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Poltergrift posted:I mean, it wasn't too long ago, historically speaking, that we were saying that humans weren't meant to fly and talking about the hubris of Icarus, as if many people don't routinely fly across the planet in a few days. People were convinced that if you ran faster than a 4 minute mile you would die and that bicycles would super age you. We believe all sorts of weird and dumb things when faced with new things that challenge our understanding of how things should work. Mister Olympus posted:I'm pretty convinced that wasn't actually the Shindo we've been following from episodes 1-6 talking. No way he would just hand some sort of crazy memevirus over to Google without a bunch of contracts and harsh stipulations, that's just far too irresponsible. Shindo hasn't been a normal human from episode 1. When he was processed by Kado he got a bunch of upgrades due to Kado not understanding humans fully before loving around with the dimensional molecules and poo poo. It's also likely that just as zaShunina is becoming more human, Shindo is becoming more anisotropic. Also it seemed like Shindo hadn't been sleeping from before the reveal of the Sansa, as he had been ignoring the concerns of others that he needed a break or may be tired almost the entire series. RottenK posted:That'd be pretty great because "actually there's no twist" is a twist on its own by now, and also a story about humanity being uplifted by a benevolent but alien creature that struggles with understanding us is interesting in its own right. The twist seems to be heading towards Man Was The True Monster All Along. zaShunina has been cautioning them all along to think things over and the first lesson that we learn is Shindo explaining the difference between a successful negotiation and a rushed negotiation. Two things that are being at least partially ignored. My guess is that, given zaShunina's fussing over precise communication, he really is relying on Shindo and Japanese bureaucracy to properly curb his actions when he is pushing too hard or acting incorrectly due to differences in dimensional understanding and other communication barriers. The Prime Minister is right, all the cool things humanity is getting from zaShunina have no bearing on whether or not humanity fucks up. That's on humanity. At least with Shindo and Tsukai drifting towards current situation philosophical extremes the negotiations might reach a better balance than Qwertycoatl posted:Alien:
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May 30, 2017 02:47
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It's too late to go back now. Next episode looks like we're gonna get some interesting revelations.
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Jun 2, 2017 16:12
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I wasn't especially fond of her argument against moving forward. Cultural exchange is a natural facet of humanity that we've engaged in since before we were even fully human. To say that what we have now is fine is an incredibly myopic viewpoint. Sure, the outcome might destroy humanity, but that's likely to happen regardless of interference.
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Jun 2, 2017 19:21
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gently caress they even have the stupid Google dome obsession including the "next-generation construction methods" required.There Bias Two posted:I wasn't especially fond of her argument against moving forward. Cultural exchange is a natural facet of humanity that we've engaged in since before we were even fully human. To say that what we have now is fine is an incredibly myopic viewpoint. Sure, the outcome might destroy humanity, but that's likely to happen regardless of interference. Yeah her arguments rang hollow with me too. Her points about how the stuff that happened "in the universe" are sacrosanct and that the anisotropic is somehow different just doesn't mesh with what we know. It's not clear whether the universe is directly "part of" the anisotropic but it's clear that they both exist and have always existed (at least for some definition of always). It'd be like saying we shouldn't travel to Mars because humanity didn't know other planets existed for a very long time. There are decent reasons to avoid these new devices and really critical questions that aren't even being asked or talked about, but the arguments that are being brought up in the show aren't very strong.
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Jun 4, 2017 05:55
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Well there's your twist, I guess. I like it.
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Jun 9, 2017 16:55
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I did not see that coming. It does make Tsukais stance much more understandable for me though.
