liking gen 7?
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Feb 18, 2017 01:01
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Acebuckeye13 posted:My all-time favorite dumb pokedex fact is that, if you do the math, Wailord is less dense than air. Can it learn fly? Because that would be genius.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:01
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Onmi posted:Pokemon Reborn is awful. Well what are your specific complaints with it? Mostly for perspective, the only people I know talking about it are the people who recommended it to me, who are very deep into competitive Pokemon, and like, the game's actual forums, so yeah I haven't seen what primary criticisms of it are like! As I said I didn't play very far because I just stopped playing games in general really. Also I'm kinda sad the Dark type stopped being about being sneaky and cheaty and honorless and started being more I SHALL BLAST YOU WITH A LASER OF DARKNESS because that sorta stops making sense, like, it's obvious why Fighting types can lay the smack down on a sneaky bastard but what does that have to do with The Evil Dark Edgelord Of Nightmare Hell Gyra_Solune fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 01:05
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CrazySalamander posted:Considering how much people love to go on about the rival Raticate death as a theme has at least been on people's minds from the 1st gen. Crazy Achmed posted:Can it learn fly? Because that would be genius. Commander Keene fucked around with this message at 01:24 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 01:20
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chiasaur11 posted:My favorite thing about that is how Dark is the weakness for ghosts. Like, the trick to beating a ghost is that they're complete suckers for Queensberry rules, and if you start going for eye gouges and the like, ghosts won't know what the gently caress. I think it's more that in most spiritual mythology, evil and sinfulness weigh down the soul or otherwise cause some form of measurable harm. So I think the more unusual thing is getting bitten by a rat and suddenly feeling the flames of Hell beckoning. Gyra_Solune posted:Also I'm kinda sad the Dark type stopped being about being sneaky and cheaty and honorless and started being more I SHALL BLAST YOU WITH A LASER OF DARKNESS because that sorta stops making sense, like, it's obvious why Fighting types can lay the smack down on a sneaky bastard but what does that have to do with The Evil Dark Edgelord Of Nightmare Hell Basically all of action anime works like this. Martial Artists defeat dudes with evil dark devil powers all the drat time. Or for a more directly pointed example, Ryu beating Akuma in Street Fighter, using his pure martial arts to overcome Akuma's borderline-demonic superpowers. EclecticTastes fucked around with this message at 01:25 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 01:22
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EclecticTastes posted:Basically all of action anime works like this. Martial Artists defeat dudes with evil dark devil powers all the drat time. Or for a more directly pointed example, Ryu beating Akuma in Street Fighter, using his pure martial arts to overcome Akuma's borderline-demonic superpowers. This is also why Bug beats Dark; because of Kamen Rider's insect-themed iterations. Psychic's weaknesses, similarly, are based on the fact that the mind has irrational fears; in this case, bugs, ghosts, and darkness. That said there's a few types that get iffy, but most of them make some degree of sense.
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Feb 18, 2017 01:47
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EclecticTastes posted:I haven't checked to verify, but I'm going to tag this just in case my supposition is right, but let's be real, you know there's gonna be Eevee, because if you add an ORIGINAL TYPE DO NOT STEAL to your lovely Pokemon fangame, of course you're gonna make an Eeveelution of that type. [oh come on. -fedule] Somebody fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 01:57
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:SPOILER POLICY: Don't spoil one goddamn thing, even behind tags. With my big and beautiful backhoe I will dig up everything. Like speculation is pushing it but then you do the thing I was saying to not do especially as blatant as a post that is nothing but an image behind spoiler tags so your post is big and empty. I am completing the Pokedex for gently caress's sake, if there's a thing in Uranium we're seeing it.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:00
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EclecticTastes posted:There's a difference between "I'm sad, my Pokemon's dead" and "You, yes you, playing this, are going to get old and die, just like these melancholy visions of faded glory, and like them, your significance to anyone outside your immediate circle of family and friends is likely to be momentary at best and extremely early compared to life expectancy, assuming you achieve anything at all, which is unlikely. Also people you thought of as important in your past have all but certainly forgotten you in return." yeah, that would be bad, if a pokemon game did that, good thing it hasn't all the pokemon entries about death are ghost being spooky and nature red in tooth and claw stuff, they aren't telling the kids they don't matter or whatever the heck this post is
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Feb 18, 2017 02:23
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mandatory lesbian posted:all the pokemon entries about death are ghost being spooky and nature red in tooth and claw stuff And also "good god Mother Nature is on all the drugs."
