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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


:vd:

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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I Understand That If I Do Not Unvote The Mod Will Not Count A Revote Unless I Am A Doublevoter.

##vote Chaoslord - I'm just getting this out of the way early.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.



I've accused him of being scum in every game we've been in together and I've never been right so I feel like I'm due for one.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


BottleKnight posted:

I Understand That The Kansas City Chiefs Were Robbed In The 1993 AFC Championship Game And I Will Spend The Rest Of My Life Complaining About This Injustice Despite The Fact That I Was Not Born Until Over A Year After This Game Was Played

I'd complain about Tom Brady getting suspended for four games last season but, well... you know... :smuggo:

Pinterest Mom posted:

murmur given the line of work you want to be in you should not be succumbing to the gambler's fallacy

Thankfully I'll be banned from actually gambling, so technically I'll be rooting for the house (which I suppose would make me scum irl)

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


The Lord of Hats posted:

Mainly to get people talking. I did a bit of a double-take when I saw the discrepancy between my own role and the sample flip, and I had to reread my PM (to make sure I hadn't misread a bit of flavor) and the OP (to see if that flavor had significance) before I realized that it was (I *assume*) inconsequential.

I mean, yes, in theory there's some weird 3P role that wants everyone from one species wiped out, but I that's far enough along the "what if" train that I think it's worthwhile to use it to get some information flowing.

What's the flavor reason for a human being in a mine with a bunch of lizards?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


got some chores tonight posted:

Oh this is a 15 player game. CCKeane is scum too then.

I buy it.

##vote CCKeane

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Murmur Twin posted:

I buy it.

##vote CCKeane

Oops forgot Ecco's unvoting rule.

##unvote
##vote Jonathan Fisk - just so I can say I've attempted to vote for three different players with one post in the thread so far.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


##unvote
##vote CCKeane

CCKeane posted:

I usually enjoy jokepost phase since jokes are cool and good. When I'm looking to advance out of it, I make a few gut calls and see what develops from there, once a case, even tenuous, exists, it becomes much easier to get reads off of reactions to it, and it can build from there.

That's pretty much what I did, except AA is actually scum so vOv.

Right now, I think Keane trying to effort-case AA looks scummier than AA's posting. If I were scum and I knew AA was town, I think that AA would be the easiest person to case to try and drive a mislynch and it feels to me that's what Keane is doing.

CCKeane posted:

The first two pinged me a bit as trying too hard to be A BIG GOOFBALL (second and related posts especially) and the third as a reaction to my calling him scum strengthened this. I don't think it's a normal reaction, and while I invented the "claim to be confirmed when you are not for giggles" maneuver, the additional vote is a bit of a whacky move. I don't LIKE IT I TELLS YA.

This strikes me as TRYING TOO HARD TO LOOK TOWNIE and I don't buy it.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

Are you saying this because AA is the scummiest person in the thread right now? I don't understand the reasoning behind your first point.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems like you're trying to say that scum AA claimed lynchbomb at the start of D1, and you think that because he can't fill in certain details on his claim, that makes him suspicious. What I'm saying is that (a) I don't think that's scum behavior, I think AA would simply not claim anything and not draw suspicion on himself, and (b) if I were scum looking to make a fake case on D1, "AA is lying about being lynchbomb" would be the easiest mislynch to push, and I would do it by asking a bunch of pointed questions to make it look like he's scum caught in a lie.

To build on that - AA's posting seems this game looks pretty relaxed, whereas Keane's case feels suspicious to me because he seems too sure of his read for D1.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

So what was used?

Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Executioner looking for a specific role?!

I am Faham. I was born to dig.

Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Blaster is my flavor name. A lynch bomb is what it is. On phone. Ain't nobody eating lunch.

I find it suspicious that Keane can't fill in the blanks that Ecco used "lynchbomb" and AA chose to change "lynch" to "lunch" (as many players around here do) and is instead trying to spin it as some sort of "gotcha!". Like even if AA was scum lying about lynchbomb, is the implication that it would be too hard for him to make up some sort of flavor for it?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

Okay, so here's what's standing out to me the most:

I don't know ecco to use "lunch".

:carrot:

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

Can everybody who isn't AA chill for a bit on this until I'm done?

