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Vermain posted:By comparison, there's plenty of footage available on the internet of Keanu at the gun range getting his muscle memory down to the point where he really can pull out a gun and plug three people in two seconds. I remember some footage like this of Tom Cruise when Collateral came out, and it was pretty neat to see the choreography of "Block a punch > Pull gun with other hand > Fire twice into guy's abdomen > Step right and take aim with both hands to shoot further-away guy 3 times" being performed on-set side by side with the shooting range.
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Feb 21, 2017 05:42
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Rap Record Hoarder posted:Yeah I think that's implied. Probably gonna see some sort of "professional courtesy" team-up, given that both he and Wick seem to be on the outs with the established assassin world, to varying degrees. Maybe Ruby Rose, too.
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Feb 21, 2017 10:39
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well why not posted:Maybe Ruby Rose, too. It occurred to me watching that scene that he'd specifically left the knife in Common and told him "If you pull it out you'll bleed to death immediately" buy when he fought Rose he stabbed her in what looked to be the same place but then deliberately pulled the knife out. She dicked him around so she didn't get any professional courtesy extended to her.
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Feb 21, 2017 16:51
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:It occurred to me watching that scene that he'd specifically left the knife in Common and told him "If you pull it out you'll bleed to death immediately" buy when he fought Rose he stabbed her in what looked to be the same place but then deliberately pulled the knife out. She dicked him around so she didn't get any professional courtesy extended to her. That's the way I saw it too, when she said "I'll be seeing you", Wick seemed to be almost rolling his eyes when he said "sure", as if he knew she was going to die. Who knows though, could go either way. Common will definitely be back though.
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Feb 21, 2017 16:55
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Basebf555 posted:That's the way I saw it too, when she said "I'll be seeing you", Wick seemed to be almost rolling his eyes when he said "sure", as if he knew she was going to die. Right, "I'll be seeing you" is exactly what Viggo Tarasov told him in #1, when we and Wick knew he was dying. They don't mean seeing you alive. It's their ironic farewell they give each other, particularly their killers, in that world.
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Feb 21, 2017 17:05
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:It occurred to me watching that scene that he'd specifically left the knife in Common and told him "If you pull it out you'll bleed to death immediately" buy when he fought Rose he stabbed her in what looked to be the same place but then deliberately pulled the knife out. She dicked him around so she didn't get any professional courtesy extended to her. I kinda like to think that he spared Common because Common bought him a drink.
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Feb 21, 2017 17:12
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Lobok posted:I kinda like to think that he spared Common because Common bought him a drink. And because Common was Gianna's bodyguard. Earlier when Cassian (Common) asked Wick if he was working that night, Wick was all like "''Fraid so" after he'd killed the person Cassian was supposed to be guarding. Wick knows that Cassian wasn't initially part of the plot to against him, and that Cassian was just trying to kill him because that's part of the territory of being a gun for hire. Ruby got killed because she was sent there specifically to tie up loose ends by killing Wick. For a movie with as ludicrous a mythos as it has, they actually manage to keep it fairly logical in it's motivational consistency. Tumble fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Feb 21, 2017 |
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Feb 21, 2017 20:35
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Ruby didn't die, she would have died in seconds from a severed aorta. Remember the golden rule of action movies: no one dies off-screen.
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Feb 21, 2017 20:55
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Tumble posted:For a movie with as ludicrous a mythos as it has, they actually manage to keep it fairly logical in it's motivational consistency. Along those lines, I liked that Wick shoots the target in the head even though she was already dead/dying, because it was the only way he could be sure he'd get credit for the kill. If she were found with just her wrists slashed maybe Santino would be able to call the marker unfulfilled. Filthy Hans posted:Ruby didn't die, she would have died in seconds from a severed aorta. Remember the golden rule of action movies: no one dies off-screen. When Wick pulls the knife out, its only like 5-10 seconds from that point to when he walks away, so I don't that's really anything definitive. You're right though, the door was left open enough that she could easily pop up again. Basebf555 fucked around with this message at 20:58 on Feb 21, 2017 |
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Feb 21, 2017 20:55
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Tumble posted:[re: Cassian/Wick fight] That was the great part about their fights. They're not necessarily enemies, just rivals or competitors. They have to fight but not for personal reasons. Why would Wick kill him when he could incapacitate him instead? That way Cassian fulfills his role, and who would argue that fighting to within a hair's breath of death for a ward who already died wasn't him fulfilling the role of loyal bodyguard, but it also means Wick can get away. Plus, in the meta sense, it leaves Cassian available to team up with Wick in the sequel!!!