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Feb 18, 2017 02:27
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Gyra_Solune posted:Well what are your specific complaints with it? Dark is still about being sneaky & cheaty & honorless. Last 2 gens introduced dark moves about : punching someone in the throat to get them to shut up, grabbing someone and swining them through every other pokemon, a move literally called "power trip", & insulting the opponent as you switch Meanwhile edgelord Yveltal's signature move, Oblivion Wing, is flying
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Feb 18, 2017 02:28
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EclecticTastes posted:There's a difference between "I'm sad, my Pokemon's dead" and "You, yes you, playing this, are going to get old and die, just like these melancholy visions of faded glory, and like them, your significance to anyone outside your immediate circle of family and friends is likely to be momentary at best and extremely early compared to life expectancy, assuming you achieve anything at all, which is unlikely. Also people you thought of as important in your past have all but certainly forgotten you in return." Like, that's maybe an okay message for adults who already realize that and have managed to find effective distractions to avoid spending all their time screaming in horror, but this is a game that's still ostensibly for children. Granted, that's easily the most extreme example in the game, the rest falls more comfortably into the usual Pokemon mold of "some of these monsters are messed up, man", but it's a moment that's stuck with me. Yeah the Eevee quest in the post Sub/Moon game was just this awful case of depression as you hunt down old people and just basically get more depressed as time goes on. Gyra_Solune posted:Well what are your specific complaints with it? About a third of the gym leaders off themselves, the plot is absolutely rancid with "Hmm, this is something I saw in my tumblr feed and is an "Important Issue." I feel like I should tackle this in a Pokemon game." The battle balance is out of whack, the actual region itself looks like garbage. The characters are all hateable, its episodic nature is exhausting. It commits nearly every cardinal sin I can think of for a Pokemon fangame. It is not 'mature' pokemon, it is just legitimately awful. It's more edgy than Shadow the Hedgehog. With a difficulty curve designed by someone who'd been smashed in the head with a hammer until their brains were leaking out their ears. Here is my personal philosophy. A good Fangame is also a good 'game' It should be made with the idea that, yeah, even if 99% of people have all played the series already and thus know everything, that you should still design it to be accessible and with clear and concise design choices. Reborn was made by tryhards who make things with broken ideas of what "Hard" is. On top of that, understand what you're making and write appropriately. Having to watch a gym leader commit suicide because the woman she thought was her girlfriend was actually straight and just indulging her (Yes this actually happened) by throwing herself off a waterfall. I'm sorry, how is that Pokemon exactly? mandatory lesbian posted:yeah, that would be bad, if a pokemon game did that, good thing it hasn't Have you not done the Eevee side-quest in Sun and Moon? Because it's exactly that An old Eevee trainer has you hunt down the trainers of Eeveelutions who always used to beat him, each one you find has grown old, one of whom has the early stages of Alzheimer's, one who is dying, and one who's dead. The overall theme being that Pokemon training isn't really something you can do as an adult, eventually you have to give it up and get a job and support your family. Onmi fucked around with this message at 02:33 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 02:28
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Holy poo poo, that sounds even worse than Uranium
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Feb 18, 2017 02:31
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GeneX posted:Holy poo poo, that sounds even worse than Uranium Put it like this. Uranium opens up with its dumb Nuclear meltdown. Reborn opens up with you narrowly surviving a terrorist attack on the train you're riding.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:40
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Unknown Quantity posted:This is also why Bug beats Dark; because of Kamen Rider's insect-themed iterations. Psychic's weaknesses, similarly, are based on the fact that the mind has irrational fears; in this case, bugs, ghosts, and darkness. That said there's a few types that get iffy, but most of them make some degree of sense. I could be wrong, but i'm guessing this is best exemplified by Fairy. I'd really love a reasonable explanation for how they came up with what it resists and what it's super-effective against. As opposed to, "Well, they're three types that only have 2 weaknesses each, so let's just go with those three," which seems to be the reasoning. Weak to Fire, Poison and Steel, and Strong against Dark, Fighting, and Dragon, seems like such a random assortment of typings. Onmi posted:Put it like this. Uranium opens up with its dumb Nuclear meltdown. This is sounding less like a normal Pokemon adventure game, and more a game that just happens to involve Pokemon.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:42
