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G-Spot Run posted:I'm not saying they definitively weren't inspired by LiS but your reasoning is like the people who thought Bioshock's battle of wounded knee was a Skyrim reference.
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Apr 13, 2017 16:12
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Except for every single piece of media set during teenage years/in high school ever, that is.
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Apr 13, 2017 16:51
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Look, My So-Called Life was clearly an homage to Duke Nukem Forever.
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Apr 13, 2017 18:33
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Escobarbarian posted:Except for every single piece of media set during teenage years/in high school ever, that is. Both are homages to some degree so I guess he's really just not that familiar with the genre.
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Apr 13, 2017 18:43
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MiddleOne posted:Both are homages to some degree so I guess he's really just not that familiar with the genre.
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Apr 14, 2017 03:49
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orange sky posted:I think he was hallucinating because he was getting no sleep. It's no Machinist but I think that's what they're going for, I've been without sleep for only two days and it's crazy what your brain does to you. Add to that the usual teenager paranoia of fitting in and an extraordinary paranoia caused by "everyone has listened to these tapes and I'm in them wtf did I do" and you have a cocktail for panic attacks and general depression and apathy. I have never felt crazier in my life than going without sleep, LSD or mushrooms might make you see funny lines in the air or horns growing out of the bad guy in the car ride at the end of SEVEN. *(worst decision ever), but nothing compares to just not being able to sleep for a couple days. They're doing construction next door and I know what you're talking about. It was so bad a couple of nights that my walls were melting and I didn't' know what time it was and forgot to feed my dogs.. It was a poo poo-show. The mom was realistic I guess, but it's just not something that is interesting to watch. All of her So-SAD scenes didn't really have a conclusion, either, which may have made them easier to take.
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Apr 14, 2017 05:30
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Escobarbarian posted:Oh yeah, DoggPickle, what constitutes "looking and speaking gay"? Alex? Or poetry-guy I guess. I wasn't saying that looking and speaking a certain way means that you're gay. It kinda makes people thing you are for sure. Which was the point.. He seems gay like he's going to be the good third wheel with his hags. And then he's not at all. So stop judging  But poetry-guy straight up says "I'm a skinny human being who writes poetry". <-his words, not mine.
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Apr 14, 2017 05:35
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Escobarbarian posted:Oh yeah, DoggPickle, what constitutes "looking and speaking gay"? Tv and movies have a very precise vocabulary that they refined over the course of the 60s and employed up until the turn of the century with great precision and regularity. Of course it's offensive and inaccurate and that's why it disappeared, but it seems unfair to the poster who brought it up to act like they're the bigot for acknowledging that those media conventions exist.
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Apr 14, 2017 18:11
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Just finished the series and wow the last 3 episodes blew me away. I kind of trudged through it for the first 5 or so episodes but after that all of the characters seemed to find their footing and there was a lot less eye rolling dialogue/situations. Definitely hope there isn't a second season, the show ended perfectly. I'm just watching the 30 minute documentary and the fact that the actress that played Hannah is an Austrailian/kiwi is really throwing me for a loop for some reason.
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Apr 14, 2017 20:54
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I couldn't watch the suicide scene (I'm a hemophobe) but god even listening to it was gut wrenching.
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Apr 14, 2017 22:18
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Gore never bothers me but that whole scene I was like 
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Apr 14, 2017 22:20
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precision posted:Gore never bothers me but that whole scene I was like 10/10 will not watch again Strange Charm fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Apr 14, 2017 |
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Apr 14, 2017 22:50
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Yeah, for a scene that we knew was coming, knew exactly what happened (no surprise on the method), it was seriously disturbing. The jagged cuts, yelps of pain, not turning the water off and doing it fully dressed...man, that was vicious.
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Apr 14, 2017 22:52
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I hope this is ok to post here (there is no financial gain from additional views), but my fiancee wrote something about this show that ended up on Hello Giggles. She is a Child and Adolescent psychologist, so the article is mostly directed towards that crowd, but thought I would share it anyways in case someone is interested. http://hellogiggles.com/adolescent-psychologist-lessons-13-reasons-why/
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Apr 14, 2017 23:45
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precision posted:Look, My So-Called Life was clearly an homage to Duke Nukem Forever. Speaking of My So-Called life, I was happy to see Ricky and that they gave him the last name Vasquez  This show felt very Donnie Darko to me, from the look of the town to the broody dark haired boy to the Joy Division (they always hook me with Joy Division). I was on board with the music at first until there were endless bad covers of good songs, but I think I am in the minority on that.