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Jun 9, 2017 17:45
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Well that went in an interesting direction. The characterization seems kind of... off though. Shindo is definitely not living up to his reputation as a negotiator. He refuses to press ZaShunina on important questions and just goes along with whatever he wants. Worse, despite claiming to respect the autonomy of humans, he decides to kill Shindo the moment he shows the slightest bit of hesitation about entering a higher universe? edit: Actually, I think what annoys me the most is that this entire story could have been resolved with five minutes of discussion between people who were actually competent: "Oh hey humanity, I'm ZaShunina, and I come from a place outside the universe. So I know this is a major revelation, but your universe is basically on one of many servers that we designed because we were bored. The outside universe processes things really quickly, so we ran out of information to process, and started generating random permutations of reality to see what would happen. Out of nowhere, you guys popped up and started creating new data! We're not really gods since this was a complete accident, but we think it's pretty cool and we want you to keep doing your thing. I brought some cool odds and ends from my garage that we think you could use to do neat things with, and all we want in exchange is to keep monitoring you. Also, if any of you are qualified, we'd love to have some human consultants come back with us and shake things up a bit. I'll be in my box if you have any questions. Also, sorry about the plane crash, that was a total accident and I'll release them all in a month once they're safely able to do so." There Bias Two fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Jun 9, 2017 |
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Jun 9, 2017 17:51
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Bistromatic posted:What it means to be human is really vague and "i know it when i see it" currently. I think the value a lot of people put on being human mostly stems from the fact that humans are the only sapient beings we know, if we knew of other beings that we would recognise as persons then "human" would suddenly take a back seat to "person". So screw being human if there is a better option. You could argue we aren't even the only sapient species on this planet. Elephants, apes and cetaceans certainly show many traits that were traditionally attributed only to humans. I'm curious to see the next episode, hope they don't ruin it. Anyway some of you might enjoy reading the novel Blindsight by Peter Watts: http://www.rifters.com/real/Blindsight.htm Piriwi fucked around with this message at 21:16 on Jun 9, 2017 |
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Jun 9, 2017 21:12
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There Bias Two posted:Well that went in an interesting direction. The characterization seems kind of... off though. I just hope they at least remember to resolve the show with negotiation.
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Jun 9, 2017 23:22
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That left turn loving sucked holy poo poo my philosophical first contact show turned onto loving anime bs
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Jun 10, 2017 03:22
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C-SPAN Caller posted:That left turn loving sucked holy poo poo my philosophical first contact show turned onto loving anime bs It's like they had an interesting premise and gave up for the follow-through.
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Jun 10, 2017 03:35
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I think it would be much better if the next episode preview did not show Za stomping over everyone. There is something to be said about watching a god-like being being heavily negotiated. Although, the idea of savestating a person if you screw up a conversation is a fun one. SystemLogoff fucked around with this message at 12:54 on Jun 10, 2017 |
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Jun 10, 2017 06:54
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 C-SPAN Caller posted:That left turn loving sucked holy poo poo my philosophical first contact show turned onto loving anime bs They've built up enough good will for me to watch the next episode before declaring the sky is falling.
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Jun 10, 2017 07:17
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Za does not seem to be very intelligent.
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Jun 10, 2017 12:33
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He just wanted information, but he didn't realize the real information was the friends he made along the way.
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Jun 10, 2017 19:55
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I wonder how many time ZaShunina has murdered Shindo? Maybe all the conversations they have had have gone badly at first.
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Jun 11, 2017 02:14
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ValhallaSmith posted:I wonder how many time ZaShunina has murdered Shindo? Maybe all the conversations they have had have gone badly at first. If this one triggered the other anisotropic being's ring, presumably the other times would have done so as well, which doesn't seem to have happened.
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Jun 11, 2017 02:37
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if not for episode 0 shindo being so unnaturally calm and agreeable would have seemed really suspicious. but no, that is just how he was even before he got eaten by a cube.
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Jun 11, 2017 04:00
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Just saw the latest episode. holy lol that's a bad ending. I'm expecting a magical girl in a mecha next episode, yelling ZASHUNINAAAAAAA!!!!!
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Jun 11, 2017 11:13
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zaShunima wanting to restore Shindo from backup after botching a conversation was a cool twist. Tsukai also being secretly anisotropic was not a cool twist.
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Jun 11, 2017 13:38
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This can potentially go real bad from now on, but the show was good enough before the twists that I'll give it a chance. Unrelated, but I'm glad that she show has openly stated that Shindo has both guys and ladies in love with him. Also apparently there's an interview that says that anisotropic Jesus has developed feelings for him too? I saw it on 4chan but didn't have the time to check.
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Jun 11, 2017 14:23
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I paused on watching this show after they moved the cube and now I'm not so certain I want to pick it back up.