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Lord Koth posted:I could be wrong, but i'm guessing this is best exemplified by Fairy. I'd really love a reasonable explanation for how they came up with what it resists and what it's super-effective against. As opposed to, "Well, they're three types that only have 2 weaknesses each, so let's just go with those three," which seems to be the reasoning. Weak to Fire, Poison and Steel, and Strong against Dark, Fighting, and Dragon, seems like such a random assortment of typings. Poison & Steel are apparently fairy weaknesses in some stories. Fairy isn't weak to anything else, fire just resists it for...reasons?
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Feb 18, 2017 02:45
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Onmi posted:Put it like this. Uranium opens up with its dumb Nuclear meltdown. Maybe I'm not a literary expert, but I don't understand why tragic backstories and action-based openings are a bad thing. Reborn's opening isn't in medias res, is it?
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Feb 18, 2017 02:47
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Re: terrible fanfiction/fangames, Pokemon is one of those playground franchises that has a framework easy enough for people to sit down and make their own content. The problem is they also don't have any experience in developing good content or playtesting so the result is stuff that sounded good in their heads but ultimately doing poorly in practice. Both in a narrative sense and a game design sense.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:49
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Lord Koth posted:I could be wrong, but i'm guessing this is best exemplified by Fairy. I'd really love a reasonable explanation for how they came up with what it resists and what it's super-effective against. As opposed to, "Well, they're three types that only have 2 weaknesses each, so let's just go with those three," which seems to be the reasoning. Weak to Fire, Poison and Steel, and Strong against Dark, Fighting, and Dragon, seems like such a random assortment of typings. Fairy was partially implemented for gameplay purposes. Specifically, it was put in to nerf a few types getting out of hand at the time. And buffing up not so great types in the process.
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Feb 18, 2017 02:52
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rannum posted:Poison & Steel are apparently fairy weaknesses in some stories. Fairy isn't weak to anything else, fire just resists it for...reasons? Yeah, was momentarily forgetting cold iron tends to be one of the more common traditional Fey weaknesses (though depending on the work they may not have a problem with actual steel  ). Poison I don't really recall being this way, but it's probably featured in some story or another. Really it's Fire resisting it, and what it's strong against, that just seem random - and that's over half its type matchups.Dr. Fetus posted:Fairy was partially implemented for gameplay purposes. Specifically, it was put in to nerf a few types getting out of hand at the time. And buffing up not so great types in the process. Yeah, sorry if I wasn't clear. I'm aware of the mechanical reasons the types were chosen, which is why I was sort of addressing that it's probably the best example of no real lore reason behind the typing's strength/weaknesses. Not that it really changed the meta in regards to its weak typings. Fire-type will always be weak so long as Stealth Rock is the bullshit it is, people still only really run Toxic out of Poison's moves particularly often, and Steel-types are more likely to just try and take a Fairy out with something else hard hitting rather than run an actual Steel move (exceptions apply). Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 02:53
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BUT WHY ARE THERE TRADE EVOLUTIONS
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Feb 18, 2017 02:54
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Junpei posted:Maybe I'm not a literary expert, but I don't understand why tragic backstories and action-based openings are a bad thing. Because it's pokemon. You want to invent a world that does these things and has you start upon your journey in your own franchise? Fine. You'll be judged by your awful gameplay still, but at least the story wont be completely tone inappropriate. Imagine if you booted up Sun and Moon and got "We're moving to Alola because your father was molesting you." POKEMON! Onmi fucked around with this message at 03:01 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 02:56
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Lord Koth posted:Yeah, was momentarily forgetting cold iron tends to be one of the more common traditional Fey weaknesses (though depending on the work they may not have a problem with actual steel Peter Pan...