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Apr 15, 2017 07:38
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vaginadeathgrip posted:Speaking of My So-Called life, I was happy to see Ricky and that they gave him the last name Vasquez Not only was his name Vasquez, but it was Richard Vasquez. I know, I know, his name was Enrique in MSCL, but I still liked that they did the whole Ricky/Richard thing.
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Apr 15, 2017 16:39
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What's the movie poster with the giant head hanging in Hannah's bedroom? It's so distracting in every scene, but there's always something in front of the title.
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Apr 16, 2017 05:10
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Episodes 1-5 I was riveted, episode 6 I started to fast forward, episode 7 I started rolling my eyes and doing other things while watching and I am praying they pull it back soon.
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Apr 16, 2017 05:24
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I just finished this and for the most part really loved it. Everything I thought re: dialogue and the impact of the suicide scene have already been said so two unrelated observances instead: - Clay has (at least) two Arcade Fire posters in his bedroom, I have one of them in a different chromed printing and it's by far one of my favorite flatstock posters from the past few years. http://burlesquedesign.com/blogs/main/tagged/reflektor - In episode 9 at 46:50-46:41 (time remaining) there's an extra waggling first one corndog then double-fisting two waggling them at his companions at the table in the foreground. Two minutes later in real time (iirc there's no cut to imply time has passed more than the conversation taking place in that room) both corndogs are gone when that table is shown again. Also I'm kind of surprised about how viciously this is being smeared on tumblr for existing at all. There's a post going around claiming the filmmakers went to a town something very similar to this happened in and interviewing dozens of people then explicitly ignoring all their advice and doing everything exactly opposite for reaction. It's very doomsday 'this is gonna make hundreds of people kill themselves, boycott this trash show' language.
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Apr 17, 2017 08:16
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I feel like that kind of keeps with the show's own theme of teenagers being dumb, though. This is hardly a romantic depiction of suicide as measured against other art that supposedly inspired waves of suicides.
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Apr 17, 2017 13:36
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I personally feel like it does romanticise the idea of suicide as an act of revenge. The tapes do exactly what she wanted them to.
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Apr 17, 2017 14:40
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I don't know about romanticizing it. I think that almost everyone that watched the show agreed that she had severe mental illness. Sure it painted the picture of the villain, but also caused completely unnecessary guilt to the others who may not have deserved it. I doubt anyone watching saw suicide as her best option - it was obvious that so many of her problems could have been resolved by talking to someone - whether a psychiatrist, or a genuine friend.
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Apr 17, 2017 14:59
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Escobarbarian posted:I personally feel like it does romanticise the idea of suicide as an act of revenge. The tapes do exactly what she wanted them to. It romanticizes the revenge, but not the suicide. The suicide scene is absolutely horrific, and anybody who would watch it and think, "yes, exactly, I'd like to go through with that," has almost certainly made up their mind already. That's how I see it, anyway. I'm working on a post about this show for my workplace's medical blog. Gonna be interviewing a psychiatrist about some of the issues being discussed in this thread/on Tumblr/etc., so I might report back with what he has to say on the matter.
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Apr 17, 2017 15:31
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Even her revenge recedes in importance compared to things like her parents' suffering and Clay getting hosed up to the point of auditory and visual hallucinations, or an approaching spree shooing. The show also dramatizes the absence of the suicidal person in the present by consistently cutting back to her as a vibrant and full living person with feelings and relationships and then just showing a world where she's not there. That seems to really cut against the fantasy of suicide as a way to hurt others, because the narrative focuses on her absence from the world and how she's not there to feel or experience anything. It's not like everyone sits around missing her and wishing she were back, but just that she's gone and people keep living and she doesn't get to. She's an idea or an object that people worry about in the present, but that's nothing compared to being alive. I would want teenagers to see that, though perhaps I am naive in hoping they would.
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Apr 17, 2017 15:50
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Escobarbarian posted:I personally feel like it does romanticise the idea of suicide as an act of revenge. The tapes do exactly what she wanted them to. Yes because I'm sure she wanted Alex to attempt suicide. If you think the the tapes didn't backfire in any way you weren't paying attention.
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Apr 17, 2017 17:27
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One thing for me with this series is that it really felt like it totally switched gears for about the last 4 episodes or so. The beginning has this slow build up with Clay as he learns more and more with each tape. As it goes on he gets more and more unhinged. He starts wildly hallucinating and even taking revenge on the subjects of the tapes. We find out that Clay has a history of illness when his parents start making references to him having nightmares again and try to get him back on his old meds. I kept hearing about how intense the last few episodes were and I honestly thought this was going to end up more akin to a horror film with Clay going nuts and ramping up his revenge to insane levels. But all that build up just sorta ends and the entire tone completely changes. Of course the ending is still really intense, but certainly not for any of the reasons I was expecting.