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Feb 21, 2017 21:03
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:I'd like to see him being given a Continental. He'll be safe but he'll never be able to leave. Maybe he can make it dog friendly As long as we're making predictions, I'll say 3 ends with Wick killing off the entire High Table and getting shot like eight times in the process. Then he sits down at the head of the table, surrounded by bodies, and his dog comes and sits next to him. The End.
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Feb 21, 2017 21:18
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Clipperton posted:As long as we're making predictions, I'll say 3 ends with Wick killing off the entire High Table and getting shot like eight times in the process. Then he sits down at the head of the table, surrounded by bodies, and his dog comes and sits next to him. The End. Did you just watch The 13th Warrior?
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Feb 21, 2017 21:24
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Filthy Hans posted:Ruby didn't die, she would have died in seconds from a severed aorta. Remember the golden rule of action movies: no one dies off-screen. Nah, I think she's definitely dead. Wick is very deliberate in the movies; if somebody is a direct threat to him, he maims them or kills them, but he broadcasts his intent either way quite clearly. Also, an injury to your heart isn't always instantly fatal.
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Feb 21, 2017 21:24
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That was fascinating stuff about the art featured in the film, thanks for sharing that Snowglobe. At the end Winston hands Wick a marker, and I'm pretty sure it's not John's. Is this another example of Winston bending the rules for John, or was it him giving John his completed marker as closure? Given the ties to mythology throughout the series I feel like the third film has to be the "end times" for the criminal underworld as precipitated by John Wick. I think there's also something to tease out about how the rules of the Continental and the High Table are represented and discussed in the films (especially with Winston and his relationship with John), but I don't have the pieces in place to write something about it.
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Feb 21, 2017 21:29
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ATP_Power posted:That was fascinating stuff about the art featured in the film, thanks for sharing that Snowglobe. The former. John may have broken the main rule, but that doesn't mean his personal friendship with Winston is suddenly invalid.
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Feb 21, 2017 21:32
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I actually may have misinterpreted that, not sure. I took it as Winston giving John a new marker as a gift, like "hey John, you're excommunicated and I can't do anything about that but I can give you this marker that you can use to save your rear end if you really need it" I figured it meant that at some point in part 3 Wick would have to call in the marker and Winston would have to help him.
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Feb 21, 2017 21:37
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:The former. John may have broken the main rule, but that doesn't mean his personal friendship with Winston is suddenly invalid. It also shows the pure reverence Winston has for Wick - Winston has never thought that Wick wouldn't persevere and be the last man standing. Winston recognizes the sheer force of nature that is John Wick, and stays out of the way as much as he can. I think the marker was Winston telling Wick "I have to enforce the rules but I am betting on you to figure this whole mess out", but I think when Wick cashes in the marker, it's going to be Wick gettting very, very little compared to what he used to be able to call in. It'll be a tiny shack full of old guns, rather than a gun sommelier at a hotel safehouse. Tumble fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Feb 21, 2017 |
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Feb 21, 2017 21:38
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The reason I thought Winston was personally giving a new marker to Wick was because of how seriously those markers are regarded by everyone affiliated with the Continental. So I saw it as Winston thinking up a way that he could help Wick at some point in the future without also betraying the rules of the Continental. If the High Table or whoever complains he can just say "Hey its not my fault, Wick had a marker on me, nothing I could do about it!".
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Feb 21, 2017 21:43
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MariusLecter posted:Did you just watch The 13th Warrior? Never seen (or read it), I thought I was ripping off Preacher 
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Feb 21, 2017 21:53
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Basebf555 posted:The reason I thought Winston was personally giving a new marker to Wick was because of how seriously those markers are regarded by everyone affiliated with the Continental. So I saw it as Winston thinking up a way that he could help Wick at some point in the future without also betraying the rules of the Continental. If the High Table or whoever complains he can just say "Hey its not my fault, Wick had a marker on me, nothing I could do about it!". Considering there was a scene where Winston explicitly asked for mr bad guy to thumbprint his blood and sign the sheet (and he insisted multiple times), I think there's gonna be some funky assassin rules/laws that get brought up in the sequel with the marker rather than it just being a 'cash in for a one time favor'. Who knows, maybe Wick will end up replacing the brother/sister at the high table due to some weird-rear end inheritance law.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:23
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I too think that's Winston's marker, not the one that's already booked.