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Feb 18, 2017 02:56
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Onmi posted:Because it's pokemon. You want to invent a world that does these things and has you start upon your journey in your own franchise? Fine. You'll be judged by your awful gameplay still, but at least the story wont be completely tone appropriate. I see your point. Just the musings of a casual Pokemon fan/wanna-be writer.
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Feb 18, 2017 03:00
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Onmi posted:Put it like this. Uranium opens up with its dumb Nuclear meltdown. Where did people get the idea that a basic game about catching monsters needed more of a back story I blame sun and Moon. There were so many moments of "shut up and let me play the game I don't give a poo poo about this nebby whatever" and then it turned into the lamest of legendary Pokemon where you had to catch it to progress Maybe uranium will pick up on the next best thing sun and Moon introduced and have more "but you must!" Yes/no choices in the game I mean sun and Moon was a good game but Christ the exposition...
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Feb 18, 2017 03:04
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My Linux Rig posted:Where did people get the idea that a basic game about catching monsters needed more of a back story These were all released before Sun and Moon.
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Feb 18, 2017 03:05
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Lord Koth posted:I could be wrong, but i'm guessing this is best exemplified by Fairy. I'd really love a reasonable explanation for how they came up with what it resists and what it's super-effective against. As opposed to, "Well, they're three types that only have 2 weaknesses each, so let's just go with those three," which seems to be the reasoning. Weak to Fire, Poison and Steel, and Strong against Dark, Fighting, and Dragon, seems like such a random assortment of typings. My hanzo steel folded ten thousand times slices your stupid european folk tale in half in one swing, bisecting it perfectly. The rest is Ferngully.
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Feb 18, 2017 03:09
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Fire, poison and steel can also be interpreted as industrialisation elements.
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Feb 18, 2017 03:33
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cugel posted:Fire, poison and steel can also be interpreted as industrialisation elements. Mostly this. Fairies in most folklore are beings of nature, and those three things are pretty emblematic of the destruction of nature. I would love to hear the reasoning behind their strengths, though.
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Feb 18, 2017 03:49
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Materant posted:I would love to hear the reasoning behind their strengths, though. I dunno about you, but when I think of fairies, I think of the Fair Folk. Dark and Fighting both seem like they'd have trouble with the horrific rules and trickery that more traditional Fey live and breathe. Dragon...I guess you could work it with the same reason, or if you spun something about dragons being servants to the Fey? But Dragon resistance can't really be for any reason other than mechanics.
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Feb 18, 2017 04:07
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cold iron is a classic ward against the folk in the hills
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Feb 18, 2017 04:10
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dancingbears posted:I dunno about you, but when I think of fairies, I think of the Fair Folk. Dark and Fighting both seem like they'd have trouble with the horrific rules and trickery that more traditional Fey live and breathe. Dragon...I guess you could work it with the same reason, or if you spun something about dragons being servants to the Fey? But Dragon resistance can't really be for any reason other than mechanics. Sleeping Beauty maybe? The Prince needed the help of the fairies to slay the dragon (Maleficent), maybe there's precedent in old fables.