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Jun 11, 2017 14:50
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RangerKarl posted:I paused on watching this show after they moved the cube and now I'm not so certain I want to pick it back up. It's manages to build up some interesting suspense before abruptly falling off a cliff.
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Jun 11, 2017 14:54
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Qwertycoatl posted:zaShunima wanting to restore Shindo from backup after botching a conversation was a cool twist. I was actually expecting that to be the case, from the stuff we had seen from the device that enabled them to see their other selves, and that the only Shindo we would see where the ones from universes in which the debates came in the anisotropic's favor, switching them back and forth as he needed.
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Jun 11, 2017 18:00
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StarMinstrel posted:I was actually expecting that to be the case, from the stuff we had seen from the device that enabled them to see their other selves, and that the only Shindo we would see where the ones from universes in which the debates came in the anisotropic's favor, switching them back and forth as he needed. It would be cool if we didn't know how often a bodyswap had happened before, but Tuskai triggering on it seems to imply that it's the first time.
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Jun 11, 2017 18:05
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I just wonder what's next. Peaceful resolution seems unlikely, for obvious reasons, but it'd be super weird if after the rest of the show it now suddenly decided to end with a big JRPG battle against a god.
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Jun 11, 2017 18:09
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Maybe someone should try actual negotiating
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Jun 11, 2017 19:30
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Qwertycoatl posted:Maybe someone should try actual negotiating 
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Jun 11, 2017 19:35
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RottenK posted:I just wonder what's next. Budokai Tenkaichi with six zaShunina versus six Tsukai with OG Shindo as the prize and Backup Shindo for second place. C'mon lets get weird 
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Jun 11, 2017 19:53
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Logicblade posted:He just wanted information, but he didn't realize the real information was the friends he made along the way. It turns out the information was in him all along He just had to believe
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Jun 11, 2017 20:36
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Wow totally stolen from Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy.
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Jun 11, 2017 21:02
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I knew the right answer was nuking the alien
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Jun 11, 2017 21:25
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Maybe "information" is an anisotropic euphemism for a husband.
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Jun 11, 2017 22:27
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There Bias Two posted:"Oh hey humanity, I'm ZaShunina, and I come from a place outside the universe. So I know this is a major revelation, but your universe is basically on one of many servers that we designed because we were bored. The outside universe processes things really quickly, so we ran out of information to process, and started generating random permutations of reality to see what would happen. Out of nowhere, you guys popped up and started creating new data! We're not really gods since this was a complete accident, but we think it's pretty cool and we want you to keep doing your thing. I brought some cool odds and ends from my garage that we think you could use to do neat things with, and all we want in exchange is to keep monitoring you. Also, if any of you are qualified, we'd love to have some human consultants come back with us and shake things up a bit. I'll be in my box if you have any questions. Also, sorry about the plane crash, that was a total accident and I'll release them all in a month once they're safely able to do so." "Man you should've seen the universe Jim made, it was full of basically identical humans but their faces were upside down so they kept getting food in their eyes, no loving way we were giving them these toys."
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Jun 12, 2017 04:26
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wow this series just got tonal whiplash to hell and back
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Jun 13, 2017 00:05
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NEGOTIATION HAS FAILED (I prefer the argument that "humanity is a child, and you're giving them fire, and they're going to burn their loving house down" and less "what humanity does on its own is special" even if we now know why the show considers it special)
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Jun 14, 2017 04:23
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booksnake posted:NEGOTIATION HAS FAILED From a purely pragmatic, alien perspective, it makes sense that you would want to allow humans to live independently. Influencing them might result in damaging their cultures and therefore their value as a source of novel information. If they were to align their values with the anisotropic, then they would no longer be different.
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Jun 14, 2017 04:32
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We know almost nothing about the anisotropic, except that they exist as seperate beings. Both Wam and Sansa can be interpreted as attempts to increase the amount of information generated by humanity.
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Jun 14, 2017 09:34
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Episode 10 was pretty good. I'm not in favor of some things that happened, but it was interesting.
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Jun 17, 2017 00:33
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Meh this is turning into a letdown. A lot of shows, something major changes the setting, but they never explore the consequences. The sleepless bit reminded me of the book Beggars in Spain Kado looked like it would follow through because of Wam and the moving project, but not so much now
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Jun 17, 2017 01:14
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