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Feb 21, 2017 22:57
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The weird thing to me is that a marker can apparently still be cashed in by someone who has been excommunicated. Shouldn't that render all past debts invalid? He's no longer part of the system.
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Feb 21, 2017 23:49
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NmareBfly posted:The weird thing to me is that a marker can apparently still be cashed in by someone who has been excommunicated. Shouldn't that render all past debts invalid? He's no longer part of the system. We don't know that, we're just speculating. But it wouldn't surprise me if the markers are handed out to anyone that the person deems deserving of one, for any reason. Like if you were walking down the street and saw John Wick about to get hit by a bus and you pushed him out of the way, maybe he'd give you a marker.
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Feb 22, 2017 00:11
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Seems like markers are a general honour/contract thing among hitmen whereas excommunication is being kicked out of the Continental system.
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Feb 22, 2017 00:23
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Lobok posted:Seems like markers are a general honour/contract thing among hitmen whereas excommunication is being kicked out of the Continental system. Maybe but Winston is the one who keeps the books on the markers, at least in his area, so they must be connected to the Continental in some way.
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Feb 22, 2017 00:24
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Markers are literal blood debts. Whether or not the guy holding it is still part of the system or on the run, it's still of the same value. Edit: The Continentals are simply the regional business/accounting/banking hubs for the Illuminati Criminal Empire. Being excommunicated means you no longer have access to Holy Ground or logistical support. Doubloons and Markers are hard currency, so if you have those in your possession you still have the ability to use them. Like if North Korea or Iran had a fist full of American Dollars, they can still use those Dollars to buy things despite being outside the good graces of the Federal Reserve system and the nation of the United States. Gyges fucked around with this message at 00:31 on Feb 22, 2017 |
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Feb 22, 2017 00:25
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Gyges posted:Doubloons and Markers are hard currency, so if you have those in your possession you still have the ability to use them. This is all speculation for now but the impression I got was that John's doubloons are not usable anymore, in that he should be denied service by anyone that would otherwise take them.
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Feb 22, 2017 02:38
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Yeah, the entire point of the marker is that you do not get to say no to it, no matter what, period, end of discussion. I mean, John says no at the beginning and gets his loving house blown up for his trouble. Like Giovanna is at first shocked at John coming to kill her, then when she finds out it's for a marker she's just like "welp ok".
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Feb 22, 2017 02:39
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NmareBfly posted:This is all speculation for now but the impression I got was that John's doubloons are not usable anymore, in that he should be denied service by anyone that would otherwise take them. He could still pay others in them, i assume. But Continental's associated services are probably right out. Charlie, the doctor, the Sommelier, the map and key guy, the tailor, etc. Baseline: anyone who uses the hotels-dining codeword system. VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Feb 22, 2017 |
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Feb 22, 2017 02:46
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NmareBfly posted:This is all speculation for now but the impression I got was that John's doubloons are not usable anymore, in that he should be denied service by anyone that would otherwise take them. He can't buy from the store, but he can pay someone directly if they're willing to take the doubloon. Like when he dropped the doubloon in the panhandler's cup, yes he gave the name John Wick, but the payment was made outside the Continental system. Doubloons are sort of a reputation calculator anyway. Whether or not John Wick is in the good graces of the system, his reputation remains thus the physical embodiment of that reputation remains.
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Feb 22, 2017 02:57
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We don't know what excommunication really means yet. If it means that members of the Continental are forbidden from dealing with Wick in any way, that's a lot different than if he's just not allowed on Continental grounds anymore.
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Feb 22, 2017 03:10
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I kind of feeling that we're overthinking the marker - I personally took it that Winston was giving him a tool in which if there was somebody powerful enough to save John's life and stave off the High Council while John is comfortable enough to being under someone's thumb again, he could present the marker and try to bargain with it. The only one I could think of is another High Council member. The council doubled the contract on John because he killed one of their (barely seated) board members. There isn't anything to indicate that they didn't do this out of anything but principal and being reactionary. Maybe John gets audience with someone powerful and sway them to his version of the events (corroborated by more intel and Winston) and that person goes to bat for John...for a price. In the intern, I can see John adapting to a lot of warfare theories of Sun Tzu & holding them off with his unpredictability and strategy. He may even temporarily disrupt their banking system while he does so.