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Feb 18, 2017 04:32
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Lord Koth posted:I could be wrong, but i'm guessing this is best exemplified by Fairy. I'd really love a reasonable explanation for how they came up with what it resists and what it's super-effective against. As opposed to, "Well, they're three types that only have 2 weaknesses each, so let's just go with those three," which seems to be the reasoning. Weak to Fire, Poison and Steel, and Strong against Dark, Fighting, and Dragon, seems like such a random assortment of typings. Weaknesses: >Steel: Traditionally iron is a ward against magical creatures in general and fairies in particular. As an interesting side note, in stories where both iron and steel exist, usually it's only iron which works and not steel - presumably under the theory that the extra carbon in steel blurs the line between 'metal' and 'living' enough to ruin the effect. >Fire: Similar to iron, circles of fire (often holy/magical fire) appear in a bunch of stories as a way to trap fairies or angels. >Poison: I don't know, but the argument that cugel made about industrialization/chemicals is probably decent. Strengths: Dark: Fairies are often portrayed as light-aligned creatures, so being able to handle darkness just sort of comes with the territory. Fighting: Fighting mons are raw physical power, whereas Fairies are magical beings, so magic>physical strength. Dragon: I can't honestly come up with a reasonable one. This one seems pretty much just a pure concession to gameplay mechanics. If you want to stretch it, maybe you could argue that fairies are typically small so they can fly circles around the wildly oversized dragons and target the small gaps in the natural armor of dragons. That said, even with a couple of questionable ones, it's still pretty drat impressive that the vast majority of strengths/weaknesses in Pokemon actually make logical sense. Though Bug doing reduced damage to Fairy seems kinda out-of-nowhere unless maybe you want to argue that they're both kinda small so Fairy sees Bug attacks coming more than most types. Also, while I don't pretend to know anything about the high-level scene, it seems like Bug has reduced damage to a crapload of types. Was there some kind of gameplay/balance thing that Bug needed another 1/2-damage type to fix? MagusofStars fucked around with this message at 05:04 on Feb 18, 2017 |
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Feb 18, 2017 04:58
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MagusofStars posted:>Poison: I don't know, but the argument that cugel made about industrialization/chemicals is probably decent. Some traditions hold that charms of rowan or certain herbs also ward against Faerie.
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Feb 18, 2017 05:07
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I beat this game; it was okay. There's a handful of Tandor pokemon I actually really like, but they haven't shown up in the LP yet. On the flip side there's about the same amount that I find utterly abysmal, also none among that have shown up yet. We're not even close to the fun stuff in this game to talk about though.
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Feb 18, 2017 05:15
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MagusofStars posted:Also, while I don't pretend to know anything about the high-level scene, it seems like Bug has reduced damage to a crapload of types. Was there some kind of gameplay/balance thing that Bug needed another 1/2-damage type to fix? Nope, bug bing awful offensively is pretty much just for flavor reasons. Historically bug tends to have bad stats and weak attacks, so facing so many resistances is just kicking them while they're down.
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Feb 18, 2017 05:34
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MagusofStars posted:Steel: Traditionally iron is a ward against magical creatures in general and fairies in particular. As an interesting side note, in stories where both iron and steel exist, usually it's only iron which works and not steel - presumably under the theory that the extra carbon in steel blurs the line between 'metal' and 'living' enough to ruin the effect. Discworld and the Laundry Files both run with "messes with the local electromagnetism scene" and came up with elaborate (and different) reasons why they'd care. I particularly liked the Laundry Files version: Laundry FIles RPG posted:You do not get many faerie infestations any more – their reliance on using bio-thaumaturgy is their downfall. Turning a grassy knoll into a summoning grid by altering the chemistry of the grass is all well and good, but the amount of power you can shove through a lawn is very limited and
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Feb 18, 2017 05:46
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I want Wes to make a comeback in the Pokeverse someday Colosseum ruled
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