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Toplowtech posted:No, it's not ganesha it's a fat smiling god so either one of seven Lucky Gods, Hotei or chinese god Budai(the "laughing buddha"). Both are there  
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Jun 21, 2017 19:35
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Buddha is getting lit af.
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Jun 21, 2017 19:36
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Toplowtech posted:No, it's not ganesha it's a fat smiling god so either one of seven Lucky Gods, Hotei or chinese god Budai(the "laughing buddha"). Due to the way Gods work in American Gods, Budai is probably the same being as Buddha, even though they are different in real life. Edit: Actually, probably not, it's probably more like what's going on with Jesus.
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Jun 21, 2017 19:47
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Snak posted:Due to the way Gods work in American Gods, Budai is probably the same being as Buddha, even though they are different in real life. In India maybe...I imagine the eponymous American God would be a blend. Like, that wasn't the ~real~ Vulcan who Wednesday killed, but a version of him which had been brought to America by the factory workers, right?
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Jun 21, 2017 19:58
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Kilson posted:I want some Indian gods. Ganesha and Shiva would be pretty rad! The depiction of Ghandi on Clone High helped kill Clone High. I don't know if that transfers to Indian religious depictions but that's probably some thin ice to walk on.
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Jun 21, 2017 20:20
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Toplowtech posted:No, it's not ganesha it's a fat smiling god so either one of seven Lucky Gods, Hotei or chinese god Budai(the "laughing buddha"). I'm not talking about that god, I'm talking about this one: 
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Jun 21, 2017 20:29
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Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:In India maybe...I imagine the eponymous American God would be a blend. If it's not, though, then why would Odin be temped by "selling out?" If selling out just makes a splinter of yourself... things becomes way more existentially complicated.
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Jun 21, 2017 20:29
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vermin posted:The depiction of Ghandi on Clone High helped kill Clone High. I don't know if that transfers to Indian religious depictions but that's probably some thin ice to walk on. Say what?!
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Jun 21, 2017 20:30
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Mierenneuker posted:Say what?! https://www.theguardian.com/media/2003/jan/31/pressandpublishing.india Weird, I never heard of this either
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Jun 21, 2017 20:38
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Desperado Bones posted:I know it's correct that we pray to saints to ask them to intercede for us with God, but in many ocassions it really, REALLY feels like and it's worshipping. Prayer is an act of worship. I can't figure out what distinction is incorporated in "We don't worship Mary, we just pray to her for supernatural intercession and erect shrines to her and the actual catechism of the Catholic church states literally that devotion to her is intrinsic to Christian worship."
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Jun 21, 2017 21:26
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When you ask other humans for help, it's not considered worship.
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Jun 21, 2017 21:47
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Snak posted:When you ask other humans for help, it's not considered worship. When you exalt and venerate and pray to a dead human in order to ask her to do things for you and the head of your church states that she lived a literally sinless life unlike every other human being in history, yeah, that's considered worship.
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Jun 21, 2017 21:56
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I mean, yeah. But it depends on how you define "worship". Many people, including Catholics, consider worship to refer to veneration of a deity. So when they say they "Don't worship Mary", they say that because they don't consider her a deity, therefore their veneration of her is not worship. If you use a more general definition of worship, like the one you have suggested, of course their veneration of Mary is worship. Like most technicalities of Catholicism, they employ equivocation to differentiate their beliefs from beleifs they are critical of.
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Jun 21, 2017 22:02
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Phanatic posted:Prayer is an act of worship. I can't figure out what distinction is incorporated in "We don't worship Mary, we just pray to her for supernatural intercession and erect shrines to her and the actual catechism of the Catholic church states literally that devotion to her is intrinsic to Christian worship." Snak posted:When you ask other humans for help, it's not considered worship. The ideal would be not to put a shrine for a saint, and just ask for said favor with a prayer. BUT you have to realize that behind many Catholic customs there are many pagan ones. Lady of Guadalupe, my example, is said to be actually an aztec goddess (her shrine is built on the same place said goddess was worshipped). Some people say she was actually made out by the religious people in the country to make native mexicans stop worshipping their other gods (they also probably didn't like the white virgin mary for obvious reasons). So Catholicism is weird, complicated and poo poo changes depending of the branch/country/town. I don't have any studies in theology or anthropology so I'm just talking about the things I've seen and know.  Edit: I also replied too late. 