I'm heading out for the night, so sure.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


The Lord of Hats posted:

I mean, that's certainly a possibility, but I agree with Keane that there isn't a good reason for AA not to be answering at this point. If you've already claimed your role why go to such lengths to conceal its flavor? This is an Ecco game, and if there's one thing I associate with Ecco games it's having lots of well-written flavor text. It's not like it's hard to say "I'm a MAFIAROLE, I do this through FLAVORTEXT".

Murmur Twin posted:

What's the flavor reason for a human being in a mine with a bunch of lizards?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

This seems a pretty weird take from MMT since it largely revolves around the concept of town making an effort, and I'm wondering what MMT would imagine casing and posting to look like in the early game if it didn't involve pursuing threads that look odd and generating cases from there.

I'm not making a blanket "all players who make an effort are scummy", I'm specifically saying that your case on AA feels like you're pushing too hard on low-hanging fruit and it seems like scum making a fake case to me.

I do this on D1 in a lot of my games - I ask myself "if I were scum, what fake case would I be pushing right now?" and, in my opinion, the argument that you're making on AA fits the bill. It feels to me like you're jumping on minor things and trying to blow them up as obvious scumtells when, at least at first glance, I don't think they are.

That said, I haven't re-read AA since engaging you on this (and am :guinness: at the moment) so I'll re-look to see if the gun is as smoking as you seem to think it is.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

I'll look for the game, but I recall MMT explicitly stating that she liked to get games rolling by making tenuous cases and seeing how people reacted, and going from there.

My play, especially early, is pretty obviously the same play that MMT championed in an earlier game. MMT raised her objections against my play pretty early, so this stands out in particular; if MMT was casing about my harder push on AA, I wouldn't have regarded that as suspicious, but early on, and in an early attempt to generate content, it stands out.

I suppose that's fair - I'm not saying "I'm 100% sure Keane is scum, lock it up", I'm saying that my first impression of the content so far on d1 (without going back and re-reading AA yet, which I stress I still haven't) was that your posting feels more suspicious to me than AA. It's entirely possible I'm wrong which is why I'm not going crazy trying to get other people to vote for you.

CCKeane posted:

If not, of course I am sure you will happily provide someone else that was suitably scummy before the business went down, since you feel the pursuing of a weak case is scummy.

For the sake of full disclosure, I'm probably not going to give the game a full effort read until tomorrow around 3-4pm PST (as tonight I'm watching Survivor and then going to bed > tomorrow I have school followed by my audition for a dealing job).

CCKeane posted:

To be clear here:

MMTs complaint is that I was/am pursuing AA and following up on inconsistencies, and AA would be "an easy scum vote"

Since I have thoughts but not confirmation on AA's alignment, and, presumably, neither would a town MMT, somebody, pursuing AA is sensible unless there existed a more glaring case at the time.

If MMT cannot provide a case that would have been more worthwhile to pursue, I was right in pursuing AA and MMT is talking out her butt, like whenever she talks about New England having quality sports teams or food.

Here are plenty of other examples of me trying to look for "which case sounds more like scum trying to push the easiest target?".

Something something New England Patriots, New Haven pizza.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


OK, back and catching up now, should be here from now until deadline.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Murmur Twin posted:

That said, I haven't re-read AA since engaging you on this (and am :guinness: at the moment) so I'll re-look to see if the gun is as smoking as you seem to think it is.

OK, on a reread I have to admit that I was wrong and Keane was right yesterday :eng99:

Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Just be sure to let a scum hammer me so they can die. Since I am confirmed town lynch bomb.

---

I am Faham. I was born to dig.

---

No, I am actually a lunch bomb.

---

No, I'm a lunch bomb. Town can use me as a vig.

---

Blaster lunchingbomb

---

I don't have kills or kill flavor lol. I just explode on hammer

---

If I saw a mirror, I'd weep from how divine the adonis staring back at me appeared. Also I think that's enough for now lol

---

Blaster is my flavor name. A lynch bomb is what it is. On phone. Ain't nobody eating lunch.

---

It's that you need the minors is what concerns me. I've given you the pay dirt and you're asking for change? Why?

---

I'm a blaster.

I'm a lunchbomb.

I'm a kobold or w.e. these lizardkin are, miner birthed to mine.

Live or die, I mine.

---

It's what you think it is and this mod meta to interpret my claim is hokey fwiw

---

Lol my phone did it. I don't care. I am a lynch bomb, let it be known.

---

Ecco used neither lunch, lynch, or any other variation.

I am simply bomb since this is pertinent.