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Apr 17, 2017 17:36
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I finished this last night and liked it, but I didn't find Hannah very sympathetic through most of the show. She definitely dug some of the hole she was in with her terrible decision making, and laying guilt on Clay because he didn't stay after she yelled at him multiple times to gently caress off the night of the party was selfish and lovely. When she left the counselor's office and stood there waiting for him to chase after her I also rolled my eyes pretty hard. Also she acts like no one cares, but right before killing herself she runs into poetry guy at the post office and he tells her they miss her, someone wrote a poem about her, etc. It's just immature decision making by a 17 year old revenge martyr. A good point the show could've made is that while it's your whole world from 14-18 your perception of life while in high school is very skewed. All these kids (save for Justin) have it better than 90% of the people in the world but were still bitching about how bad their lives were like "oh geez I may have to go to a STATE SCHOOL because my daddy's pharmacy isn't doing well". Another thing that ties into that was the counselor, yeah he was rear end at his job but he even said he came from a school where kids just shot each other, so maybe to him the problems these kids were having weren't as life threatening as what he'd been used to. The real tragedy was Jeff dying that dude was cool.
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Apr 17, 2017 20:29
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This show is kinda weird. The only people I would consider recommending it to are also the ones who shouldn't be watching that.
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Apr 17, 2017 20:43
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Me episodes 1-8: "None of these characters are making good decisions. Not a single one of them." Me episodes 9-13: "Oh no, I'm a dick and forgot all about my awful teenage years and this makes 100% sense." My girlfriend and I couldn't watch or even listen to the suicide scene and by merely remembering is just now my stomach turned. That and when Hannah's eyes go dead during the Bryce-tub-rape are scenes that we'll probably remember forever.
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Apr 17, 2017 21:09
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Just finished the show and I don't know how to feel about it. I love anything that plays with noir tropes in different settings and this definitely did that but it was tonally off. At times it felt like it was trying to be Veronica Marsish where the tone isn't realistic and is kind of light and then at times it felt like it was trying to be a Serious Realistic Portrayal of the Suicidal Mind and you can't really do both. Like, after the graphic and affecting suicide scene, I expected more out of the scene of her parents discovering her body and her parents hearing her voice for the first time on the mp3 file but their responses felt less realistic and more theatric? I don't know, it just was all over the place. I can't say I disliked it. It was trying to do something new with the teenage drama genre and while it had a lot of misses, there were some hits and most of the actors (especially the leads) were very good actors. Plus, you know, cool Echo and the Bunnymen covers.
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Apr 22, 2017 14:07
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Donnie Darko made using Echo and the Bunnymen a punchline, but I'm honestly OK with that because they were great. e: Wait, the DD scene I'm thinking of was "Under the Milky Way Tonight", which was The Church, never mind
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Apr 23, 2017 03:30
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Just finished this as well, here are my thoughts. I'll assume that spoiler tags are not needed at this point in the thread. - The first 5 or so episodes were quite a chore to get through, and I don't know if I would have persisted if I didn't have a history with depression myself and wanted to see what they would do with the topic. These first few episodes feel very much like a ham-fisted typical teen drama (or at least, from my limited experience with them) albeit with a very original and creative format. The dialogue is often clunky and Hannah's early narrations come off as cringey because early on it seems like typical angst over high school drama. However, once we dive into the depths of the other characters' lives, this does start to shine and I found it pretty gripping by the final 1/3rd. Perhaps this was the intention since the target demographic is probably teens. - I feel that they made it just apparent enough that Hannah had underlying mental issues that the whole thing worked for me and I don't have any complaints about it. She kept everything inside the entire show and she actively pushed away those who did try to help her (Clay, the poetry people, her parents, etc). There is one final nod to this right before she commits suicide from the librarian guy. I found it entirely believable, a person prone to depression could be driven toward suicide after getting caught in a downward spiral of poo poo. - I don't feel that Hannah's rape undermines everything preceding it. It and the terrible counselor's conversation were just confirmation in her mind that she is worthless to the world. - I was actually quite happy that Clay did not have any dark secrets. We have enough morally ambiguous lead characters today. I went from thinking he was the most boring, milquetoast lead character ever to fully rooting for him by the end. - I do think Hannah should have been given more of a personality, but I'm guessing this was a conscious decision to not make her too likable so the audience never fully sees her mindset as okay. - The suicide scene was brutal. Hannah's mom's reaction is so real and heart wrenching. And it had to be this way, I don't know how anyone could think the show was glorifying suicide after that. - I was a bit letdown by the ending since I think they really hurt the impact with so many "there could be a season 2!" elements. - I lost track of the number of times a conversation on the show ends with one character getting frustrated and storming off, followed by the other character calling their name as they walk away. - Tony would have been easier to stomach if he didn't just stare with this  expression and tone for the first half of the show.- I can't decide who treated Hannah the worst besides Bryce, but I'm leaning toward Courtney. - A neat little touch I noticed is that any flashback scene where Hannah is alive is shot with warm white tones and heavier saturation, and every present day scene is shot with cool blue white tones and desaturated a bit. I won't watch this again, but I don't regret watching it. SweetMercifulCrap! fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 23, 2017 06:13
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I've been marathoning this show all day. I just finished episode 11 and when Clay was thinking of what he should have said; that tore me up. I had a friend who committed suicide two years ago and that scene hit close to home.