Desperado Bones fucked around with this message at 22:07 on Jun 21, 2017 |
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Jun 21, 2017 22:05
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Same thing happened with Brigid in Ireland, she'd been a Celtic goddess that the church basically just put a St. in front of to appease the locals
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Jun 21, 2017 22:07
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I think it would be awesome if Crowley and Anton LaVey both show up and fight each other Catholics at one point even said that Egyptian gods and Buddha were saints. They were just giving it away at that point.
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Jun 21, 2017 22:12
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Soothing Vapors posted:Catholics don't worship Mary This guy needs to go to South America.
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Jun 21, 2017 22:18
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precision posted:I think it would be awesome if Crowley and Anton LaVey both show up and fight each other When you want to gain as much followers as possible and people don't really like your religion, some times, you have to just make everything a saint! Of course another way to gain followers is by mere brutal force.
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Jun 21, 2017 22:22
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The point is that the Catholic "party line" is that they don't. Catholicism's whole deal with how it spread is to reclassify worship of pagan deities as a roundabout method of worshipping the Christian God. In practice, just like in the show, lots of Catholic do worship Mary and other saints. It's just like how there's no such thing as an Ex-Marine, because once you're in the USMC, you're too badass to be vulnerable to the past tense.
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Jun 21, 2017 22:24
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ODIN VS PAN, ACTUAL FOOTAGE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuQw3qjzsBE
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Jun 21, 2017 22:26
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Catholicism is so frustrating because it's almost there, I mean just in the last 10 years one of the higher-ranking Vatican scholars admitted that the Gnostic Gospels were worth reading - contrast this with most Protestant branches who claim they were "written by Satan"
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Jun 21, 2017 22:30
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vermin posted:ODIN VS PAN, ACTUAL FOOTAGE Caught this on TV twice,I give it 12 out of 4 stars. (I think the original didn't have the annoying narrator explaining everything).
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Jun 21, 2017 22:58
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I believe the narrator is Thoth
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Jun 21, 2017 23:01
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Snak posted:Like most technicalities of Catholicism, they employ equivocation to differentiate their beliefs from beleifs they are critical of. Yeah. But in the context of *this show*, I think it's unquestionably worship. The people who celebrate Easter every year and dye eggs and eat chocolate bunnies don't believe in Ostara as a literal goddess, but the rote actions they're going through are still close-enough echoes of what her actual worshippers used to do that she's still around and still pretty damned potent. And again, Vulcan: Every trigger pulled is a prayer. Even though they're not *literal* prayers, that's still close enough for that power to flow to him as a God. If every trigger pulled is a prayer, an act of worship that can sustain a divine entity, even if the people doing the shooting have never heard of and don't care a bit about Vulcan, than all the old Spanish and Italian and Mexican and French ladies who are *literally* praying to Mary 53 times every time they do a rosary (54, if they stick a Fatima in there amongst all the Hail Marys) are definite engaged in worship in the sense the show means it. Snak posted:It's just like how there's no such thing as an Ex-Marine, There are a few but they're generally among the class of people who are so infamous they're referred to by all three of their names.
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Jun 21, 2017 23:05
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Of course it is, because Mary is there at Easter. Generated by people's worship. She wouldn't be there if people didn't worship her. Edit: Sorry, I'm not trying to be antagonistic here, but I realize I'm coming off that way. I agree with almsit everything that's been said on this topic, I was simply pointing out why Catholics can say they don't worship Mary with a straight face. This is not a show gives a poo poo about the definitions of things according to churches and cults. It's about the emergent nature and power of belief. Snak fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Jun 21, 2017 |
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Jun 21, 2017 23:08
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Was the baby Jesus with that Virgin Mary a separate person, or do you think it's all one person? Like because her concept is "Mary with Jesus" she permanently has a baby attached to her arm.
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Jun 21, 2017 23:16
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Snak posted:Of course it is, because Mary is there at Easter. Generated by people's worship. She wouldn't be there if people didn't worship her. I once read a quote about how Jewish people sort of view their god as one who would respect/be proud of a bit of rules lawyering where religious laws and biblical interpretations are involved. As Judaism's direct descendant, it would make sense that there's a large degree of it in Catholicism as well. Can't say I disagree, tbh, and it makes for some of the cooler mystical bits of both religions. Protestantism is just so dry by comparison.