If AA was town he would have said something like "I'm Fahad, my flavor is Blaster and my role is Bomb(er?)" the first time he was asked this. Yesterday I thought it was Keane going after low-hanging fruit but in retrospect the number of times it took him to get a straight answer definitely reads like scum caught in a lie.

##unvote
##vote AA

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Anomalous Amalgam posted:

In defense of my life for an actual better use of it, consider the following:

- Would I, as scum, draw this much attention to myself unnecessarily day one? Remove me from the equation, would it be a good play by anyone?
- What would I have to gain by lying about this claim? Imagine it as town, scum and 3P?
- Offering my ability up voluntarily to not only clear myself in act of martyrdom, but also destroy a target the town collective deemed as scummy, should stand as town motive for my play and justifications.

Point ones and two: If you're scum, you would claim it to make people reluctant to hammer you. It would be a good play if you could sell it well, but your followup to Keane's question reads far more like someone trying to come up with a lie than someone relaying information naturally.

Point three: your volunteering to be lynched by the person town thinks is scummiest doesn't make sense. If a town player is deemed scummiest and hammers that's bad for town, if a scum player is deemed scummiest they're not going to go along with your plan just because you asked.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


got some chores tonight posted:

Jonathan Fisk Must Die

:yeah:

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


I am a Driller (town vigilante) and I did indeed target Fisk last night. I agree with Max/Keane that Fisk was probably double killed - the drilling in the guts was me but I don't think the pickax was. I was leaning towards drilling Max last night but switched to Fisk at the last minute. :eng99:

CCKeane posted:

Good catch, this matches with my flavor.

Can you clarify this? You were jailed but Fisk getting double-killed matches with your flavor?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Asking for your flavor is a pretty tame request if you repeatedly claim a role. Freaking out at someone who finds your sparse response lacking is p bad.

##unvote
##vote AA


---

AA being cagey about their role flavor is kind of weird to me after being so loud about their role.

When I look at how I think scum would have played D1 (as I did when I cased Keane yesterday, although I've since changed my mind regarding him), I think they would have seen a plausible case on a town AA and hopped on it. That's not open-and-shut in a vacuum since plenty of people (including me) ended up doing that, but

Max posted:

Something about Grandi gnawing at me.

---

Since when was your argument about Tone?

---

That just ignores everything else that's been going on and offers zero specifics.

---

"Boy I sure don't like the way Max called me scummy after not really contributing much and barely making an argument."

---

I'm honestly willing to vote Grandi if people are around to make that happen.

Max's case on Grandi seems more like a defensive OMGUS to me than it does a genuine attempt to find scum.

Max - is Grandi still your top scum suspect?

Also on my mind is that (a) I immediately noticed the double-kill flavor since I was responsible for the drilling but in my mind I don't think someone else would have noticed it unless they had something to do with the kill, and (b) I remember from a recent game that Max, as SK, targetted low-effort players, so I can see a world where scum Max would have gone after Fisk. I'm not saying either of those is a slam-dunk against Max but they're little things I noticed so I'm pointing them out.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


EccoRaven posted:

Come morning - the miners could only tell by small gaps in the top of the mine which penetrate the surface - there was yet another murder. This man was the janitor; he used magickal cleaning equipment to suck up dust and dirt while simultaneously pushing away stones and debris, keeping the tunnels clear from obstruction so miners can easily travel through them. He also had a keen sense of the human (and lizard) spirit. He believed he could see into people's thoughts and figure out their intentions.

The rest of the miners were always skeptical, but it seems, whatever the case, he will never get his chance to prove himself. He had a pickax lodged in his skull, and some of the drilling equipment mangled up his guts.


:s: Jonathan Fisk, Subul, Janitor (town-aligned cop), was killed night 1. :s:

Reading over the flavor I noticed that Fisk had "a keen sense of the human (and lizard) spirit" which makes me wonder - is anyone else other than Hats a human in this game?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Quidthulhu posted:

what's there to quid about? :confused:

You've been posting in other threads, have you still found nothing in-game to comment on?

EccoRaven posted:

Rarity is replaced by stickup

Everyone say hi!

Hi Stickup!

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


this is a stickup posted:

mmt was town and correctly figured out you were scum early on due to posting that is incredibly similar to the way you're posting now, and yet mmt has not mentioned you at all

I was waiting for Tobbs to post more before bringing it up. Going into D2 he had town points for referencing a bunch of meta reads but scum points for not voting for anyone outside of Keane.