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Apr 23, 2017 10:51
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sweetmercifulcrap posted:- I feel that they made it just apparent enough that Hannah had underlying mental issues that the whole thing worked for me and I don't have any complaints about it. She kept everything inside the entire show and she actively pushed away those who did try to help her (Clay, the poetry people, her parents, etc). There is one final nod to this right before she commits suicide from the librarian guy. I found it entirely believable, a person prone to depression could be driven toward suicide after getting caught in a downward spiral of poo poo. Yeah, I don't understand the responses to the show that say it dismisses or undersells the role of mental illness in suicide. She shows some pretty distorted thinking in the final episodes. In addition to blowing off the librarian without seeming to understand what he's telling her, she totally ignores her mother and uses the conversation with the guidance counselor as an arbitrary metric for whether she should keep living, putting everything on whether he'll follow her out of his office within a window of 30 seconds to a minute. And to defend him, he's getting some kind of very important personal phone call during their scene together that he seems to feel he has to take (cell rings twice and he throws it in a drawer, office phone rings and he hangs up, office phone rings again and he picks it up once she leaves). There's also the fantasy she has about what dating Clay would be like, where she just decides that's impossible and will never happen, even though they haven't gone on a single date and have at most done some light flirting. That fantasy also has a scene where she imagines enjoying watching Clay and her mother get along, which underlines exactly what a good relationship she has with her mom and how highly she thinks of her, but it never occurs to her to reach out at all. Those seem like very good demonstrations that she's no longer thinking clearly at all, even if it's not visible to the other characters. Really, there's a lot of mental illness in the series. Clay's parents and teachers kind of drop the ball on not getting him psychiatric help for his many auditory and visual hallucinations and violent freakouts. There's a point where he gets into psych hold territory.
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Apr 23, 2017 12:14
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I just finished the series. Going to have to echo that I hope they don't go with a season 2. This was enough. Some thoughts: - The motivations for the students passing around the tapes made more sense as the show went on. Once I remembered being a teenager (hell I'm a manchild right now) it was easier to understand some of their dumb decisions. Teenagers are really bad at communicating their feelings. - A lot of people are saying that Hannah was sort of a weak character but I liked her. She reminded me of the type of girls that I like. Her faux-philosophical narrations helped define her as a girl who's smart and wants to show it but is trying a little too hard. Every time there was a flashback, I hoped things would get better for her even though I knew how her story would end. - I didn't see the tapes as vindication since they were basically an audio suicide note. - The rape scene in episode 12 was horrible to watch; not that it was shot bad or anything but it made me feel sick and angry. - I will probably never watch this show ever again.
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Apr 23, 2017 14:14
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Is Clay Jensen the worst protagonist of any TV show, ever? I want to punch him literally all the time. He makes Ted Mosby look awesome.
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Apr 23, 2017 23:26
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Love this show. Although, I was only able to watch a few epsiodes at a time. I'd be totally content with the show never having a second season. The depth of the characters was great and extremely well done, probably my favorite aspect of the whole series. Saddest thing for me was learning that Jeff was actually dead. I don't know why, perhaps I liked his character the best, but man that was a tough episode to end. Anyone else on the same page there?
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Apr 23, 2017 23:43
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Escobarbarian posted:Is Clay Jensen the worst protagonist of any TV show, ever? I want to punch him literally all the time. He makes Ted Mosby look awesome. It doesn't help that he has got the worst case of Milktoast Face I have ever seen. He is the whitest kid I know.
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Apr 23, 2017 23:59
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I don't think Clay actively did anything too douchey, his biggest crime was being really inept with talking to girls. But year during the first half of this I hated him and the endless shots of him staring off, contemplating, or awkwardly lying.
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Apr 24, 2017 02:10
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They were obviously going for a Cameron Frye thing with him, but he's better than the original in that with him it's actually plausible that he could have a friend who is just a hallucination like in that stupid fan theory about Ferris Bueller's Day Off.
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Apr 24, 2017 02:48
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