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Feb 22, 2017 04:10
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I'm assuming that Akoni is going to play a big role in helping John out in 3. The Italian siblings were going to take a bunch of his territory and enterprises, and they were quite clear there wasn't poo poo he could do about it. Now John's helped out Akoni and helped out Fishburne's character as well. He also made peace with the Russians before everything went down. My guess is the Council gets almost completely refreshed and the new council gives John his total out. Of course there will still be dudes who hold grudges against him, likely a couple people on the council, if they want to do another movie or two. At this point though, the only revenge motivations left are helping out his former apprentice, helping out his former tutor, a long lost kid, or maybe some Equalizer bonding with a broken kid thing. I guess someone from his dead wife's family could come to him with some sort of Taken situation going on. It would be kind of cool to see John Wick unleashed in another part of the world where nobody knows who he is and the bad guys can't figure out why none of their underworld contacts will have anything to do with them. Might be kind of hard to pull that out to a full movie though if they don't have an army of dudes to throw at John Wick though.
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Feb 22, 2017 04:24
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Gyges posted:It would be kind of cool to see John Wick unleashed in another part of the world where nobody knows who he is and the bad guys can't figure out why none of their underworld contacts will have anything to do with them. Might be kind of hard to pull that out to a full movie though if they don't have an army of dudes to throw at John Wick though. Go full Rambo IV, John Wick vs. Boko Haram
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Feb 22, 2017 04:26
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Loved Wick 2: Electric Boogaloo. The gunplay, choreography, gorgeous cinematography and slowly advancing ridiculous distortion of reality with every new rule of conduct were all stellar. IMO, unless Lionsgate wants to milk this thing dry for all they can get (I'm fully expecting lovely prequels once Keanu hangs up the silenced pistol), the optimal route is two movies left. Third one is a quasi-prequel that delves into the Impossible Task, then jump back to present day for John Wick Vs. The World Which Is All Hitmen For Some Reason. I also would watch a movie where someone manages to take John prisoner and his dog exacts vengeance.
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Feb 22, 2017 05:01
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I hope they never mention anything more concrete about the impossible task than they already have. There's no way they'll ever make a movie that adequately lives up to the hype of the imagination.
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Feb 22, 2017 05:13
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Dead Snoopy posted:I kind of feeling that we're overthinking the marker - I personally took it that Winston was giving him a tool in which if there was somebody powerful enough to save John's life and stave off the High Council while John is comfortable enough to being under someone's thumb again, he could present the marker and try to bargain with it. This was my take as well. Winston gives him an empty one to do with what he may.
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Feb 22, 2017 05:32
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ATP_Power posted:I think there's also something to tease out about how the rules of the Continental and the High Table are represented and discussed in the films (especially with Winston and his relationship with John), but I don't have the pieces in place to write something about it. Here's one piece of the puzzle: quote:LRM: Let’s start with this. If you had to describe in a few words on who John Wick is—how would you define and describe him as? I don't think they used the Arthurian stories as the basis for any of the movie plots or based any of the characters on Arthurian characters (but I'm certainly no Arthurian expert, I could be wayyyyy wrong there. I guess that Winston might be slightly Merlin-like?) but it looks like the honour system in JW is at least based partially off or inspired by the Arthurian chivalric code. Edit: the Continental honour system is also incredibly similar to Bushido, especially as depicted in old samurai films. Wick is pretty much an aging ronin who gets dragged back to deal with upstart new daimyo who think they're going to be the next shogun. Snowglobe of Doom fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Feb 22, 2017 |
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Feb 22, 2017 07:25
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:Edit: the Continental honour system is also incredibly similar to Bushido, especially as depicted in old samurai films. Wick is pretty much an aging ronin who gets dragged back to deal with upstart new daimyo who think they're going to be the next shogun. 47 Ronin confirmed as John Wick prequel. My hope for a third movie is that John operates among all the underground malcontents of this assassin guild world. It stands to reason that a ton of people would have been excommunicated for some reason or another. And John becomes their king. I seriously hope they can wrap up John's story in one movie, though. Not everything needs to be a 6+ film mega-franchise. An extremely good trilogy about this character that holds to an ending would be refreshing. If the director wants to make more, do something different. Create a different character, set it somewhere else, try something new. Better that than John W7CK: Everyone is Tired Now. ...ugh. Now I'm imagining John Wick: Origins. What I imagine is bad.
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Feb 22, 2017 12:17
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I really liked the ending scene of this movie showing that he can't just walk away from it all, he has to run.
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Feb 22, 2017 16:51
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