As it stands right now I agree with you. ##vote Tobbs

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

P sure MMT was scum that game.

Are you badgering MMT for not playing her scum game?

I was town, you were scum, and you killed me N2 because I was 100% positive you were scum based on a meta read on you. It was like 3 weeks ago, do you not remember?

For reference, the meta case (here) was:

"Murmur Twin" (in another game) posted:

I don't think I've ever been in a game with scum Tobbs, which is why the difference here is so striking to me. The things he's doing differently aren't minor things, they're striking differences that I would perceive as scumtells on anyone.

(a) we're halfway into day 2 and he's only made one case (which starts with "I actually agree with MMT here")
(b) he isn't voting for anyone
(c) he posts an excuse for why he isn't posting as much this game

---

I'm just going down the list of recent games:

In Swan Song, where Tobbs is town, he makes 8 total votes in the first three pages of his post history.

In Katamari Mafia where Tobbs is town, he makes 9 total votes in two pages of his post history.

In Paupers of Podlma, where Tobbs is scum, he makes 2 total votes in the first three pages of his post history (full disclosure: I wasn't in this game and hadn't read it; I just scrolled through Tobbs' post history for that game).

In this game, he has 1 vote so far, 2 if you count the stickup joke vote.

In this game, midway into D2, he has 2 total votes, only 1 if you discount the joke vote on CL.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Tobbs Gnawed posted:

P sure MMT was scum that game.

Are you badgering MMT for not playing her scum game?

What are your opinions of me, Max, and Keane so far?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Max town, you town, Keane scum.

##vote CCKeane

---

Also quid and stickup scum.

Were you going to explain why or do you need me to ask you first?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Hot phone post take, I'm not really sold on Tobbs as scum, mostly because I believe he would have argued for me to be the NK, not Fisk.

You don't find anything the least bit suspicious about the fact that Tobbs has one single game opinion that he's been willing to flesh out and otherwise is showing no interest in hunting for scum?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Tobbs Gnawed posted:

I think AA has been playing a really really bad game and saying only things that are wrong, but that doesn't mean he's scum.

I should just give in and admit that I am a meta monster.

I'm not feeling Max for scum this game. That fishiness that surrounds him is absent.

This is so painfully obviously chores' town game that I wouldn't vote him even if he claimed Cop, got counterclaimed, and we lynched the counterclaimer who claimed cop.

I've been wrong on meta calls before (loving TMM) but I was hoping someone had played with Keane when he was town and not a useless shitposter. I have played many games with Keane, and this and FF2 (where he was scum) are the only ones that I've seen this posting style.

Tobbs claims to be a "meta monster" and makes references to games from months ago.

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

This is actually quite wrong.

I won a game as scum recently, and it's because people don't lynch for meta reasons. Max had me nailed as scum and ended up killing me (he was SK).

Other players like Moat knew I was scum, but they got lynched anyways.

Also I was copped as scum and got the cop lynched lol

Tobbs references a game three weeks ago where he was scum.

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

P sure MMT was scum that game.

Are you badgering MMT for not playing her scum game?

When Stickup refers to that exact same game and says that Tobbs is acting the same way, Tobbs has erased all memory of it despite referencing it earlier this game.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Hot phone post take, I'm not really sold on Tobbs as scum, mostly because I believe he would have argued for me to be the NK, not Fisk.

Right now my primary suspicion is that he's a scumteam with someone who would prefer to go after low-effort targets - you.

Ignoring the NK target choice, what's your opinion of Tobbs' posting style this game?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Tobbs Gnawed posted:

I'm not feeling Max for scum this game. That fishiness that surrounds him is absent.

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Max town, you town, Keane scum.

##vote CCKeane

How is Max's posting this game different from how you think he might post as scum?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


##unvote
##vote Tobbs

I don't think my vote registered on VF so I'm just resending it.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


BottleKnight posted:

Someone pandering to chores. Hah. Can you imagine?

I can see it, MMT. Only having one vote, for Keane, after so much time definitely seems like someone intentionally avoiding opinions, and my best conception of Tobbs town game was in, uh, I think it was Selene Pereau? Where he was all over the place with all kinds of different opinions. This definitely seems like an intentionally conservative Tobbs.

Would vote Tobbs. Stickup is still my first target, though.