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Jun 21, 2017 23:37
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Cojawfee posted:Was the baby Jesus with that Virgin Mary a separate person, or do you think it's all one person? Like because her concept is "Mary with Jesus" she permanently has a baby attached to her arm. Yeah, it was the Madonna.
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Jun 22, 2017 00:14
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Mierenneuker posted:Say what?! What is that you say?!
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Jun 22, 2017 00:58
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Crow Jane posted:I once read a quote about how Jewish people sort of view their god as one who would respect/be proud of a bit of rules lawyering where religious laws and biblical interpretations are involved. As Judaism's direct descendant, it would make sense that there's a large degree of it in Catholicism as well. Can't say I disagree, tbh, and it makes for some of the cooler mystical bits of both religions. Protestantism is just so dry by comparison. Jewish rules lawyering is absolutely loving hilarious. I especially love the Sabbot Phone. I'd love to see a depiction of Yahweh looking over a phone and declaring it technically acceptable, which as we all know, is the best kind of acceptable.
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Jun 22, 2017 01:36
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counterfeitsaint posted:Jewish rules lawyering is absolutely loving hilarious. I especially love the Sabbot Phone. I'd love to see a depiction of Yahweh looking over a phone and declaring it technically acceptable, which as we all know, is the best kind of acceptable. There's a giant wire encircling Manhattan that technically makes it a private place where you're allowed to actually do things on the day of rest: http://mentalfloss.com/article/91594/theres-wire-above-manhattan-youve-probably-never-noticed
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Jun 22, 2017 04:03
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Man, the way shadow just turns into a giddy blob of pudding when ostara says to Wednesday "you brought a blusher with you".
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Jun 23, 2017 06:08
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What a loving great series. Odin is a badass and i hope Gillian Anderson does a face turn and join the old gods. Having been with a broken girl Laura should leave my friend Shadow alone and with that nice star sister lady. Bilquis should gently caress off and die, she sucks. DoctorGonzo fucked around with this message at 06:55 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 06:34
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pr0p posted:So Wednesday is the bad guy, right? Machinated everything that has gone wrong in Shadow's life for 3 years, framing people for murder and using that information to talk Easter into destroying humanities food sources? Bad guys are not wrong, they are just assholes, basically? Well Odin didnt tell Laura to suck Dane Cook cock, did he? Also they should add Trentren Vilu and Caicai Vilu DoctorGonzo fucked around with this message at 07:11 on Jun 23, 2017 |
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Jun 23, 2017 06:54
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DoctorGonzo posted:Bilquis should gently caress off and die, she sucks. I'm no book reader, but I think she will be doing 2 out of 3 on that front 
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Jun 23, 2017 08:21
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I'm interested in seeing what they have planned for Bilquis. They've spent a lot of effort establishing a character that so far has no connection at all to the rest of the show
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Jun 23, 2017 09:50
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I bet they try to set a trap for Shadow, not knowing that Shadow's not the kind of guy to cheat on his dead wife!
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Jun 23, 2017 09:53
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Steve Yun posted:I bet they try to set a trap for Shadow, not knowing that Shadow's not the kind of guy to cheat on his dead wife! Nah, she resents her current position and pines after former glory. I'd be very surprised if they're not setting up for some form of betrayal
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Jun 23, 2017 10:26
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Gum posted:I'm interested in seeing what they have planned for Bilquis. They've spent a lot of effort establishing a character that so far has no connection at all to the rest of the show So far she's uniquely positioned between the old and the new gods. In terms of origin she's an extremely old god (IIRC her legend starts sometime around ~1000 BCE, making her older than basically any other god except the egyptians), but at the same time she's currently aligned with and indebted to the new gods. That puts her at a very central position where both factions will want to get her on their side, and it's quite likely that she'll end up betraying either side in some way. Fake edit: Come to think of it, she might also be kind of a hybrid between old and new gods in terms of her nature. On the one hand, she still does the whole personal worship thing via the vaginebula. But at the same time whatever the new gods did to make her relevant again also linked her into that whole passive distributed worship thing that they've got going on.
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Jun 23, 2017 11:06
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Gum posted:I'm interested in seeing what they have planned for Bilquis. They've spent a lot of effort establishing a character that so far has no connection at all to the rest of the show hopefully nothing
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Jun 23, 2017 11:17
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