How is stickup (the first person to make a case on Tobbs, one that you've said you agree with) more scummy than Tobbs?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Max posted:

Still feeling Grandi

Murmur Twin posted:

Ignoring the NK target choice, what's your opinion of Tobbs' posting style this game?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Grandicap posted:

When did Keane claim that d1? I know he claimed jailed last night, which infers he has a powerrole, but I don't recall this happening d1.

This post:

CCKeane posted:

I'd much rather not, I got a power role.

---

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Keane: "I have an important town power role."

Scum: (kills random unclaimed player who was going after Keane).

Makes you think.

He's claiming that he was RBed or jailed so to me the most obvious explanation is that scum chose to play around a town doctor and chose instead to kill someone without many posts to analyze.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


CCKeane posted:

Tobbs is focusing on me a bunch to the exclusion of everything else, but I do the same if I think I've got somebody, even if I'm wrong, which happened day one. So.

BK's call on Rarity makes sense.

If it was anyone else I might agree with you but please read the links in this post:

this is a stickup posted:

apart from omgusing bk for voting me without even letting me finish reading the thread, tobbs has made exactly one call and one vote (minus a joke on chaoslord)

it's easy to push keane when keane is pushing aa, especially when you know aa's alignment. as mmt did, here and here are the examples she brought up of town tobbs throwing his vote around and making calls even early in the game.

for contrast, the game she cased him in looks just like this one, and she was right about him being scum there. I'm skeptical that town mmt in this game wouldn't bring this up again after correctly getting tobbs in that game, and later on saying she should've fought harder to get tobbs ded

I think that Tobbs is the literal top of my list of players who post differently when town and scum and I feel really confident that this is his scum game.

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Lol you're really wrong. After that stupid, stupid D1 though town is hosed so you may as well get rid of me.

I'm vanilla town (since everyone is gunning for me).

Is the case on me just meta anyways?

Neat.

Again I ask:

Murmur Twin posted:

How is Max's posting this game different from how you think he might post as scum?

Followup question: if you see me aggressively pushing for a mislynch on a town Tobbs, what makes you think I'm town?

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Quidthulhu posted:

OK, the reread begins NOW. Where do I start, someone give me a place to begin

Read it in order and post hot takes as you go!

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


It's mafia, people will get mad no matter what :j:

Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Quidthulhu posted:

OK, the reread begins NOW. Where do I start, someone give me a place to begin

You're not, like, waiting for someone to name a place to begin, are you? :j:

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Murmur Twin
Feb 11, 2003

An ever-honest pacifist with no mind for tricks.


Does Tobbs read like someone who is comfortable sharing information or someone who is nervous getting caught in a lie?

Murmur Twin posted:

What are your opinions of me, Max, and Keane so far?

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Max town, you town, Keane scum.

##vote CCKeane

---

Also quid and stickup scum.

I ask for reads, he gives his answers without any further explanations.

Murmur Twin posted:

Were you going to explain why or do you need me to ask you first?

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Same reasons as yesterday. Keane believing AA but still pushing him is icing on the meta cake.

I ask for clarification - he answers that his read on Keane is the same as the one from yesterday without anything to it. He doesn't address his reads on me, Max, Quid, or stickup.

Murmur Twin posted:

How is Max's posting this game different from how you think he might post as scum?

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

Doesn't smell fishy. Scum Max has a fish smell and I'm not smelling it.

I ask Tobbs why he has a town read on Max and he gives a relative non-answer.

chaoslord posted:

Tobbs I am interested in this post. Stickup makes a pretty good meta case on both you and MMT. You love meta and acknowledge that you believe stickup is correct. In your next post you declare MMT to be town. Why do you believe her to be town?

Tobbs Gnawed posted:

I don't see her play as scummy.

That, and scum MMT tries really hard, and I'm not seeing it this game.

I'd like to think I try hard regardless of alignment? And I feel like I've been putting a reasonable amount of effort into this game - it's just that I feel like I've nailed scum so I'm focusing my questions in one direction.

Again, if Tobbs was town, he'd be fighting back against me because from his point of view I'd be trying to drive a mislynch on him. If anything, I think he would have at least brought up that I claimed a vig on the NK target last night and that it would, on some level, inform his opinion of me. His answer to this reads like he knows my alignment and doesn't want to argue that I'm scum when he knows I'm not.

Also Max - is there anything specifically in this post that you think I'm wrong about so far?

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